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Agent of Chaos

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  1. Agent of Chaos
    Wait for the FAQ/Errata I guess...
  2. Agent of Chaos
    And playing against those units can be tedious as you have to work out which model has which weapon and roll accordingly. It was simplified for Iron Jaws so seems strange to do it for chaos warriors when they didnt have it previously.
  3. Agent of Chaos
    I cannot see mixed weapon options being the intention of the rule. Its classic inconsistent/ambiguous rules wording from GW and very likely to be clarified by FAQ/errata as there is no other unit in the game that can mix weapons, apart from the occasional 1/5 or 1/10 etc can have a special weapon.
  4. Agent of Chaos
    @itgnightraven if the shrine has mark of khorne it can be included in khorne allegiance and will be useful for the slaves units in the battalion. In a khorne army it can also take a blood blessing and pray for judgements (thanks to PRIEST keyword), plus bloodreavers benefit form its totem keyword. It just wont give any buffs/wards to non slaves units. I see the lord on Karkadrak as a good candiate for goretide general as his 4 x attack profiles will benefit greatly from +1 DMG and various bonus attacks. With 3+ save and no MONSTER keyword he greatly benefits from Thronebreakers Torc as well. With him you will want a unit of chaos knights to receive his command ability, add killing frenzy and bloodstoker and that unit will shred things. Could support them with the warshrine who can use the tzeentch prayer for reroll saves. With their innate 5+ against mortals and the shrines 6+ ward that is a tanky unit that will put out the hurt regardless of weapon choice.
  5. Agent of Chaos
    #1 Get your rules right! If in doubt, look it up on the spot and play on as you can always edit it later. Nothing worse then seeing people getting rules blatantly wrong or, not being sure and just deciding to play it a certain way (i.e. wrong) without bothering to check. #2 I like the above idea, for competitive battle reports, of explaining the theory behind the list and what you are trying to achieve, especially in relation to the scenario. #3 A little focus on the scenario and its objectives goes a long way. Too many battle reports gloss over it (I havnt committed all scenarios to memory and am unlikely to have my GHB handy to look up what the objectives are ). #4 Reports of different lengths wouldnt be a bad idea. Some 30min, some 45min and some 60min+. Could be different versions of the same game if you could be bothered. #5 After action summaries are always good for analyzing what worked and what didnt. You could have fun with the format of this as most reports I've seen just have the players sitting on the couch or at the desk having a chat and it can be a little bland.
  6. Agent of Chaos
    Well put! Definitely still a viable unit but you have to really think about how you will use them and buff them. 20 man units are definitely easier to manage but it only takes a single casualty to lose the +1 to hit bonus.
  7. Agent of Chaos
    @Salyx Not 100% on the first question but pretty sure you would do 2 x mortal wounds for each 6. Karanak has the HERO keyword so he can use command abilities, etc. However he does not take up a "Leader" slot when writing your list. This is indicated in the points table at the end of the tome where a unit's role is noted (leader, battleline, behemoth, etc). It means in a 2K list you can have 6 heroes plus Karanak. I took 30 bloodletters to a 2.5K tournament recently. They did OK but there are a few problems with them; 1) 32mm bases make large units unwieldy to move, yet their +1 to hit for 20 models and horde discount encourages large units. 2) 1" reach makes it hard to get models in melee range. The 6" pile in certainly helps mitigate some of this issue but doesnt resolve it completely. 3) 5" move, can't be whipped by bloodstoker, no bonuses to run or charge, no run & charge... 4) 5+ save with 1 wound, they die to a stiff breeze 5) Only 1 attack base, need bloodsecrator and/or wrathmonger support to do real damage but its tough to maintain "wholly within aura due to unit size". Same issue applies for Reapers of Vengeance as you must be wholly within 8" to use it. I know the theory that you dont need a hero to use the slaughterhost abilities has been floated however Im not certain that was the intention of the rule. If you can use it without a hero then the unit just has to be wholly within 8" of itself (???) which is easier to manage. 6) You can get superior output from a unit of 5 x Skullreapers while being easier to keep in range of buffs.
