shadowgra Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 hello everyone! posting here cause i have a big issue: follow the competitiveness or following my hobby (painting)? i love nurgle in all his forms, i swear it is even quite as good as khorne or other factions, but this maybe is a dream. nurgle is resilient but lacks damage. my actual force (i own an half of it) is based on pure mortals, and on the plaguetouched warband: resilience is the key of success, with tons of warriors (28) and blightkings (14), plus some more mobile (chariot) and utility stuffs, like bloab and harbinger. however i find really frustrating painting warriors, marauders and chariots, cause they offer very little from an hobbystic point of view (personal opinion). since i don't own a lot of bits and i have just started with conversions, i don't know if painting 16 warriors will be the end of my painting progress (already happened in the past). however i am really interested in trying out a new force, a mixed one, that i would enjoy more painting: i really like plaguebearers and plague drones, i have built a daemon prince on my own (that i think is quite good, based on a talos, with blightkings bits and other stuffs). the question is: "can a nurgle army, including blightkings and some daemons, be competitive at 2000, maybe basing itself on the tallyband formation?" i made a quick list, not perfect and not complete, but at least is a beginning: leaders: GUO 240 daemon prince 160 Battleline 20 plaguebearers 200 2*10 plaguebearers 2*100 Units 10 Blightkings 360 2*3 plague drones 440 this is a start (only 1600 points) but if u could help me in this challenge, maybe i won't have to stop painting (i hope ^^) sorry if my english wasn't enough correct, and ty for the replies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broxus Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 My recommendation is that you replace the demon prince with epidemus. That dude adds some scary good buffs to your army. THen consider a plague law catapult. I would make one of those plaguebearer units 30 strong to get their full buffs. Get the tallyband formation since it will help keep this formations full. Another crazy idea is get an extra units of blightkings and the Harbinger of decay as your general. This would allow you to give your blight kings a 5+ invul save and he can keep up with all of your army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herald of Chaos Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 Everyone seems to consider plague drones a great unit however I have stopped running them and have far greater and more consistent success taking unridden plaguetoads instead. Take a look and and at least consider them as an option, I have never been disappointed with these units, they always punch above their weight and are the embodiment of everything Nurgle. I would definitely agree with taking epidemus and at least 1 if not 2 plagueclaws at 2000 points also. The plagueclaws give Nurgle some much lacking reach and if fired at large units for the first turn will usually get you a nice high tally early in the game. Epidemus with his Nurgle wide buffs is the amazing, other factions wish they had someone even close to this guy and if your opponent really wants to take him out and deny you those buffs you can make that a very difficult and costly decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowgra Posted December 10, 2016 Author Share Posted December 10, 2016 I have seriously considered epidemius, and from him the plagueclaw catapult, however i play mostly against ironjawz and stormcast and i know for sure that i will almost never get the tally stacked This however might be an error by me (i have played not that much games in aos) About bk and harbinger, i already have an harbinger of decay from my previous army, so this is perfectly possible! About the plaguetoads are they really that strong? at least drones dish out mortal wounds, they cost a lot tho. don't u miss the rend or the mortals from the drones bringing the toads? they seem to me like a chaff and tanky unit, aren't they? The daemon prince is a so bad idea in a tallyband? he has -2 rend, with a 2+ save with mystic shield and regenerates d3 per turn, which is rather high! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herald of Chaos Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 6 minutes ago, shadowgra said: I have seriously considered epidemius, and from him the plagueclaw catapult, however i play mostly against ironjawz and stormcast and i know for sure that i will almost never get the tally stacked This however might be an error by me (i have played not that much games in aos) About bk and harbinger, i already have an harbinger of decay from my previous army, so this is perfectly possible! About the plaguetoads are they really that strong? at least drones dish out mortal wounds, they cost a lot tho. don't u miss the rend or the mortals from the drones bringing the toads? they seem to me like a chaff and tanky unit, aren't they? The daemon prince is a so bad idea in a tallyband? he has -2 rend, with a 2+ save with mystic shield and regenerates d3 per turn, which is rather high! You make good points, the only way to really find out what will work for you is to try it. Players can make some pretty good units fail by not using them properly and can also make other overlooked units terrifying if you have a plan in mind which works for you. You can get advice but how it all runs together comes down to how you play it and what works for you may not work for some of us and vice versa. Epidemus is much less effective