The Red King

*I'm not actually gonna @ the mods for this joke* Everyone say bye to Neverchosen before he gets banned lol

Yeah I get that. I just play Skaven, cities, and beasts, so when I see all the cool named characters for a faction that have as many models as some grand alliances "man I wish theyd make another version of all of those." Is pretty far down my list of thoughts lol

Please no. We do not need stormcast getting the space marine treatment of needing individual sculpts and supplements for every storm host.

These guys are the most dark souls looking infantry in the game so I'm bound to get 5 in my living cities army (with a head swap) either way. I'll follow this thread with interest lol

I didn't mean to imply a conspiracy or even a negative. Just that as someone who worked in medical logistics if you told me "weve only got room for like 60% of what you need to send" I'd do an analysis of how best to utilize the room available and make a difficult decision based on that. Now they're not sending medicine but plastic toys so they dont have to weigh damages to the recipient (nor should they) but instead weight damage to their bottom line. If using all available space to ship the bigger selling game is the more financially sound decision I would expect them to make it. Of course the damage it does to the... for lack of a better word, morale, of your customers is an intangible that won't show up on a quarterly earnings report and I'm not qualified to say whether they've properly weighed it or not.

I was pretty much past blaming them for the shipping issues and thought surely it was just a poor coincidence that grey knights didnt get caught up in the delay. Or orks. Or kill team.. or black templar... Now it's starting to feel more and more like they ran the numbers and said "X customers buy 40k so we'll lose less money if we use our limited shipping room to sell only 40k" (which might even be a sound business decision I dont know) and just wont admit it.

Why is he stabbing her in what might be the root thighs? Like she has a very solid looking upper body and even stomach and he decides to stab what might just be a completely non lethal clump of roots? Or is this some soulsucking weapon and I'm an idiot?

Oh man theres the counter argument I cant believe it took this long to see. Note I'm only quoting Gaz in this case because he put the argument the most succinctly. This is in no way an attack on the messenger. "you still have a choice to send out content that may be viewed negatively early or not. As mentioned previously, if you feel you can not make a product that will earn praise, don’t send out review copies." There is no reason that GW should be excused for trying to legally stifle criticism. Yes you can't please everyone but when you go out of your way to try to legally mandate positive reviews it starts to look like maybe the criticism is more valid than the praise. Whether that's true or not, an innocent man doesn't fight so hard to keep people from being honest and perception is very much a factor.

