AoS Night - 2 November - Death v Sylvaneth

[Nico]

So it looks like I'll be playing against Craig's @Bowlzee newly reinforced Sylvaneth.

I'm bringing this unconventional Nagash list:

• Nagash (General) 900
• Tomb Herald (Ring of Derp) 100
• Coven Throne (260)
• 6 Necropolis Knights 320
• 3 Ushabti (Bows) 120
• 3 Skeleton Chariots 140
• 10 Zombros 60
• 10 Zombros 60

1960

Will Craig carpet the table with Wyldwoods? Will Nagash unbind Shield of Thorns? Will I remember to use a triumph ability? Time will tell.

 

 

[Bowlzee]

Here's my list for tonight:

Leaders
Treelord Ancient (300)
- General
- Trait: Gnarled Warrior 
- Artefact: The Oaken Armour 
Branchwraith (100)
- Artefact: The Silverwood Circlet 

Units
Dryads x 20 (240)
Dryads x 20 (240)
Dryads x 20 (240)
Dryads x 10 (120)
Kurnoth Hunters x 3 (180)
- Greatbows
Kurnoth Hunters x 3 (180)
- Greatbows
Sisters of the Thorn x 5 (220)

Batallions
Forest Folk (60)
Winterleaf Wargrove (100)

Total: 1980/2000

 

Do I have enough Wyldwoods to spam the table, will I regret not taking a third Leader??!

[Nico]

I think we'll reroll if it's 3 places of power, as it will not be a game.

List-wise another Ancient is probably a good shout (along with new dice to stop rollings 1s and 2s on their attacks).

[Nico]

Battleplan

This was Gifts from the Heaven. Like last week - this was good news for me, as a single model could deny Craig from scoring.

 

Deployment

Craig popped his Wyldwood down diagonally extending out of what turned out to be his deployment zone. In hindsight it might have been better linking the two deployment zones.

I gave Craig the side with the Mystical Terrain. Both sides had Damned Terrain to buff the Kurnoth Hunters before healing them.

I made several mistakes in deployment. Nagash should have been on the front so he could get into combat and shooting range sooner and the Tomb Herald should have been behind him.

The Nagashcam

Craig deployed lines of his many Dryads, his Ancient centrally and the bow Hunters spread out. He had no Scythes.

 

Battleround 1  

Craig elected to take first turn (not sure this is optimal). He wasn't able to find a good space for the Ancient to pop its free Wyldwood. A question is whether wholly within in this context means that each of the 3 bases has to be within 15 or whether all of the 3 bases has to be within 15 - I'm 90% sure it's the former.

Craig put Shield of Thorns on the big unit of Dryads on my left and threw them forward a bit - Craig's inner Khorne speaking.

Craig did the Damned and Regrowth Combo on the Hunters and proceeded to snipe off the Tomb Herald without difficulty. I said that target selection would be critical in this game and Craig had done his homework. The others chomped down some Zombros, but Craig rolled badly - not enough to kill 10 or at least 8 and take them out with Battleshock (before Nagash could do his command ability).

In response, I recovered 6 Zombros and merged them, put mystic shield on the Chariots, cast Soul Stealer and failed to beat the Dryads' bravery of 6 (6 spells unused whoop) and waddled forward. Necropolis Knights seem sluggish at 8 inches instead of the healthy 22. My Bowshabti began a series of derping and did nothing as did the bows on the Chariots. Nagash killed 2 Dryads with his Gaze attack.

I lobbed the Coven Throne out to the left so as to stop Craig scoring if his comet came down that side (and because I had brought it mainly for its spell for Nagash to cast - with a Stonelord in mind as the target).

I won the initiative.

Battleround 2

My comet came down centrally, so the Zombos waddled back to get it.

Now Nagash could do some more serious casting. I fired off Soul Stealer and Arcane Bolt and started denting the Kurnoth Hunters atop the hill on the right. Mystic Shield went on the Necropolis Knights. Finally I managed to cast Beguile and rolled over 6 on 3 dice to paralyse the Dryads so they couldn't touch Nagash. Nagash then proceeded to lodge himself between them and the non-shielded 10 man Dryad unit.

My shooting chipped away at the Hunters on the hill.

The Chariots picked on the same small Dryad unit, while the Necropolis Knights YOLOed into the heart of Craig's army, feeling that their 3+ save in combat and cheery 30 wounds would keep them alive, whereupon the banner and Nagash would bring 2 models back.

