Helping Newbs Best buys 1000/2000 point load outs what to buy?

[TimM85]

I creating this thread a useful tool to help newbs and old hands.

What would you advise for someone starting in your faction.

The purpose of the post is to post 1000 and 2000 point lists (aretfacts not really necessary can include battalions) that won't get smashed up straight away and will stop them just buying random models that cost them in the end and just sit in the box of shame hoping to save people money in the long run.

Why- Best value for money is not always best value for your wallet, when coming back into the hobby it was this new rule of cool buy it it looks cool it will be fine on the tabletop, NOPE,(when I first started out 16 years ago the guys in the gw store would build a solid foundation around a faction you like I want to replicate this advice in my local independent retailer) in fact only 5 blood warriors and a bloodsecrator see the tabletop out of my first 150 quid back into the hobby. Now I'm stubborn play more get better buy some decent unit's but if someone new had spent 150 quid or more on an army to find out its  rubbish once they've built and painted they may put off. I want to be able to give good advice to our local gaming group and Newbie AOS players and what will be the best value in the long run for the player for the army they want.

For example a Khorne player

Bloodsecrator

2x slaughter priest

2x10 blood warriors gorefists

2x 10 blood reavers with meat ripper axes

gorepilgrims 

skull altar

1000 pts

now its not amazing but its a solid foundation and easily expanded to larger games and even smaller games you will still use bits from this cost 168.50 I've avoided the start collecting as you only get reaver blades, no gore glaive, no standard musician etc, 

expand to 2000pts

3xBloodthirsters 

advice magentise best preference or 1 of each

255gbp

again not ground breaking but they then have a solid 2000pt list which is easy to add and remove models they won't get smashed off the table every game, I'd advise them on trying to get half wrath and rapture and a start collecting daemons box. so another 100quid.

obviously if they expressed an interest more in the mortal side I'd give them different advice wrath mongers, skull reapers, crushers, and still advise the half of wrath and a start collecting daemon and 1 bt for summoning. 

Now my knowledge is pretty limited to khorne, dispossessed and wanderers so asking your ideas your solid foundations for your faction.

NOTE: this is not a who has the better list post its a post about helping others build a solid foundation so they can play a decent game while they workout whats best for them without buying 4 start collecting using 10 percent of it and that 10 percent need converting. Many thanks Guys and Girls all list suggestions with reasons are much appreciated.

 

Edited August 12, 2019 by TimM85

[zilberfrid]

With my limited knowledge, I'll hold off on replying except for the following:

If you are interested in Free Peoples,  Ironweld, College, Disposessed, Dark elves, High elves or Wanderers, wait for a bit. So much is unsure at the moment, that no list can be made that you can expect to work the same in three months.

[Fairbanks]

12 hours ago, TimM85 said:

I creating this thread a useful tool to help newbs and old hands.

What would you advise for someone starting in your faction.

The purpose of the post is to post 1000 and 2000 point lists (aretfacts not really necessary can include battalions) that won't get smashed up straight away and will stop them just buying random models that cost them in the end and just sit in the box of shame hoping to save people money in the long run.

Why- Best value for money is not always best value for your wallet, when coming back into the hobby it was this new rule of cool buy it it looks cool it will be fine on the tabletop, NOPE,(when I first started out 16 years ago the guys in the gw store would build a solid foundation around a faction you like I want to replicate this advice in my local independent retailer) in fact only 5 blood warriors and a bloodsecrator see the tabletop out of my first 150 quid back into the hobby. Now I'm stubborn play more get better buy some decent unit's but if someone new had spent 150 quid or more on an army to find out its  rubbish once they've built and painted they may put off. I want to be able to give good advice to our local gaming group and Newbie AOS players and what will be the best value in the long run for the player for the army they want.

For example a Khorne player

Bloodsecrator

2x slaughter priest

2x10 blood warriors gorefists

2x 10 blood reavers with meat ripper axes

gorepilgrims 

skull altar

1000 pts

now its not amazing but its a solid foundation and easily expanded to larger games and even smaller games you will still use bits from this cost 168.50 I've avoided the start collecting as you only get reaver blades, no gore glaive, no standard musician etc, 

expand to 2000pts

3xBloodthirsters 

advice magentise best preference or 1 of each

255gbp

again not ground breaking but they then have a solid 2000pt list which is easy to add and remove models they won't get smashed off the table every game, I'd advise them on trying to get half wrath and rapture and a start collecting daemons box. so another 100quid.

obviously if they expressed an interest more in the mortal side I'd give them different advice wrath mongers, skull reapers, crushers, and still advise the half of wrath and a start collecting daemon and 1 bt for summoning. 

