The Vanguard Wing

[kozokus]

Hey!

I am trying to make a 1K list with as few drops as possible and it came to my ming that the vangard wing got bigger with a new unit of judicator. So a Vanguard wing, with a decently sised Libérators unit looks like this.

• V-Wing 100
• Prosecutors 80
• Prosecutors 80
• Prosecutors 80
• Judicators 160
• Libérators 200

Total 700 points, so that is 300 left for at least one hero, maybe two for the additional artifact but not necessarly. The goal is to stay at 3 drop maximum to ensure that you can choose the first turn most of the time.

II am thinking about a unit of paladin with a hero, like an Azyros or a Relictor but not sure of anything. maybe a Raptur unit?

I think this really needs something able to deal with high armor unit, mortal wounds or high rend Otherwhise you might be dead on a monster army with a 2+rerollable.

Do you have any consideration to share regarding that?

[Turragor]

It's an objective game so it's best forgetting how to handle 'all lists'. In that regard, Castellant plus Azyros and then more liberators (shielded staunch defender'd tarpit for scary enemy units). 3 drops!

Another nice alternative is Azyros and then more juds (for Azyros and vanguard wing benefit). That leaves you wasting an artefact and troubled with 3 places of power.

[CountryMou3e]

Hey!
I am trying to make a 1K list with as few drops as possible and it came to my ming that the vangard wing got bigger with a new unit of judicator. So a Vanguard wing, with a decently sised Libérators unit looks like this.

• V-Wing 100
• Prosecutors 80
• Prosecutors 80
• Prosecutors 80
• Judicators 160
• Libérators 200

Total 700 points, so that is 300 left for at least one hero, maybe two for the additional artifact but not necessarly. The goal is to stay at 3 drop maximum to ensure that you can choose the first turn most of the time.
II am thinking about a unit of paladin with a hero, like an Azyros or a Relictor but not sure of anything. maybe a Raptur unit?
I think this really needs something able to deal with high armor unit, mortal wounds or high rend Otherwhise you might be dead on a monster army with a 2+rerollable.
Do you have any consideration to share regarding that?

How do you mean choose to go first each turn ? I thought it was randomly rolled for (I'm new


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[kozokus]

10 minutes ago, CountryMou3e said:

How do you mean choose to go first each turn ?

Only once,  the first player that finish his deployment decide who goes first in the first battleround (a whole bataillon count for one deployment)

Having only 3 deployment insure that most of the time you finish deploying before your opponent. The rest of the battle it is rolled randomly.

Most of the time, you want your opponent to go first, as you can prepare yourself to minimise his actions and want to have a chance to get a double turn on the second battleround which is a crucial turn.

[kozokus]

1 hour ago, Turragor said:

 

Another nice alternative is Azyros and then more juds (for Azyros and vanguard wing benefit). That leaves you wasting an artefact and troubled with 3 places of power.

Making a 10 jud unit? nice. Haven't thought about that. Wasting an artifact doesn't bother me too much as i cant think of an artifact that i want absolutly.

[Turragor]

26 minutes ago, kozokus said:

Making a 10 jud unit? nice. Haven't thought about that. Wasting an artifact doesn't bother me too much as i cant think of an artifact that i want absolutly.

You can take a gryph hound or aetherwings (less useful without raptors) as the last 60. That said, could you go 'order' instead of SCE allegiance if you've no relictor and aren't fussed on artefacts?

Hmm no staunch defenders is rather too good imo. So is mirroshield.

[Veillotron]

36 minutes ago, Turragor said:

 

Hmm no staunch defenders is rather too good imo. So is mirroshield.

Staunch defender is a command trait :-)

Agree re mirrorshield, it is excellent. So can be Luckstone (especially with Venator), Quicksilver draught, armour if destiny (good for both wounds and MWs), ...

Might be worth getting another hero. Castellant is a must in my book; Lord Celestant on foot offers great value for money and has a great Command Trait

 

[Thomas Lyons]

My list looks something like this:

• 300     15 Liberators
• 80       3 Prosecutors
• 80       3 Prosecutors
• 80       3 Prosecutors 
• 160     5 Judicators
• 100     Vanguard Wing
• 100     Lord-Castellant          
• 100     Lord-Celestant          Staunch Defender

If you wanted another hero, you could trade out 5 Libs, but I think having a deathstar of 15 libs with a perm 2+ reroll 1s save which can do double damage on a 5+ to hit is pretty good. This would also let you basically claim any objective on turn 1 a prosecutor run and starting the lib teleport deployment 5" out, and daisy chaining them to the objective.  

[kozokus]

I begin to really like that idea of "alpha strike anvil" teleporting on the first turn in a nice bubble around the ennemy army directly in combat to keep that nice bonus of staunch defender.

Such a shame there is no "fire and forget" buff for a close combat unit except for the bless weapon prayer.

 

[Thomas Lyons]

4 minutes ago, kozokus said:

I begin to really like that idea of "alpha strike anvil" teleporting on the first turn in a nice bubble around the ennemy army directly in combat to keep that nice bonus of staunch defender.

Such a shame there is no "fire and forget" buff for a close combat unit except for the bless weapon prayer.

 

Agreed!  I used it to great effect with my Nurgle Mortal army at Adepticon so it caused me to explore if it could work with SCE as well.  This is the shell of what I came up with for a 1k game.  I'm still massaging my 2k version of the list.

[Turragor]

1 hour ago, Veillotron said:

Staunch defender is a command trait :-)

I know, you wouldn't get it going Order is my point

[kozokus]

35 minutes ago, Thomas Lyons said:

Agreed!  I used it to great effect with my Nurgle Mortal army at Adepticon so it caused me to explore if it could work with SCE as well.  This is the shell of what I came up with for a 1k game.  I'm still massaging my 2k version of the list.

