Let's chat : Blades of Khorne!

[Killax]

21 minutes ago, LordMoros said:

Stormcast doesn't care what defenses you have on your secrator. They are the real issue for me. The heraldor, the dracoth breath, and the hammercloak = secrator dead everytime.

This is good advice tho and I will try some of it out as soon as I get another game.

I completely agree with @Jharen on the general approach of 'how to play a Khorne army', so I'd still would love to know the army you used.
So far there isn't any list in particular where I'd say Khorne atomatically folds. I will say that for a true competative approach I am of the opinion that Murderhost or The Goretide seem almost essential. By large because they increase the speed and closing in does indeed matter against ranged attacks.

What I feel/see is that many think Blades of Khorne is just the Bloodbound Battletome with Daemons of Khorne attached and well... There is a lot more to it competatively speaking. Not only have the choices drastically increased, everything became better barring the Collar of Khorne on the Mighty Lord of Khorne  
 

[J-P]

"If ifs and buts were candy and nuts, we'd all have a merry Christmas" -- Sheldon Cooper.

I don't trust theoryhammer too much. Too many variables, some not even game-related. For example; how complicated and/or brittle are the combos? Nah, I need to see to believe.

I'd love to see a matched game with players of roughly the same competitive (and high) skill, pure Bloodbound vs Shooty/balanced (preferably Stormcast with raptors, judicators, vanguard units, etc), on WH Twitch stream.

If the Bloodbound would pull off a win (or loose in the final dice throws in turn 5, not including the turn roll) I'd be happy, but until then my faith in Khorne needs buffing. Still happy with my new Bloodbound army though, the models are wicked cool.

[Aspirant Snaeper]

Entirely unrelated topic that I didnt wanna make a new thread about:

What is the round base size for the Lord of Chaos? I just picked him up in the older clamshell and it didnt include a round base. Thanks!

[Jharen]

17 minutes ago, Aspirant Snaeper said:

Entirely unrelated topic that I didnt wanna make a new thread about:

What is the round base size for the Lord of Chaos? I just picked him up in the older clamshell and it didnt include a round base. Thanks!

I don't think he's been repackaged with a round yet but he's probably good on a 40. 

[Surtur]

Actually, that's a really interesting topic coming up: which experiences did you make with BoK (esp. pure Bloodbound lists)? How did you counter ranged armies? In particular, how to deal with Stormcast and, nowadays, raptors and something like the Aetherwing Strikeforce?

I am not an experienced player, but since I've started I have always had trouble with Stormcast. I think I won once. Largely, that's because I am inexperienced and Bloodbound are certainly not easy to play. Now, this Aetherwing Strikeforce gives me some headache again, even though I believe Bloodbound have become much stronger with BoK.

My first ideas against such a ranged force was bringing The Goretide in order to be able to close the gap asap. A bloodstoker is always good, both for mobility and for buffing Skullreapers. There's also many artifacts and abilities that help your mobility nowadays. However, I really am afraid that my Heroes or whole units die the first time it's his turn. Especially, losing the general is not very pleasant. Or a Bloodsecrator for that matter. So I thought of bringing several Heroes using maybe defensive and offensive artifacts so to balance the threats. For example, the general (which I would chose the MLoK for) could use Berzerker Lord for defense. The Exalted Deathbringer might get Gorecleaver to make him more terrifying. Another character might get Crimson Plate (The Blood-forged Armour is useless against Raptors), and another might get, e.g., the Talisman of Burning Blood.

