WAAAGHdogg15

It's not completely clear though is it? It clearly denies LRL the ability to cast a spell of higher value than 9, but what if I wanted to cast, for example, Arcane Bolt - casting value 5? I'm modifying the roll to a 10 or higher but I'm not casting a spell that has a casting value of 10 or higher, so I'm in line with the FAQ, right? I'm not saying this is correct, but it is a legitimate interpretation of the FAQ, no?

Apologies if this has been answered elsewhere or is common knowledge, a search of the site didn't throw anything up. Lumineth Realmlords ability "Deep Thinkers" allows a spell to be automatically cast with a casting roll of 9. The spell can still be unbound, but it doesn't say anything about modifying that roll of 9. I.e. if I am Zaitrec (+1 to cast) or standing next to arcane terrain etc, can I modify this automatic "roll" to make it higher? Can it be modified down by opponents' abilities or is it always just 9?

That makes sense. Presumably the same would be true for double 1 when casting then? The d3 MW could be taken by the unit, not just the high sentinel? Still seems a bit janky to me - it's not like pink horrors where they're all wizards as long as the unit is a certain size, but I think your explanation shows the rules can be applied the same way.

Thanks for pointing out the FAQ. That makes it slightly clearer. I think the wording of the Khorne ability would still mean that the caster (high sentinel) would take the first lot of wounds, so in my example it would be the high sentinel plus 5 others. The Khorne ability specifically says it targets the caster. You would then apply the core rules as per the FAQ, I think. So maybe it's still not 100% clear...

An interesting debate emerged from a recent game of mine in which I, as a Lumineth player, faced a Khorne army. The bloodthirster general had the ability (I forget its name) that if he unbound a casting attempt on an 8, the caster took D6 mortal wounds. During the game, one of my high sentinels (sentinel champion in the unit) was unbound in such a manner when trying to cast Power of Hysh. My opponent rolled a 6 for the mortal wounds roll - so far, no problem. The question is, where do you distribute the mortal wounds? The wording is that it is the caster who takes them and the high sentinel is the only caster in that unit. Does he therefore take all 6 and you just remove him from the unit? Alternatively, the core rules state that when applying damage to a unit, wounds roll over onto additional models in this kind of scenario, so effectively the high sentinel would die and 5 other men from the unit. Thirdly, could I even just choose for 6 normal sentinels to die? I think this is most unlikely because they aren't casters, so the high sentinel must have to take something, right? We played it the first way with just the high sentinel dying, but I have since had debate with other players that we should have done it the second way. Would be intrigued to know what the masses think. 😃

Random post. Just wanted to tell the story of a three game, one day tournament I attended this weekend. I was running Lumineth, but all three of my opponents were Sylvaneth! Each army was quite different - I lost to a warsong revenant with quite a lot of different units around it, beat a list with 2xTLA and 2xDurthu and then also won vs Alarielle. It's made me really think about Sylvaneth lists again (they were my first ever AoS army, right back at the start). Biggest question for me is, do we think Alarielle is worth it? I'm thinking she is as long as you can keep her alive for at least 2 turns. I'm thinking of trying out Alarielle, Arch Revenant and 4x3 kurnoth hunters in some form or other (with her creating a fifth unit in turn 1). I think hunters are really good for their points, despite being quite expensive on the face of it. Would be interested in the thoughts of regular players.

8.0 describes a situation before the move takes place. 9.4 describes something during the action of moving, so I don't see why the fly rule would be able to ignore 8.0. In terms of wording - "pick 1 friendly unit that is more than 3" away from all enemy units" followed by "you can ignore other models and terrain features when you trace the path of its move across the battlefield." You only start to trace the path of movement across the battlefield after you have selected the unit, so I would say no, you can't fly out of combat using this interpretation. I don't think 8.1 is an issue as long as we agree on the above. You must start and end outside of 3" but "can ignore other models and terrain features" during the actual act of moving. So personally, I don't think there is a 'rules as written' argument here - I think the wording is clear.

I would agree that Arzalyn is correct, it is a set up rather than a move and therefore isn't a retreat. There are a number of other units for which this is the same. As long as it doesn't specify that it counts as your movement and doesn't specifically say that you cannot shoot/charge etc after doing it, then I would say you are still free to do those things.

Something came up in a game I played last night that I had never considered before. I out deployed my opponent and gave them first turn. We both deployed on our "home" objective in the Nidus Paths, so at the end of my opponent's first turn he was holding his objective and I was still deployed on mine. For the purpose of scoring at the end of his turn, he clearly holds one objective, but doesn't hold two. The tricky bit is, does he hold more objectives, since I hadn't had a turn yet and therefore hadn't actually claimed my objective yet, even though I had about 20 Expert Conquerors deployed on it?

Just to check understanding on this, if I park a purple sun next to, say, Kairos Fateweaver and roll a 1, he’s slain? I’m guessing this wouldn’t work for mega gargants due to their warscroll rule, but they would take d6 MW?