Now my knowledge is pretty limited to khorne, dispossessed and wanderers so asking your ideas your solid foundations for your faction.

NOTE: this is not a who has the better list post its a post about helping others build a solid foundation so they can play a decent game while they workout whats best for them without buying 4 start collecting using 10 percent of it and that 10 percent need converting. Many thanks Guys and Girls all list suggestions with reasons are much appreciated.

 

Stawk’s 1000 point list guide comes to mind, though by now I’m sure it’s out of date and had more of a goal of getting you some kind of list on the cheap.

I think for most armies I’d start with the suggestion of one Start Collecting, getting a few games at ~500 points, then the book, and then fleshing out from there.

[TheNotebookGM]

Fyreslayers are pretty expensive to get into- but here is the deal.

Two paths diverge in the land of Fyreslayers.

The current spam lists are basically 45-65 Hearthguard Berserkers, a Runefather, Battlesmith, and Runemaster running the Lords of the Lodge battalion. If you decide to max out the Hearthguard you won't need any Vulkites, so don't bother with Start collecting boxes. This creates 2-3 basically invincible blocks of infantry that just slowly roll across the field and dish out solid attacks in droves, one of which strikes first and twice for a measly command point. 

That said, I personally find having so limiting a collection too limiting, and would suggest starting with a Start Collecting, a Battlesmith, and 2 Boxes of Hearthguard Berserkers/Auric Hearthguard. (Going to run you about 215 USD before book and forge)

If you are a magnetizing-capable individual I highly suggest doing so for the Magmadroth

        -Runesons on Magmadroths are most useful in pairs, so if you want to take advantage of their re-roll to attacks I suggest just starting with 2 Start                  Collectings as you're building your way to a great Warrior Kinband list.

        -I most often find myself using the Runesmiter on Magmadroth as I like to have to extra prayer with my mortal wound machine, plus, that builds towards the Forge Brethren battalion, which I personally favor.

        -If you are going to build towards the Lords of the Lodge list you can't go wrong with the Runefather on Magmadroth, he is the hittiest of the three, but also the priciest and lacks that tasty, tasty, prayer. 

 

At this point, if you take my suggestion for a more rounded selection you'd have the following.

A hero on Magmadroth (Runeson 240-Runesmiter 260-Runefather 280) 

Two Heroes on foot (Runefather 100- Runeson 100- Runesmiter 120 but allows deepstrike and has a prayer)

A Battlesmith (140)

10 Vulkite Berserkers (160)

2x5 of Auric Hearthguard, Hearthguard Berserkers or one of each (240) (Hearthguard Berserkers are battleline if Runefather is General, Aurics if the Runemaster is general, who you'd have to add to the list of what to buy)

(1000-1040 depending on loadout)

This gives you a good feel of what the army does, and if you decide to build one of each from the Hearthguard box you will have one unit of all three main things in the army and you can decide where to go from there. Anyone with further questions about the Fyreslayers should post them in the discussion thread over on the Order forum or reach out to me by PM, I'm always happy to field questions about our stunty friends. 

[TimM85]

5 hours ago, TheNotebookGM said:

Fyreslayers are pretty expensive to get into- but here is the deal.

Two paths diverge in the land of Fyreslayers.

The current spam lists are basically 45-65 Hearthguard Berserkers, a Runefather, Battlesmith, and Runemaster running the Lords of the Lodge battalion. If you decide to max out the Hearthguard you won't need any Vulkites, so don't bother with Start collecting boxes. This creates 2-3 basically invincible blocks of infantry that just slowly roll across the field and dish out solid attacks in droves, one of which strikes first and twice for a measly command point. 

That said, I personally find having so limiting a collection too limiting, and would suggest starting with a Start Collecting, a Battlesmith, and 2 Boxes of Hearthguard Berserkers/Auric Hearthguard. (Going to run you about 215 USD before book and forge)

If you are a magnetizing-capable individual I highly suggest doing so for the Magmadroth

        -Runesons on Magmadroths are most useful in pairs, so if you want to take advantage of their re-roll to attacks I suggest just starting with 2 Start                  Collectings as you're building your way to a great Warrior Kinband list.

