Doko

I said it because we have vulkites in the sc allready,i wasnt speaking about rules

New hero+vulkites+hearthguardx2 would be cool but if they want a horrible box can be heeo+vulkitesx2+hearthguard

Dont feed the troll,there is a reason that irondrakes usually arent in any 5\0 cos lists. The bridge isnt reliably and imposible win 5 games with the bridge tactic. Its so sad as a army as citys that usually is around 14\19 in tournaments rankings(tier3) got a nerf while top tier armys as behemats or belakors got 0 nerfs

Sure but that isnt in the irondrakes warscrool neither in his cost,it is a extra 100 points runelord. Yes the 4 save vs 6 is big(32% better save) but also blibarb have 11 wounds (10% more) so the gap isnt so big. And also we could mention the others 100+ points that the unit of blibars gonna bring in free sumon. I am not saying irondrakes for 170 are bad,buy i laugth so hard when i heard some people cry about blibarbs when they are the same or even better than irondrakes Im pretty sure that only one game with irondrakes cant move,cant have units in melle and only 16" rangue and everyone gonna see how more playable and reliably is have 27" rangue and can unleash hell with units in melle at his 100% damage output and not 50% as irondrakes. In fact after the nerf to unleash hell the irondrakes must have got a decrease in points as every other cos rangued unit that halves his damage with units in combat

Yes i was say 100% the same,even id it is posible argue that a rerroll 1 of save vs a +1 ward is the same.............but then we need ignore the fact that one was armywide and new is only 1 unit. Also ignore the other fact of inmune moral and reroll 1 hit Old ca was a 10\10 and new is a 4\10 so easy as that and is imposible compare it

Where are your numbers? Because all i said true...... Irondrakes median damage is 8,8 with 16" rangue and cant move neither have units in melle Blisbarbs median damage is 6'6 with 18" rangue+6" move and 3'5 of run so their treathrange is 27'5 and dont mind units in melle that huge advantage for unleash hell. Now where are you data to refute this and not only this kiddo joke? Also you can tell me the 1000 points of free sumons that can have the irondrakes? No true? Show us data and numbers if you want people take you serious because is a fact that blisbarbs are better than irondrakes rigth now with same cost because so easy as same cost 8'8 damage at 16" or 6'6 at 28'....... The choice is a no brainer

I dont think nothing have changed,the same s tier armies remain as s and a tiers are a tier yet,but the gap betwen s and a is bigger now. Only changed the lists of these s tiers,as tzenth change his archaon list for other only tzenth lists or seraphons change his salamander spam(8+) for estegadon spam and 2 salamanders etc

Yes seems how if they heard the opinion of some random testers with 0 idea about the game(as the sc dragons nerf before release) in place of make their changes after read and get a idea of actual meta and tournament data. Best army of the actual meta:sons of behemat and ironjaws. What have done gw? Buff behemats and a sligth increase to gruntas while doing nothing to maw krushas and also overbuffing kragnos doing him a autoinclude and broken model at the level of old archaon and nagash. Also random nerfs to middle tier armys as irondrakes and gotrek even if data show how these units arent in any 5\0 tournaments

Im so happy that my dilema betwen krondys vs nagash one month ago was won by the dragon.... Nagash is 100% useless now in vampires,dont get any buff of alegiances or soulbligth keyword,now is so much weak loosing the reeoll 1 and 6++ and his use that was a buff stick is also useless now. A reroll1 to hit,save and inmune moral armywide was great but waste 1k points for a +1 to ward????it is a joke as bad it is. I really dont see nothing good for nagash,around 12 damage output and 16 mortals if you can cast 8 arcanebolt(good luck with double 1 or enemy denyinb it). So who really see playable waste 1k points for 28 damage output(really gonna be less but lets be good with luck) and 16 wounds with save 3 and 0 special save and a 4++ for mortals and you cant use any buff on him of alegiances neither reliks due to be named etc. To me even at 700 i wouldnt use him but 950 is almost so overcosted as new twin dragons. I hope he can be playable in nighthaunt and so you can have fun with your nagash,but he is 100% deleted and umplayable in soulbligths.

Yes,i laugth so hard when i see peoole saying blisbard are bads but irondrakes must be nerfed. I hadnt idea about stats of blisbards but then i go to his scroll and i see how they are so much better than irondrakes for same cost and this unit is supossed to be bad and overcosted due to free sumon??? I would play blisbard above irondrakes everyday. Irondrakes 8,8damage output at 18" treathrange and 4'4 at melle(new unleash hell makes irondrakes useless) or at 22" treathrange Blisbarbs 6,6damage at almost 30" treathrange and dont loose damage at melle.(can run and shoot) So in my experience blissbarbs gonna do more damage than irondrakes allways because enemy know how play and stay at 18'1 of irondrakes so his damage is useless while blisbards have a insane 30" treathrange