Basically the list might look like this:

Allegiance: Khorne

Leaders
Mighty Lord Of Khorne (140)
- General
- Trait: Berzerker Lord  
Bloodsecrator (120)
Bloodsecrator (120)
Bloodstoker (80)
- Artefact: The Crimson Plate  
Exalted Deathbringer (80)
- Ruinous Axe & Skullgouger
- Artefact: Gorecleaver  

Battleline
10 x Blood Warriors (200)
- Goreaxes
- 1x Goreglaives
10 x Blood Warriors (200)
- Goreaxes
- 1x Goreglaives
10 x Blood Warriors (200)
- Goreaxes
- 1x Goreglaives

Units
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 1x Soultearers
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 1x Soultearers

Battalions
The Goretide (40)
Slaughterborn (80)

Total: 1540/2000

But how to continue from here? Remaining points I would spend on Blood Reavers in units of 10. But I could also see another Hero adding value. An Aspriring Deathbringer, a Slaughterpriest or another Stoker. Also, Khorgoraths might be worth their points. They present the opponent with resilient threat that has to be dealt with. 

I would really appreciate your experiences and help and general opinion on how to deal with mass ranged threats. And as mentioned earlier, I really could use a buff for my belief in Khorne.

Cheers.

[Jharen]

@Surtur One thing you could do is drop one of the Bloodsecrators, add in two Slaughterpriests, two units of 10 Bloodreavers and you'd qualify for Gore Pilgrims Battalion which is a GREAT battalion.   You'd be at 6 Heroes in your list at that point with 160 points left over.  You could spend this on another unit of Skullreapers and have 20 points left over.  You could then further drop the bloodstoker if you wanted to for a 3rd slaughterpriest in the Gore Pilgrims.

[Surtur]

Thanks for the reply. I have thought about Gore Pilgrims, too. I've dropped the idea as the raptors have 24/30" range and I would have trouble getting the Slaughterpriests into use before he snipes them off. Additionally, its units couldn't profit from the D6 move of The Goretide and would maybe (!) not even make it to his ranks. Anyways, it's three of them. And the Slaughterpriests don't need to get close to him in order to have an effect on my units at least. And not all of my units could or should arrive in combat at the same time anyways.

I will give it another consideration. I like the idea of Gore Pilgrims again.

What generally bothers me with the Goretide batallion is that I have to go with so many Blood Warriors. They give a shooty oppponent so much opportunity to make use of -2 rend, as compared to Bloodreavers. And when they die in shooting, there's not gonna be any las pile in and attack. So, it's a lot of points on the table for presenting the opponent with a target he couldn't wish could be better. But maybe I am overdoing it with theoretically avoiding each and every weakness.

[Xasz]

I wouldn't add another battalion.

They are expensive (200p just in conditional special rules) and in this case, the Pilgrims even come with two extra battlelines which you already have enough of. On top of that, it forces you into a rather inflexible and slow hero lineup.

Adding a bazillion battalions to your army seems great at first, but I think you should only run 1-2 tops and not for more than 100p (The Goretide might be an exception)

My current Goretide list:

Spoiler

Allegiance: Khorne

Leaders
Mighty Lord Of Khorne (140)
- General
- Trait: Disciple of Khorne 
- Artefact: The Blood-forged Armour 
Exalted Deathbringer (80)
- Bloodbite Axe & Shield
- Artefact: Mark of the Destroyer 
Bloodsecrator (120)
- Artefact: The Brazen Rune 
Bloodstoker (80)
Lord Of Khorne On Juggernaut (140)
Valkia The Bloody (120)

Battleline
10 x Blood Warriors (200)
- Goreaxes
- 1x Goreglaives
10 x Blood Warriors (200)
- Goreaxes
- 1x Goreglaives
5 x Blood Warriors (100)
- Goreaxes
10 x Chaos Marauders (60)
- Axes & Shields
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne
10 x Chaos Marauders (60)
- Axes & Shields
- Mark of Chaos: Khorne

Units
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 2x Soultearers
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 1x Soultearers
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 1x Soultearers
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 1x Soultearers

Battalions
The Goretide (40)
Slaughterborn (80)

Total: 1980/2000
 

 

[Killax]

1 hour ago, Surtur said:

