PJetski

Yup, you basically nailed it. The only thing I changed is the Incantor spells. The general knows Lightning Blast, and the other one knows Stormcaller.

I like that it works on shooting, though. It's a cool option for Judicators, Hurricanes, Prosecutors, and Castigators. It's also fun to use it on melee units that have shooting attacks like Dracoths. It only becomes a problem when you combine it with the super long range on Longstrikes... and I think that's going to be true with many buffs in the game.

Fair enough haha I think Jezzails have the same issue as Longstrikes, but since Skaven don't have crazy damage multipliers on their shooting it keeps their power in check. If Skaven had the Anvils command ability to shoot in the hero phase then you would have to make Jezzails cost a lot more than 140p.

I was actually thinking that Tempestors could be battleline if your general is a STARDRAKE. Re: Raptors It's not just the Anvils CA that I am concerned about. Any unit that can shoot 30" with low volume, high power attacks, is really tricky to balance if you can bring them in multiples of 4. Buffs on super long range attacks need to be carefully managed - if every buff in the battletome has to consider how it will interact with a unit of 9+ Longstrikes then you can't make them universally apply to other similar units like Hurricanes, Castigators, and Judicators. Longstrikes are basically an Artillery unit, and there's a good reason that no other artillery unit in the game can be brought in more than a squad size of 1... wiping your opponent off the board in 2 rounds with mega long range attacks isn't fun for anyone.

Relictor Incantor Incantor Azyros Heraldor 5x Liberators 5x Liberators 5x Liberators 3x Aetherwings 3x Aetherwings 9x Longstrikes 10x Evocators Geminids

Thanks for the feedback! Yes, as per the recent FAQs if you do not give any artefacts to a PRIEST then you could skip the artefact from that Stormhost. A similar thing can be seen in the Fyreslayers (Lofnir lodge) and Orruk Warclans battletomes. I reduced the size of Liberators because I don't like the idea of an army with large infantry like Stormcast running units of 30+ models. It's a strange aesthetic that doesn't fit the vibe of Stormcast being an 'elite' army. That's just my opinion, of course. In terms of gameplay, I think it makes it difficult to design interesting battalion/stormhost abilities while also considering how they would scale out of control if applied to a unit of 30+ models. For example, the old Vanguard Wing battalion was really weird thing to play against when you could teleport a unit of 30 Liberators, but maybe with only 20 models it could have been fine. In the case of Raptors, I limited their size to fix the current situation of their synergy with the Anvils of the Heldenhammer command ability. On their own Raptors are a fairly inefficient and fragile unit, but when they can double their shooting output they become absurdly powerful. If Longstrikes are limited to 6 in a unit then it becomes less effective to buff them (you need double the command points), which means maybe they don't need to cost 170 points per 3 models, and then maybe the could be usable in lists other than Anvils. I thought about making Paladins a 3+ save. I went with a point cost reduction instead, since a 3+ save would make it harder to add any kind of save bonuses to the army. I may still consider making them a 3+ save and raising their points back up. I'm not sure how to balance battleline Dracothian Guard. If they are battleline then they become spammable, and if that's the case you need to raise their point cost. They are already barely playable at their current costs so I thought it might be better to indirectly boost them through improved Stormhosts. A big unit of Desolators in Knights-Excelsior is going to do some really nasty things in the combat phase! My next pass will have Command Traits for the Aquilor! I was thinking one would let nearby gryph hounds strike first, and another one would allow him to charge after using Ride the Winds. Still working on it. I think the reason we have a Knight-Zephyros is because the model comes with two different head options. You can run Neave and a Knight-Zephyros side by side with two slightly different models. Gavriel is a very distinct model with no opitions, with Hammers of Sigmar iconography all over him, so I'm not sure it would work to make a generic Lord-Celestant out of his model. I knew that the LCOD and Castellant changes would be controversial! My goal is to make the LCOD a staple choice in Stormcast armies again. He was the original Stormcast hero model but his warscroll has not been updated in a way that makes any sense to the modern version of the game. I effectively moved Staunch Defender from a passive Command Trait into an active Command Ability. In addition to costing a command point, it can only be used once per turn, and it requires that the LCOD is your general - that's a lot of opportunity costs. Is a +1 save boost to units wholly within 12" too powerful? I'm not sure it is. In the first edition it certainly would have been an extremely powerful ability... but the game has changed a lot since then. There is a lot more mortal wounds in the game now, and the game isn't defined by two army bricks smashing into each other in the middle of the battlefield so the range is a big restriction. The Lord-Castellant granting +1 save bonus has been a big problem for the design of the faction as a whole. If the Castellant is too weak, there are other ways to boost him without bringing back a save bonus. For example, what if instead of just 1 unit it affected all units near him? My version of Lords of the Storm does still include a gryph-hound, because it would be spawned from the required Castellant and/or Veritant. I think the reason the current battalion has them is because the Lord-Castellant comes with one, and it's a vestigial remnant from the first AOS battletome that brought Gryph-Hounds as single models. The reason I removed them as a unit choice is that it doesn't really make sense for this battalion to have a big pack of 6+ gryph hounds running around it. That seems more like a Vanguard Chamber thing. I took the Knight requirement out because I feel like the battalion is nearly impossible to ever play when it requires 6 heroes/leaders. I want to open up more options for list building, and having a relatively inexpensive battalion for the underused Warrior Chamber heroes goes a long way towards that goal. The original lore of the Devastation Brotherhood did not include any Judicators. I wanted to make the battalion easier to put into lists, so removing the requirement to bring 160 points of Judicators helps open that battalion as an option. I would consider changing it to a 0-1 Judicator requirement. Definitely! I love what they did with Grimwrath Berzerkers in the Fyreslayers battletome. I'm not sure that would be enough to push the Questor into being a viable choice in competitive games, but at least he have a niche as a cheap HERO that can be used for command abilities and whatnot.