Yes,we have hundreds of tournaments showing us as gargants are broken,morathi,teclis etc.......and also we have these tournaments showing us as gotrek isnt in almost any 5\0 list. But we have many people (that dont know how play) that cry about gotrek and he is nerfed,but in competitive where people know how play gotrek is useless(ok not useless but not even close to top tier) But what does gw?nerf broken units as gargants or morathi and dont change a second tier unit as gotrek? Nop,better buff gargants with a decrease in points to giants and buff morathi so she know every spell now and get a huuuuuge nerf of 50 to gotrek. Also a random nerf to irondrakes,a unit that isnt used in almost any 5\0 cos lists,yes many 3\2 or 4\1 have them,but with so huge handicaps as cant move the top players know play around them. So a unit of a middle tier army as cos and a unit that isnt even in their top lists get a nerf but units broken as demons princes,maw krushas,fulminators,new kruelboys archers etc get nothing. Yes 10 points nerf to irondrakes isnt nothing(around 30 points for a full list), but is the fact that a unit of a middle tier army get a nerf while broken god tier armys as gargants go freely with 0 nerfs and even buffs. This only shows how good is the work of gw balancing his game and the concept that they have when they tells us that have playtesters balancing the game. I know this is a stupid rant,but really in what world any people that know the meta can think in nerf a unit in city of sigmar and then give a buff to gargants.........also as is posible gotrek get so huge knejerk nerf(haters won as happened with sc dragons seems) but maw krushas,morathi etc get nothing. Is more the fact that they nerfed middle tier units and the top tier units got 0 changes than the numbers,because only gotrek got a huge nerf,others nerfs are very small and almost no impact in any list

So our expectations gonna be no changes for top tier meta armys but nerfs to middle\botton tierd as have been this update?

He lost the 6++ that is huge together with reroll saves of 1. So only nagash got a HUGE nerf in survivality. Also the reason that he was in these list was due to give reroll 1 to hit,saves and inmune to moral to blood knigths and all this was lost. 1k points for only 8 spells(with very high chance to double 1) and 16 wounds is a garbagge,his stats are closer to 700, he was used in competitive due to be a huge strength multiplier to blood knigths while being almost unkillable. Now he is kilable and bring nothing to buff blood knigths so he is useless

Top tier got almost 0 changes. Vampires got nagash deleted but had other lists without nagash at their level. Demons got archaon nerfed but had other list at his level as belakor as continue at top without nerf. Lumineths a slight nerf of 30\40 points in a 2000 list wont change nothing. Morathi alo a 30 nerf in the list wont change nothimg and got a buff in morathi Behemats 0 nerfs, and even a buff in points Ironjaws a sligth nerf to gruntas wont change nothing Only seraphons got a bigger nerf with the list of spam salamanders gettimg a big increase but the list with spam triceratops was close to his level. Stormcast,have units as fulminators heavily undercowted but 0 nerfs and other units as twin dragon useless that didnt get any buff But meanwhile middle tier list as any with gotrek or irondrakes got a big nerf. Makes sense. Seriously is the worst balance update never done,no changes in top tier meta but nerfs to middle tiers. I guess when gw hears the playtesters as tye famous youtuver that is a sc hater and got nerfed the dragons even if he never played with sc makes sense these balance update

Fulminator and raptor didnt get nerfs and big dragon didnt get buff,seems the dude balancing dont know math or dont watch tournament data

Im happy for my vampires really all are good buffs(but nagash was deleted and is 100% umplayable in competitive now) I really tougth blood knigths or grave guard was going to get a hit,glad nothing changed. Black knigths for me arent competitive untill drop to 75 points for his stats,but 100 is closer,needed a save 4 and a extra damage or rend in lances when charged to be ok.

Yes,we have as 2000+ tournaments datas showing that gotrek isnt used in 5\0 lists,but he got a huge overner. Same data show how teclis, morathi have 90+% of playrate in top tier armys and got 0 nerfs even a buff! Or maw krusha is broken and a top tierarmy is even bringing two but got 0 nerfs.make sense

Worst balance never done by gw ever. Top armys: Gargants 0 changes or nerf Dok 0 changes or nerf,even some buffs Tzenth no nerf for kairos or lord of change Seraphons a sligth nerf to salamdres Sc dont get any nerf even broken units as fulminators or raptors(and useless units as twin dragons domt get any buff) Ironjaws that are the top army didnt get even close to any nerf,only a sligth nerf to gruntas But middle tier armys as citys got a huge nerf to irondrakes,gotrek got a 50!!!! Nerf when teclis or morathi didnt get any change

Twin deagons no change. Gotrek 50 points nerf Irondrakes 20 points nerfs Meanwhile morathi no chance,kairos no change,teclis no change,gargants no change.......... Good work gw......... In what world irondrakes got a huge nerf when citys is middle tier but longstrikes dont get any change? Or thevother tierd god armys as morathi or gargants? Is the worst balance never done by gw

Give me a cavalry of minimagmadroths,heavy armored non runed fyreslayers and a BIG vulcatrix with ungrim on top of her and i am happy

1-they are overcosted by 150+ points and arent viable even in casuals games 2- he is pretty good,and amazing against behemats that are the gatekeepers 3-they are ok,they gonna delete every unit that they touch.....but as gotrek they are very slow,so they gonna delete one unit when they fall in deep strike and then wont come close to other unit in all the game

Yes the twin dragons are umplayable in competitive,no reason to waste 600 points in 18 wounds that gonna die with 18 mortals. They have stats of 400 karazai and 450 krondys,for 600 they need a ward save of 4 to be somewhat playable. Only a fast glimpse to glotkin who for only 100 more points have ward of 5 and more damage than karazai while casting two spells as krondys

Yes they are usefull,but for this the tree rebenant do the same and cost 140 less.

That new points are fake 100%, have some names bad written and also drakes got allready the nerf of this faq some weeks ago,it was this next faq nerf but they only showed us the drakes early. So they wont change the points now

And also the cavalrys take so muuuuch space lol. Im used to small bases because in all my cos,sc and fyreslayers i only have one unit of wild riders and palladors. Now i have 10 black knigths and 15 blood knigths and only these 25 models takes the same space than my 3000 and 2000 points of cos and fyreslayers lol