My first ideas against such a ranged force was bringing The Goretide in order to be able to close the gap asap. A bloodstoker is always good, both for mobility and for buffing Skullreapers. There's also many artifacts and abilities that help your mobility nowadays. However, I really am afraid that my Heroes or whole units die the first time it's his turn. Especially, losing the general is not very pleasant. Or a Bloodsecrator for that matter. So I thought of bringing several Heroes using maybe defensive and offensive artifacts so to balance the threats. For example, the general (which I would chose the MLoK for) could use Berzerker Lord for defense. The Exalted Deathbringer might get Gorecleaver to make him more terrifying. Another character might get Crimson Plate (The Blood-forged Armour is useless against Raptors), and another might get, e.g., the Talisman of Burning Blood.

Basically the list might look like this:

/List

But how to continue from here? Remaining points I would spend on Blood Reavers in units of 10. But I could also see another Hero adding value. An Aspriring Deathbringer, a Slaughterpriest or another Stoker. Also, Khorgoraths might be worth their points. They present the opponent with resilient threat that has to be dealt with. 

I would really appreciate your experiences and help and general opinion on how to deal with mass ranged threats. And as mentioned earlier, I really could use a buff for my belief in Khorne.

Cheers.

Very solid points! I'll try to comment on games as soon as I have my 2K force ready actually. What I wanted to know from the previous poster is how he or she thinks that Blades of Khorne is uncompetative based on a single game. I don't believe such calls are legit to make after a single game, even less so if no actual information on lists or gameplay are provided. 

I'm with you on the Goretde plan, I like where the army is going. I also believe that you've made a really good choice on the doubled up Bloodsecrator and I also think you shouldn't add another Battalion (because frankly it isn't needed). 

@Jharen mentioned it aswell on the previous page, but what is essentialy to Khorne's succes is threat saturation. Present so many dangeroes things that your opponent cannot deal with them all through just only ranged attacks. 

Some comments on the list before adding more options:
- I don't think Berzerker Lord is worth the Command Trait slot. There is a very simple reason for this and this is that I still believe Khorne models greatest quality in general is quantity and this also applies for it's Heroes.
- Crimson Plate on the Bloodstoker follows the same thought as above. I personally wouldn't give him an Artefact at all. It's an 80 point guy that can get shot but see how much you care when you gain that Blood Tithe point and use more Command Abilities.
- Exalted Deathbringer doesn't really need much more love, again I see him as 'simple support'.
- The army at it's core looks great. 

So with the 460 points left there are a lot of routes to go. Again I'm a big fan of threat saturation and would even consider splitting up the Blood Warrior units into 1 of 10 and 2 of 5, so you would gain another 200 points to play with.
Since the army is largely Bloodbound and you get the most out of Bloodbound choices (because they can be part of The Goretide) I'd consider the following:
- Lord of Khorne on Juggernaut (140) or Mighty Lord of Khorne (140), simply to present more threats and tool them up as true melee issues.
- 20 Bloodreavers (140)
- 5 Wrathmongers (180)

As a rule of tumb I personally don't use any Artefacts on characters below 120 points, by large because what they offer is nice in terms of damage output but their survivability is too shaky in many cases.

@Xasz Nice list man! Though I'd personally be inclined to change the Marauders to Bloodreavers, you have the points left afterall. 
I totally agree that a 5+ save is better as a 6+, however I do think that the additional movement gained from The Goretide is worth this trade of. As Marauders cannot be part of that Battalion but Bloodreavers can  
Assuming the table provides terrain, moving those Bloodreavers up faster should allow for a practical compairable result and when you need to move them, they will go faster. 

[Surtur]

Thanks very much for your thoughts. They give me new ideas which is perfect.