        -I most often find myself using the Runesmiter on Magmadroth as I like to have to extra prayer with my mortal wound machine, plus, that builds towards the Forge Brethren battalion, which I personally favor.

        -If you are going to build towards the Lords of the Lodge list you can't go wrong with the Runefather on Magmadroth, he is the hittiest of the three, but also the priciest and lacks that tasty, tasty, prayer. 

 

At this point, if you take my suggestion for a more rounded selection you'd have the following.

A hero on Magmadroth (Runeson 240-Runesmiter 260-Runefather 280) 

Two Heroes on foot (Runefather 100- Runeson 100- Runesmiter 120 but allows deepstrike and has a prayer)

A Battlesmith (140)

10 Vulkite Berserkers (160)

2x5 of Auric Hearthguard, Hearthguard Berserkers or one of each (240) (Hearthguard Berserkers are battleline if Runefather is General, Aurics if the Runemaster is general, who you'd have to add to the list of what to buy)

(1000-1040 depending on loadout)

This gives you a good feel of what the army does, and if you decide to build one of each from the Hearthguard box you will have one unit of all three main things in the army and you can decide where to go from there. Anyone with further questions about the Fyreslayers should post them in the discussion thread over on the Order forum or reach out to me by PM, I'm always happy to field questions about our stunty friends. 

Awesome stuff just what I was after thankyou.

[TimM85]

6 hours ago, Fairbanks said:

Stawk’s 1000 point list guide comes to mind, though by now I’m sure it’s out of date and had more of a goal of getting you some kind of list on the cheap.

I think for most armies I’d start with the suggestion of one Start Collecting, getting a few games at ~500 points, then the book, and then fleshing out from there.

Yes and no. Sometimes the cheapest is not always going to give the player a good load out and give them anything to expand on SCs are great value but only if your going to need those models. In the khorne example theres no start collecting except the daemons, the proper box of blood warriors includes the gore glaive standard and musician and reavers get meat ripper axes, vs SC reaver blades and no command option for BWs. The old wrath monger skull reaper box was an awesome option. And as placed in the fyreslayer comment included 1 SC and loaded out with other models. 

Its also about me expanding my knowledge so recommending to newbs so they don't end up with loads of stuff they won't use as I put i'm limited to khorne diss and wanderers knowledge and with khorne SC Mortals buy 1 max if at all.. In my example the secretor the priests and the BTs SC Daemons and half WandR will all see use no matter which way they go with their army yes they might not use them all all the time but the majority fit in most battalions.

[DeadGroove]

I'd appreciate some help on a 1000 point death army list. So far have this:

 

Arkhan the black

Necromancer 

30x skeletons 

10x dire wolves

5x black knights

[Kasper]

Good idea with this thread, but I feel like people often have a "buy this, buy that" attitude towards new players, instead of taking a step back and advicing the new player as to what faction they should start investing in. Nobody did this with me, and I happily invested in a faction due to the fluff. I didn't even think about how they played on the table, and it bit me in the ass later on when it came to actually playing the game.

I think some of the important questions you have to ask a new player is:

• What is the goal? Do they want to just buy, collect and paint? Then fluff and "rule of cool" is king.
• Do they actually want to play the game? In which case, casual mode or semi competitive? If casual, fluff/rule of cool is still king. If semi competitive, power level of the army is super relevant. There is a HUGE difference between the old books and the newer ones, and it sucks having invested in an "abandoned" faction.
• If they want to play the game, what do they fancy? Aggressive melee army that rushes across the board to smash the enemy's face in? Some tanky army with good saves? Some army that stands back and shoots the enemy? Army that specializes in heavy magic?
• Do they want a horde army? My army "required" 150+ models to be competitive. If I had known this, I would never have spent a dime on that army. Maybe a semi elite - "normal" army is more interesting for them. Having to buy, assemble and paint 100+ models for a 2k point game can be very intimidating for new players. Pushing that many models across the table is also incredible annoying for some players.

Etc. etc. The hobby is expensive, and personally I would've liked to not having spent that much cash on an army I will never play again.

