Sapca

DoK: Khailebron has Whisperdeath (hits of 6 deal MW + normal damage) Kelt Nar has Gaisa Falx (6 does 2 hits) You can't change those two artifacts, must take. And you take them on your Shrine/Cauldron DoK's primary damage prayer is exploding 6ses where magic happens on melee hit 6 (2 hits), Shrine/Cauldron is relatively good target for it. I don't mind new rule of picking one. But I do mind factions designed with "problem" inbuilt. CoS probably has 20+ of broken combos (broken as not working anymore) with this since is biggest model/rule range possible to think of. But "smaller" factions should be free from these hard interactions unless they take in some sort of allies. I already feel cheated by not able to select super wide range of traits for my generals since everything is locked in with subfactions, which you basically must take...

Triggered Effects rule (only one applied): + + =? Under old rules (or maybe we had this house ruled?): Roll 6: * 1st hit is 6 already and does MW due ability, don't roll wound/save. * roll 2nd hit for wound (not automatic 6 also) from prayers explosive rule. PS. These are already bad Executioners in already weak Har Kuron made somehow decent.

The only thing that block Smite from Priest to Priest.

Yes. Anvilguard is still CoS army even if Morathi did her thing. It's in FAQ / Designers Commentary.

Hmm, do it with Fleetmaster and Corsairs then. Kharibdyss with roar + fell gaze gives -3 to bravery in area. Dark Riders another -1. It can be nasty, just not vs OB Hydra with acid blood has has two good interactions (it guarantee heals and with acid blood, bounces few MW back in melee). So opponent kinda needs to go hard on her or you kinda get more out of both acid and heal. Sorceress on Dragon, use only with 40 Darkshards imo to use command ability. Otherwise Dreadlord better. Foot sorceress still good for -1 hit. Acidic Spray (save to - spell) can still be ok with pirates with xbows. Incantor is really good for 1 unbind and he's hard enough to eat some shooting (good Adjutant). -- This here is 1580 as core, 3 dragons, 2 hydras/kharbs and 3 battlelines (hydra/kharb is BL in Anvilgard). I really advise to have at least one unit of Shadow Warriors. Fleetmaster wont die with 20 strong routine, can use his CA on Kharb also. Corsairs with xbows are deceptively good damage also, resist some shooting. If you manage to get spray off they actually hurt things, can likely drop to 10 also without issue if you need extra 80 points. For maybe a Stardrake in middle of everything, hehe. But get some objective grabbers, archers,... Shadow Warriors are always awesome but there are also other options I guess. Niche thing you can do is bravery bombing, if CP gets important... -bravery will force some inspiring presences here. Well not on OB ofc... immune. Can drop 1 dragon as 3 seems bit overkill with monsters with also hydra+kharb in list, 1200 spent (2 dragons, 2 hydra/kharbs, 3bls, 2 extra heroes) and 800 left to play with... Anvilgard gives you 2 artifacts and 2 curses with Blackfang Crimelord.. With 3.0 edition you might want to drop one curse/artifact for d3 extra CP instead as that might be big. New Monster rules should be fun here as you would be able to use most of those all the time (Titanic Battle, Roar, Stomp,...). Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar - City: Anvilgard (Illicit Dealings: Black Market Bounty) Mortal Realm: Aqshy Dreadlord on Black Dragon (300) - Lance of Spite & Shield - Artefact: Drakescale Cloak Dreadlord on Black Dragon (300) - Lance of Spite & Shield - Artefact: Asphyxica Censer Dreadlord on Black Dragon (300) - Lance of Spite & Shield Black Ark Fleetmaster (60) - General - Command Trait: Blackfang Crimelord Knight-Incantor (120) - Lore of Dark Sorcerery: Vitriolic Spray - City Role: General's Adjutant 20 x Black Ark Corsairs (160) - Vicious Blade & Repeater Handbow - City Role: Honoured Retinue (Must be 5-20 models) Kharibdyss (170) - Drakeblood Curse: Fell Gaze War Hydra (170) - Drakeblood Curse: Acidic Blood Total: 1580 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 96 EDIT: Hydras and Kharbys in Anvilgard do NOT count as Behemots towards the army limit! They are Battleline. Explained in FAQ (so theoretically, you could go 3 dragons and max hydras as you can fit.... or one Fleetmaster +11 hydras is also legit (1930 pt))

Spells go brrrr. (did this in Anvilgard with d3 extra CP thing, bonus cp, etc..). Funny. And call Annihilators 7" away (with new hero pointing them) with 10" radius MW landing. That seems nice combo.