I'd only have two broad follow-up questions: firstly, how would you protect your Heroes from being sniped off? A unit of Raptors (depending on its size) can easily kill a Bloodstoker in one shooting phase. And it's a good idea to do so, as it decreases my mobility and also the effectiveness of the Skullreapers. If you have no trait/artifact to buff his defense up (or buff the Exalted deathbringer in order to present an alternative target), then there's no real trade-off for your opponent. As the Bloodbound player, if I have no other idea to protect him (terrain maybe), I could also almost not take him at all. It might be easy in case of the Stoker (hiding him, not giving so much thought on whether he survives at all, etc.), but Raptors could also kill a MoLK quite easily. If that's your general, it would be not very good to loose him before he gets into combat (having the Slaughterborn ability in mind). Hiding him is no option, so this leaves me with the mentioned question and related ones: how to protect the heroes? Why take some at all if the opponent ignores them (e.g., standard Exalted Deathbringer) because he thinks them no threat/they are no threat? I've not given so much thought to the traits/artifacts for this list yet, but at first glance your proposal raises these questions.

Secondly, many lists contain units of 5 Blood Warriors. The theoretical problem for me is that they get much worse without the glaive which is available only if you take at least 10. So a unit of 5 might be worth only 80 points. Splitting up a squat of 10 means you pay 40 points. What for, that's the question? Being able to choose other units? Being able to get a certain battalion? It's not that I doubt it's a good idea, it might be. I am the unexperienced. But I always thought: don't ever take Blood Warriors in a unit of 5. They're not worth it (and actually yes, at that size I've never achieved anything with them). So, in this special case (where Blood Warriors might not be the first choice), would you go with units of 5 just to fill the minimum requirements of The Goretide because that's the important thing to have against shooters?

Thanks already for the input. The discussion gives me some new perspectives on list building with the Bloodbound. Some might be just what makes the difference.

[Killax]

@Surtur One of the downsides to Blades of Khorne is that we cannot really prefent our Heroes from being sniped off in the first place. It happens and we saturate threats to allow us to continue on. It's with this principle that the 'core' of the list is allready very good. Blood Warriors and Skullreapers demand awnsers. Sniping of characters can be done but also instantly provides a Blood Tithe point. It's because of this that strong Command Abilities are ideal. As in many cases we should be able to leverage our battles with:
- Bloody Exemplar
- Murderlust
- Crimson Rain
- Apoplectic Frenzy
I believe that Relentless Fury is only really available to forces that commit to a full MSU style army. Which currently has not seen much if at all play. As it is very different from what both Daemons of Khorne and Khorne Bloodbound could provide in the past (which was FBU, few big units).

So to awnser some of the Hero related questions:
1. In general we can't protect our Heroes, Units or whatever, so we present multiple issue cases. So bring:
- Multiple Bloodsecrators
- Multiple Mighty Lords of Khorne (ideally with Mark of the Destroyer)
- Multiple Khorne Lords on Juggernaut (equip with what you like)
- Consider a Battlion-less force, sounds silly but ask yourself if you really want to spend 100+ points in non-Units, in some cases you do not want to do this
- Multiple Khorne Units...
2. You thake multiple Khorne Heroes because they are treats, as above the 120 point+ Heroes of Khorne can seriously mess up battle. One of the most competative choices now most certainly is a Mighty Lord of Khorne with Mark of the Destroyer. With our without Battalion buff, a 140 point model that brings 14 attacks is worth the consideration, then factor in that every +1 on all Melee Weapon attacks turns into 4 and you can buff up this model very fast and it becomes very dangerous. The same applies to muliple Rage of Khorne effects, it adds, it messes up melee combat fast.
3. If your opponent ignores your Heroes that's fine aswell, it means that they'll have to get in there to do it themselves. They will be fast enough with The Goretide and Slaughterborn (part of Goretide) directly rewards your aggressive upfront play with your Heroes. In both cases also keep in mind that Hungry for Glory does not require your General to be part of Slaughterborn and Aqshy's Bane does not require you to have the Mighty Lord of Khorne be the general aswell. What this leaves as an option is to include something like a Bloodthirster in addtion to all of these models and Mark of the Slayer is suprisingly little discussed about. While Mark of the Slayer and Mark of the Destroyer are arguably the best Artefacts in the whole book. 