  8. Agent of Chaos
    @smartazjb0y a mortal wound save is one of the only decent abilities they have going for them so I would say always go shields. Rerolling hits of 1 is good and all but no rend, one damage means you're not causing much harm either way. Plus there are many other ways to get rerolls for hits such as warshrine, mark of khorne with hero buff, Daemonic Power Spell, etc but no other way to get a mortal wound save.
  9. Agent of Chaos
    @Scurvydog amazing analysis! Loving this forum guys! Yes, chaos player here (obviously) but Ive been considering a second (4th or 5th, whatevs) army for a while and something small, elite and hard to kill was what I was thinking and these guys fit the bill. Love the models & love the way they operate. Only disappointing thing as it appears many are finding... its so hard to fit all the toys you want in 2K! I am definitely going to sit back and wait, really read the battletome and carefully choose a playstyle and army. Never approached warhammer like that before so figure I owe it to myself to plan an army for a change. Big question around Mortek Guard with spears or swords. Gamewise its swords all day because even a unit of 20 can fight in 2 ranks on 25mm bases so spears only become necessary in those terms for 30-40 man units. However the spears look so much cooler so I'm thinking 2 x 10 with swords, 2 x 10 with spears, but they operate in pairs with the spears standing behind the swords. This way if the front line does get hit with something with lots of rend and/or mortal wounds, they end up overkilling it and you still get a hit back with the undamaged spears. If they dont kill the frontline the spears have the reach to still attack. Meanwhile a Boneshaper or Harvester accompanies each pair of units to bring back as many as it can. This covers your battleline requirements without sinking tons of points into massive units. Does this sound viable?
  10. Agent of Chaos
    @minthras the only time you would go halberds on warriors is if you anticipated taking a big unit (15+) where the 2" reach ensures more of them, if not all, will be in range to fight. More often then not hand weapons are the way to go for better hit rolls. Chaos knights should always be charging so glaives are the way to go. Maybe one unit with hand weapons if you have a few units.
  11. Agent of Chaos
    chaos knights with a 3+ armour save ( I really miss the days of chaos armour + shield+ barded horse = 1+ save)
  12. Agent of Chaos
    @Tiberius501 looks fun!
  13. Agent of Chaos
    I'm about to play my first game in a local 1250 point meeting engagement league (3 games followed by 3 more using pitched battle rules). Tossing up between 2 lists but in both cases the focus is on speed (first game is Death Pass). My opponent is Flesh Eater Courts although apparently not a fan of terrorgheists so I'm expecting an Abhorrent with lots of flayers, ghouls and Courtiers. List 1: Daemons (mostly)- idea is to build up some early blood tithe by sacrificing Riptooth and Magore's fiends for some hero phase movement once the thirsters get on the table. Holding the Insensate Rage back in the rearguard is risky but with +4" movement and reroll charges, not to mention a 6" pile in, I'm confident he will get involved enough. Also hoping for a bonus unit of dogs from Karanak but appreciate that will be tricky. Allegiance: Khorne - Slaughterhost: The Bloodlords Spearhead Slaughterpriest (100) - Blood Blessing: Blood Sacrifice 5 x Flesh Hounds (100) 3 x Magore's Fiends (80) 1 x Riptooth (40) Main Body Karanak (140) Bloodthirster of Unfettered Fury (270) - Artefact: Halo of Blood 10 x Flesh Hounds (200) Rearguard Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage (270) - General - Trait: Slaughterer's Thirst Extra Command Point (50) Total: 1250 / 1250 Extra Command Points: 