Allegiance: Cities of Sigmar - City: Anvilgard (Illicit Dealings: Black Market Bounty) Mortal Realm: Aqshy Dreadlord on Black Dragon (300) - General - Lance of Spite & Shield - Command Trait: Blackfang Crimelord - Artefact: Drakescale Cloak - Drakeblood Curse: Fell Gaze Dreadlord on Black Dragon (300) - Lance of Spite & Shield - Drakeblood Curse: Jutting Bones Sorceress on Black Dragon (300) - Witch Rod - Lore of Dark Sorcerery: Vitriolic Spray Assassin (80) - Artefact: Venomfang Blade - City Role: General's Adjutant 5 x Drakespawn Knights (130) - City Role: Honoured Retinue (Must be 5-20 models) 5 x Drakespawn Knights (130) 5 x Drakespawn Knights (130) 40 x Darkshards (400) 10 x Shadow Warriors (110) 10 x Shadow Warriors (110) Total: 1990 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 0 / 400 Wounds: 137

We are busy painting microscopic eye pupils and nipple shadows. No time to post on forms. So here's a Sorceress sacrificing some male to gain someone +2 on paining motivation rolls. I'm going with bluish skin tone on my DoK, red leather, some silver-iron metal sheets(actual armor/weapons), golden trims and accesories (like on Sorc).Violetish hair (redish for leaders). Half finished here in background. Even older. Face probably took me more time than painting entire liberator As far as it goes, went into DoK since I liked older Dark Elves and it looked like they will compliment each other. Executioners should totally be able to just freely migrate from CoS to DoK as alegiance. I hope Malarion gets to just join Morathi and expand DoK line in new bigger allegiance of murder.... DoK + DarklingCoven + Privateers + Drakespawn + Malerion. Motivations are mostly same here overall. Malerion just needs to bring proper dragons with him and that repeater bolt thrower artillery. I'm biased Carmine Dragon owner 😛

Murdering hordes of undead, demons and orks can make a place quite orderly. But I guess if you do it just for fun and power, then its not. Living on an edge... gives you power to make decisions on which side you step.

My Liberators... liberated some spears (played as warblades, both champs have Sword also) and cloaks long time ago on request of their waifu there on Balewind. They are bit on raunchy side with all the girls in same storage box.... Vindictors and Praetors ... eat yourselves. (I should really get on with painting them all - currently bit further than last pic) Having played: SCE with some Sorceress magic support (before Shootcast or Incantor was a thing) and it was fine. Even later that +2 sorceress cast could be nice with endless spell or two compared to Incantor/Arcanum while being 'cheap'. Shadowhammer Compact (DoK+ScE batallion) because I had them and DoK. This was fun, but not really flexible on 2k And with CoS release... Anvilgard which was interesting soup. But probably worst. Or maybe my opponent had just way better army at the time. Nothing was nowhere near competitive, but we always had fun and it went to turn4-5 always. Later with more... khm hardcore lists we mostly just wiped boards on turn3 or even 2 once (Khorne player got in with all the big boys, did like 50 mortal wounds overall just on that axe spin 🤣) Also, my first model ever bought was Carmine Dragon (using him as Dreadlord/Sorceress on dragon mostly) and I want to shove it into every list possible. Thus, soup armies

Gotrek is often allied along Morathi for fun lists. Just saying so there's no surprise to some bearded-snakemen in the future.

Carmine Dragon is now 400 points and fits every Order army. Executioners also get DoK keyword now that Morathi is kinda Khaine. Stormcast get 6+ FNP or MW shrug if painted black by default.