The Blood Warriors:
There is a very simple reason for running some smaller units in a Khorne Army, the biggest reason is Blood Tithe points and the secondary reason is for Objective purposes. Because we are so melee orientated finding the right unit to stick to an Objective can be difficult to do or manage. The beauty here is that doing this with a smaller unit means that you have more units to throw into melee. 
More importantly however is that I'm not really suggesting all your Blood Warrior units should be 5 guys, instead I'd be willing to have 2 10 man units and 1 5 just to free up some points. These points can add to threat saturation again. 

In essence presenting multiple headaches is one of the best things BoK can do. You can still go the older big block route but one of the insentives to not do this is the Blood Tithe point table. There are several Command Abilities that usually only work on 1 unit, this still is the case but 1 Blood Tithe point allows you to use this Command Ability multiple times which obviously generates another layer of issues for your oppone to work with. Some examples:
- Lord of the Blood Hunt usually targets 1 unit, 1 Blood Tithe point and you can 'scoot up' 2 of those feared 30 Bloodletter blocks.
- Gorelord usually targets 3 units, 1 Blood Tithe point and you can target 6. Meaning your MSU force can be under full effect of this Command Ability. 
- Blood Stampede usually targets 3 units, 1 Blood Tithe point... Well... You get the drift. 

[Dragonlover]

I really wish my brain would let me run MSU, but I can't do it. It just looks wrong on the board to me.

Oh yeah, rules question: I watched some Frontline Gaming stuff yesterday, and they were talking about deploying the entire Khorne army in one go to pretty much guarantee first turn. Where does it say you can do that? I thought you had to alternate deployment with your opponent.

Dragonlover

[Killax]

On a competative sidenote, I cannot claim that I've found the best competative Khorne list yet, but I did want to share this:

 

Quote

(20) Murderhost
- Skullmaster, Herald of Khorne (100), The Crimson Crown
- 30 Bloodletters, whole shebang (300)
- 30 Bloodletters, whole shebang (300)
- 5 Fleshhounds (100)

The Crimson Crown could obviously become Mark of the Slayer, depending how deep you go into Khorne Daemons or Khorne mixed. 

However I wanted to ask the folks here a question in regards to this! Is there any way we can actually spend 620 points "better" because to be honest with you this seems like one hell of a set up that:
1. Fills in all Battleline requirements
2. Presents a very good 100 point Hero with very decent survivability and speed
3. Presents a very good Unbind module, assuming the Skullmaster doesn't bite the dust too quickly

In my opinion this might very well be the best Battalion combining the scariest things we have from the Daemonic side. Obviously we will add Bloodsecrators and Bloodstoker to flavour  Maby even go 90 Bloodletters...

[J-P]

@Killax 

This post is the best strategy guide for Blades of Khorne I've seen anywhere so far. Thank you so much for helping us Bloodbro's/sisters out!

I mentioned brittle before. It's (in my own opinion) a great way of thinking about strategy, and it fits in with your guide. When thinking of combos and battalions, think of how brittle they might be;

How hard is it for you to get the combo/battalion rules to be effective? Do you need 3 units in combat, if so, how many of those units do you have? How sturdy are they? How fast are they? Are you abandoning a tactical objective by bunching them up at one end of the battlefield? 

How hard is it for your opponent to break your combo/battalion?

Does the combo hinge upon a single character, if so, how hard is it for your opponent to snipe or disturb that model?

Avoid a brittle strategy.  Assume your opponent knows how to take your army apart. Understand that as the complexity level of your battleplan/combo increase, so too does it increase how brittle it is.

[Killax]

@J-P Thanks! Yeah you could consider it a thake on a brittle concept. I guess it helps looking from it from different game perspectives also.

In essence Blades of Khorne is very much compairable to MtG's Mono Red, in a way also 40K's Tyranids and Orks. If you know you cannot protect your pieces well, apply more, ideally faster as what your average opponent is used to.

