Ganigumo

4 mournfang do outdamage SHBR now It gets a bit closer when you factor in the better mortals and shooting attacks, plus the stonehorn is better on objectives and costs 40 points less. Personally I rank the linebreakers ability pretty low, theres only a small set of armies that can take advantage of unleash hell, and a lot of the units in question get mortals on 6s or something similar anyways. The math points to them being interesting but I'm not sure they'll find their footing. They're very weak to battleshock and maneuvering 4 of them might be harder than maneuvering a stonehorn.

Nurgle would make a super easy boxed set. Fec would be pretty easy too, especially if you load up up with less monsters, 40 ghouls, 9 horrors/flayers and then a dragon. If you buy a bunch of SC you end up with more than enough dragons, but short on ghouls/flayers if you want to go into those builds. Cities could make Wanderers work I think, a nomad prince, 2 boxes of eternal guard, 2 boxes of wild riders, and a treelord would make a good set. both guard and wild riders are dual kits, and the treelord would fit better here than the giant did in the ironjawz and ogor ones. BoC would just need to have another bray shaman in it, but a thunderscorn or warherd based box could work. Bray shaman, ~3 units of bullgor/dragon ogors and 1-2 ghorgons. A full Tzaangor box would be a good choice too. a Tzaangor shaman 2 boxes of tzaangor with the 40k upgrade sprue and 2-3 boxes of enlightened/skyfires. Honestly I'm still a little shocked we don't have a start collecting, vanguard, or combat patrol: Tzaangor yet.

I think the disappointment comes from the book still missing the mark (widely in some places), despite it being a minor facelift overall. The new hunter is the exact type of hero that has no role in the game, mournfang still struggle with allegiance abilities (they only count as 2 models each and are the only unit in the book that needs to be reinforced to get the good ogor charge), cats basically got worse and basically nobody played them, Frost wreathed Ice was copy-pasted, The butcher costs the same as the slaughtermaster which is ridiculous as the slaughtermaster is a butcher that gives out free buffs. The artefacts are pretty much all bad (these are the worst we've seen since kruleboyz I think, but at least they're better than kruleboyz), and the command traits are pretty lacklustre as well. I'm pretty sure most Ogor lists are just gonna run Master of Magic + Arcane tome, but even vial of manticore venom, high priest, and battle-lust are more appealing. Its also a little silly how despite not even having a full 6 table for artefacts/command traits a big portion of them are still unit locked. Also grasp of the everwinter is as forgettable as it ever was. The internal balance between gutbusters and BCR are still an issue I think. Pretty much the only good enhancements are the mount traits, which are locked behind expensive BCR monsters, but every army gets a free mount trait, so the book creates a 1-way incentive towards bcr, which have been the better side of the army since the last book. Overall I think the book is better for ogors, because it gives them what they need to function in aos 3, and it does some things well like subfactions, but it really feels like a side-grade, to an army that has struggled for a while. Also the lists that seem to be powerful all seem like skew lists too, ironblaster spam, meatfist kragnos, and the same old BCR monster truck build. I've never understood this argument/psychology. In order to regret the decision because of a rules nerf (in this case a pretty minor one) you'd need to have mostly based your decision on the strength of the rules, not the models or narrative. But given the book won't be matched play legal until the proper release, and the person in question has already seen the leaked rules they don't have much of an incentive to buy it in the first place. I know it happens that way though, I was also shocked people were actually returning their votann boxes because of the rules nerf.

I think the kragnos meatfist cheese is something like: Kragnos-720 Slaughtermaster with arcane tome + master of magic- 135 Tyrant with brawlerguts (mortals on 3s)- 150 5x4 leadbelchers -850 Purple sun - 90 Lauchon - 50 (or go for triumph). Comes to 1995 points. Maybe you want cogs for the reroll charges, but each unit of leadbelchers is doing roughly 5 mortals on average with the charge, plus you can splash damage around through shooting. You'd play a bit like nighthaunt I think, and try to combo charge stuff to blow it up. It also all fits into a single battle regiment.

