AoS 2 - Hedonites of Slaanesh Discussion

[CarkFish]

1 minute ago, Enoby said:

No problem at all Do you have a list in mind?

im just looking at the book now.... Figure ill start by choosing a sub faction then build from there.... Thnkin "pretenders" at the moment... but im only 5 mins into the book

Tips welcome

[Enoby]

16 minutes ago, CarkFish said:

im just looking at the book now.... Figure ill start by choosing a sub faction then build from there.... Thnkin "pretenders" at the moment... but im only 5 mins into the book

Tips welcome

I'll write up a bit more later, but one thing to keep in mind is the Wrath of the Everchosen subfactions

These are Scarlet Cavalcade Godseekers), Faultless Blades (Pretenders), and Lurid Haze (Invaders). 

I know Lurid Haze off by heart but the other two I'm a bit fuzzier on and my book is elsewhere right now.

From memory:

Scarlet Cavalcade (Godseekers): when you make a charge wholly(?) Within 12" of another Scarlet Cavalcade unit, you can roll for just one unit (using its bonusses) and take that roll for both; works well with copying marauders charge rule. I cannot remember the artifact or trait, or command ability 

Faultless Blades (Pretenders): when you make a charge move, you gain +1 to hit against heroes. I think either the trait or artifact gives a 6" pile in, can't remember the command ability

Lurid Haze: After deployment, before the first round, you take d3 units from your side of the board and set them up in the Haze. In your first movement phase, you can set them up anywhere on the board within 6" of the board edge and 9" away from enemy models. The command trait allows you to reroll runs wholly within 12" (or maybe it's within 6"?), and the and the artifact gives 1 extra wound. Finally, the command ability gives +1 to save wholly within 12". 

I, and many others, love Lurid Haze. It combos well with Sigvald - send him (and a keeper) in enemy back lines; give him a 2+ save with a 4+ oversave, and he'll get loads of attacks on the charge with the ability to attack twice.

[CarkFish]

1 hour ago, Enoby said:

I'll write up a bit more later, but one thing to keep in mind is the Wrath of the Everchosen subfactions

These are Scarlet Cavalcade Godseekers), Faultless Blades (Pretenders), and Lurid Haze (Invaders). 

I know Lurid Haze off by heart but the other two I'm a bit fuzzier on and my book is elsewhere right now.

From memory:

Scarlet Cavalcade (Godseekers): when you make a charge wholly(?) Within 12" of another Scarlet Cavalcade unit, you can roll for just one unit (using its bonusses) and take that roll for both; works well with copying marauders charge rule. I cannot remember the artifact or trait, or command ability 

Faultless Blades (Pretenders): when you make a charge move, you gain +1 to hit against heroes. I think either the trait or artifact gives a 6" pile in, can't remember the command ability

Lurid Haze: After deployment, before the first round, you take d3 units from your side of the board and set them up in the Haze. In your first movement phase, you can set them up anywhere on the board within 6" of the board edge and 9" away from enemy models. The command trait allows you to reroll runs wholly within 12" (or maybe it's within 6"?), and the and the artifact gives 1 extra wound. Finally, the command ability gives +1 to save wholly within 12". 

I, and many others, love Lurid Haze. It combos well with Sigvald - send him (and a keeper) in enemy back lines; give him a 2+ save with a 4+ oversave, and he'll get loads of attacks on the charge with the ability to attack twice.

I did notice the keepers Command ability and think.... This has play :)....

A few questions ....

How do you rate the archer units? .....

The slickblade seekers look pretty awesome ... Would the battallion that gives me 6" pile in mean i could walk them up to 5" ... not charge... and still get to attack?

The greedy dude on the wagon seems great .... but 400pts is an awful lot?

[CarkFish]

If I take one of the wrsth if the everchosen faction i.e. "The faultless blades" .. do I also get the pretenders abilities from the main book?