1 List 2: Mortals (mostly)- simple idea for this list... lots of speed. Bloodstoker with spearhead to maximise his movement buffing, especially with the item choices. The priests will look to buff the spearhead knights at first, then buff the warriors to hold my objective or the skullreapers/knights again if I am pressing his objective. Bloodsecrator turns up late to help me defend the home objective before pushing onto the enemy objective. Not sold on this list yet but it has promise. Allegiance: Khorne Spearhead Bloodstoker (80) - General - Trait: Violent Urgency - Artefact: Talisman of Burning Blood 5 x Flesh Hounds (100) 5 x Skullreapers (180) 5 x Chaos Knights (160) - Chaos Glaives Main Body Slaughterpriest (100) - Blood Blessing: Killing Frenzy Slaughterpriest (100) - Blood Blessing: Bronzed Flesh 10 x Blood Warriors (200) - Goreaxe & Gorefist - 1x Goreglaives 5 x Chaos Knights (160) - Chaos Glaives Rearguard Bloodsecrator (120) Extra Command Point (50) Total: 1250 / 1250 Extra Command Points: 1
  14. Agent of Chaos
    Thoughts on this list? Basically everything castles around the hurricanum with shadow warriors to drop on objectives once everything has been shot to pieces. The rockets hit on 3+, reroll 1's and shoot twice in the first turn. Volley Gun hits on 2+ (assuming prayer success) rerolling 1's. The Iron Drakes hit on 2+, reroll 1's with rend -2 (assuming prayer success) and have 2 shots each assuming no movement. Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar- City: Greywater FastnessLeadersRunelord (90)- General- Trait: Drillmaster- Artefact: Steam-piston Plate MailCogsmith (60)- Artefact: Mastro Vivetti's Maginificent MacroscopeBattlemage (90)- Spell: Lore of Smog - Descending Ash Cloud (Greywater Fastness Wizard)- City Role: General's Adjutant (Must be 6 wounds or less)- Mortal Realm: GhyranBattleline20 x Irondrakes (300)10 x Longbeards (110)- Ancestral Weapons & Shields10 x Longbeards (110)- Ancestral Weapons & ShieldsUnits10 x Shadow Warriors (110)10 x Shadow Warriors (110)BehemothsCelestial Hurricanum (220)War MachinesHelstorm Rocket Battery (130)Helstorm Rocket Battery (130)Helstorm Rocket Battery (130)Helstorm Rocket Battery (130)Helblaster Volley Gun (120)BattalionsGreywater Artillery Company (120)Endless Spells / Terrain / CPsBalewind Vortex (40)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 121
  15. Agent of Chaos
    @Smooth criminal More or less yes, competitive Khorne is with at least 3 thirsters. 6" pile in is incredibly powerful and gives daemons a huge amount of flexibility so Crimson Crown on Unfettered Fury is a must have. Dogs are an amazing unit for the versatility, cost and fulfilling battleline. That being said the all mortal list with dual shrines won best chaos and was second only to Matt Campbell in terms of Khorne so that is definitely a viable competitive build as well. From a competitive perspective the main function of judgements is movement blocking with any damage caused a bonus. Therefore the skulls have to be the judgement of choice for the reliability of casting. Personally I only acquired a 3rd Thirster leading up to the tournament so I was always going to give it a whirl but there are definitely alternate builds out there.
  16. Agent of Chaos
    @AresX8 100% correct mate. Blood Host was purely for a 2 drop army as the reroll charges was redundant for all but the Bloodthirsters themselves. However that being said in one game I did reroll the insensate rage thirster's charge from a 6 into an 11 which got him where I needed him before he tore through around 20 Iron Jaw Brutes! Seeing that go off alone made the battalion worth it 🙂 I used Reapers of Vengeance slaughterhost as for me its the most competitive option when running thirsters. With the random damage output you really want them having 2 bites at it.