Thoughts on the new tome? Feels like a bit of a sidegrade like some of the other recent books to me, but it definitely has some play and cleans up the rules for 3e. Mournfang are more interesting, but still failed to get out of their in-between spot of not getting good trampling charges or might makes right, which hurts their value. Thundertusks might be competitive between the rampage and 5+ ward mount trait. I could see boulderhead taking at least 1. Artefacts and command traits seem lacklustre, the generics have better options. The warscroll changes were all really good, and probably the highlight of the book, and the subfactions are all pretty solid options. I think its a solid book overall, but we'll need to see how it plays. The few builds that jump out at me are meatfist Kragnos + MSU gutbuster(leadbelcher?) spam, classic boulderhead monster spam, and underguts gunline with those rend 3 cannons.

The head's all wrong, the fangs are close but the structure is different, also the creature on this guy's back has no big crack, and has all 8 eyes, but the rumor engine one is clearly far more damaged. He'd need an option for a different thing on his back, and IIRC necromunda generally doesn't have a lot of options for things that aren't the main gangers (not sure what this guy is).

I think doing dual tome releases is hurting too. it creates bigger gaps between releases.

If this is the wording this is actually insane. What you can do is charge something, do the rampage and move 3d6 over units, then still pile into something (because you made a charge move you can pile in even if you're not within 3" of an enemy). Screening stonehorns just got insanely hard. Plus it works well for combo charging stuff and taking it out with mortals.

I was just saying the other day I hoped the next season would focus on non-monster non-mounted heroes. Cavalry seemed the obvious next choice but I'll be very happy if its true. I just hope they incentivize taking those "fighty" on foot heroes that generally don't have a place in the game, and it doesn't devolve into spamming support heroes.

Imo gutrippaz are still too high in the age of bounty hunters, i'll try them out again, but we might need to just wait until the next season. The point drops are all welcome though. Killbow at 110 means it doesn't feel as bad to use it as a screen in a matchup where its bad, and vultures at 220 is a steal. I think the shaman change makes gobsprakk a worse option, a big reason to bring him was because shamans rarely cast, but now they can, and he has no bonuses to cast or unique spells. With the shaman change I wonder if one of our best general options is going to be a swampcalla with master of magic & arcane tome. In grinnin blades he can be pretty safe too. I think the changes are nice overall, but it doesn't even come close to addressing all the issues with the army. I started listbuilding again and was very quickly frustrated, despite being able to fit in an extra 100+ points. The army just doesn't fit into battalions unless you go boltboy spam. BR only has 1 leader slot, which is hotly contested. You can fit a single warlord/entourage, but filling 4 sub-commanders is a challenge. Our BH options are terrible at being BH. We can run EC but our units aren't well suited to it. KB definitely need some more fixes, even if this gets the winrate to a better spot. Stuff like dropping the gnashtoof to 9 wounds (it will never really justify a leader slot in this army but as a sub-commander i'm a buyer), giving us a non-leader mirebrute/sludgeraker, giving skulbugz an actual ability and giving gobsprakk a casting bonus or something.

Fitting all 8 into your deployment might be a challenge. The only thing it really turns on is warparties in bounty hunters, which can actually push their damage(vs GVs) to a good spot. They have 18 damage 1 attacks. 3x5 Spider riders never felt like much of a tax since they've always been good screens. I think the squig herd and shoota drops are going to be the biggest buffs for us overall. Just start taking shootas instead of stabbas but play them like stabbas.

Zarbag from the first gitz warband was a madcap shaman. Could be spiderfang or squig themed? Maybe with a new "skarsnik" or on foot webspinner shaman.

40ks core ruleset and codex complexity make it a balancing nightmare. There are way too many levers to pull, its hard to identify which is the right one, and they keep throwing bandaid fixes into the game because of it which are easy to re-break if you're not careful.

You could put spiderfang into both books and let them play with either set of allegiance abilities Would be a bit like tzaangor are.

The bad moon mechanic might work (although it would still be inconsistent) if the buffs it gave were strong enough. It would make the army a more random version of Idoneth in a way. But at the moment gitz basically just don't have allegiance abilities without it, and the buffs aren't much stronger than what other armies get all the time. I wouldn't mind seeing it like chaos marks in the current book. a minor passive ability for each subgroup all the time, (or maybe until the moon leaves the battlefield) and a huge buff when under it. Like trolls passively get +1 to save, but when under the moon they restore d3 slain models in the hero phase as their regeneration goes crazy.

Tzaangor had a good run.

