Let's chat Disciples of Tzeentch

[Nico]

Quote

1.If I cast Scintillating Simulacra on a Terrorgheist - do his wound rolls of 6 still trigger Maw ability? Or if it autofails - they dont?
2.Also can the opposing player choose not to reroll his hit\wound after getting Scintillating Simulacra debuff? Rerolls say "you can reroll" so my guess he can choose not to.

(1) The special rule is done after any modifier applies (there's an FAQ answer on this point in relation to the Screamer's sixes to ones rule). Hence those 6s are changed to failed wounds and so do not have the effect of the buff. It cannot be a miss which also does mortal wounds in other words.

(2) As you suggest, if they have a rule which allows them to reroll their misses, then that will likely be discretionary (may reroll), so they can choose not to reroll the misses, leaving them as misses, which then become hits due to Scintillating Simulacra.

[boelimaa]

Hello there

I'm Thomas and next week I will be playing my first local AoS tournament with 1000points (2+battleline). I would appreciate some tips for which traits, lore and artifacts, which one's would you suggest for this kind of list?

The models I own are the start collecting box, a box of blue/brimstone's, the ogroid, skyfires, 10 pink horror's, curseling and the blue scribes. If you see something more ideal i am open for any suggestion. Also a play strategy tip would be helpful.

Thanks in advance mates

Tzeentch 1'000p (Scrollbuilder: http://bit.ly/2oMisQw)

---------------------

Leaders
Ogroid Thaumaturge (160)
The Blue Scribes (120)
Herald Of Tzeentch (120)
Battleline

Pink Horrors (140)

Pink Horrors (140)

Units
Burning Chariots of Tzeentch (160)

Tzaangor Skyfires (160)

Total: 1000

---------------------

---------------------

[Nico]

I had a good game with my Hosts Duplicitous list today against James Grant's Aetherstrike Force. I went first and zapped a lot of his toys and debuffed his Judicators. James double turned me - taking off the Gaunt and one LoC. Despite heavy losses I was able to clear out his big hitters with my second hero phase and grind down everything else.

James's list was solid but not brutal and would have benefitted from being a single drop army.

DD were bad (two 3s and three 2s) and I didn't use them for mortal wounds for a change. I'm still of the view that all the mechanics for regenerating or predetermining DD (e.g. The Arcanite Mega-Battalion which lets you set three of the DD to 6s) are utter junk if you cannot then use them for Mortal Wounds.

You would be mad to take Overseer's Fate Twisters too.

[Goodwin]

6 hours ago, boelimaa said:

Hello there

I'm Thomas and next week I will be playing my first local AoS tournament with 1000points (2+battleline). I would appreciate some tips for which traits, lore and artifacts, which one's would you suggest for this kind of list?

The models I own are the start collecting box, a box of blue/brimstone's, the ogroid, skyfires, 10 pink horror's, curseling and the blue scribes. If you see something more ideal i am open for any suggestion. Also a play strategy tip would be helpful.

Thanks in advance mates

Tzeentch 1'000p (Scrollbuilder: http://bit.ly/2oMisQw)

---------------------

Leaders
Ogroid Thaumaturge (160)
The Blue Scribes (120)
Herald Of Tzeentch (120)
Battleline

Pink Horrors (140)

Pink Horrors (140)

Units
Burning Chariots of Tzeentch (160)

Tzaangor Skyfires (160)

Total: 1000

---------------------

---------------------

 

I barely know what I'm doing at the best of time, but, I'll try!

I'd probably recommend Fold Reality on at least one unit.  Maybe take them on a Pink Horror unit so its harder for the enemy to get rid of it.  You could maybe double up with it, you won't get to cast it twice, but this way if one goes down you still have a backup.  This way your Pink Horrors and Skyfires should get a little more mileage.

It looks like a pretty solid shooty list to me.  Blue Scribes is a good idea for what you are packing.  I worry that you'll run out of things to cast, but I think with the Scribes around you can risk taking some of the harder to cast spells and maybe even get them off.

I'm always torn between Curseling and Ogroid.  You don't have much fighty stuff though so it may be worth keeping the Ogroid around.  In that case, I'd give him Treacherous Bond or Infusion Arcanum.  With TB he may be hard to take out if you are spitting wounds onto the Pink Horrors, and then Fold Reality-ing them back.  With Infusion he'd be rough in a fight but will be subject to regular character snipin'.