I saw that one

I really like your 1K list, even if i am not sold on the Lord Celestant On the pro side he has that nice command trait but it will be hard to get it on the Libérators. He also is a mortal wound dealer and that is something i love. I wonder if i would miss the reroll1 of the Azyros.

[kozokus]

12 minutes ago, Turragor said:

I know, you wouldn't get it going Order is my point

What would be the point to go Order btw?

[Veillotron]

18 minutes ago, Turragor said:

I know, you wouldn't get it going Order is my point

Understood ?

[Turragor]

11 minutes ago, kozokus said:

What would be the point to go Order btw?

I was thinking of potential uses for the last 60 points that weren't restricted to gryph hounds and aetherwings if you broke SCE allegiance (and what you'd lose if you did so).

Edit/ Oh but of course! Juds aren't batteline if you do so, so nevermind me

[Veillotron]

2 hours ago, Thomas Lyons said:

My list looks something like this:

• 300     15 Liberators
• 80       3 Prosecutors
• 80       3 Prosecutors
• 80       3 Prosecutors 
• 160     5 Judicators
• 100     Vanguard Wing
• 100     Lord-Castellant          
• 100     Lord-Celestant          Staunch Defender

If you wanted another hero, you could trade out 5 Libs, but I think having a deathstar of 15 libs with a perm 2+ reroll 1s save which can do double damage on a 5+ to hit is pretty good. This would also let you basically claim any objective on turn 1 a prosecutor run and starting the lib teleport deployment 5" out, and daisy chaining them to the objective.  

 

Actually, your "deathstar" of 15 would need to be broken into 3 to meet the minimum battleline units requirement, or can they be fielded as one but count as 3?

[kozokus]

After all, maybe the good solution is to put TWO Lord Castellan rather than the Lord Celestant.

[kozokus]

Just now, Veillotron said:

Actually, your "deathstar" of 15 would need to be broken into 3 to meet the minimum battleline units requirement, or can they be fielded as one but count as 3?

They count as one, but there is also the Judicators that are Battleline, and at 1000 points 2 battleline are enough. At 2000 this is another story thought.

[Thomas Lyons]

1 minute ago, Veillotron said:

Actually, your "deathstar" of 15 would need to be broken into 3 to meet the minimum battleline units requirement, or can they be fielded as one but count as 3?

In Vanguard games, you need 2 battleline units.  The Liberators are one; the judicators are the other (since you are mono SCE).

[Veillotron]

Cool, thank you for clarifying - indeed you only need 2 battelines at 1000pts

[kozokus]

Only had one test so far with the Vanguard Ving

15 liberators 3X3 Prosecutors 1X5 Judicators Lord celestant and lord Castellan.

Was against a mixed uncompetitive Chaos force on Take and Hold.

The result was atrocious. I won on the third turn, loosing a couple of Libérators and tabling my opponent entirely.

The movement shenanigan was so unfair, beeing able to engage and put 3 GreatHammer on anything at will with a 2+rerolabble 15 man unit.

Afterthoughts : The Lord Celestant was the weakest link, doing nothing and his +1 almost never came online.

A good idea could be to remove him and put an Azyros instead to reroll thoses pesky 1 on shooting and make the libérator Prime the général. After all he never had to charge a single time. The total absence of mortal Wounds still concerns me.

[Turragor]

4 hours ago, kozokus said:

Only had one test so far with the Vanguard Ving

15 liberators 3X3 Prosecutors 1X5 Judicators Lord celestant and lord Castellan.

Was against a mixed uncompetitive Chaos force on Take and Hold.

The result was atrocious. I won on the third turn, loosing a couple of Libérators and tabling my opponent entirely.

The movement shenanigan was so unfair, beeing able to engage and put 3 GreatHammer on anything at will with a 2+rerolabble 15 man unit.

Afterthoughts : The Lord Celestant was the weakest link, doing nothing and his +1 almost never came online.

A good idea could be to remove him and put an Azyros instead to reroll thoses pesky 1 on shooting and make the libérator Prime the général. After all he never had to charge a single time. The total absence of mortal Wounds still concerns me.

Well the Castellant has the option against chaos. Azyros can also explode once per battle. Extra juicy against chaos. 

Nothing reliable really. 

Maybe a heraldor. 

I can't see you get any mw units in at 1000 with the formation. 

[kozokus]

Well, the formation is 800 worth with 15 libérators si there is only 200 left and the Castellan is a staple so 100 left. That makes only 4 serious candidates : Celestant, Azyros, Relictor and an additonnal Castellan for extra lulz. I skipped the Questor even if i like him. the only possible source of Mortal wounds is the celestant's cape so i guess there is better things to do.

[Turragor]

Relictor prayer but not reliable. 2 Relictors with blessed weapons to guarantee that in your libs? Or 10 juds? 

[Kakoshka]

On 2017-4-29 at 8:48 PM, kozokus said:

Well, the formation is 800 worth with 15 libérators si there is only 200 left and the Castellan is a staple so 100 left. That makes only 4 serious candidates : Celestant, Azyros, Relictor and an additonnal Castellan for extra lulz. I skipped the Questor even if i like him. the only possible source of Mortal wounds is the celestant's cape so i guess there is better things to do.

A relictor with lightning chariot to move the prosecutors 24"? It may be over kill given their 12" move but the neg 1 to hit lightning storm can make your tar pit even tar-pit-ier?
A knight-venator while a bit over costed could be good to offer you some long range shooting. If you're not facing much competitive action putting a luck stone on him and sniping heroes can be not the worst.