It might not be "something straight out of a nightmare" but narratively and ruleswise the cunning portion is easy for them. You make them into cunning pack hunters, that use strange contraptions to weaken the enemy while chasing, fading, and harassing the opponent until they're too exhausted to fight back. The fear of them will come from the fear of ever getting caught even slightly exposed, and how good they are at picking targets, since there are rarely any survivors. For contraptions and war machines you make them all wagons. You embrace the old goblin wolf chariots, but combine it with the old war machines, so it fits the nomadic hunter flavor. Doom divers can be less suicidal, and more like a ranged unit that shoots "fanatics". Instead of just shooting it lets you set up a model with offenses like a fanatic, and the hit roll affects how close to a unit you can place it. With everything in the army mounted pump wagons would make sense, as its the only way snotlings could keep up, and you could use the light of hysh to explain how they got smart enough to build them. Ruleswise you give them bonuses for flanking (more than 1 unit in melee), speed, double activations/extra pile ins, and bonuses for attacking wounded units as grots love kicking people when they're down.

They hit the mork note narratively, but not really unit-wise or rules-wise. Theres a bad disconnect there, especially since destruction really needs an army that embraces it. Even with completely rewritten rules I think they'd struggle to make the army feel fully "morky" because of the models available to the army. A morky feeling army would be a finesse army like KO or Slaanesh, or a heavy synergy army like khorne (which they're working on eliminating in aos3). Destruction really needs an army to fill the pure morky void, like gitmob, grotbag or spiderfang if they really push them to stand on their own. Gitz are a bit too chaotic to properly fit the bill. Kruleboyz should stand as an in-between, an army with finesse elements that can take a hit without crumpling, because it would be good narratively and a forgiving starter army for new players, which is where I think they tried to put them but failed with the rules.

The whole dark & serious thing really is more chaos' wheelhouse. When it comes to seriousness it varies a lot based on the army, Ogors and Ironjawz are pretty no-nonsense, but gitz and gargants are silly. To me Kruleboyz really missed the mark on a few levels though, even though I like them and have a painted army. Units don't reflect their narrative, the sculpts do, but the army is just a bunch of rank and file infantry and monsters, which is about as far from sneaky and kunnin as you can get. The book really pushed shooting as the kunnin aspect, probably because it was the only thing the model range had that came close. Generally destruction is written as a force of nature, or a natural disaster. Ogors are like locusts, Beastclaw are a blizzard, Gitz are like a flood, etc. Kruleboyz do a poor job of matching the theme. They're supposed to represent the dark unknown places of the wilds (swamps in particular) but thats just not as threatening or impactful as something like an earthquake, which could strike anywhere at any time. For me Kruleboyz (as a whole) just don't hit right, even if the sculpts are fantastic, and I'm not exactly sure where to start unravelling the issue.

They could make a book with grotbag & gitmob. Gitmob basically worship the sun which is about as far from moonclan as you can get. Then they can throw little waaagh!!! in the book too.

The spears from the enlightened kit fit on the bodies from the normal tzaangor kit. I did exactly that myself to build my enlightened on foot. You'll need some 40mm bases too though.

My first guess is OBR. I doubt they'll get an expansion so soon and they couod use the new book. Gitz are the next obvious choice. Bad book + no white dwarf but I could see a small spiderfang refresh of 2-3 kits (spider riders, monstrous spider/scuttleboss dual kit, + something else). I could see Seraphon, KO, Khorne or FEC as well.

I hope they do recycle some of the old ones, the kits from 8th edition still hold up like necropolis knights, necrosphinxes and the boar boyz. I really liked the 8th edition boar boy kit, and wish it had wormed its way into ironjawz somehow instead of getting squatted. IMO the best thing they could do is re-use still in production kits, resurrect discontinued ones that still hold up, and point their modelling resources towards the stuff that doesn't hold up or never had models in the first place. Then they should create a home for all the armies/models in AoS somehow. Even if they don't find a home in the core books building out a limited & restrictive set of allegiance abilities would be nice. Stuff like greenskinz being playable in big waaagh!, kislev getting its own city where the subfaction ability is just access to the kislev units etc. GW is really hit or miss with compatibility between their games though, but that kind of compatibility with pull players into both games, and buying models for both games.

I disagree. If there's only one weapon profile on the scroll you can model anything and its easy to tell what the weapon is. Its better than having two options with the one you have being terrible, because then you actually do need to swap the weapons out.

They didn't nerf the damage by half. They went from 10 damage 1 attacks to 4 damage 2 attacks, but the unit captain gets +1 attack. thats only a 20% drop on the club attacks.