  17. Agent of Chaos
    Greetings Blood Boilers! Figured some of you might be interested that over the weekend I attended Sydney GT; a 2 day x 5 game event with 2500 point armies and 84 players. I took a fairly anti-magic list as I anticipated endless spells and other magic shenanigans to be a big factor (we were using the realms of metal and fire and the realm spells were available to any wizard). As it turned out I drew khorne twice, Iron Jaws (with no shaman) and Nighthaunt (one wizard who died turn 2) which was disappointing. My final Nurgle opponent had four casters so I finally got to roll some unbinds. I had ensured my list was 2 drops, via Gore Pilgrims and Blood Host, as I thought determining who went first would be crucial. Hard to say if it was however I definitely felt my opponents had an advantage via being able to deploy their units to counter mine (i.e. ensuring wizards are outside 30” of the Wraith of Khorne thirster with Mage Eater Crown, mirror matching deployment in Duality of Death, etc). Definitely something to consider for next tournament. There were 6 Khorne players at the GT with 5 lists taking at least 3 if not 4 bloodthirsters each, including my own. The 6th was an all mortal list with 50 x bloodreavers, 40 x marauders and 2 x warshrines. The resident #1 khorne player in Australia, Matt Campbell, again went 5-0 for the tournament (15 straight wins for him at tournaments now) but finished 2nd overall to a nasty Stormcast “shootcast” list (it was basically a 40K army the shooting was that good). I had the fortune of playing against Matt in my second game and it was awesome to see his mastery of the game and the tools available to khorne first hand. It was also my first time facing up to Skarbrand and he did not disappoint. I also faced the mortal khorne list in my 4th game but played poorly while the dice didn’t help me out either (khorne cares not). Fighting through all that chaff was painful and the combo of 10 x Wrathmongers with Skarr Bloodwraith was highly effective, as was the double warshrine buff. My opponent ended up winning best Chaos so it was a good showing for Khorne overall. Apart from those two losses I had solid wins against nighthaunt and iron jaws (old battletome) and a minor loss to a really tough Nurgle list with 3 Great Unclean Ones, 30 x plaguebearers and 40 x plague monks. Going into my first large solo tournament I was happy to get one win so getting 2 meant I was reasonably pleased. 2500 points certainly allows for some filthy lists (looking at you vanguard raptors with 2 shots each firing twice per turn). Glad I didn’t have to face any Slaanesh, Daughters of Khaine, Fire Slayers or Skaven. In one game between Khorne & Slaanesh they churned through over a dozen Keepers and Bloodthirsters before the game was done thanks to the stupid amounts of Bloodtithe and Depravity that was flowing! One Slaanesh player managed enough depravity to summon 5½ Keepers in one game! Happy skull hunting!
  18. Agent of Chaos
    @Lionheart You are welcome mate 🙂 These guys dont quit hey? Do their armies not have powerful abilities that seem too good or what? The warscroll for the altar says priests can reroll "prayer rolls". According to the priest warscroll Bloodboil is known as a "Bloodfuelled Prayer" and requires the priest to make a "prayer roll" to see if it is successful. Blood Blessings of Khorne also require the priest to make a "prayer roll". Seems pretty conclusive to me... Tell your mates to quit their bitching and get on with the game.
  19. Agent of Chaos
    @Lionheart what is the argument for each priest not being able to attempt blood boil in the same turn? The priest warscroll says "in your hero phase, this model can chant one of the following prayers...". No restrictions are mentioned for multiple models with this ability. Page 76 of the battletome; Blood Blessings of Khorne; "In addition to any other prayers they can chant, each Priest knows one blessing... Each blood blessing of khorne can only be chanted once per turn, regardless of how many priests know that prayer." So there is a specific restriction noted for the Blood Blessings (Killing Frenzy, Bronzed Flesh, etc), but no such restriction is noted for the warscroll prayers (bloodboil and bloodbind). Blood Blessing are done at the start of the hero phase, warscroll prayers are done during the hero phase. Blood Blessings are limited to khorne allegiance (i.e. slaughterpriests taken as allies in a different allegiance could not take blood blessings). Blood Blessings cause 1 mortal wound on a roll of 1, warscroll prayers cause D3 mortal wounds. The two sets of prayers are different and have different restrictions/rules that apply to them. Finally the battletome designer's commentary (https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/age_of_sigmar_blades_of_khorne_designers_commentary_en.pdf) says; "Q: If a Priest knows more than one prayer, can it attempt to chant each of them? A: Yes, as long as no other restrictions apply." So where is the restriction that says a priest cannot attempt bloodboil if another priest has already done so? This is how it is played in tournaments and every battle report you can find on youtube so double blood boil away! In fact tell your friend to get a 3rd priest for triple blood boil!!!
  20. Agent of Chaos
    @smartazjb0y No worries mate! After I wrote that up I was like, "dam, I wanna play that list!" It will be pricey but a fun project to work towards, and a challenge to think of a painting/basing scheme to tie them all together.