Prime has large 18" +1 bravery bubble for the girls (stacks with avatar/cauldron) and -2 for enemies on drop. This makes Mindrazor stick fully against heroes/death most of time. Use it, abuse it, love it. Blocks of SoS love it, small units of WE's love it also. Secondary function is artillery against slow moving stuff, not even starting in air. He's conditionally better than Morathi (and cheaper) for this. Spells can be failed and unbound, his comet does not. He migh be better in DoK army than in SCE... Warlocks... I love models but they always failed for me for some reason (playing vs Khorne/Death mostly I guess). I prefer 1-2x Khinerai to support Prime, drop with him and step next to his side to block some counter pileins/charges, their bases are large enough. So he doesn't vaporize immediately...

Alternate Battleline option with more elite stats. -1 rend would be welcome. Teleport/Cloaking ability, unit counting as wizard if leader or that warlock is alive with own spell. Mortal wounds on natural 6 hit rolls (poison). Probably split profile to 2-3 weapons (dual melee, range and leader).

If WE's have ward save due their faith (under their Allegiance) and SCE don't... does that mean that SCE boys don't believe enough in Sigmar? 🤔 And yes, I'm sure that cape is at-least -1 to be hit with shooting if not ward save. 😛

4 attacks -> 2 blades +hero in 8" range (100 point support) 4 save (in combat only, not ranged) on WE = 1 blade + buckler with blood shield (18") from 290 or 330 model. (cant be both, let's say it's second one*) 5+ ward is from general CA in Hagg Nar, 7" range ward reroll is from prayer from a 100 point, 5w, 5s model. Prayer hits on 3 (66%). So, minimum of 390 support on 120 line. (510) --- Liberator Prime 3 attacks, 4+/3+/-1/2. 4+ Lets support him with 120 point hero in small range and staunch defender. 3+ (to pay for HaggNarr and extra attack*) Lets support him with a lantern (0, same hero*). 2+ and heals (reroll prayers) because we still have points for that 290 pt of Blood Shield... Lets drop 270 more points of support on this... in form of 150 lord arcanum, now 1 wound can be negated 120... meh add 100pt relictor for prayer, lets say divine light and we have.... 2+ that heals on 6ses, negates 1 wound* per round, rerolls saves of 1, opponent rerolls 6s against it and this support still has 1 spell and 1 prayer left. Let's say 2x -1 to hit (Lightning Storm and Thunderclap or whatnot) . Against WE "prime" 3x 2+/4+/-/1. 4+. 5++ that has 1 prayer left from support (Classic explosive 6's seem weak now that you must reroll them). Default WE without support is 2 or 3 attacks at 3+/4+/-/1, 6+ save, 6+ ward. No rerolls. How does this look against rend -1 shooting? Extremely well. Hint. While I agree liberators are weak and outdated, we can't go compare them to probably the most glass cannon unit in AoS, the WE's. Any shootcast player will tell you that DoK is balanced game, even easy with nice shooting castle. Now Liberators vs Chaos Warriors, that's better comparison. CW get 5+ ward and I don't know what their marks do. But hey have one nice solution that SCE liberators need... Halberds with 2" range. To "patch" liberators at their points. I would just add weapon option to them (Spear, 2"/4/4/-/1) and give them 6+ ward on their shield's. Sell weapon upgrade pack... I mean, just look at him! (also has a cape, because he's cooler that way) 😛

I always find my 1-2 x 5 HR's very useful. Slaughter Troupe (retreat doesn't prevent shooting/charging) that I play most has 2x HR as requirement anyway. I generally hold them in air (on sectioned off / reserves part of table, so opponents sees them and doesn't forget about them) till turn 3. And they already do their damage just by being there. Then whatever they do is just a bonus (finishing off 1-2w heroes, moving into objectives, etc...). After shooting and successful dice roll... I only drive them into melee If I'm 100% sure they will survive if they need to lock something down or finish off whatever is there. Otherwise I pull them back. I know I won games with them. ---- playing some variation of this usually. Ulgu gives interesting CA for Khinerai now Allegiance: Daughters of Khaine - Mortal Realm: Ulgu - Temple: Hagg Nar Morathi High Oracle of Khaine (480)- Lore of Shadows : The Withering Slaughter Queen on Cauldron of Blood (330)- General- Command Trait : Devoted Disciples - Artefact : Thousand and One Dark Blessings - Prayer : Blessing of Khaine Bloodwrack Shrine (210)- Artefact : Shadow Stone - Lore of Shadows : Mindrazor Hag Queen (100)- Prayer : Martyr's Sacrifice 30 x Sisters of Slaughter (300)- Barbed Whips and Blade Bucklers 10 x Sisters of Slaughter (120)- Barbed Whips and Blade Bucklers 10 x Witch Aelves (120)- Pairs of Sacrificial Knives 5 x Khinerai Heartrenders (90) 5 x Khinerai Heartrenders (90) Slaughter Troupe (130) Ravenak's Gnashing Jaws (30) 2000/2000, 5 drop