[CarkFish]

Looking to run this tonight .... It feels "right" .... Thoughts welcome

++ **Pitched Battle** 2,000 (Chaos - Slaanesh) [1,990pts] ++

+ Leader [750pts] +

Keeper of Secrets [340pts]: 0. Contest of Cruelty, 2. Monarch of Lies, 2. Pendant of Slaanesh, Arcane Bolt, Elegant Greatblade, General, Impaling Claws, Mystic Shield, Sinistrous Hand, Wound Tracker 

Shardspeaker of Slaanesh [150pts]: 0. Contemptuous Brand, 3. Dark Delusions, Arcane Bolt, Haze Staff, Mystic Shield, Shadow-cloaked Claws

Sigvald, Prince of Slaanesh [260pts]: Shardslash

+ Battleline [520pts] +

Chaos Marauders [160pts]: 20 Chaos Marauders [160pts], Barbarian Flails, Drummer, Icon Bearer, Slaanesh

Chaos Warriors [180pts]: 2x 5 Chaos Warriors [180pts], Chaos Hand Weapons and Chaos Runeshields, Hornblower, Slaanesh, Standard Bearer

Chaos Warriors [180pts]: 2x 5 Chaos Warriors [180pts], Chaos Hand Weapons and Chaos Runeshields, Hornblower, Slaanesh, Standard Bearer

+ Battalion [720pts] +

Battalion: Seeker Cavalcade [720pts]
. Blissbarb Seekers [180pts]: 5 Slickblade Seekers [180pts], Blissbarb Bow, High Tempter, Steed of Slaanesh's Poisoned Tongue, Sybarite Blade
. Slickblade Seekers [400pts]: 2x 5 Slickblade Seekers [400pts], Slickblade Glaive, Steed of Slaanesh's Poisoned Tongue

+ Allegiance +

Allegiance
. Allegiance: Slaanesh
. . Pretenders Host: Faultless Blades

+ Game Options +

Game Type: 2000 Points - Battlehost

++ Total: [1,990pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

Edited June 2, 2021 by CarkFish

[Enoby]

11 minutes ago, CarkFish said:

I did notice the keepers Command ability and think.... This has play :)....

A few questions ....

How do you rate the archer units? .....

The slickblade seekers look pretty awesome ... Would the battallion that gives me 6" pile in mean i could walk them up to 5" ... not charge... and still get to attack?

The greedy dude on the wagon seems great .... but 400pts is an awful lot?

I like the archers, but they're tricky to assess: blissbarbs are good to have a ranged support battleline - a unit to sit at the back and plink away at. Blissbarbs seekers are better in nearly every way, except they are not battleline. This hurts a lot because we can be points stretched - I'd recommend taking blissbarbs on foot if you're lacking a battleline position, and blissbarbs on steed if you have your battleline filled out

And yes, the seeker cavalcade is considered amazing for just this reason with a 6" pile in from 6" away, you can retreat and pile in, run and pile in, and strike first in your turn - as well as pile in to 2" away so you get your glaives in, but the opponent can't get as many in. Combos well with the KoS, who stops them piling in at all - making the slickblades immune for that turn

He's definitely worth 400pts of tankiness (remember Lurid Haze gives him a potential 2+ save 5++ oversave) and that -1 to hit bubble helps a tonne. He's also not a monster, so benefits from look out sir and cover (and garasons). In addition, he can provide battleshock immunity with an easy spell and can mystic shield himself. Works well with Archaon, who can heal a tonne with Glutos's command ability. 

58 minutes ago, CarkFish said:

If I take one of the wrsth if the everchosen faction i.e. "The faultless blades" .. do I also get the pretenders abilities from the main book?

Yes - you get both abilities the downside is you lose one of your command traits and your first artifact. 

24 minutes ago, CarkFish said:

Looking to run this tonight .... It feels "right" .... Thoughts welcome

 

I think it will be an interesting list, though with Sigvald and Marauders you might be better suited to Lurid Haze for that early game teleport. In addition, as you'll be piling in more than charging with a good chunk of your army, the Faultless Blade ability won't work as often.

A few other comments:

It will increase your drops significantly, but you're on high drops anyway - I'd split your warriors into four groups of 5. The rerolling saves is nice, no doubt, but it fades so quickly I think having more board presence and double screens would help more.

