Duke of Mousillon

@Icetea your first list is essentially my list from the previous page of this thread. I like it. You just switched out my Curseling for an Ogroid. I like the idea of the list otherwise I would not have proposed the same one the other day myself. I see why you wanna run an Ogroid having his spell available for Kairos seems really good. If Nurgle is your biggest threat then potentialy nice targets for the Curselings spell could be Festus or Bloab and he would be a perfect safety valve to unbind the Glottkins +1 wounds spell in case you are afraid of needing to chew through too many bodies? But I do not think he is necessary for just fighting Nurgle alone. The Ogroid should be nice at keeping your Kairos toped off from Nurgles chip damage. In the second list I like throwing Pinks through a bridge. Also I am not sure about a 20 man unit. Maybe that is too much overkill. Though if Nurgle is your archenemy. Maybe try to squeeze in those Soulsnare Shackles here too? It just seems great to make the people who have 4 inch move on most units not be able to run or charge. Also Glottkin should have this new ability that lets him and another unit charge out of sequence? I am not sure about the wording on both of these effects but if it stops his out of sequence charging that should be a huge pain.

@TerminusRex please tell us about your experience with the Cult of the Transient Form. I think on paper it looks ... mediocre but I will be more then happy to be shown its benefits. Even if you wanna play a Tzaangor army just being another Cult that gives better generic buffs seems superior.

I completely ignored the fact that their new warscroll has no spell anymore. Thats a bummer is it. Thanks for pointing that out. Was talking about the Fatemaster. Fatemaster being the potential supporting hero to give them buffs if youd like normal tzaangors to be your melee threat. Why not Enlightened on Disc? I was never intrigued by the non-disc variant.

I see. Yeah Be'Lakor seems nice in theory to me at least. Sadly the newest update removed allegiance abilities from our coalition units so he can not use destiny dice anymore or complete agendas can he?

I myself am interested in the Guild of Summoners just for the sole reason to not having to paint too many summonable units. Though I would need to paint probably 2 Lord of Changes as summonable units? and then again I never get around having pinks in my list because I am just too afraid of not being able to summon more bodies. Right now i am think about smth like this: Be'Lakor Kairos The Blue Scribes Curseling Changecaster Kairic Acolytes x10 Pink Horrors of Tzeentch x10 Pink Horrors of Tzeentch x10 Umbral Spellportal Soulsnare Shackles I could see having only one unit of pinks and put the points into acolytes and smth else, like a cheap sixth hero or a third endless spell or even just 2 units of acolytes to cover more board space but yeah. That would decrease the painting effort. But this list is where my thoughts are heading towards rn. Having a hard time getting motivated to actually buy, assemble and paint things when you never even know when you are allowed to play games in stores again. Corona things. Any thoughts on Be'Lakor? Is he actually a unit you can send off alone and let him do his thing?