[TimM85]

4 hours ago, Kasper said:

Good idea with this thread, but I feel like people often have a "buy this, buy that" attitude towards new players, instead of taking a step back and advicing the new player as to what faction they should start investing in. Nobody did this with me, and I happily invested in a faction due to the fluff. I didn't even think about how they played on the table, and it bit me in the ass later on when it came to actually playing the game.

I think some of the important questions you have to ask a new player is:

• What is the goal? Do they want to just buy, collect and paint? Then fluff and "rule of cool" is king.
• Do they actually want to play the game? In which case, casual mode or semi competitive? If casual, fluff/rule of cool is still king. If semi competitive, power level of the army is super relevant. There is a HUGE difference between the old books and the newer ones, and it sucks having invested in an "abandoned" faction.
• If they want to play the game, what do they fancy? Aggressive melee army that rushes across the board to smash the enemy's face in? Some tanky army with good saves? Some army that stands back and shoots the enemy? Army that specializes in heavy magic?
• Do they want a horde army? My army "required" 150+ models to be competitive. If I had known this, I would never have spent a dime on that army. Maybe a semi elite - "normal" army is more interesting for them. Having to buy, assemble and paint 100+ models for a 2k point game can be very intimidating for new players. Pushing that many models across the table is also incredible annoying for some players.

Etc. etc. The hobby is expensive, and personally I would've liked to not having spent that much cash on an army I will never play again.

Yeah thats the point of the thread, even playing casual you still need a decent base, running my wanderers is like playing on hard mode, almost the same with khorne though they are mid tier. I find the painter/collector doesn't really need advice unless their goal is to play. Most don't want super competitive but also don't want to get smashed all the time. Also it's to save people unnecessary purchases, every khorne player will own at least 1 bt 1blood secretor and 1 slaughter priest they will also have some flesh hounds and letters for summoning. Khorne is almost a secret horde army to be playable.

If you have purchase advice initial 1000points for your faction it would be really helpful in the comments.

If you have 

[TimM85]

13 hours ago, DeadGroove said:

I'd appreciate some help on a 1000 point death army list. So far have this:

 

Arkhan the black

Necromancer 

30x skeletons 

10x dire wolves

5x black knights

Seems like you have a decent base  you actually have a decent 1000pt army just split the dire wolves into 2x5, they will be able to feed you better info on allegiance traits and artefact the only limiting factor is you need your necromancer as general to receive a command trait and he also has to take the artefact.

[NinthMusketeer]

Going with Nurgle, keeping this short and sweet:

Get a start collecting box for Rotbringers and for Nurgle Daemons. Buy two boxes of blightkings and a harbinger of decay.

You can now run the Blight Cyst battalion with a harbinger for his command ability, this fills 1000 points and performs well. The daemons are for summoning.

To expand get two boxes of plaguebearers so you can add a 30x unit to the list as an anvil, bring in a lord of afflictions (from the start collecting box earlier) to buff your blightkings and fight on the front lines, use the poxbringer for magic support, and nurglings to outflank. Plague drones remain off the list to be summoned in during the game, and picking up some more plaguebearers for that purpose is a good idea but optional. Fill the rest as you see fit to get to 2000, more blightkings are always nice while festus and gutrot are good character choices. If budget is less of an issue pick up a GUO and give him the bell.

[TimM85]

3 hours ago, NinthMusketeer said:

Going with Nurgle, keeping this short and sweet:

Get a start collecting box for Rotbringers and for Nurgle Daemons. Buy two boxes of blightkings and a harbinger of decay.

You can now run the Blight Cyst battalion with a harbinger for his command ability, this fills 1000 points and performs well. The daemons are for summoning.

To expand get two boxes of plaguebearers so you can add a 30x unit to the list as an anvil, bring in a lord of afflictions (from the start collecting box earlier) to buff your blightkings and fight on the front lines, use the poxbringer for magic support, and nurglings to outflank. Plague drones remain off the list to be summoned in during the game, and picking up some more plaguebearers for that purpose is a good idea but optional. Fill the rest as you see fit to get to 2000, more blightkings are always nice while festus and gutrot are good character choices. If budget is less of an issue pick up a GUO and give him the bell.

Thank you great stuff. Appreciate it.

[DeadGroove]

How does this look for a 1000 point idoneth deepkin list?

Vulturnos

Isharan soulrender (or tidecaster)

20 thralls (either 2x units of 10 or one 20)

6x akhelian morrsarr guard (again either 2x 3 units or one 6)