I'd not appreciated that the Ancient was sporting Gnarled Warrior as well as Oaken Armour - 2+ rerollable, ignoring the Knight's -1 rend - a 35/36 save. Fortunately only 2 Knights went on him,  the rest went into the Hunters in cover and the Branchwraith.

As Nagash couldn't be attacked by the big block of Dryads, activated the Knights first. Thankfully they killed the Branchwraith, but the combination of the stomp from the Ancient and the 3+ rerollable save of the Hunters meant I did about 1 extra wound - pitiful. Thankfully, the Ancient flubbed his attacks. The rest of the army slapped away and killed one Knight. This all smacked of stalemate.

Nagash (facing -1 to hit) only killed about 9 Dryads from one unit and 2 from the other. The Chariots did about 3 wounds. Craig lost a few more to Battleshock, but wisely extricated his unit from combat by removing models.

Craig's comet landed near Nagash - terrible luck for him. He now had a choice between melting the Zombros and scoring from my objective - which would result in a draw if it worked or killing the Knights outright and then killing Nagash quickly. We had a long discussion about where he could put his Wyldwood and how he could use the once per game mass teleport for the Dryads to flood the Zombros - but there didn't seem to be a way to do it because of the scenery, where the Coven Throne was etc.. If he had had Verdant Blessing then it would have been a different story. Ultimately Craig resolved to try to melt the Knights.

Nagash unbound Shield of Thorns with ease. To give him credit, if the game is dependent on magic, he does rock. However, at best this qualifies him as a sideboard choice against Tzeentch or Gnarlroot.

Craig woke up the wood with the Ancient's spell and also triggered the roused by magic effect, to chip away wounds off the Necropolis Knights. They weren't near a hero, so no ward save.

The Sisters moved left to get out of Nagash's unbinding range.

He fired everything at them in the shooting phase and mobbed them with his Dryads, who had exploding attacks on 5+ due to their song ability.

He chipped away numerous bodies. I activated them first and clobbered a few Dryads who hadn't attacked yet. Again the Ancient derped. When all was said and done, the banner bearer survived with 3 wounds left. Nagash did little on the right (I cannot recall whether Craig retreated those Dryads).

Snake burger anyone?

As ever, the initaitive roll was huge. Craig won it! Hope lived for the Sylvaneth.

Score 2-0

Battleround 3

Craig failed to cast Shield of Thorns on the other big block of Dryads.

The Ancient did awakening of the Wood again and chipped off one wound, however, the roused by magic did another 2 and the last Snake Surfer bit the dust. My centre had collapsed.

Craig started to waddle everything towards Nagash. The slowness of the Ancient was palpable here.

His shooting chipped off some wounds. One small unit of Dryads made it in and did about 2 more wounds.

Nagash deleted the impertinent sticks in response.

 

Craig couldn't score.

In response, Nagash did soul stealer and got one wound back. i think he was on 12 wounds left at this point. He lobbed other spells at the Hunters. I think Craig managed to unbind mystic shield which was big. Then the Chariots moved up and Nagash waddled into another unit of Dryads and Hunters. Again he paralysed the Dryads (the Ancient was out of range). The Ushabti walked forward and finally did some damage to the hunters.

Nagash (facing -1 to hit) failed to do any damage whatsoever with either pew pew or melee which was abysmal. This is a huge problem with the big characters in the game and the Rogue Idol, their low number of attacks makes them incredibly unreliable. It's not helped when Destruction can use Battlebrew to make a 520 point Stonelord do double the amount of shooting and combat damage as Nagash in a turn and do so reliably, whereas it's almost impossible to buff Nagash or Gordrakk materially.

The Coven Throne flew back to secure the objective with the Zombros.

Score 5-0

Battleround 4

Craig won the initiative and threw almost everything at Nagash. While Nagash unbound spells, the fact that they are cast triggered the roused by magic which did 2 wounds on Nagash - Morrikhane reflected one mortal wound back into the forest.  As usual the cannon from the Ancient didn't wound. Wound started to drain off Nagash. The Ancient smacked into him. 

15 Dryads engaged the Coven Throne. The kiss missed sadly, but the other attacks did pretty well.

By the end Nagash still stood with 5 wounds remaining. 

Again Craig didn't score.

I cast Soul Stealer and got a wound back. Then it was the big moment, when Nagash would take his vengeance. Nagash raised his hand and blasted a withering beam at the Ancient. Craig picked the wrong hand, so the Ancient vaporized.

I failed to cast mystic shield. The roused by magic chipped off another 2 wounds and damaged the Coven Throne on the other end of the wood, so only 3 remained.