AoS 3.0: * Going first vs Second (and double turns). Going second gives you 1 global (minor? defensive) tactical buff in opponents turn only. For cost of 1 CP or better, free once per game. Might be just enough. "Brace for Impact" "Shields Up" etc... (-1 to be hit with shooting, -1 to be hit in melee, +1-2 to unbind rolls,...) * Endless Spells are owned by caster, no stealing, moved to hero phase. Wizard that cast the spell needs to be 30" within (not wholly) to sustain it. If caster of spell is slain, spell vanishes or goes rogue(can be controlled by enemy wizard(s) also). This enables alternative "Unbind" option for armies without actual Unbind(s). All Endless Spells get Augment option (wizards uses 1 cast at to augment it on 2nd round of it's life, no roll or -2 of initial cast needed*). CoS wizard spells do not vanish if slain and are always augmented. Augment has 30" range and requires LoS. * Coop-Casting. Wizard can assist other Wizard with a single cast. They need to be 3 or 6" within each other. They cast 1 spell together (2 casts used), bonuses per faction / warscroll. EG. Death wizard spells combine cast roll (they have a lot "if 10+ cast"), Chaos higher range, Destruction extra damage and Order's can't be unbound this way. Or just make it uniform that it requires 2 unbinds or something. * Bonereapers are NOT immune to battleshock. It just limits design space (and all armies that want to bravery bomb, which is bad tactics even without this atm). * Offensive (maybe all) Prayers and Invocations can be blocked by enemy Priests (Prayer unbind). Some factions have better prayers than others have spells... without dangers and up to 2x better chance of it working + blocking magic themselves. * Small heroes (5w and less) get better at not dying if they have 3 or more of small friendlies nearby / between attacker and them. Look Out Sir v2... * Carmine Dragon is 400 points or less with warscroll to match and is legit in matched play (purely selfish reasons, because I need a dragon in my fantasy army, thanks). * Minimum sized (battleline only maybe) units gain "Cooperation / Strike As One". If in combat with same unit they (can) activate together to offset HUGE advantage larger units have over small due activation sequences. * Remove all Fights First bs with possible exception on a specific Hero or two...

One hit at 2 damage + extra hits from that 1d6 at 1 damage (1d2 + 5d1 max) - this is default with just Vanguard Wing. + 1 hit from Bless Weapons at damage 1. So 1d2 + 5d1 +1d1 max. (7 hits max)

That's perfectly clear. But looking for it in FAQs I found this and whew. It was FAQed. Q: Sometimes a dice roll will trigger an effect. For example, a weapon might have a rule that says a hit roll of 6 causes two hits on the target instead of 1. What happens if another effect applies to the same roll? For example, the weapon from the previous example might have a rule that says it inflicts D6 mortal wounds on a hit roll of 6 and the attack sequence ends – would I get to inflict two hits that each inflicted D6 mortal wounds? A: When a dice roll triggers more than one effect, each effect is triggered once. For this example, this means that the hit roll would cause two hits, but only one of the hits would inflict D6 mortal wounds (you would carry out the rest of the attack procedure for the other hit normally). So, my fair case(s) are legit. Judicator (with special bow) in Vanguard Wing + Prayer -> One hit roll of 6 -> 1d6 hits + 1 extra hit from prayer. One out of 1d6 hits has +1 damage from VanguardWing. Liberators, Paired Weapons, Vanguard + Prayer -> One hit roll of 6 -> 3 hits (2 from paired, 1 from prayer). One of hits is d2 due VanguardWing +1 on 6. WHEW. Edit (source): https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/8f9bd00c.pdf