against factions like stormcast and ironjaws, if you don't play against anything else then Epidemus probably wont make as much of an impact. He can still give some nice little bonuses though, just not as quickly or as much as against other factions, plus most people really want to get rid of him for any bonuses he has so he can be a good way to take some focus off other units in your army. The harbinger is a good choice for a mortal army, especially if you already have the model your already set. I generally run more daemons so I don't get much from having him around. Plagueclaws I think would still be a very good option against stormcast and ironjaws, even if you just bring a single one. They might not be removing units but you can take shots at those buffing characters which can either kill them or at least strip some wounds off and probably most importantly, your opponent will want to put some thought into where they move those characters and if they want to risk taking the hit rather then letting them have free reign to move about and get wherever they are wanted. The plaguetoads I do think are really that strong, I have yet to play a game with them (and I have been playing with them a lot lately) where I don't want to order some more. They are a rock, nothing moves them, and they do a surprising amount of damage, point for point I find just as much if not more then plague drones, though I have not actually run the math on that yet for some reason since I do for pretty much everything. These could just be an example though of a unit that works for me and my play style but not for others. I don't like daemon princes, they just don't work for me, I probably use them wrong. Other people I have watched or played against seem to have varying degrees of success with them, sometimes they do well sometimes they don't, but it still feels to me like they more often then not fall into the don't side. Their attacks seem good but they only hit with half of them, then after wounds not many get through. As I said in the beginning, give it a go and see if it works, your play style might just make great use of the prince. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiky Norman Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 1 hour ago, shadowgra said: The daemon prince is a so bad idea in a tallyband? he has -2 rend, with a 2+ save with mystic shield and regenerates d3 per turn, which is rather high! The Demon prince is pretty good as a mobile hero to follow the Drones, but he cannot be part of the Tallyband, so he does not regenerate d3. You can heal the prince with the Great Unclean One spell though, so keep that in mind. Also the -2 Rend is a very nice addition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 I will remove demon prince(-160) and put another unit of 6 plague drones+ tallyband battalion and u are ok:) anyway i think dp can be part of tallyband ( it says nurgle deamons) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James McPherson Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 the main problems Nurgle armies have are speed and punch . Survivability and tankiness are never really a problem, they are the perfect grindfest attritional army. Perfect anvil. They just don't have much of a hammer. That and they are slow. If you can find ways to get around those points, then you have a very strong / versatile force. You will find with the current set up you are great at sitting on objectives and blocking board space, but the missions where you need to move quick or remove high armored units from the table you will struggle with. You need a movement trick like Sayl the Faithless or Warp Grinder teams . The Plague Toads are good because they can fly and Drones are OK for the speed, but you really need a trick that can get you up the table really fast.. And you also need something that is super killy to take out those immovable units your opponent has. Consider Tamurkhan, Morbidex or or some Plague Monks, or maybe even some Knights or some Chosen or something . Blightkings aren't bad but they have big bases, a unit of 10 will be hard to get all into combat and move around the table and will get in the way of your other units, and they are super slow and they don't have any rend. more of an anvil unit. At the moment you have like 3 or 4 anvil units and only one or two fast medium hitting units in the Plague Drones, so your army will survive but can't kill much, and against Stormcast and Ironjaws that will be a problem as they are both quite tough/high armoured/fast/mobile. P.Monks are good because they are cheap, take a block of 30 for 210 pts or x2 blocks of 20 instead of the blightkings, and maybe stick a priest in there for another 80, that makes 360 pts. and instead of the Daemon Prince take a Sorceror Lord on horseback or foot or take Sayl the Faithless. With 30 PMonks that's at least 90 attacks on the charge with re-rolls to hit, and 6's to wound hit at -1 rend. You can make that 5+'s with a priest casting 'Wither'. Screen them behind a unit of plaguebearers so they don't get charged, and use them as a counter charge/support unit, or just A-bomb them into a unit using Sayl and watch the mayhem they cause. I've taken out a unit of 6 Treekin in one round of combat with them before , with loads of wounds to spare, and a Vamp Lord on Zombie Dragon in one round with just 20. Seriously they can kill anything, one of the most overlooked units in the game. You will find them putting out a lot of damage. The sorceror lord is great because he can give the same buffs to a unit as Epidemius (but only on one unit) but you don't have to wait for the tally