I have not gotten to play third edition yet either so keep that in mind. I will just give you my thoughts as I read rules @MattyP What I see is Acolytes being the cheapest generic battleline we have. At 115 they are 10 wound with eh defensive stats but they cast a spell and have some ranged chip damage. If they get into melee they probabaly fall over against any melee unit if you dont bring 30 of them and even then you better have them battleshock immune when they are done in melee. Are they worse then Pink Horrors? Yes I think so, even at 30 for 345 points they have 20 wounds less then 10 pinks at 250, but at almost half the points cost I think Kairic Acolytes are not to be forgotten. They essentially do the same thing pinks do but are a WAY worse tar pit. Horrors also just cast one spell and do chip damage otherwise. I am conflicted on Tzaangors. I want to like them but I just can not. The good. They have the same defensive profile as Acolytes (if you can call not becoming even less defensive a positive) but they have two wounds. So point for point you will get more wounds out of your Tzaangors which is decent. Two wounds are nice. They can run and charge which is an awesome ability and unique to them in Tzeentch if I am not mistaken. Their melee profile is not terrible? As i said I have not played third edition yet but the savage greatblades being 2 attacks with 4+/3+/-1/2 seems not bad, essentially enlightened spears minus an attack, and having 4 in ten models with these is quite a lot. Even the normal weapons can be 3 attacks with 3+/3+/-/1 which is ofcourse only chip damage but three attacks per model is nothing to ignore. Now the bad part I see. They have no utility like the "best" battle line (pinks) or the cheapest battleline (acolytes). No ranged chip damage. No spell. Furthermore. They seem to fall over quite quickly too and with the bonus of an extra attack falling away at already 8 models, I do not see myself running only a 10 man block for efficiency reasons, if i count on them as a melee threat. Furthermore 1 inch reach on 32mm bases on a 10+ man unit makes coherency a big hamper for the potential damage they can actually inflict. This means the "a thousand paper cuts" does not really work out does it. If I have the option most times I want my savage greatblades in front fighting and not the normal weapons. Does this mean I would rather run shields then paired blades? Yes i think so. I just do not see many of the non greatblades getting into swinging range. So for efficiency reasons if you want these to take a hit in melee and still swing back properly you do not look at 175 points but at least 350?(Which will be 100 points more then pinks and still 10 wounds less) Just keep in mind that their +1 to wound requires being wholly within 12 of an arcanite hero. If you really want these to work, which i doubt they will to my own dismay, I am afraid most buffs the books wants to give them are pointless. The coven and the Tzaangor Shaman spell which bring back Tzaangor models are too unreliable. Give them a Fatemaster who can easily keep up with them to buff their melee as an arcanite and via command ability, if you think you can keep them reliably wholly within 9, because apparently Tzaangor Shamans are buffing every Tzaangor unit except this one. On a sidenote: then you are looking at a battleline and a hero who will not cast spells for your fate points, may or may not matter depending on the rest of your list and the circumstances. If you plan on getting them up as fast as possible, which seems to be a not unwise decision, consider a Great-Brayshaman for bonus movement. Again. Just thoughts when reading through the rules. My opinion is as good as yours here.

Not quite. You see he still has to obide by the rule of only casting each spell one time a turn throughout your army. What he can do is for example: Cast Pink Fire of Tzeentch. If that was a 9+ he can cast another spell but Pink Fire of Tzeentch has already been cast. So now you can cast for example Mythic Shield. If that was a 9+ too then you cast Arcane Bolt. That was a 9+ too? Then cast the tzeentch demon wizard spell lore spell you gave him or maybe some endless spells you brought to the game. So yes he can in theory have an unlimited amount of spell casts per turn, given you only role 9+. In reality he is limited by the number of different spells he is elligible to cast. Most times these will be: Pink Fire of Tzeentch, Mythic Shield, Arcane Bolt, the spell/spells you gave him in your army creation and endless spells you brought.

Yeah I think so too. I think you can get away without them maybe when you can summon more bodies later on but then again. Thinking about Guild of Summoners here I have a hard time not having them in my list. On another note, I am uncertain about the new rule interactions with allies and coalitions etc. If I take Belakor in a Disciples list will he be able to get a spell from the Demons list? I do not have the rule book at hand so I have no Idea about the proper wording on it but since Belakor is below 400 points he can just be an ally instead of a coalition member right? I just noticed that they changed some coalition interactions in the new eratas. Edit: He does not have the Tzeentch keyword. I forgot. Nevermind.

I was not able to play 3.0 yet with the whole corona thing but I am playing around with some potential Guild of Summoners lists in my head at the moment and I just can not get away from Pink Horrors. With the Guild of Summoners not being able to summon in more bodies later on except the one Lord of Change I just cannot see battlelines of Acolytes ever winning the objectives no matter their size. Am I underestemating Acolytes or are some Pink Horrors unavoidable for guild of summoners even at their new point cost?