I'm struggling to read the number of slickblades you have - am I correct in saying 10 slickblades and 5 blissbarbs? I'm not sure if the Slickblades are separate, but I'd definitely put them in two separate units of 5 - again for board presence, but also to lessen the impact of battleshock.

Hope this helps

[CarkFish]

5 minutes ago, Enoby said:

I like the archers, but they're tricky to assess: blissbarbs are good to have a ranged support battleline - a unit to sit at the back and plink away at. Blissbarbs seekers are better in nearly every way, except they are not battleline. This hurts a lot because we can be points stretched - I'd recommend taking blissbarbs on foot if you're lacking a battleline position, and blissbarbs on steed if you have your battleline filled out

And yes, the seeker cavalcade is considered amazing for just this reason with a 6" pile in from 6" away, you can retreat and pile in, run and pile in, and strike first in your turn - as well as pile in to 2" away so you get your glaives in, but the opponent can't get as many in. Combos well with the KoS, who stops them piling in at all - making the slickblades immune for that turn

He's definitely worth 400pts of tankiness (remember Lurid Haze gives him a potential 2+ save 5++ oversave) and that -1 to hit bubble helps a tonne. He's also not a monster, so benefits from look out sir and cover (and garasons). In addition, he can provide battleshock immunity with an easy spell and can mystic shield himself. Works well with Archaon, who can heal a tonne with Glutos's command ability. 

Yes - you get both abilities the downside is you lose one of your command traits and your first artifact. 

I think it will be an interesting list, though with Sigvald and Marauders you might be better suited to Lurid Haze for that early game teleport. In addition, as you'll be piling in more than charging with a good chunk of your army, the Faultless Blade ability won't work as often.

A few other comments:

It will increase your drops significantly, but you're on high drops anyway - I'd split your warriors into four groups of 5. The rerolling saves is nice, no doubt, but it fades so quickly I think having more board presence and double screens would help more.

I'm struggling to read the number of slickblades you have - am I correct in saying 10 slickblades and 5 blissbarbs? I'm not sure if the Slickblades are separate, but I'd definitely put them in two separate units of 5 - again for board presence, but also to lessen the impact of battleshock.

Hope this helps

Thank you!!! ... Tess the slickbkades we're in 10 ... I'll break them out... With the KoS artifact they'll get a 9 inch pile in I think

[Enoby]

46 minutes ago, CarkFish said:

Thank you!!! ... Tess the slickbkades we're in 10 ... I'll break them out... With the KoS artifact they'll get a 9 inch pile in I think

I'm not totally sure on that one, I must admit! I can't remember the exact wording of the Scarlet Cavalcade item

 

Also, as of today's article, Glutos loses look out sir but Synessa gains it - yay us? Tbh, Synessa needs it more 

[Yoid]

1 hour ago, Enoby said:

I'm not totally sure on that one, I must admit! I can't remember the exact wording of the Scarlet Cavalcade item

 

Also, as of today's article, Glutos loses look out sir but Synessa gains it - yay us? Tbh, Synessa needs it more 

Uuuh. Is so weird that Dexcessa don't have Look Out Sir but Synessa have it.

[CarkFish]

How do the two new KoS characters feel to you guys .... Dexcessa feels a bit better to me 

[CarkFish]

53 minutes ago, Yoid said:

Uuuh. Is so weird that Dexcessa don't have Look Out Sir but Synessa have it.

How did you get to that? Seems odd aye....

figured it out .... wounds

 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2021 by CarkFish

[Nagashfan]

With AOS 3 coming soon and the changes to battalions, will we loose the seeker cavalcade and that awesome 6 inch pile in for the slick blades?

[CarkFish]

4 minutes ago, Nagashfan said:

With AOS 3 coming soon and the changes to battalions, will we loose the seeker cavalcade and that awesome 6 inch pile in for the slick blades?

Possibly ... But remember, if that happens everyone else looses their crazy toys too

[Nagashfan]

22 minutes ago, CarkFish said:

Possibly ... But remember, if that happens everyone else looses their crazy toys too

True, I just felt that was a powerful ability that helped Slaanesh be competitive while other armies can just rely on their op warscroll abilities like LRL

Edited June 2, 2021 by Nagashfan

[Enoby]

If it's any consolation, I very rarely use Seeker Cavalcade - not because it's not good (it is very good), but because I worried it would go and I wanted to learn to work without it.