I think a 5+ ignore would be too strong. I went back and forth about whether to make it a -1 hit debuff for enemy attacks or a 6+ ignore, and settled on the 6+ ignore. If a 6+ ignore is too weak I can consider making it also heal 1 wound when it ignores an allocated wound. Not all units are supposed to be exactly worth their points cost. FEC Ghouls are also 100 points but also a terrible unit for their cost, but they serve a niche as being useful in a large horde unit and as a cheap battleline. I would rather make Liberators more useful rather than reducing their point cost, like through improving the battalions they are in, or making their rules a little better (like I did with Paired Weapons). I agree! I have plans to update all the Hammers of Sigmar heroes, and add at least 1 named hero for each Stormhost. I was thinking that Vandus could get 10 Liberators instead of 5 when using the Soul of the Stormhost command ability. I'm not a fan of Gavriels stackable charge bonus, I think deep strike charges should always have a chance to fail.

Full list of Warscroll and point changes, patch notes style Celestant Prime +2 Wounds Points cost reduced from 320 to 300 Aventis Firestrike +2 Wounds Lord-Arcanum on Tauralon +2 Wounds Command Ability now effects all STORMCAST ETERNAL units, rather than just SACROSANCT Lord-Celestant on Dracoth Lord of the Host: Now grants +1 save instead of Battleshock immunity Notes: Only usable if he is your general, once per turn, Staunch Defender is gone, Warding Lantern has been changed Points cost increased from 220 to 280 Lord-Celestant +1 Wound Lord-Castellant +1 Wound Warding Lantern now grants a friendly unit a 6+ ignore instead of +1 save and healing Lord-Exorcist +1 Wound Now has the PRIEST keyword Lord-Ordinator +1 Wound Command Ability changed to boost a units shooting hit rolls Lord-Relictor +1 Wound Drakesworn Templar Points cost reduced from 460 to 400 Lord-Celestant on Stardrake Points cost reduced from 560 to 480 Castigators Thunderhead Greatbow does D3 damage instead of 1 Prime now has +1 attack instead of +1 to hit rolls Burst of Celestial Energy reworked Now deals bonus hits against units with 10+ models Can re-roll damage against DAEMON or DEATH Points cost increased from 80 to 120 Liberators Paired Weapons now grants +1 attack all the time instead of adding an extra hit on hit rolls of 6 Maximum unit sized reduced to 20 Points changed from 100/520 to 100/360 Decimators Points cost reduced from 180 to 160 Protectors Points cost reduced from 180 to 160 Retributors Lightning Hammers are now Rend-2 instead of Rend-1 Points cost reduced from 200 to 180 Battleline in a KNIGHTS EXCELSIOR army Sequitors Stormsmite Greatmaces now deal bonus hits to DEATH units instead of just NIGHTHAUNT Points cost reduced from 130/440 to 120/400 Gryph-Hounds Battleline in an ASTRAL TEMPLARS army Vanguard Raptors with Longstrike Crossbows Maximum unit size reduced to 6, down from 12 Vanguard Raptors with Hurricane Crossbows Maximum unit size reduced to 9, down from 12 Dais Arcanum Wound restriction increased to 7 (now heroes with 6 or less wounds can ride it) Points cost reduced from 30 to 20