Oooh! Sorry, I had old warscroll in my mind! They had reroll 1's, now they have exploding 6's on default! HA. "Each unmodified hit roll of 6 for model.... inflicts 2 hits" Ugh this by RAW creates same issue as with Judicators. GW should FAQ this as it's so common in SCE. Liberator with Vanguard Wing + Bless Weapons: 1 attack, roll 6 = 2hits (no roll for them) from paired + 1 hit from prayer. * 2d1 + 1d1 (all hits were created, not rolled - likely RAW and also sad way to look at it as it negates Vanguard's Wing +1 damage) * 1d2(initial hit) + 1d1(extra hit from paired) + 1d1 (prayer) (this is how I would rule it as it seems fair - full damage potential goes from 1 to 4... from 1x 6 roll versus 5 hit roll.) * if Paired two hits would be both considered as if "Roll 6" happened... then liberator with paired and prayer would generate 4 hits on 6. With 2d2 (first two) + 2d1 (prayer). But this also then extends to Judicators and Ballista. I don't think there's chance of this being ever ruled like this. --- I went back to double check core rules... This is all there is, no mention of how to handle those multi-hit's "Dice/Roll Wise": Sometimes a single successful hit roll will score 2 or more hits. If this is the case, make all of the wound rolls for those hits at the same time, and then all of the save rolls.

Well, yes each hit of 6 with bless on will also explode and deal extra hit so d2 + d1. In normal scenario where Liberators do not have prayer on (there are better targets), Vanguard Wing doubles their damage on 6's. That's quite good, for Liberators Paired weapons on liberators give you reroll of 1 for that extra bit of consistency without use of CP. Can be ok if you can ensure/improve charge without actually targeting them (Gav Bomb, Hallowed Knights, Vexxilor,... ) since it's unlikely those Liberators will get any defensive bonuses. Also makes them bit immune to roll 1 hit triggers (DoK Medusai - Temple Nest - hitting them with 1s is 1 MW suffered). In Vanguard Wing, 5 libs should do ~4 damage to 4+ save target (1 more than their average) which is actually huge passive increase. But really, you want to shove them into 6+/- save target where they would draw some gazes with ~8 damage.

You roll 6 (once) - Prayer and Battalion Ability trigger for this dice roll. You get +1 damage on this one roll This roll makes another hit (at 0/no dice rolled, it's not 6 its not 1... it's just extra hit) Normally this means that first hit (roll of 6) gets +1 damage and creates extra attack at normal damage (see longstirike sample below) --- But Judicators ability is written interestingly When roll with Shockbow hits at any roll from 2-6 it doesn't do damage... but creates 1d6 hits. Sockbolt bow is just laser tag for Sigmar to throw lightning down like it's written now. This could mean that on initial hit roll of 6 with shockbow: * that no Hits get +1 damage from battalion (6d1+1d1) since all hits are created and not rolled. * that players agree that 1 hit does 2 damage, rest do 1. (1d2+5d1+1d1) (this is fair imo, but likely not correct by rules BUT likely how designers imagined it) * that all bow hits get 1 damage from battalion (6d2), but this would also mean that those 6 hits are considered "roll of 6" which would also then create 6 extra hits from prayer and not just 1 extra hit (6d2 + 6d1) (definitely not correct) PS. Also Ballista suffers from same rule, if it's somehow possible to give it +1 damage on "Whenever 6 is rolled for hit". Single Balista with later understanding of this interaction would have 72 damage potential (4d6 hits of roll 6 (24d2), extra hits (24d1)) or 49 damage if you say +1 damage works, but extra hits do not from those 6xes. --- It's same/similar treatment with mortal wounds and other triggers on ROLL 6. If you get extra hit, those do not trigger as there's no roll. Extra hits (created) cannot trigger extra hits also, since they have no roll. This was in FAQ's also. With Longbow Raptors + exploding prayer, on roll of 6 you get = 2mw + hit (that needs to wound save & save check). Not auto 4 MW. Same for Retributor lightning hammers... etc. Hmm. If these two could get +1 damage on 6... what happens? Extra MW, nothing or you need to roll attack sequence that you were ordered to stop? (damage =! MW)