From experience, we're fine I think that's probably the biggest hit we'll take in 3rd (and others suffer too) unless some ****** decides to up our points again!  

[Nagashfan]

2 minutes ago, Enoby said:

If it's any consolation, I very rarely use Seeker Cavalcade - not because it's not good (it is very good), but because I worried it would go and I wanted to learn to work without it.

From experience, we're fine I think that's probably the biggest hit we'll take in 3rd (and others suffer too) unless some ****** decides to up our points again!  

You use slickblades thou? Any tips for a struggling new hedonite?

[Enoby]

Just now, Nagashfan said:

You use slickblades thou? Any tips for a struggling new hedonite?

I do use Slickblades I think you just have to play more defensively with them - charging them in with another unit, especially a keeper for that pile in protection and double pile in. Don't be afraid to not charge and move back instead, and definitely don't be afraid to retreat. 6" pile in is great - no doubt - but it just tipped slickblades from very good to incredible. 

Is there anything you're struggling with in particular?

[Nagashfan]

Mostly just how to use the new hedonites units and how generate DP as fast as possible, I used to always try for first turn charges but that is probably old book slaanesh

[Enoby]

5 minutes ago, Nagashfan said:

Mostly just how to use the new hedonites units and how generate DP as fast as possible, I used to always try for first turn charges but that is probably old book slaanesh

Awesome

My advice is to not focus on DP generation - you can get it quickly if you try, but focusing resources to it often ends you up not having enough to do anything else. DP will generate at a decent rate normally, with Blissbarbs being the best unit for that while still being useful as battleline.

As for each of the new units:

Glutos: Very strong unit that should act as an all-round support. Gives a large -1 aura, is very tanky, gives a small aura of +1 bravery, can dispell well, can cast battleshock immunity, and eventually gives it. Worth it in most lists, though not all

Sigvald: very good in Lurid Haze for the teleport ability combined with his charge, as well as a KoS getting him to pile in twice. Despite his save, having 6 wounds makes him pretty squishy and very susceptible to bad luck. He'll likely die, but he can carve through the opponent before he does and can force hard decisions 

Lord of Pain: they're okay - they will get considerably better if Painbringers come down and so make better battleline

Shardspeaker: my Shardspeaker hates me and doesn't ever work, though I've been told they're good. Think of her ability as a universal buff - focusing on the unit that needs to die and is about to be charged

Twinsouls: they hit like a truck but they die relatively easily; start with the 5++ and alternate from there. Their greatest weakness is their high cost mixed with low wound count - if they take a bad hit, you really feel it.

Painbringers: they're statted like good chaos warriors but currently pointed too highly. If they come down to 110 (or whatever the AoS 3 equivalent is) they will shoot up in usefulness as their base scroll is really neat

Slaangors: the less said about them the better

Blissbarb seekers: I'll admit I've only used them once; they seemed good, but all of the while I was thinking I would have preferred slickblades. As they aren't battleline and they want to be moving, they don't have as secure a position as the blissbarbs on foot who can plink away on an objective for dp or softening targets

Slickblade seekers: very strong cavalry unit to be used similar to bloodknights, though less tanky. They don't do ridiculous damage, but they do hurt and most important cause panic. If you have Sigvald, Keeper, and these harassing the opponent ASAP they quickly mess the opponent up and can ****** with their plans. If they double pile in, their damage can be surprisingly high

Generally each unit in your army should have a role, and the army is most effective when making the opponent panic. Sigvald and Lurid Haze works well for that.

I really want to see AoS 3 in action for heroic interventions, command abilities, and monster buffs before commenting on the twins.

[Poryague]

If the 10 Wound rule now applies to cover that would mean the Voice gets cover. The reason I say this is the 10 Wound thing showed up on sylvaneth army terrain piece as well monster and flying rule disappeared. This may be a new thing throughout. 