The Stormcast battletome released in 2018 is woefully out of date. It does not have the same kind of interesting abilities or army rules found in battletomes released immediately afterwards. None of the Stormhosts really match the narrative of the army, all of the battalions are total trash, most of the traits/artefacts are rubbish, and many units are just downright useless. With that in mind I have started a project to rewrite some of the rules in the battletome. The goal is to update the rules to better match the narrative and make more interesting choices when making lists. In some cases that means some units/Stormhosts will become more powerful, but in those cases I believe it is justified since they are currently weak to the point of being unplayable. I will use this thread to post my progress, thought process, and hopefully gather feedback from other AOS players. Here is what I have so far: https://imgur.com/a/HAuEMWl I don't believe this will be 100% balanced, but let me know what you think either way! Update Nov 14 2019: https://imgur.com/a/dHAJdvI Update Jan 3 2020: https://imgur.com/a/zdDQQ8J Update March 18 2020: https://imgur.com/a/tCyMsVJ

Thanks for the feedback Re: Hallowed Knights - The Orruks book has changed the format, with the Drakkfoot clan getting a spell instead of a command trait. I thought this was pretty interesting and decided to run with it. HKs always felt like the stormhost that would use the most Priests, so it seemed like a natural fit. Re: Knights Excelsior - My version of No Mercy is quite strong but right now KE is a useless stormhost so maybe that's alright? It's in line with other armies allowing units to fight twice, but this one has the stipulation that the first attack had to wipe a unit out. It seemed like a good fit for their narrative. Re: Warbringers - I'm not sure Stormcast should have access to more bonuses to unbind/dispel since we have Incantors with dispel scrolls. Re: Tempest Lords - The artefact is pretty bonkers. You can use a free command ability in every phase. That means you can use a hero phase CA, run 6, reroll charge, combat phase CA, and inspiring presence every turn. I was also planning on going through and updating some of the warscrolls to have better command abilities (Stormcast have really bad command abilities) so it may even end up being overpowered. I never considered it, but if they actually read stuff I might put more effort into this and try to submit them to GW. Is there an email address for this sort of thing? On a side note, I want to also make rules for Nighthaunt Ghosthosts 👻

I have been been making some house rules to update the stormhosts. I'm pretty sure these aren't balanced, but let me know what you think anyway https://imgur.com/a/Fom4XcZ

No, it doesn't seem off at all. There are plenty of weird rules in AOS; Longshot is not very peculiar in a game where Aetherwings break almost every rule of movement and charging. I did not consider it ambiguous; I previously played it 24" to avoid having arguments. I understand the argument against it but I don't agree with it in the slightest so why would I recognize it as a valid argument?

Why would you assume the writers of the game got their own rule wrong? Rather than trying to guess their intent, isn't it more reasonable to assume they wrote the rule the way they wanted it to be used? There have been many opportunities over the past 16 months for them to change it. Rules work the way they are written. You can't play a game when everyone is trying to interpret the rules in whatever way they think it is supposed to work.

Using the Long Shot bonus does not prevent movement. The ability would tell you if it did that. The bonus is active at all times until you satisfy the condition to disable it. The phase order is irrelevant - if they wanted it to only work in the shooting phase they would have worded it that way.

When you shoot in the hero phase you have satisfied the conditions for Long Shot to be active. It does not impede your movement later. I'm not sure what led you to such a strange line of thinking.