too accrew. You could have him riding around with your knights or plaguedrones on horseback. You seem to have a pretty good list/collection already, I would just experiment adding one unit to it at a time, and finding out which ones work best for you and don't commit to too many purchases at once until you have a chance to play a few games with each one . Plagueclaws + Epidemius + Sayl + Plaguemonks + Plague Bearers + Drones would be my core choices in the long run I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiky Norman Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 37 minutes ago, Tizianolol said: I will remove demon prince(-160) and put another unit of 6 plague drones+ tallyband battalion and u are ok:) anyway i think dp can be part of tallyband ( it says nurgle deamons) Unless it's changed, then it specifies which units can be in the Tallyband, in which a Daemon Prince is not part of the list: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 I have fuond it in this article https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Age_of_Sigmar/Tactics/Edition_1.1/Daemons_of_Nurgle it says " nurgle demons" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 I have fuond it in this article https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Age_of_Sigmar/Tactics/Edition_1.1/Daemons_of_Nurgle it says " nurgle demons" i mean if you mark a demon prince with nurgle he got keyword nurgle and deamon I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted December 10, 2016 Share Posted December 10, 2016 i think you right, so the site is prob not Clare ..:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowgra Posted December 11, 2016 Author Share Posted December 11, 2016 Ah i knew daemon of nurgle too, oh well peace So lets rearrange ideas a bit 1) since toads cant join the tallyband are automatically a worse choice (plus they are so expensive) 2) about the making a list with the harbinger, i think that maybe is the best option for me, maybe with another blightking unit and removing the prince for something else. also he can stay with the drones for their extra punchiness. the catapult i think is too weak as a one of, am i that wrong? 3) punchy units: u said morbidex and tamurkhan. while the last wont survive without an harbinger buffing him (he is really overcosted), morbidex is always quite interesting on the profile point of view, even if i'll be forced to run nurglings. otherwise i think that orghotts, with his command ability, can be even stronger than him, buffing kings and drones to dangerous levels. Another really strong unit are bile trolls, really shooty and punchy And the soulgrinder i think is the best monster we can possibly have, with good tankyness, fire and melee About skaven in general: i's not that i think they're weak, but i think that they do not connect very well with the rest of the army in terms of flavour. call me an idiot, but for me the aestethic beauty of an army is the most important factor So without the prince we are at 1440 points! choices includes: Harbinger, more plaguebearers, more drones, more bk, toads, trolls, tamurkhan, morbidex, orghotts, sorcerer, catapult, plague monks One could be: Tallyband 100 Leaders Harbinger of decay 140 Guo 240 Battleline 20 plaguebearers 200 2*10 plaguebearers 200 Units: 2*3 plague drones 440 10 blightkings 360 5 blightkings 180 1 beast of nurgle 60 Another coud be with morbidex and a unit of nurglings and the same structure Or i could drop the tallyband, even if i think is a really good battalion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted December 11, 2016 Share Posted December 11, 2016 @shadowgra I like that, an idea can be play only 2x5 blightkings and 10 warrior of nurgle ( if you need rend)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broxus Posted December 11, 2016 Share Posted December 11, 2016 As i said earlier if you want to be competitive with Nurgle using Epidemus is an absolute must (he can also be part of tallyband). Also you need one solid 30 block of plaguebears. Never run Blightkings in units of 10 because they become less effective due to the champoin not gaining an extra wound and less attempts on their discharge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowgra Posted December 11, 2016 Author Share Posted December 11, 2016 ok then a list with epidemius and tallyband coud be like this: Tallyband 100 Leaders Epidemius 180 GUO 240 Battleline Plaguebearers 300 plaguebearers 100 plaguebearers 100 Units 5 putrid blightkings 180 5 putrid blightkings 180 6 drones 440 3 beasts of nurgle 180/ plagueclaw catapult (splitting drones in 2 units) 2000 points very daemon based army, i think i covered almost everything, got a bunch of models, a wizard, mortal wounds, kings, huge pb block and epidemius. for a more mixed army without the tallyband (sort of good stuffs) could i do include the glottkins, along with 30 plaguebearers? or to make him worthy is just a dream? cause the miniature is awesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted December 11, 2016 Share Posted December 11, 2016 I think tallyband is so strong ,I'll drop 5 blightkings and epidemius for 6 plaguedrone more..2 units of them are really strong with the battalion, and they make your list faster..I think one unit of blightkings is enought!:) - epidemius is good but 2 unit of drones buffed with tallyband is better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowgra Posted December 11, 2016 Author Share Posted December 11, 2016 For the blightkings i really wanna use ten, cause i think they are really strong and i own them, so i will play ten of them. So epidemius yes