Once you go this path there are many ways to go about it with Blades of Khorne. For Narrative purposes practically everything is possible. For competative purposes it could very well be that you join the 'spam-train' and apply a Blade of Khorne right in the chest.

Within this concept things like The Goretide or Murderhost are amazing. More importantly though skipping Sayl does not have to be an issue if you have other ways to speed up and for the costs involved there is very little that actually (in my mind) beats what Murderhost offers you for a mere 20 points. It at least fills the following requirements:

1. Do you want a cheap Battalion, yes, Artefacts are worth X points regardless of additional bonusses.
2. Do you want 30 blocks Bloodletters, yes, it's a proven competative strategy.
3. Do you want cheap Khorne Heroes, yes, it's the easiest way to obtain 1 Blood Tithe point and skilled opponents know that your Heroes need to be sniped out or things get out of control really fast. 

With this many green lights, I'll let the brainstorm continue until I've found my 'perfect' 2K list.  

[Aspirant Snaeper]

4 hours ago, Jharen said:

@Surtur One thing you could do is drop one of the Bloodsecrators, add in two Slaughterpriests, two units of 10 Bloodreavers and you'd qualify for Gore Pilgrims Battalion which is a GREAT battalion.   You'd be at 6 Heroes in your list at that point with 160 points left over.  You could spend this on another unit of Skullreapers and have 20 points left over.  You could then further drop the bloodstoker if you wanted to for a 3rd slaughterpriest in the Gore Pilgrims.

1. He would not be able to include the Gore Pilgrims alongside The Goretide without adding in two more battalions 

2. He would also need to include another unit of Warriors for the Gore Pilgrims tax and I think 3 is enough. 

[kozokus]

I think i really like the following :

Goretide, MLK 180

Slaughterborn EDB, 2X5 Reapers, 3X10 Warriors 1040

Pilgrims Secrator 3Xpriest 10 warriors 10 Reavers 770

TOTAL 1990

But that is 200 points in the wind. Is really 3 artifacts, +D6 movement, reroll prayers, worth 10 more blood warriors? (and 2 drops vs  13) Not sure.

 

Additional question can you general of the Goretide (within or without) be selected to engage while at more than 3" like Icefall Yetees? Just beeing at 8" to engage seems brutal.

[Killax]

@Aspirant Snaeper Yeah agree with what you mean, though alongside is possible without the Gore Pilgrims being part of The Goretide. If he wants to include the Gore Pilgrims as part of The Goretide he will indeed need more of those named Battalions. 

However as mentioned I see what you mean and I agree. I personally do not think one should try to include more Battalions within The Goretide as part of The Goretide for 2K competative matched play. It soaks up a ton of points without adding significant synergy.

In general I feel we have a bit of a choose Battalion for X models you like. If you like The Mighty Lord of Khorne, Skullreapers and Blood Warriors The Goretide is interesting. 

 

[Xasz]

16 minutes ago, kozokus said:

But that is 200 points in the wind. Is really 3 artifacts, +D6 movement, reroll prayers, worth 10 more blood warriors? (and 2 drops vs  13) Not sure.

I've got the feeling that it's not worth it.

I ended up with something similar, for a mixed list.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Khorne

Leaders
Mighty Lord Of Khorne (140)
- General
- Trait: Disciple of Khorne 
- Artefact: The Blood-forged Armour 
Exalted Deathbringer (80)
- Bloodbite Axe & Shield
- Artefact: Mark of the Destroyer 
Slaughterpriest (100)
- Bloodbathed Axe
- Artefact: Talisman of Burning Blood 
- Blood Blessing: Bronzed Flesh
Slaughterpriest (100)
- Bloodbathed Axe
- Blood Blessing: Killing Frenzy
Bloodsecrator (120)
- Artefact: The Brazen Rune 
Valkia The Bloody (120)