A Tzaangor Shaman instead of the HoT or the OT would probably help.  The Skyfires would be poppin' on 5+ instead of 6s.  I think the Herald has a decent spell and ability though, and the Ogroid is your only fighty unit though, so maybe that'd be risky.

That's the best I got.  There are a lot of people here that know things so hopefully they chime in.  Since I'm pretty green myself!

 

[AverageBoss]

2 hours ago, Goodwin said:

I barely know what I'm doing at the best of time, but, I'll try!

I'd probably recommend Fold Reality on at least one unit.  Maybe take them on a Pink Horror unit so its harder for the enemy to get rid of it.  You could maybe double up with it, you won't get to cast it twice, but this way if one goes down you still have a backup.  This way your Pink Horrors and Skyfires should get a little more mileage.

It looks like a pretty solid shooty list to me.  Blue Scribes is a good idea for what you are packing.  I worry that you'll run out of things to cast, but I think with the Scribes around you can risk taking some of the harder to cast spells and maybe even get them off.

I'm always torn between Curseling and Ogroid.  You don't have much fighty stuff though so it may be worth keeping the Ogroid around.  In that case, I'd give him Treacherous Bond or Infusion Arcanum.  With TB he may be hard to take out if you are spitting wounds onto the Pink Horrors, and then Fold Reality-ing them back.  With Infusion he'd be rough in a fight but will be subject to regular character snipin'.

A Tzaangor Shaman instead of the HoT or the OT would probably help.  The Skyfires would be poppin' on 5+ instead of 6s.  I think the Herald has a decent spell and ability though, and the Ogroid is your only fighty unit though, so maybe that'd be risky.

That's the best I got.  There are a lot of people here that know things so hopefully they chime in.  Since I'm pretty green myself!

 

Shaman is more mobile, and has a once per game ability to cast two spell. His exclusive spell is a D3 MW spell that replenishes Tzaangors. And increases Skyfire effectiveness in a way that can not be mimicked elsewhere

The Ogroid (or the MANotaur as he has been named at my game club), is tougher, pretty fighty, and one of the best targets for Arcane Transformation. He also does D3 MW on the charge (I always forget about that). His exclusive spell does D6 MW and replenishes Horror units.

I find both very useful, so I tend to run both. Also, they are both great models. Ogroid comes out at 60 more points though.

[Deathadder99]

On 28/03/2017 at 11:50 AM, Nico said:

I'm considering the Lord on Daemonic Mount as a superior choice. While he cannot get the -3 rend, he can still take Phantasmal Weapons (including on the Horse - for 4 attacks at 3+, 3+, -2, 2 damage - a great profile) and is insanely tanky, with a 4+ rerollable (who can benefit from cover) and a 5+ ward save vs mortal wounds; he also comes with a command ability; and is cheaper by 20 points.

The downside is that it doesn't have a spell, but none of the Daemon Lore spells are buffs that affect the caster only, so this is less of an issue.

 

On 28/03/2017 at 1:03 PM, Nico said:

I'm thinking as part of the Fatesworn Warband, which also puts the horse attacks from the Lord on DM up to -2 rend when combined with Phantasmal Weapons. It also let's the Lord on DM cast Arcane Bolt (for what it's worth). That way the Knights become decent (rend with Ensorcelled weapons and rend on the horses - and we all know that the mounts do more damage anyway*). Thinking 9 Knights. With a 5+ vs Mortals and a 6+ outright Ward they might even survive 30 seconds of the game against 18 Skyfires and other pew pew boredom.

*With the glorious exception of Dorghar the Everderping.

 

On 28/03/2017 at 0:56 PM, FunkyPunk said:

Agreed - Ive been eyeing up the lord a lot, I think I'm going to play around with it a lot after SCGT. 10 chaos knights to go with him are expensive but could be a good objective grabber, and not awful on the charge with the command ability.

Please let me know if either of you end up making a list with the Lord (EDIT: On Daemonic Mount) - I find him to be one of my favourite models and really tanky. I like the idea of Fatesworn Warband but I think all the Tzaangors are too strong to pass up on. Could be wrong though, the Rend is tasty... I also quite like Gorebeast Chariots but unfortunately Sayl is not Tzeentch marked so no Fate Dice shenanigans.