or no? keep in mind i am almost always against stormcast and ironjawz This is mandatory to clarify, cause i am getting confused ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tizianolol Posted December 11, 2016 Share Posted December 11, 2016 I think epidemius is not bad, but if you play tallyband I think 2x6 drones are better then epidemius and 5 blightkings..i think 5 blightkings are enought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoe Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 I get the sense that Monofaction armies are going to be very good, but always closer to fluffy than to competitive. In order to get the best, you have to pick and mix from your Grand Alliance. It's not that Monofaction is bad, but the rest is so good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowgra Posted December 12, 2016 Author Share Posted December 12, 2016 maybe this can be the final list (i hope) decided to drop epidemius cause i think that against an army with 32 models (ironjawz of ma friend) if i already killed 21 to get the final buff i have already won. also the other buff are yes good indeed, but make up for a really high cost, a weak profile and the protection he needs. this doesn't mean that he is weak or else, i only don't find him the best fit in this particular context. so i think i will use one of these 2 lists: 1 Tallyband 100 GUO 240 Harbinger of decay 140 30 Plaguebearers 300 2*10 plaguebearers 200 2*5 blightkings 360 2*3 drones 440 3 beasts 180/ 3 drones i left 40 points over playing beasts. have huge block of pb, mobility with drones and same stuffs as above. 2 tallyband 100 GUO 240 morbidex 260 30 plaguebearers 300 10 plaguebearers 100 10 plaguebearers 100 3 nurglings 80 6 drones 440 2*5 blightkings 360 20 points left this is meant to work with morbidex pumping out nurglings, all followed by a tallyband and a big unit of drones. @Shoe i know but i really love these ****** rotten characters, there is nothing i can do about it,... maybe in the future i will build a good stuff list, with all the nice things chaos has to offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoe Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 Just now, shadowgra said: @Shoe i know but i really love these ****** rotten characters, there is nothing i can do about it,... maybe in the future i will build a good stuff list, with all the nice things chaos has to offer. I wasn't faulting, you buddy! I love fluffy concept lists. Particularly when they are tough. The Nurgle 1k list I am working on is Glottkin, 10 Blight Kings and a Harbinger of decay: The Glottkin and it's guard. I'm certain I will lose many scenarios, but I'm looking forward to playing it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Lyons Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 While this may not be the direction you want to go, I would suggest dropping the Tallyband completely. Instead, if you want mono-Nurgle, build on whats good and shore up the weaknesses. I might suggest something like this: 480 Glottkin 180 Epidemius 140 Mounted Chaos Sorcerer Lord 160 Sayl 300 30 Plaguebearers 120 20 Chaos Marauders 60 10 Chaos Marauders 180 Plagueclaw Catapult 180 Plagueclaw Catapult 180-200 5 Blightkings or 3 Bile Trolls Plaguebearers are a staple and Glottkin does a surprising job of making them even better. His command ability doubles their attacks and his spell doubles their wounds. Epidemius is the best buffer in the game but he works best with early wounds, hence the double plagueclaw catapults. Epidemius also triggers the save rerolls on the plague bearers. The Chaos Marauders help fill out the battleline requirements and are great to stick on the off objectives. Sayl makes up for the lack of mobility (i.e. Plague drones) by granting any unit in your force an 18" fly movement (much better than the plague drone's 8"). This allows you to get those units on those objectives when you need them. The mounted sorcerer lord is probably the most contentious addition but this mobile hero (12" move; good for places of power) allows you to buff strategic units with a spell that rerolls 1s to hit, wound, and save from the outset. While Epidemius will do some of this (hit and wound) later, he can buff one of the catapults turn 1 to make sure it lands. He provides a backup to losing Epidemius (who may get assassinated) and can alternatively arcane bolt when Epidemius is at full strength. This leaves an additional 200 points to pick up 5 Blightkings or 3 Bile Trolls to increase your damage. Depending on your meta, I might suggest dropping the 2nd plague claw for a second unit of Blightkings as well. Alternatively, you could drop the Sorcerer and convert the unit of 10 marauders into a unit of 20 Plaguebearers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoe Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 34 minutes ago, Thomas Lyons said: 160 Sayl I think I'm confused about Sayl. He doesn't have the Nurgle Keyword, does he? Can he be marked like the other STD units? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Lyons Posted December 12, 2016 Share Posted December 12, 2016 2 minutes ago, Shoe said: I think I'm confused about Sayl. He doesn't have the Nurgle Keyword, does he? Can he be marked like the other STD units? Technically, Sayl isn't Nurgle although he is functionally an unmarked Chaos Sorcerer who is part of Tamurkhan's army (which is Nurgle). No, he can't be marked but he is too useful for a Nurgle force (which is traditionally slow) not to include him in the force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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