Now Nagash was free to rampage through the woods. He chomped down the remaining Sisters and Hunters. Leaving only a large block of Dryads remaining. The Chariots and Ushabti consolidated their grip on the objective. The Coven Throne wiped out the Dryads in the middle.

Amid this carnage - Craig won the initiative.

Nagash had lost 12 wounds

Score 13-0

Battleround 5

Craig had only one thing to do and one tool to do it with - taking out the Great Necbromancer with his Dryads.

They made a healthy charge and got all the models in - 2 inch range for the win. The attacks exploded forcefully with the +1 to hit song. There were 15 wounds to save - I rolled the dice - five 2s! "Take it off"  Nagash exploded into a wind of Warpfire and bats taking out half of the Dryads with him.

The remnants raised their song - they had been defeated today with many heroes slain, but they would regrow and fight another day. 

Conclusion

Even with a tailored list designed to get a decent benefit out of Nagash's abundance of spells, he's not worth 900 points by any stretch. Against some melee armies without the ability to pick targets and focus fire the way Craig did, I could have caused real problems by restoring models to all my units every turn. Another unit of Necropolis Knights would be better than the Ushabti.

He would be useful against Gnarlroot armies or Tzeentch but just doesn't cut the mustard otherwise. The Command Ability is nice, but not enough to make the difference.

Probably the only combo that I can see working is Nagash, a Mournful and a Catapult (to combo with the MG). The 3+ save rerolling ones, rend immune on the Mourngul would be sweet, but it's very gimmicky and the Mourngul may not be able to do enough damage to shift the enemy off objectives.  I fail to see why you wouldn't just spend 100 points fewer and get 3 Mournguls or 2 Mournguls and a Necrosphinx or GKoZD.

Dryads and Winterleaf showed their value in this game, particularly the way they held up the dreaded Necropolis Knights. The -1 to hit and +1 to hit buffs are colossal.

I think Craig needs to add a Spirit of Durthu or Drycha and add verdant blessing and he'll have a very good list.

Thanks again Craig @Bowlzee

Next week - it could be Fyreslayers....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bowlzee]

It was a fun game. Happy to kill Nagash at the end. 

Conclusion:

• Sisters of Thorn are not worth 220 points. I failed to cast it several times, and anything with Rend ignores the ability to do mortal wounds back. Their shooting is really short range and unless you screen them, will get killed by anything it wants to shoot at. 4+ 4+ just isn't very good.
• Ancient is awesome at tanking. I rarely do any damage with it, but I will start using it to slow down units. He was untouchable, until Nagash cast his uber spell and just took him off. 
• I keep wanting to bring Hunters, thinking ranged shooting is what the lists needs. But I'm continually underwhelmed by them. I think I might be better off with Scythes. In all the games I've used them, they do horrific damage. I decided not to use them this game, thinking I could use the Winterleaf Wargrove abailty on the Dryads to do the damage. But even 3+, 4+  exploding attacks on a 5+ isn't enough to do lots of damage without any rend. Perhaps against an army with bad armour saves it would be better.
• That being said, Dryads are awesome at staying on the field. -1 to hit is so useful. if a Treelord is around, it can easily go to -2 to hit with his stomp.

Time to dust myself down and try something else.

Always fun to play @Nico I think I'm 0-4 vs him now  

[Nico]

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Sisters of Thorn are not worth 220 points. I failed to cast it several times, and anything with Rend ignores the ability to do mortal wounds back. Their shooting is really short range and unless you screen them, will get killed by anything it wants to shoot at. 4+ 4+ just isn't very good.

It needs to be comboed with +2 to save to really shine, either 20 Dryads plus cover, or plus mystic shield or mystic shield plus Oaken Armour on the TLA/Spirit of Durthu. As you say, it's still a big gamble. On the other hand, a Spirit of Durthu plus an Ancient could probably solo an entire Khorne Bloodbound army (other than the Mighty Lord).

Quote

Always fun to play @Nico I think I'm 0-4 vs him now  

It was fun.

Surely 3-0? I still haven't beaten Tom Loyn and I fare badly against Rob's Nurgle as well.

 

[Thanatos Ares]

Looked like a brutal game! Gutted I couldn't be there!!


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[Dez]

Sticks and stones

may break grots bones

But weedy Gitz can't hurt me!

 

 

sounds like a great game!

[Nico]

Poetry in the South London Legion.

[Marc Wilson]

When's your next aos night?

[Nico]

Hey Marc.

Next Wednesday 7 December I believe. 

I'm there tomorrow for AoS/Bloodbowl, but cannot make the actual Club AoS night. 

Hope you can make it.