  21. Agent of Chaos
    @smartazjb0y I wouldnt say that its bad or even that it isnt viable, just that it might not be the most competitive from a tournament perspective, then again it might do alright. If this is for casual games at home or in store then go for it! If you are worried about winning even in a casual setting then like any list it comes down to synergy and how you use it. Does have it have sufficient screening units, speed, hammers and anvils? Are you focusing on killing or playing to objectives? Some tips for building that list; As Smooth Criminal said, the Beasts of Chaos can only take the mark of khorne via the Brass Despoilers battalion. So maybe start with that, work out the minimum requirements so you know how many points you have left for other stuff. If you want Bullgor then you probably want a Doombull as the leader option to support them. If you just want Bestigors or Gors then the Beastlord is a cheaper option. Decide on a slaughterhost as your choice of host may influence which units you go for (and because who doesnt like free rules?). Either of the mortal ones might be the better choice as any Slaves to Darkness units will benefit via the mortal keyword (Beast of Chaos wont benefit from any host abilities, although a doombull general wouldnt hate the Goretide command trait of +1 DMG to his axe and horns). When mixing all those factions you should look for buffs that effect units with the khorne keyword without being specific to mortals or daemons. Slaughter priests are great for this with their prayers, bloodsecrator and wrathmongers give extra attacks to any khorne. Heres a sample list for you with plenty of hammers (Doombull, Bloodthirster, 2 x units of Bullgors) a decent anvil (Blood warriors- who can benefit from the goretide command ability to get onto an objective), screening units (2 x flesh hounds, Gors), a fast flanker (chaos knights) and solid support (2 x slaughterpriests, bloodsecrator, wrathmongers). Everything has a role to play and it has 143 wounds to chew through!; Allegiance: Khorne- Slaughterhost: The GoretideMortal Realm: GhyranLeadersDoombull of Khorne (120)- General- Trait: Hew the Foe- Artefact: GhyrstrikeBloodsecrator (120)- Artefact: Thronebreaker's TorcSlaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Killing FrenzySlaughterpriest (100)- Blood Blessing: Bronzed FleshBloodthirster of Insensate Rage (270)Battleline10 x Gors of Khorne (70)5 x Flesh Hounds (100)5 x Flesh Hounds (100)10 x Blood Warriors (200)- Goreaxe & Gorefist- 1x GoreglaivesUnits3 x Bullgors of Khorne (160)3 x Bullgors of Khorne (160)5 x Wrathmongers (140)5 x Chaos Knights (160)- Ensorcelled WeaponsBattalionsBrass Despoilers (190)Total: 1990 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1
  22. Agent of Chaos
    Use several fast moving units such as flesh hounds across the table so at least some can get into melee and tie them up., remembering to use your bloodtithe for hero phase movement.
  23. Agent of Chaos
    Ive played a couple of meeting engagement games. Didnt hate it, didnt love it. Its definitely got some flaws but is still viable to play and worth having a go for something a little different. Perhaps the problem is that a regular 1000 point matched play game on a 4' x 4' table is perfectly viable without the funky rules. Also AOS itself is approaching the point of bloat where there are so many rules and books needed to play a regular game (rulebook, GHB, Army book, Malign Sorcery, FAQ's, Errata...), the addition of meeting engagement rules is too much and not necessary.
  24. Agent of Chaos
    I can second this. I have tried to incorporate the bloodcrushers and cannon into my games but they performed as expected (poorly) and for the same 270 points you can take a bloodthirster... thats a no brainer for me. You dont even really want to summon them as Bloodletters, Flesh hounds and obviously bloodthirsters are all better summoning options.
  25. Agent of Chaos
    Looking for painting tips before I start on a bloodthirster. Right from the start I'm unsure what to use for undercoating. I typically spray everything in chaos black and then if its going to be predominantly red, another spray of Mephiston Red. This leads to a darker overall tone for my models so if I want a particular detail to pop (bright red on a banner for example) I will paint a layer of white first. I really want the thirster to pop on the table and be a fairly bright centre piece to the army and so am considering spray undercoating in white. However I have had a bad experience with white spray before where it dried thick and flaky and made the models virtually unpaintable. Would people recommend a white spray undercoat? Any other tips for undercoating to ensure I get a smooth finish ready for painting?
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