[blueguy203]

1 hour ago, Deathadder99 said:

 

 

Please let me know if either of you end up making a list with the Lord - I find him to be one of my favourite models and really tanky. I like the idea of Fatesworn Warband but I think all the Tzaangors are too strong to pass up on. Could be wrong though, the Rend is tasty... I also quite like Gorebeast Chariots but unfortunately Sayl is not Tzeentch marked so no Fate Dice shenanigans.

I wrote a list that included the LOC as well as some Tzaangors that i will be playtesting next weekend at a ITC tourny, here it is below:

All comments and criticisms are welcomed

www.warscrollbuilder.com
Norman - Allegiance: Tzeentch
Leaders
Lord Of Change (300)
- Lore of Change : Tzeentch's Firestorm

Tzaangor Shaman (120)
- General
- Command Trait : Arcane Sacrifice - Tzeentch Arcanite Hero
- Lore of Fate : Bolt of Tzeentch

Gaunt Summoner (100)
- Lore of Change : Fold Reality

Ogroid Thaumaturge (160)

- Artefact :Paradoxical Shield 
- Lore of Fate : Infusion Arcanum / Treacherous Bond

Units
10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change : Bolt of Tzeentch

10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change : Unchecked Mutation

10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)
10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)

20 x Tzaangors (360)
- 6 x Pair of Savage Blade
- 8 x Savage Greatblade
- 6 x Savage Blade & Arcanite Shield

9 x Tzaangor Skyfires (480)

Scenery
Balewind Vortex (100)

Total: 2000/2000
Leaders: 4/6 Battlelines: 3 (3+) Behemoths: 1/4 Artillery: 0/4

[Deathadder99]

1 hour ago, blueguy203 said:

I wrote a list that included the LOC as well as some Tzaangors that i will be playtesting next weekend at a ITC tourny, here it is below:

 

Sorry, I meant the Lord on Daemonic Mount that they were discussing. I haven't played much competitive Tzeentch, but your list looks good to me.

[TalesOfSigmar]

Hows the does the Blue Horror and Brimstone Horror split rule work in regards to reinforcement/summoning points?

Like if only two Pink horrors die and split into 4 Blue Horrors, is that all you can do as you've spent the reinforcement points for a unit of 10 even though 4 only appeared?

Cheers

[Dragonlover]

Does this book have it's own dedicated spell list? If yes, how does that work? Does every caster have access to the whole list, or do you pick spells pre game?

Dragonlover

[Killax]

1 minute ago, Dragonlover said:

Does this book have it's own dedicated spell list? If yes, how does that work? Does every caster have access to the whole list, or do you pick spells pre game?

Dragonlover

I'd highly suggest picking up the book. But to awnser your question, it does, how it works is up to your local area to decide. The book mentions that you could randomly generate them or pick as you like. 

The Wizard in question does have acces to the whole list but there are multiple Spell lists in Desciple of Tzeentch. Different Wizards have different acceses.

Cheers,

[DarkBlack]

3 minutes ago, Dragonlover said:

Does this book have it's own dedicated spell list? If yes, how does that work? Does every caster have access to the whole list, or do you pick spells pre game?

Dragonlover

You get one spell per wizard. The rules say pick or roll, so that depends on how you agree to play.

[Dragonlover]

Cool, cheers guys!

Dragonlover

[Nico]

Quote

Like if only two Pink horrors die and split into 4 Blue Horrors, is that all you can do as you've spent the reinforcement points for a unit of 10 even though 4 only appeared?

We debated this above in the thread. We concluded that you could top the unit up to 10 models (but not more) for various reasons.

[Kuma]

Trying out a funky list for tomorrow at a 2k GH tourney, single drop, only holding 1 blue and 1 brim for splitting. Lots of magic, lots of shooting...:

 

Allegiance: Chaos

Leaders
Gaunt Summoner (100)
- Artefact: Wellspring of Arcane Might 
- Lore of Fate: Glimpse the Future
Lord Of Change (300)
- General
- Trait: Magical Supremacy - Tzeentch Daemon Hero
- Artefact: Aura of Mutability 
- Lore of Change: Unchecked Mutation
Lord Of Change (300)
- Artefact: Wellspring of Arcane Might 
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
The Blue Scribes (120)
- Lore of Change: Tzeentch's Firestorm
The Changeling (140)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
Herald Of Tzeentch (120)
- Staff of Change 
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch

Battleline
10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch
10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change: Arcane Transformation
10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality

Units
10 x Brimstone Horrors Of Tzeentch (40)
10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)
10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)
10 x Brimstone Horrors Of Tzeentch (40)
10 x Brimstone Horrors Of Tzeentch (40)
1 x Exalted Flamers of Tzeentch (120)
10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)

Battalions
Changehost (60)
The Hosts Duplicitous (50)

Total: 2000/2000

[Kuma]

Ended up taking first with 3 major wins! The army was fun to play but has lots of moving parts.