Battleline
10 x Blood Warriors (200)
- Goreaxes
- 1x Goreglaives
10 x Blood Warriors (200)
- Goreaxes
- 1x Goreglaives
5 x Blood Warriors (100)
- Goreaxes
5 x Blood Warriors (100)
- Goreaxes
10 x Bloodreavers (70)
- Meatripper Axes

Units
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 1x Soultearers
5 x Skullreapers (140)
- Daemonblades
- 1x Soultearers
5 x Wrathmongers (180)

Battalions
Gore Pilgrims (80)
The Goretide (40)
Slaughterborn (80)

Total: 1990/2000
 

But this list has no Stoker, only one fast hero, lesser unit quality and overall less wounds, compared to a list that runs either Gore Pilgrims or Goretide only.

[Killax]

7 minutes ago, kozokus said:

But that is 200 points in the wind. Is really 3 artifacts, +D6 movement, reroll prayers, worth 10 more blood warriors? (and 2 drops vs  13) Not sure.

 

Additional question can you general of the Goretide (within or without) be selected to engage while at more than 3" like Icefall Yetees? Just beeing at 8" to engage seems brutal.

Exact, honestly I don't think it is. Slaughterpriest with Gore Pilgrims are great but the real question becomes, do you really want to have 1 Bloodsecrator? And to me the awnser to that question remains no. Great as Slaughterpriests look and are with the Gore Pilgrims what they do so well is ensure that your models reach the other side. Bronzed Flesh is the best awnser we have to Missle Weapons but moving up XD6 should work out fine aswell. 
- What Slaughterpriests want are big units.
- What The Goretide provides is thougher units that are faster.
The both are not synergizing as well as you potentially could with one of either.

Regarding your The Goretide question/comment. The MLOK affected by Aqshy's Bane does not have to be your general. In regards to the other part, I believe that in order to Pile In you still have to have an enemy within 3" of you, so that 8" is still nice but not completely an 8" engagement. Though with with additional movement you'll be there fast enough. 

[kozokus]

6 minutes ago, Killax said:

The both are not synergizing as well as you potentially could with one of either.

I see what you mean. What caught me the most is that two drops are good way to choose who go forst and that is something i value a lot, maybe too much.

 

[Knight of Ruin]

Also.. A unit of 30 bloodletters can be buffed in such a way to dish out mortal wounds on a 4+ to hit with rerolls. (slaughterpriest and bloodsecrator)

Place 2 such blocks supported by atleast 1 bloodthirster of unfettered fury for 6" pile in, both units near a bloodmaster (foot herald) so that if 1 herald strikes first, the 30 bloodletters near him can then pile in 6" and do their thing. 

Ideallu most of that stuff is in a maxed murderhost. Luckily in my mind (pure theory so far but seems to support earlier play experience), bloodcrushers and flesh hounds are great alongside 1-2 30 man bloodletter squads.

They both provide some speed to go after judicators, small buff heroes like relictors or branchwraiths, but most importantly. Blood tithe and battleline.

Even better are that with some work, the blood crushers can be buffed in a similar way just to less effect as the bloodletters.

All this should leave enough room to add some sprinkles like wrathmonger unit for even more attacks, another blood secrator for redundancy, or heck even skarbrand.

 

If you really want, i think you can do fine with 1 unit of 30 bloodletters if you present some oter scary targets, like 4 units of msu flesh hounds in a murderhost.

I think that if the opponent has to choose between dealing with 4x5 flesh hounds that move at d6 plus 8 plus run or charge or a big block of 30 bloodletters.. Or a bloodthirster.. Or the supporting heroes in the back..

You will force so many difficult choices that it requires a very skilled/experienced player to make sure the right things go down.

Lets look at that:

1) supporting heroes: these are the slaughterpriest and secrator. Stoker is optional but not really needed imo.