Well last night I had an amazing game against daughters of khaine. A matchup I would usually avoid but I was late and didn't have much choice so I set to it and mentally prepared to be murdered like my game against Seraphon. My list was goretide: Khorgus kul Demon prince w/torque Lord on karkadrak w/gorecleaver Bloodsecrator Slaughter priest 5 wrathmongers 6 bullgor 10 reavers 5 fleshounds ×2 Ghorgon ×2 Hexgorger skulls Opponent played zainthar kai: Hag on cauldron w/minus one to wound her artifact Slaughter queen Medusa general w/arcane tome Medusa w/shadowstone 10 witch aelves ×3 15 bloodsisters 15 bloodstalkers Snake endless spell (he never cast it) I wrote the following write up last night so I'll try to fix it to be more readable but bear with me. Firstly we were playing power struggle where you have to hold the objectives for consecutive turns to score. For deployment he had 20 or so witches on my left side, 10 on my right and then the snakes and heroes central with the archers right of center and glaive left. My deployment had dogs on the flanks, reavers in the middle with the bullgor and wrathmongers, khul and the prince on my left deployed far enough to not be easily shot and the karkadrak on my right also back. A ghorgon to either side of my middle block. I expected him to take first turn with the shooting so maybe deployed too far back but he ended up giving it to me so it was kinda moot. T = turn as opposed to round. T1- I summoned the skulls and moved everything up but the bloodsecrator and priest which may have been a mistake keeping them back. I hesitated because the 15 stalkers were scary but I reasoned anything he wanted to kill he would but he couldnt kill everything at once. Popped blood slick ground and just formed up. Scoring 1 point for holding more and 2 for my battle tactic by having the Ghorgon hold one of my objectives on my left flank. 3-0 T2- the daughters failed to cast anything of value despite being out of range of my debuffs, dispelled my skulls, and moved up forming a general blob with the sisters and heroes, witches together side 20 on my left and 10 on my right with the stalkers. Shooting killed khul and 2 wrathmongers but thanks to bloodslick ground he failed the 4 inch charge with rerolls to get into my reavers and bullgor in the middle with his sisters and this may have won me the game. He scores 2 for slaying the warlord. 3-2 T3 - (no double turns in this game). I moved to all forward again (except my dogs who due to my forgetting I could leave objectives stayed back all game) getting the left ghorgon and prince within 3 of the witches, bullgor and reavers within 3 of the stalkers, and right ghorgon and karkadrak with a 5 and 9 inch charge respectively. I started with the bloodreavers who rolled poorly but just enough to get in 3 of his stalkers forcing the overwatch which utterly obliterated them of course. This opened the karkadrak to make a long charge on 10 witches and the ghorgon to make it into the witches/stalkers on his right flank. The bullgor hit the stalkers in the center and my prince and ghorgon hit the 10 witches on my left which where my battle tactic target to kill. The prince and ghorgon killed their 10, the bullgors in the center with all out attack and +2 attacks from wrathmongers+bloodsecrator killed 13.5 blood stalkers (HUGE for me) and the karkadrak and ghorgon on the right killed 8 witches and ~5 stalkers between monstrous and all. The sisters auto passed on a command point and the last 2 witches fled even with a reroll. My right most ghorgon went down to 1 wound, I lost a bullgor, and my prince was taken down to 3 wounds by a medusa who piled in. I scored 3 for the objectives held + more than my opponent, 2 for the tactic, and 1 for doing it with a monster for a big 6. 9-2 T4- He uses hero phase fighting to take the last wound off my right ghorgon but fails to do anything impactful enough to remember between his spells and prayers (some buffs/debuffs) partially due to the skulls. Brings up the last 10 witches on my left and retreats the sisters and medusa in the center. For whatever reason he pours all his shots into my demon prince (salty about that CA I guess) and manages to kill him. Moves the cauldron towards my right and charges into the karkadrak leaving him on 1 wound. He scores the leftmost for 1 as well as bring it down and slay a monster for 3. 9-5 T5- He removed my left side objective but it didnt matter as he hadnt taken his right side one back from me. Things get a little nutty after this with bloodtithe lining up perfectly. I pop The fight on death for 6 and he uses rally to bring back 3 slain blood sisters. My karkadrak stays in glorious combat to die as my bulls reposition to charge the archers if they can get around the sisters. The left side ghorgon moves away from the buffed witches towards exposed support characters and I decide to feed him to the overwatch. Predictably he dies terribly after charging the sisters but somehow manages to deal 9 wounds fighting on death at his bottom bracket thanks to mongers and bloodsecrator. The bullgor then charge the now exposed bloodstalkers and make glorious blood splatters out of the entire unit with all out attack and +2 attacks. His cauldron FAILS to kill the karkadrak who healed to 3 wounds with heroic recovery taking him back down to 1. I score my 2 plus more as well as battle tactic to run 3 units which I did in my backfield. He also scores one for killing my ghorgon. 14-6 Turn 6- I used apoplectic frenzy on my karkadrak during his turn to pile in and kill the cauldron with really lucky rolls. Magic is mostly blocked by the skulls. He proceeds to shoot down another bullgor with medusa stares and charges all his characters and last 10 witches into the bullgor killing them down to 1 remaining with a wound. On death plus their actual activation they kill all 10 witches and possibly the slaughterqueen return. I can't really recall and we basically called it as he failed to take the center objective as his battle tactic and scored a point for holding his. 14-7 I was super pleasantly surprised at the outcome that I won't call entirely luck, but I definitely rolled hot with my bullgor (even after losing kul turn 1) and his target priority for shooting was a bit whack. Like I think target saturation and an unfamiliar army caused him to misplace his shots which could have been better served mincing my bullgor. He also made a mistake letting me go first as I got on the objective in the middle ahead of him to start the process of scoring more. My big mistakes were in forgetting I could move my dogs (could've eaten some overwatch with them instead of a ghorgon) and leaving my Slaughterpriest back early. My biggest tactical positive was when he gave me turn 1 and I decided after much hemming and hawing that nothing could be kept safe so I'd just throw it all and see what made it. Turning point was probably that failed turn 1 charge thanks to bloodslick ground. I guess he didnt shoot them then because he thought the sisters would clean them up easily but there was no excuse not to shoot them on his second turn after he'd seen what they did and he tunneled in on that prince who caused the fumble.

Saying you cannot allocate wounds [this way] Is the same thing as saying you must allocate wounds [that way]. Pardon me if this is too America centric but if I come to a 3 way stop while driving where I can turn left or right and there is a sign that says "one way - no left turn" then by extension I must turn right or else sit there not progressing. If you want to argue that not progressing is a valid option and therefore we cant infer that the inverse or something we're not allowed to do is, by extension, something we must do by virtue of it being the only option to progress the game then I would genuinely like to hear what you think should happen to the unit in question when you go to allocate the wound.

Tell you what. Show me a tournament that will let you play by your technically correct Interpretation and I'll concede this isn't a massive waste of time. If not then what's the point of arguing theoreticals? This reads like D&D threads where people argue they should be able to conjure water inside someone's lungs. It doesn't matter if you're right or wrong if it has no application to the game.