Game one: Vs Daughters of khaine army--it was like my list was tailor made to fight against this. tabled em on 3

Game two: Vs shooty free peoples. MVP gaunt casting his spell so the blue scribes could learn..ended up getting first try. They then swapped about leaving smoking craters of big mobs of handgunners.

Game 3: Vs khorne list. killed all their characters by 3, unrevealed changling wins the game.

[Goodwin]

Nice work!

I hope to get to a tournament sooner or later myself.  I'm pretty Tzaangorcentric right now, but as long as a Nurgle release doesn't hit anytime soon I can see myself slowly building towards something like that. 

Blue Scribes are definitely on my want list.

Thanks for the report!

[boelimaa]

On 20.4.2017 at 5:18 AM, Goodwin said:

I barely know what I'm doing at the best of time, but, I'll try!

I'd probably recommend Fold Reality on at least one unit.  Maybe take them on a Pink Horror unit so its harder for the enemy to get rid of it.  You could maybe double up with it, you won't get to cast it twice, but this way if one goes down you still have a backup.  This way your Pink Horrors and Skyfires should get a little more mileage.

It looks like a pretty solid shooty list to me.  Blue Scribes is a good idea for what you are packing.  I worry that you'll run out of things to cast, but I think with the Scribes around you can risk taking some of the harder to cast spells and maybe even get them off.

I'm always torn between Curseling and Ogroid.  You don't have much fighty stuff though so it may be worth keeping the Ogroid around.  In that case, I'd give him Treacherous Bond or Infusion Arcanum.  With TB he may be hard to take out if you are spitting wounds onto the Pink Horrors, and then Fold Reality-ing them back.  With Infusion he'd be rough in a fight but will be subject to regular character snipin'.

A Tzaangor Shaman instead of the HoT or the OT would probably help.  The Skyfires would be poppin' on 5+ instead of 6s.  I think the Herald has a decent spell and ability though, and the Ogroid is your only fighty unit though, so maybe that'd be risky.

That's the best I got.  There are a lot of people here that know things so hopefully they chime in.  Since I'm pretty green myself!

 

 

On 20.4.2017 at 7:34 AM, AverageBoss said:

Shaman is more mobile, and has a once per game ability to cast two spell. His exclusive spell is a D3 MW spell that replenishes Tzaangors. And increases Skyfire effectiveness in a way that can not be mimicked elsewhere

The Ogroid (or the MANotaur as he has been named at my game club), is tougher, pretty fighty, and one of the best targets for Arcane Transformation. He also does D3 MW on the charge (I always forget about that). His exclusive spell does D6 MW and replenishes Horror units.

I find both very useful, so I tend to run both. Also, they are both great models. Ogroid comes out at 60 more points though.

 

 

Okey Guys, thanks alot for your precious tips. I just handed in my list as per below and attached. What do you think? .-D

Tzeentch 1'000 points: http://bit.ly/2pTyedp

Leaders
Herald Of Tzeentch (120)
- Staff of Change
- Lore of Change: Treason of Tzeentch
The Blue Scribes (120)
- Lore of Change: Tzeentch's Firestorm
Ogroid Thaumaturge (160)
- General Ability: Nexus of Fate
- Artefact: Timeslip Pendant
- Lore of Fate: Treacherous Bond

Battleline
Pink Horrors (140)
- Fold Reality
Pink Horrors (140)
- Treason of Tzeentch

Units
Burning Chariots of Tzeentch (160)
Tzaangor Skyfires (160)
 

 

 

Tzeentch_1000p.pdf

[RoloMcFury]

On 4/21/2017 at 3:48 PM, Kuma said:

Trying out a funky list for tomorrow at a 2k GH tourney, single drop, only holding 1 blue and 1 brim for splitting. Lots of magic, lots of shooting...:

 