So far, I very much like what I have seen of AoS 3.0. It's early days and I have only played one game at time of writing, but there is a lot to like from my experience so far. The thing I like most is the absence (so far) of cookie cutter mentality. There are so many more decisions and so much more uncertainty - to take Galletian Vets or not? To take the new battalions or not? To give away turn priority or not? etc. These choices have become so much more debatable with the emergence of a few rather elegant rules. Once the book has been in play for a few weeks, this may all change of course, but I always prefer the game when it is in a state whereby there isn't just one way to win or be successful. I think we will see much more variety on the table and much less "you're doing it wrong, you have to do it this way..."

I recently posted something similar to this on the main chaos board, before I saw this thread. I have now had a go at tweaking it with the new battalions and rules etc. I have never run Legion of the First Prince before so would love to know what folk think. All the netlists I have seen seem to incorporate Kairos and other big moster leaders. Those lists just leave me feeling a bit thin on the ground for bodies so I have tried more of a classic hammer and anvil. In theory (!) The khorne parts of the list look to charge and kill stuff (probably down a flank) whilst the horrors tar pit up objectives and try not to get in the way of any bounty hunters. I plan to use Be'lakor's summoning to create screens in front of them and aim to kill any opposing bounty hunters with the bloodcrushers & thirster. Meanwhile, Be'lakor does Be'lakor things in the backfield before flying out to mop up at the end. The soulscream bridge is really just there in case there's the possibility of an alpha strike, or just to give me some more movement flexibility. It's high drops because I have included both Expert Conquerers and Bounty Hunters, but I don't think choice of first turn is massively important here. Please correct me if you think I'm wrong on that. Allegiance: Legion of the First Prince- Grand Strategy: Tame the Land- Triumphs:Be'Lakor, the Dark Master (360)- General- Lore of Ruinous Sorcery: The Master's CommandBloodthirster of Insensate Rage (280)- Artefact: Armour of the Pact10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (250)*10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (250)*10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (250)*6 x Bloodcrushers (260)**- Reinforced x 16 x Bloodcrushers (260)**- Reinforced x 1Soulscream Bridge (80)*Expert Conquerors**Bounty HuntersTotal: 1990 / 2000Reinforced Units: 2 / 4Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 106Drops: 7

Just as an addition to this, I think the rules will start heading towards a particular model in the unit being granted the WIZARD keyword as it is for Lumineth Wardens and Sentinels - the unit champion specifically is a wizard, so all spell related measuring happens to and from that model.

This comes up a lot and I think there's a certain amount of common sense that needs to be applied. I think my rule of thumb is that you can use the shrug on a spell that "targets" the model with the shrug at the point at which it is cast. You are right that RAW, you could interpret it to mean any effect of any spell that in any way has any impact on the shrug unit e.g. if I attack a unit that is mystic shielded, do I roll the shrug to see if I am "affected" by your unit getting +1 save? - for me, the common sense approach to this would be no, the spell isn't affecting the unit attacking because it was targeted at the friendly unit. With spell effects that happen on subsequent turns, I think it's less clear, especially with Endless spells as in the Purple Sun example. My instinct would be that you can roll it each turn when the Purple Sun moves - any unit within 6" of it after it moves can roll a shrug to ignore that effect for that turn. Then there are complications if the player decides not to move it, but I'd argue that's where common sense comes in. It's certainly a multi-layered, potentially sticky one. As you say, hopefully it'll be FAQd

I read it as being an extension of the GHB lists. Certainly common practice at my club is that you can use the army specific Grand Strategies and Battle Tactics alongside the GHB ones.

Hoping it's okay to post this here as there doesn't appear to be a specific LOTFP sub board or thread out there. I've been toying with a Be'lakor list for a while and came up with the list below quite recently. Looking at what I can find online, it is a bit different to how other people look to be running Be'lakor. In theory, it's a true hammer and anvil list, with 3x10 pink horrors acting as the tar pit/objective grabbers and the bloodcrushers and Thirster being the pain bringers. At the moment it's 2 drops with a battle regiment but I'd hope to use the new galletian formation to make the horrors count as 3 models each in the new edition. The Soulscream Bridge is there just to try and force the khorne element of the list into positions where they could realistically charge - it's all about them charging and not being charged. Meanwhile, Be'lakor sits behind the horrors, casting and doing his shenanigans. Does it have legs? I have a feeling there are issues I'm not seeing since it's such a different build to most LOTFP lists I've seen out there. Allegiance: Legion of the First Prince- Grand Strategy: Prized Sorcery- Triumphs:Be'Lakor, the Dark Master (360)*- General- Lore of Ruinous Sorcery: The Master's CommandBloodthirster of Insensate Rage (280)- Artefact: Armour of the Pact10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (250)*10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (250)*10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (250)*6 x Bloodcrushers (260)*- Reinforced x 16 x Bloodcrushers (260)*- Reinforced x 1Soulscream Bridge (70)*Battle RegimentTotal: 1980 / 2000Reinforced Units: 2 / 4Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 106Drops: 2