You seem pretty convinced about your correctness so what is the point of this thread? Hope that enough people would agree with you so you could browbeat some poor newbie into accepting your obviously unintended end goal? You're arguing a theoretical because absolutely nobody is going to play this the way you want them to so what's the goal here? If you want to be told "you are right you found a contradiction in the rules" then Congratulations, you are right you found a contradiction in the rules. Anything beyond that is a moot point because games are played in the real world and no tournament or game with anyone that refuses to be browbeaten is going to use your interpretation of the rule so what are you actually hoping to achieve?

I think it's best (for stormcast) if we just assume it works as posited and then the unit becomes immortal because you have to allocate wounds to a wounded model first and since you cant do that because theres more than one and they cant both be first the wounds arent allocated. Clear and concise, stop using common sense to counteract shenanigans guys geez.

Please no. I need beasts to be bad or else I'm just bad T_T But really do we have a list to look at and try to decipher?

*The tone of my post felt aggressive so I wanted to preface with a statement that it isn't meant to be.* This is a blanket statement that excuses any actions taken by a million dollar corporation scientifically designed to affect the consumers ability to make smart purchases. That's not even a claim of big business being evil or anything, just that PR and marketing are huge industries designed around using psychology to influence people's decision making so saying it's not the companies fault is shifting the blame in a way I find egregious. And I'm not trying to put words in your mouth but that argument always reads to me as "it's their fault if they fell for a con." Instead of blaming... yknow... the guy running the game?

Lauchon the endless spell guy? Edit: ignore me I'm dumb. You said triskele and I meant trireme.

I also don't anything to do with Arch no matter how I feel on this matter.

I really appreciated the email proclaiming it contained info about a "spider wrangler" just to be necromunda. Thanks guys, definitely not a tone deaf reminder that there's no news for AoS lol.

Idk. I'm kinda with neverchosen on this one. This stretches the bounds of "dubious" to heretofore unimagined levels lol

I don't even need solid release dates because I know that can backfire. Just tell me "we'll be releasing a chaos-death-order-destruction tome [in that order] and this is what they'll be!" I don't care when it's coming but knowing WHATS coming can only help players plan out their projects but for whatever reason, GW insists on marketing as if their selling an impulse product when it's clearly a luxury hobby.

I've moved beyond blaming GW as I hear more and more shipping woes for everyone, but I'm still going to disparage their awful communication skills. A roadmap would do wonders right now for consumer goodwill. Like stormcast dragons interest me because they're dragons, but I'm not buying anything until I know what the chaos battletome is going to be so just leaving money on the table there. It makes even less sense because they're currently putting (ostensibly) a fourth of their customers into a holding pattern when if they revealed what the chaos tome is going to be it would only be one factions customers dissuaded from making purchases in the meantime.

Ain't that the truth. My doombull of khorne is still like the 3rd thing that pops up if you google image "Brass despoilers". Which I mean cool for me I guess but not for my beasts lol.

I use them all the time so some pointers. They die really easily. So if you expect a lot of shooting they're not really worth it. Second, they're really swingy. Sometimes you'll go in and kill like 12 guys and sometimes they'll do like 2 wounds. Average against a 4+ save is 6 wounds. They really benefit from buffs. Just keeping him inside the bloodsecrator aura and giving him all out attack or monstrous duel will double his damage output. Avg against 4+ almost 12. They serve best as bait or distractions. I've often lured enemies into committing something dangerous because ghorgon LOOK big and scary and then I end up charging the unit next turn with the things that actually ARE scary (bullgor, bloodthirster, etc). I find them of debatable use. If theres a lot of shooting they'll still work as a distraction but almost anything competent will kill them without any trouble. They can lure melee armies into over committing but since shooting doesn't pay the same opportunity costs in the movement phase or have to put themselves at risk to bring it down it really comes down to the meta. Other than that. Depending on the mission they can make for an easy savage spearhead battle tactic and you will want to make use of their monster status to score some extra points because they will inevitably be giving up points to your opponent.

Hmmmm if I stop running goretide (I built the army beasts out so the reroll aura of kul tempt me) I'd need another use for my beautiful 3rd party doombull so I could see myself trying double princes.

I'm really tempted to try Skarbrand myself but he'd change my whole list as obviously I'd have to go reapers. Archaon is everybody's winner. I refuse to use him as he doesnt suit the theme of my army. Skullreapers look neat but every unit that does the same thing as bullgors usually loses out to bullgors for me. Though they do kinda demand a CP for effect. Princes are awesome but not particularly for damage statistically so I'm curious what you'd want 2 for other than spreading out the amazing CA?