'Competitive' Ironjawz

[Malakithe]

4 hours ago, N_Watson said:

Your list has no mortal wounds so you would need to either tie it up all game (possible) or try and avoid it.  You certainly can't kill it. 

I think that we kinda need to just suck it up and take the Mawcrusher and at least 1 shaman to be able to deal with things like this. You just need to make sure you get the most out of them by doing all you can to get the charge and not wasting a cast on Foot of Gordon (agree with  @Chris Tomlin on this one)          

Bah that's true. Against high armor and mystic shield plus other save buffs not even brutes can touch that.

So back to the list with a Shaman lol

[N_Watson]

8 minutes ago, Malakithe said:

Bah that's true. Against high armor and mystic shield plus other save buffs not even brutes can touch that.

So back to the list with a Shaman lol

Like, if you are able to pick your list for your apponent, I think the list without mortal wounds would be really strong against some armies. But when you have no sideboard I don't know how smart it is to take no unbind and no mortal wound  output. 

[N_Watson]

Alright my budget before year end allows for one more purchase. 

I am currently running a 2k list with Gordrakk so I need one more unit to be able to run the list with the normal megaboss on maw crusher. 

Current list includes 15 brutes 10 ardboys and 3 goregruntas. 

This was my first AOS army so not overly fussed with winning everything at this point. Just want to pick the best option between another 5 brutes or another 10 ardboys.  

What would you lot go for? 

[Malakithe]

15 brutes should be fine running with gordrakk. If you drop him down to a normal maw-krusha then you can have more bodies. More bodies for ironjawz is usually a good idea no matter what

[N_Watson]

3 hours ago, Malakithe said:

15 brutes should be fine running with gordrakk. If you drop him down to a normal maw-krusha then you can have more bodies. More bodies for ironjawz is usually a good idea no matter what

So would you go for another 5 brutes if dripping Gordrakk or 10 ardboys? 

[Chris Tomlin]

As you're posting in the 'Competitive' Ironjawz thread I would suggest the Ardboyz. Get some extra bodies on the table to help out with objectives. Give them shields where possible as well.

If you posted elsewhere, I'd say Brutes because they are far superior models!  

[Garxia]

Definitely a 2nd Ardboys unit.

I don't feel safe without 20 of them (too few bodies in the army), and brutes suffer from battleshock if not Inspiring Presenced.

[Lord Biscuit]

I agree with the 'ardboy assessment, they might not be as killy as brutes but as a unit they are a bit more independent, their bravery is higher and they can charge further distances with the right loadouts. As such they can be trusted to tackle a unit or objective and hold the line (it takes about 6 wounds to trigger a bravery check, something that's only done better by the Goregrunter.) without having to make the boss hold them up. Yet despite being a little inferior on the offense, if they receive a Waagghhh perk they are chucking about as many attacks.

 

Brutes are brilliant but they do need boss supervision to make sure they do their job proper, or at the very least they need to be proactively engaging targets rather then receiving attacks. Losing a brute hurts and losing brutes to battle shock is even more painful

[Jamie Grinstead]

I'm fairly new to the competitive side of Ironjawz and I was wondering, how do you typically arm out your Ardboys?

[Braggoth]

I go for the rend weapons, they get better if the opponent has a 2+ save character. It's true that the 3 attacks are superior in all other cases, but I find myself killing units at the same pace with either weapons, so having the opponent hit back with a couple more models isn't a huge deal as the Ardboyz can take the beating.

[LortOlle]

6 hours ago, Braggoth said:

I go for the rend weapons, they get better if the opponent has a 2+ save character. It's true that the 3 attacks are superior in all other cases, but I find myself killing units at the same pace with either weapons, so having the opponent hit back with a couple more models isn't a huge deal as the Ardboyz can take the beating.

Wait, what? You suggest 2handers even though you know they are only better in real corner cases that rarely happen and say that one handers are better in all other cases? Go two one handers, if you realy want to min-max, take a few shields in the back line to take the first wounds on.

Saying that not killing more is fine because they can take a beating is weird as well. Of course you want to kill the opponent as fast as possible?

If you like the look of 2-handers more, just say so because this reasoning is strange.

[N_Watson]

I would go with a mix. For myself I will run one unit of 2hander with rend and two units dual wielding. Each unit having 3 shields. Things like kurnoth hunters re-rolling saves will just shrug off the dual wielders. And when you consider the Waaagh buff, in practice I find rend to be kin in those scenarios. 

If you plan on playing over 1000 games for your rolls to average out, do the math. It probably doesn't make all that much of a difference otherwise. 

In before people start talking about fractions of a wound.     

[Braggoth]

6 hours ago, LortOlle said:

Wait, what? You suggest 2handers even though you know they are only better in real corner cases that rarely happen and say that one handers are better in all other cases? Go two one handers, if you realy want to min-max, take a few shields in the back line to take the first wounds on.

Saying that not killing more is fine because they can take a beating is weird as well. Of course you want to kill the opponent as fast as possible?

If you like the look of 2-handers more, just say so because this reasoning is strange.