Hey I am new to Skaven or at least thought about starting Skaven. Wanted to maybe buy into a 1000 point start to play with a friend for now. Do you guys think it is okay to play without Clan Rats at the start? I like Stormfiends. So I thought about buying 2 times 3 Stormfiends for battleline. I know I would be missing numbers but would it be that horrible that i couldnt have fun with it? If I got up to 2000 points and would look into a more competitive list I would look into Clan Rats but I feel like I would prefer to play around with the "fun" models for the beginning.

Thank you for explaining ^^ I did not know there was a differenciation between Text and Sub Text in the name of a unit.

thanks you

@RUNCMDoh no didnt say you arent but i was afraid since you are the one who also plays like this you would ofcourse support this interpretation of the rules so i asked for another oppinion. Did not mean to insult you. Let me ask you this. When you say the NONBOLD written Tzaangor Enlightened means the key word Tzaangor enlightened which would include Tzaangor Enlightened on Disc and not the name Tzaangor Enlightened which would exclude those on Discs since there name is different. Why do you think for example in the Changehost battalion the name Horror-Heroes is written in bold. If the nonbold version is the keyword then surely the bold written version needs to be a name and not a keyword otherwise thered be no reason do differentiate between bold and nonbold. But is there a unit called "Horror-Heroes"? Tzaangor Enlightened on Discs are not Tzaangor Enlightened they have two different names. BUT indeed they both have the keyword Tzaangor Enlightened in common. But if any rule refers to a keyword the keyword is always written in bold.

@RUNCMDnononono you dont get me. If i look at that battalion in the book. The Tzaangor Enlightened unit needed for said battalion is NOT written in bold. What i get is that there is not the keyword written. The battalion does not ask for the keyword Tzaangor Enlightened. It asks for the UNIT Tzaangor Enlightened which would be not on discs. @MitGascould you help me here? You seemed reasonable. Explain this one to me if you woudnt mind please

I have a question. Does the battalion not call for Enlightened on foot? I thought if it was asking for the keyword Enlightend it would been to be written in bold.

@Ganigumothanks. I will see which battalions I would actually like.

Does that also count for enlightened on foot or only on disc? I read through some pages in this forum and a lot of people seem to think enlightened on foot arent worth there time.

@MitGasyeah the mount model looks realy out of date sadly. but thank you. At least now i know he woudnt be a deadweight in a list if i should start tzeentch ^^

I am looking for a new army and thought about maybe picking up Tzeentch. I love the spell of the Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore. Is he worth anything or is he just too expensive for a level 1 wizard?

@Siegfried VII the stormcast got this fancy winged mountain goat thing lately. A Tauralon? That looks kinda good if you cut off the stormcast symbols off of its armor. But its not as heavily armored as those dracoth and stuff its really just a bit. Got that stone thing going for it because it literally looks like a winged mountain goat. Dunno about base sizes for the Cowmountains but doesnt look too small. Though admittedly Tauralons cost 90 Euro so eh. Dunno how high your budget for conversions go.

This. Exactly this.

We translated the Nations on page 108 in this discussion for anybody who cant speak German.

@Siegfried VIIi wasnt talking to you there? I am sorry i think i quoted the wrong post and then had to delete a quote and requote by editing. i wa stalking to the guy who asked about why there was a stonemage in somebodies list. Refering to our situation. As i said the most "order" lookin big mount we have for that base is a griffon from cities of sigmar. If you want something stoneish we only have stonehorns in age of sigmar. Could do maybe some kitbashing but that would have to be some more effort since the face of the stonehorn definetly doesn not look in line with our lets say "heroic" approach to this

To keep in mind. Stonemages are the only non-Teclis option for the second spell lore in this book. Indeed almost everything is a wizard but almost none is allowed to use the second spell lore

Idk I would actually just prefer a horse? A mounted hero riding to battle with the cav. And not even a bigger horse like in OBR. Where that thing has i think even a round base (correct me if im wrong) but certainly larger then normal cav base. Just the same base as the silverhelms and on a horse. That would be the dream but eh. That is not Age of Sigmar I suppose. Old World comes. Just waiting for that basically. But for the beast if you want to use that large base of the mountaincows id probably look into the griffons from cities of sigmar