Edited June 2, 2021 by Poryague

[Nagashfan]

19 minutes ago, Poryague said:

If the 10 Wound rule now applies to cover that would mean the Voice gets cover. The reason I say this is the 10 Wound thing showed up on sylvaneth army terrain piece as well monster and flying rule disappeared. This may be a new thing throughout. 

Is it confirmed that we can’t stack debuffs to hit or wound in AoS 3 or still rumour because if we can the voice would be minus 2 to hit and plus to save in cover 

[Nagashfan]

1 hour ago, Enoby said:

Awesome

My advice is to not focus on DP generation - you can get it quickly if you try, but focusing resources to it often ends you up not having enough to do anything else. DP will generate at a decent rate normally, with Blissbarbs being the best unit for that while still being useful as battleline.

As for each of the new units:

Glutos: Very strong unit that should act as an all-round support. Gives a large -1 aura, is very tanky, gives a small aura of +1 bravery, can dispell well, can cast battleshock immunity, and eventually gives it. Worth it in most lists, though not all

Sigvald: very good in Lurid Haze for the teleport ability combined with his charge, as well as a KoS getting him to pile in twice. Despite his save, having 6 wounds makes him pretty squishy and very susceptible to bad luck. He'll likely die, but he can carve through the opponent before he does and can force hard decisions 

Lord of Pain: they're okay - they will get considerably better if Painbringers come down and so make better battleline

Shardspeaker: my Shardspeaker hates me and doesn't ever work, though I've been told they're good. Think of her ability as a universal buff - focusing on the unit that needs to die and is about to be charged

Twinsouls: they hit like a truck but they die relatively easily; start with the 5++ and alternate from there. Their greatest weakness is their high cost mixed with low wound count - if they take a bad hit, you really feel it.

Painbringers: they're statted like good chaos warriors but currently pointed too highly. If they come down to 110 (or whatever the AoS 3 equivalent is) they will shoot up in usefulness as their base scroll is really neat

Slaangors: the less said about them the better

Blissbarb seekers: I'll admit I've only used them once; they seemed good, but all of the while I was thinking I would have preferred slickblades. As they aren't battleline and they want to be moving, they don't have as secure a position as the blissbarbs on foot who can plink away on an objective for dp or softening targets

Slickblade seekers: very strong cavalry unit to be used similar to bloodknights, though less tanky. They don't do ridiculous damage, but they do hurt and most important cause panic. If you have Sigvald, Keeper, and these harassing the opponent ASAP they quickly mess the opponent up and can ****** with their plans. If they double pile in, their damage can be surprisingly high

Generally each unit in your army should have a role, and the army is most effective when making the opponent panic. Sigvald and Lurid Haze works well for that.

I really want to see AoS 3 in action for heroic interventions, command abilities, and monster buffs before commenting on the twins.

Thanks! 

[Poryague]

5 minutes ago, Nagashfan said:

Is it confirmed that we can’t stack debuffs to hit or wound in AoS 3 or still rumour because if we can the voice would be minus 2 to hit and plus to save in cover 

I don't know about stacking. But potentially benefiting from cover is cool I will take a 3+ save an some infinite range abilities.

[Enoby]

30 minutes ago, Nagashfan said:

Is it confirmed that we can’t stack debuffs to hit or wound in AoS 3 or still rumour because if we can the voice would be minus 2 to hit and plus to save in cover 

As @Poryague said, nothing confirmed on stacking - we can assume it may be gone as it was in 40k, but I don't think we're copying all of 40k's rules. 

If we don't have -2 to be hit in shooting that's not the end of the world. But it will be a massive help if they can benefit from terrain

[CarkFish]

7 hours ago, Enoby said:

As @Poryague said, nothing confirmed on stacking - we can assume it may be gone as it was in 40k, but I don't think we're copying all of 40k's rules. 

If we don't have -2 to be hit in shooting that's not the end of the world. But it will be a massive help if they can benefit from terrain

I think my main concern is that they Tony leaks we've seen so far don't seem to hint at them reigning shooting in ... And my god it needs it .... I'm hopeful we see something substantial to curb it a touch