I'm sure it looks weird to you, but in my meta, almost everyone are playing big behemoth deathstars (maybe I should have said that sooner haha), 9/10 of the armies are like that here. But yeah , if not take the double weapons, that's what I was doing for a long time, until everyone was fielding Alarielle, Archaon, Nagash, Terrorgeists, Frostlords and so on

And also, with the Waagh buff, the difference becomes very negligible, but if you're running Gordrakk, rend weapons are the best to have a heavy burst early game.

[Anaticula]

So, you can just carry a few shields and apply the first wounds to them? That is ... weird. But I understand it is technically possible.

 

[Chris Tomlin]

@Jamie Grinstead@Anaticula - There is a good thread specifically about how to equip Ardboyz here;

It was started some time ago and could probably do with some updated opinions tbh. I've played loads of competitive/tournament games now (still have another 15 to report on my thread) and am convinced Ardboyz are a crucial unit if you want to get the best out of Ironjawz in competitive matched play. More to the point, I believe that arming them entirely with shields is the optimal load out. Currently I don't have the models painted so used mostly 'uge choppas as aesthetically I prefer them, but acknowledge this is the weakest choice.

[Anaticula]

Ah thanks  @Chris Tomlin

That is some very interesting information. I have only one unit painted which is equipped with 3 'uge choppas and the rest with two melee weapons; so I will do the other unit with shields.

[Jamie Grinstead]

Thanks for the replies everyone, it has been really useful hearing everyone's experiences and to see how it can vary depending on what everyone else is playing locally.

I think the fact that the Ardboys can have that mixed approach means I can have some fun playing around with the different weapon options to begin with. I may start with a few with shields in each unit as @N_Watson has done as that seems like a good way to see how they will do.

Thanks for that link to the other thread @Chris Tomlin, I've had a look through that one as well although it was largely discussing arming Brutes which I was a bit more comfortable with

[Dez]

I've already got 20 built with 'Uge Choppaz. I think I'll be using them as the first assault wave, as with the drummer they can get a 1 turn charge pretty easily. This makes them a threat that can't be ignored, and while unwieldy will still be able to tie up multiple units and hopefully I can get some units of Brutes into combat to bring the paint. 

I've still got an insane amount of Ardboyz to build, but I'm thinking shields are the way to go now too.

[Chris Tomlin]

1 hour ago, Jamie Grinstead said:

Thanks for that link to the other thread @Chris Tomlin, I've had a look through that one as well although it was largely discussing arming Brutes which I was a bit more comfortable with

Hey @Jamie Grinstead, sorry I initially linked to the wrong topic. I have since edited my post. This one should be more useful for Ardboyz!

[Cthulhus Lawyer]

On my local scene I tend to play against a lot of 3+ armor saves so my list is tailored after rending and all out Choppiness 
Ive been running this list 

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (520)
- General
- Trait: Might is Right ( May be overkill )
- Artefact: Battle Brew

Orruk Megaboss (140)

- Artefact: Battle Brew
Orruk Warchanter (80)
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)

Units
Orruk Brutes x 10 (360) (Gore Hacka )
Orruk Brutes x 5 (180)
Orruk Brutes x 5 (180)
Orruk Ardboys x 20 (360) ( 2H Choppa )

Behemoths

War Machines

Batallions
Ironfist (60)

Total: 2000/2000

[Dez]

I'd consider taking Wild Fury over Might is Right and the Talisman of Protection over Battle Brew. I still think Ravager is the best Command Trait.

[N_Watson]

@Cthulhus Lawyer I like the list!

I do second @Dez though about Ravager and Talisman on the Mawcrusher. I do tend to make my Megaboss on foot the general though as making the Mawcrusher the general is like keeping him on a leash for command abilities. 

I have tried out Bellowing Tyrant a bunch and it is a solid choice as well. Especially against things like Sylvaneth and Death that can stack a lot of negatives to hit. Nullifying a -2 to hit can really throw your opponent. 

I haven't found the energy to build any more Ardboys, so I am currently playing with the same as you, but with 3 Goregruntas instead. Everyone says they are bad. Hell, I think they are bad as well, but I tell you, they always bloody surprise me... 

On paper, anything else is better, but this is a dice game and they have pulled off things for me that Brutes and Ardboys would have a hard time doing due to mobility restrictions. Not saying you should run loads of them, by any means, but if you haven't tried them, maybe give them a go.

I tend to use them to block for my Mawcrusher. They have big bases, so they can block pile ins on him and due to their move speed, have an easy time keeping up. Tend to make them my Ironfist boss as well, purely because having the +2 wounds on the brutes, leaves you with just one brute at the end, but I use the Goregruntas to tank anyway, so the extra 2 wounds is welcome. 

[Drillz]

Has anyone had any luck against the stormcast skyborne slayers lists because it just seems to have so many mortal wound and they are build to give a good brawl

[Malakithe]

That goes into 2 of the main issues for ironjawz. No way to defend against MW, same with stormcast, and no MW output. 

We have Maw-Krusha and Weirdnob for MW and that's it. Tanky armies are tough which is why in want to opt for a hybrid Ironfist/Weirdfist. 

[Nocturnic]

hey guys,

just wondering if anyone is having a tough time vs slyvaneth. i seem to get slammed everytime.

i usually have:

1 megabosses

1 maw krusha

1 shammy

1 warchanter

5 brutes x3

10 ard boyz

6 gruntas

in an Ironfist

@ 2000 pts

 

any suggestions/ advice/thoughts?