Slain when Fleeing from battleshock

[Dan.Ford]

Do you get blue horrors from pink ‘if’ the pinks died due to battle shock.

I personally think the ‘flee’ part is inferring that they run away off the table and counts as slain.

Well .. in Death frenzy if a model is ‘slain’ you can Pile in and Attack . 

Not once did I pile in and attack when I failed battleshock test. I also did Not get kicked in the nuts 

[Marc Wilson]

Nooo, no no - careful here.  'Slain' and 'Counts as slain' are two different things, in the same manner as 'as if it were' is different from 'is'.

i.e. 'as if it were the combat phase' does not mean it is the combat phase, and 'counts as slain' is not 'slain' - it's simply the easiest mechanism for you to remove your models from the table.

 

 

[amysrevenge]

Follow-up question.

How do we know what elements of "slain" are and are not included under the umbrella of "counts as slain"?

Is it obvious that it counts for kill points but does not count for the Pink->Blue Horror spawn?  Where and how would we find a reference for which functions of "slain" that "counts as slain" will fulfil and which it won't?

 

The most conservative reading would parallel "as if it were the combat phase", which it turns out actually means "not as if it were the combat phase at all".

Edited June 24, 2019 by amysrevenge

[King Taloren]

The “count as slain” is only for scoring purposes and for abilities to that return slain models to the field as some battle plans look for number of models slain in combat for tiebreaker. (Partly because initially some rules lawyer was saying that models that fled in the battleshock phase weren’t slain and therefore couldn’t come back to the unit so GW has to fix it and say they count as.)

They are not actually slain in combat and do not activate any abilities that work when they are  slain normally. Much how the endless spells do not trigger any abilities when they wound/slay units at  the start of the turn. 

[Isotop]

16 hours ago, amysrevenge said:

Follow-up question.

How do we know what elements of "slain" are and are not included under the umbrella of "counts as slain"?

Is it obvious that it counts for kill points but does not count for the Pink->Blue Horror spawn?  Where and how would we find a reference for which functions of "slain" that "counts as slain" will fulfil and which it won't?

 

The most conservative reading would parallel "as if it were the combat phase", which it turns out actually means "not as if it were the combat phase at all".

I agree with your critical review. There is basically no reference on what "count as being slain" means.

[Isotop]

26 minutes ago, King Taloren said:

Guess it’s a new one to toss at the FAQ guys in GW then. Or rather an old one they need to reclassify because I know for certain they used to say models fleeing in battleshock do not get to use abilities.

A quotation/reference for backing this belief of yours would go a long way.

[King Taloren]

8 minutes ago, Isotop said:

A quotation/reference for backing this belief of yours would go a long way.

The problem is it looks like it was deleted/removed from where it used to be. Otherwise I would.

 

Though oddly enough this is a rule still in 40k About models leaving the battlefield from battleshock. Could be one they forgot to transfer to Sigmar 2.0 like the 1s always failure and don’t trigger abilities regardless of modifiers.

Edited June 25, 2019 by King Taloren

[King Taloren]

Guess it’s a new one to toss at the FAQ guys in GW then. Or rather an old one they need to reclassify because I know for certain they used to say models fleeing in battleshock do not get to use abilities.

Edited June 25, 2019 by King Taloren

[Charleston]

Units running away count as slain. Therefore any rules, that apply when a unit is slain, apply also when a unit runs away. Also models that run away are counted towards mission goals/victory points as if they were slain by an enemy.

Rules like "No Respite" usualy especially mention, that they can be used whenever a Unit is Slayed in the Combat step.

"Dreaded Death Frenzy" of the Verminlord Warbringer doesn´t mention this. Therefore you could use the rule in the battleshock phase, too.