If the priest dies you will lose the re-roll 1's or reroll hits on the bloodletter. Not the worst. The other is the blood rage (i think its called). Coupled with the lash from the fury thirster can reslly helo bring a choice unit closer to you.

Secrator. This one is more punishing. You lose 1 attack.. And the plus 1 to hit from a banner artifact. Meaning your amount of mortal wounds is quite reduced. With 30 bletters you will still kill stuff.. But you wont wade through a unit of retributors or kurnoth hunters anymore.

2) bloodmaster (herald on foot). This one you cant lose. He provides the murderhost its ability (iirc), the extra pile in, and the loci. Arguably.. If you dont have a maxed murderhost its also less punishing as you only need him once. That said, you still reduce the bloodletter effectiveness, but not that much.

 

3)thirster: he is a fire magnet. The bletters and small heroes are far more dangerous. The best thing that can happen os that this dies first. Espexially if you can use blood rain in between

However the 6" pile in is very handy for a big unit like the 30 bletters simoly to get more attacks in. If tou placed the crimson crown on this guy, you will want him to live longer and i think he becomes more important than the herald at that point.

4) flesh hound: yay blood tithe. Let them be killed and get tithe point. Or not and they will tear supporting units a new one or score objectives (remember thah this is what wins games) and with 4 min units you are well prepared to take objectives.

5) bloodletters. Well you can lose up to 10 before you reduce tjis units effectiveness signnificantly. Be lucky on the icon and hope you regen a few.. Or hope you reach your targey unit before dropping belos 20 and delete that unit.

So thats my thoughts for now. Became a bit more than i intended, so internet cookiez for you if you read it all

 

[Jharen]

As to what @Killax mentioned, yeah of course I should have clarified I did not mean to suggest the Gore Pilgrims be included IN the goretide, as you'd not be able to do that.  As to it working alongside multiple smaller units I feel it can, but I'm also not going to say it's the best of the best in options.  It does provide more target threat saturation as long as you go with 3 Slaughterpriests.  The idea is to use the Slaughterpriests to keep your heroes alive more than your units, and to threaten with Bloodboil prayer or pulls to manipulate your enemy.  Killax has done a fine job breaking down various tactics to use though and I also suggest you measure everything everyone says against what you ultimately want to play and find fun and are comfortable with.

@Knight of Ruin makes further good points, especially about Bloodletters.  In my experience you can always just drop a unit of 30 bloodletters into about any list and you're to instantly cause a distraction target.  Your opponent is going to want to kill that before it gets close, and while the bulk of his concern is going to be in removing 11 of them, if you have damned terrain or a slaughterpriest available their concern is going to be on removing nearly the entire unit.  Bloodletters are always a safe bet because they're just scary.

 

[Jaehaerys]

Hey folks here is a 2k I will be running. Mostly because it's everything I have. Thoughts?

 

Leaders

WoK Bloodthirster -360

Bloodmaster Herald -80

Slaughterpriest- 100

Slaughterpriest - 100

Bloodstoker - 80

Bloodsecrator-120

 

Units

Bloodletter x30 - 300

Bloodcrusher x3 - 160

Bloodcrusher x3 - 160

Bloodreavers x10 - 70

Bloodreaver x10 - 70

Blood Warrior x5 - 100

Blood Warrior x5 - 100

Khorgorath - 100

 

Batallion

Murderhost -20

Gore Pilgrim - 80

 

 

I guess I'd have to go first if possible with murderhost advancing after setup if I'm against ranged heavy (which I'll definitely be up against). I kept Reaver and Warriors apart for Blood tithe. Think it's around 5 drop on setup. Khorgorath is thrown in there cause that's all I have left over. 

Any thoughts, comments, strategy would be welcome

 

[Domlin]

Quick question off topic.

 

Double checking if are artefacts are unique or not. I don't see anywhere in the book where it would prevent me to take the same artefact on multiple heroes as long as I'm running formations to generate the extra artefacts. Is that correct?

 

Thanks.