It depends on how the ability is worded. Some abilities specify "in the combat phase" or "in the shooting phase" like Blood Stalker ability Heartseeker. There is an FAQ about this about this ability that says it does not happen when you activate them to shoot in the hero phase (eg. with Morathis command ability) because it specifically mentions when it activates. Evocators Lightning Arc does not specify a phase, so it activates in every phase the unit attacks. They just put out an errata on that ability and kept the phase phrasing the same. If theywanted to change the ability to work only in the combat phase they could have done so at the time of printing the errata. It is therefore fair and reasonable to assume that it is by design that some abilities are worded so that they only work in a specific phase, and other abilities work in any phase. Units normally move in the movement phase, shoot in the shooting phase, charge in the charge phase, and fight in the combat phase, but there are plenty of rules in the game that allow units to make these actions outside their normal phase. The order of the phases is irrelevant when it comes to bonuses that apply regardless of the phase that is active. Long Shot bonus range is active until the condition is met. It works in all phases, even if that phase comes before the unit would normally be selected to shoot.

That is a really terrible metaphor. The rules normally specify when an ability is only active in a specific phase, and there are plenty of examples where abilities break the regular rules of the game. Just because a rule isn't intuitive doesn't mean it isn't working as intended. You took my quote out of context. I used to play it at 24" to avoid having any kind of argument with an opponent, not because I believed it worked the other way.

It's not a matter of opinion... if you read the rule then there is only one correct interpretation. Anyone arguing against that interpretation are deluding themselves and others because they dont like the way the rule works (or maybe they just like arguing). It's a binary condition - your unit has either moved in the movement phase, or it hasn't. You can't make up a third state for a binary condition; that's not logical. If you haven't had a movement phase yet then the condition is satisfied and the bonus range applies. If they had some way to shoot in the enemy turn then they would also get the bonus range in that scenario. If they didn't intend for it to work outside of the player shooting phase they would have specified "in the shooting phase" or "in the next shooting phase". Many abilities in the game are worded to work only work in a specific phase, and this is not one of them. Play the rule as it is written instead of assuming they wrote it wrong. The book has been out for over a year - there has been more than enough time for them to issue an errata.

My favourite part of reveal season is that some people lose their minds and cry that it is overpowered even though we have only seen a few sentences of rules.

Allies cant benefit from allegiance abilities, but they would still count as a deployed unit for the purposes of Scions of the Storm. Long Shot is always active in the hero phase. Going to copy my response from the last time this question came up: "Add 6" to the Range characteristic of this unit’s Longstrike Crossbows if this unit did not move in the movement phase of the same turn." The way the ability is worded the 6" bonus range is always active unless you do the specific action to disable it. Since it does not specify "in the shooting phase" then it is active in all phases, even if the hero phase comes before the movement phase. It may seem strange at first, but warscroll abilities break the normal rules of the game quite frequently.

Baleful Blade is really good.

It's not, though. If you roll less than 7 you can just move the Aetherwings backwards and he can no longer declare a charge at all because there are no units within 12" He doesn't even get to roll to charge.

It doesn't matter if they have +50 to charge, they cant declare a charge if there is an enemy within 3" or if there are no enemies within 12". Aetherwings allow you to fulfill either of these conditions easily.

It doesn't really matter what side of the table I'm on, and I'm not sure why you think it does? I put the Evocators and Raptors so far forward because he put Thralls in reserve instead of eels. He was trying to hit me on the flank with Thralls and come through the front with eels. Their Rend-2 attacks don't matter because the eels never get to attack anything besides Aetherwings. It seems like you still dont understand how Aetherwings work. Azyros is on the table because it's Duality of Death and I need a quick hero to contest objectives. Tzeentch and Sylvaneth are quite easy matchups when you have 2 dispel scrolls in your list. I disagree that Anvilstrike auto loses to a double turn. With a good defensive deployment your Aetherwings and Liberators are enough screens to weather the storm, and you should be able to kill something important on that first turn. It's all about knowing what your opponent is capable of doing and planning ahead to counter it.

The worst matchups are long range mortal wounds that can hit the Longstrikes and Evocators before they get hit first. Jezzails are a tricky unit to deal with, Seraphon teleporting wizards in range to throw Pendulums through the army is a problem, and I suspect some COS lists (Hallowheart and Greywater notably) to a threat. I would say all matchups against melee armies are favourable for Anvilstrike, most magic armies are not an issue because we can easily pack in 2+ dispel scrolls, and even most ranged lists are not a problem because Longstrikes have such a ridiculous threat range. Fyreslayers aren't really a problem because we can use the precision fire of Longstrikes to take down their heroes and make the hearthguard just another slow melee unit. Everyone plays the same Hermdar list with 30 Hearthguard, but I am much more concerned about the Lofnir shooting lists... thankfully they are exceedingly rare.