That's what I thought also... Then AoS 2.0 and FAQ'******. Apparently battalion rules are a mess (especially in Death and Orruks) Old (DoK included) 1.0 battalions had Faction Name above it, new 2.0 battalions don't. They have "Warscroll Battalion" in small text above name. New battalions can be in any faction that's in the book where battalion is (this creates some Orruk funny situations I believe). And battalions do not grant keywords anymore. Sources: Core Rules: https://ageofsigmar.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/12/2018/06/AoS_Rules-ENG.pdf Page 15: Notice no mention of any allies or units in battalion gaining Keyword from Battalion. Page 17: "A warscroll battalion can include allies. They do not count against the limit on the number of allied units you can include in the army" --- From core rules FAQ: https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/8f9bd00c.pdf Q: The rules say that a warscroll battalion can include allies and that they don’t count against the number of allies in the army. Does this rule only apply to battalions that share the same allegiance as the army, but that have units from two different factions (a battalion in a Daughters of Khaine army that has Daughters of Khaine and Stormcast Eternals units, for example)? A: Yes. The faction a warscroll battalion belongs to is shown on its warscroll, above the title of the battalion. In addition, the battalion is assumed to belong to the Grand Alliance that its faction is a part of. Warscroll battalions that share the same allegiance as an army can always be taken as part of the army, and if they include any allied units, these units do not count against the limits on the number of allies the army can have (or against the points limit that can be spent on allies in a Pitched Battle). An army can include a warscroll battalion of a different allegiance to the rest of the army, but if it does so the units in it do count against the limits on the number of allies the army can have (and the points for the battalion and the units in it count against the points limit that can be spent on allies in a Pitched Battle) TLDR; Warscroll Battalon itself has allegiance , not units on it. --- In case of Shadowhammer Compact this boils down to question: Why would I play Shadowhammer Compact with half of an army unable to benefit from allegiance abilities, temples, buffs/spells and near zero synergies between DoK and SCE? See all DoK Prayers, Unit Abilities and Spells that are buffs... require DoK Keyword to work and Battalions do not grant that under current rules apparently. I hoped they change this Battalion to something like Idoneth have with Sylvaneth. Or change one of temples to include allies.

No, SCE units in battalion do not benefit from Allegiance abilities. It's also in DoK Designers Commentary. https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/age_of_sigmar_daughters_of_khaine_designers_commentary_en-1.pdf You get: 1) Liberators cont as Battleline so you have 4 (2x Liberators, 2x WE's) 2) All SCE listed in Battalion do not count into Allies points (but they are considered allies). So you have 400 points left, even Gotrek if you wished. 3) Battalion's CA works on Battalion SCE units (but not allied SCE units*). Sadly ShadowhammerCompact is crazily priced at 170 and has huge required list that really limits how to build it. Minimum is 1030 points even with massive SCE point reductions. Funny thing possible now is to have Morathi and Celestant-Prime(ally) in this list tho and you have 190 points left. Enough for Medusa/Hag to carry Temple ability (Khailebron / HaggNar) and maybe extra 90 of Prosecutors/Khinerai. Khailebron temple, teleport/shift Morathi and mindrazor and drop Prime then shove them into thing(s) preferably in a way that getting to Prime goes trough Morathi. Hope they kill and block enough so your small units get objectives and do enough shooting damage with SHC command. Unfortunately Prime is not eligible target for Command Ability as Ally. Khinerai can drop to objectives or help blocking Prime from counter attack (also look out sir works). PS. Prime in DoK army can be interesting due +1 bravery to everyone and -2 bravery to enemies when dropped in combination with Mindrazor. But he works better as mobile artillery support with Cauldron due stacking with Avatar bravery. And in non Shadowhammer list ) Also, Sword Liberators seem less ****** - The Withering adds +1 to Wound so they become 3+/3+ or 2+/3+ against bigger things. Where Hammers would be 4+/2+ or 3+/2+ (Swords are tiny bit better in this case) EDIT: fixed points, added info.