Allegiance: Chaos

Leaders
Gaunt Summoner (100)
- Artefact: Wellspring of Arcane Might 
- Lore of Fate: Glimpse the Future
Lord Of Change (300)
- General
- Trait: Magical Supremacy - Tzeentch Daemon Hero
- Artefact: Aura of Mutability 
- Lore of Change: Unchecked Mutation
Lord Of Change (300)
- Artefact: Wellspring of Arcane Might 
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
The Blue Scribes (120)
- Lore of Change: Tzeentch's Firestorm
The Changeling (140)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
Herald Of Tzeentch (120)
- Staff of Change 
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch

Battleline
10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch
10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change: Arcane Transformation
10 x Pink Horrors Of Tzeentch (140)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality

Units
10 x Brimstone Horrors Of Tzeentch (40)
10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)
10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)
10 x Brimstone Horrors Of Tzeentch (40)
10 x Brimstone Horrors Of Tzeentch (40)
1 x Exalted Flamers of Tzeentch (120)
10 x Blue Horrors Of Tzeentch (50)

Battalions
Changehost (60)
The Hosts Duplicitous (50)

Total: 2000/2000

I've been playing a nearly identical list, with only 2 squads of Brimstones in the actual army and enough reinforcement points for a Balewind, one Blue + Brimstone, and then either another Blue + Brimstone or a summoned squad of Plaguebearers (just for the reach). So far, the only game I've lost was due to insufficient bubble-wrapping (had not played against the Clan Skyre deep strike insanity before...). I've taken to placing the Changeling near the bulk of the opposing army, only to swap it out with a squad of Pinks turn 1, locking them down for possibly two turns, with the Blues then Brimstones that follow. Playing a one-drop list also just feels dirty- dictating who goes first is a big deal.

[Kuma]

Oh, I like that idea of switching out the changeling. Didnt think of it...fun stuff you can try there

 

[Goodwin]

3 hours ago, boelimaa said:

Okey Guys, thanks alot for your precious tips. I just handed in my list as per below and attached. What do you think? .-D

Tzeentch 1'000 points: http://bit.ly/2pTyedp

Leaders
Herald Of Tzeentch (120)
- Staff of Change
- Lore of Change: Treason of Tzeentch
The Blue Scribes (120)
- Lore of Change: Tzeentch's Firestorm
Ogroid Thaumaturge (160)
- General Ability: Nexus of Fate
- Artefact: Timeslip Pendant
- Lore of Fate: Treacherous Bond

Battleline
Pink Horrors (140)
- Fold Reality
Pink Horrors (140)
- Treason of Tzeentch

Units
Burning Chariots of Tzeentch (160)
Tzaangor Skyfires (160)
Tzeentch_1000p.pdf

7

You're welcome!

I've been thinking of trying a similar setup with the Ogroid.  With Pinks being annoying as they are, plus Fold Reality, should be handy!

Goodluck.  Let us know!

[HorseOnABeachBall]

5 hours ago, Kuma said:

Oh, I like that idea of switching out the changeling. Didnt think of it...fun stuff you can try there

 

I don't think you can. The ability says Unit, which the changeling isn't. Thoughts ??

[Nico]

A single model is still a Unit.

[Nico]

The final game of the SCGT 2017 illustrated the Changeling deployment debate. Joe deployed the Changeling (correctly as a drop in the usual alternating drops). He deployed it behind enemy lines (in the deployment zone).

Soon afterwards, his opponent deployed a ring of Skyfires around them (which locks the Changeling in position). Then his opponent deployed his general within 3" (after Joe kindly let him redeploy it after a discussion). This would allow his opponent to reveal the Changeling in turn one.

The wording of the rule is unhelpfully ambiguous - but this example illustrates that an interpretation where the Changeling can only deploy in the deployment zone makes the Changeling trivial to counter (borderline absurd). I consider that the express reference to "territory" is to be preferred over the confusing interpretation that trivialises the Changeling.

 

[Goodwin]

Doesn't his warscroll state Territory?

In most scenarios isn't the table split in half with each player having half the table as their Territory.  They can only Deploy 12" away from enemy Territory.  So while your opponent has a 12" "Deployment zone," the Changeling can set up in their Territory, which is either side since half the table is your territory and half is the opponents?  So he can set up basically anywhere, EXCEPT for your own portion of your territory in between the center line and your Deployment zone.  So you either set him as normal in your "Deployment Zone" or you set him up in the enemy's territory (their side of the table).

I'm not sure I understand what the debate is?  Or am I reading something wrong?