That is certainly the gist of it. I’ll tell you a slow melee army that this can’t beat though… Sons of Behemat. It doesn’t have the damage output or bodies to kill them or contest objectives. It is a very rock, paper, scissors type list but I have to say, I’m really enjoying it. What I have also recently realised is that even when you run an extreme list like this, as long as you aren’t a ****** whilst playing it, even an opponent who can’t deal with it will usually still enjoy the game (as long as they are also not a ******…)

Had a massive debate on Twitter yesterday about whether or not foxes create negative play experience. Personally I think they just have a few mechanics that people aren’t used to yet. They are, albeit, very difficult to kill without good movement and shooting. This list has clear weaknesses though, especially when it comes to holding objectives or applying damage. There is very little in the way of MW output. To answer the question though, it’s a hell of a lot of fun to play with. To play against… let’s just say it’s a good job I’m a friendly person 🤣 Seriously though, I think once people get used to foxes being part of the meta, the 12” shooting phase move won’t be as much of an issue. I’m just waiting for all those who haven’t yet discovered the pile in jankiness which means that, even when they’re with 3” of you, you still can’t hit them! To me, that’s what creates the NPE if anything. It’s a really fun list though and I suspect you’ll see it doing the rounds sooner or later.

List now adapted for 3.0 and it has become a bit silly. We are up to 5 foxes. It is the most fun I’ve had playing Warhammer but it’ll be really matchup dependent! Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords- Great Nation: Helon- Grand Strategy: Predator's Domain Hurakan Windmage (120)- General- Command Trait: Skyrace Grand Champion - Artefact: Metalith Dust - Lore of the Winds: Guiding Flurries Sevireth, Lord of the Seventh Wind (345) 5 x Hurakan Windchargers (155)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (155)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (155) 1 x Hurakan Spirit of the Wind (265)1 x Hurakan Spirit of the Wind (265)1 x Hurakan Spirit of the Wind (265)1 x Hurakan Spirit of the Wind (265)Total: 1990 points

Update to this list. Currently running 4 foxes because I can’t get enough of them 😂 Allegiance: Lumineth Realm Lords- Great Nation: HelonHurakan Windmage (120)- General- Command Trait: Skyrace Grand Champion - Artefact: Metalith Dust - Lore of the Winds: Guiding FlurriesSevireth, Lord of the Seventh Wind (300)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)5 x Hurakan Windchargers (130)Hurakan Spirit of the Wind (250)Hurakan Spirit of the Wind (250)Hurakan Spirit of the Wind (250)Extra Command Point (50)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 1Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 105 Anyone who enjoys movement and msu elves (aelves), I urge you to give this a go! Win or lose, it’s great fun!

The leaks seem to suggest that battalions like this won’t be used in matched play. Matched will use a more 40k system from what I understand e.g. 3 battleline + hero = battalion in any army (don’t know if that’s actually a combo). At least that will level out some of these rules queries for matched play players. in the meantime I might try out the battalion before 3rd hits. Unfortunately it means big tweaks to my list - either dropping 2 units of chargers or a fox or turning Sevireth into a Spirit of the wind and thereby losing a hero.

I’d love to think your interpretation is correct. Sadly, I’m pretty sure it isn’t. You can only pile in if you’re within 3” of an enemy. With the double pile in that LRL get as standard, it is a good ability but not worth 180 points in my opinion. Role on 3rd edition where we can retreat and stand and shoot as charge reactions 😁

Just to update, the tweaked list had a minor win vs Sons of Behemat this week. It really is old school wood elf MSU. Unless you can apply force in multiple places at range, this army will annoy the hell out of you and unless you can hold multiple objectives reliably, it can take them off you to keep up on the scoreboard. It has lots of weaknesses but also more strengths than you might realise on paper.

Went pretty well. Beat a 2 mawcrusher, pig heavy jawz list. Positioning is crucial because the Roos are squishy, but using them in conjunction with the foxes really helps keep them safe in combat. Need to try it vs a shooting heavy list. I think it’ll get taken apart by KO but will do well against anything that doesn’t match it for movement. The main thing is that it is very very very fun! Already tweaking it though. I’m really not concerned with lowering the drops and the Hurakan temple is, IMO, pointless for its price (180 points!) Shifting the points around gets me 2 spirit of the wind for the cost of 5 Roos and a mage, so 1 mage, 3 foxes (incl Sevireth), 8x5 Roos I think could be even better an even more fun!

Tried a new list yesterday. I think it has a huge amount of fun potential. What do you think? Sevireth wind mage wind mage 5 windchargers 5 windchargers 5 windchargers 5 windchargers 5 windchargers 5 windchargers 5 windchargers 5 windchargers 5 windchargers Hurakan Spirit of the Wind Helon Temple