Fan Rules: REAL Daemon Princes

[kenshin620]

I decided as a thought experiment to design better rules for Daemon Princes. These guys should be awesome, I mean they proved themselves to be the BEST mortal champions ever and are given one of the rarest blessings from the gods. Yet as many point out (and I had a topic on this a month ago) Princes are "meh"-tier distraction carnifex outside of making a budget bloodthirster with artifacts or something.

 

So I changed that by a few ways. Main points are

All Daemon Princes are separate warscrolls. This allows matched play point differentiation rather than try to balance 5 versions with one point level. I haven't pinned down though where a good point level would be for them. Probably hovering around Dragon Ogor Shaggoth territory give or take 10pts.

They lose Monster and Behemoth. This removes a few Monster interactions, allows for Look Out Sir, and lets more behemoths be taken (though thats usually pretty rare for chaos anyways).

Up to wounds to 10 and gained a "6" ward save.

Cursed Soul Eater becomes Standard.

All attacks hit on a 3+.

Weapon Choices are now based on damage. Risk a D3 roll or do a flat 2.

All are wizards except for Khorne. Their unique spell Chaos Warp Blast gives them some mortal wound punch. Is the double 6 roll too much? I made it mostly for fluff purposes (8 pointed star of chaos).

If you do not opt for Wings, you have a 3+ Save instead.

Undivided helps with Battleshock. Probably too basic? But he can be the cheapest.

Nurgle is tougher with better "ward save" as standard for nurgle daemons and heals more.

Tzeentch casts and unbinds 2 spells and can access Lore of Fate (but I didn't want it to access mortal/arcanite items/traits).

Slaanesh can pile in farther and is faster when running/charging. Maybe I should keep the "always strikes first" thing? I dunno how Hosts of Slaanesh will change stuff. Maybe he's too fast?

Khorne hits more accurately, can dish out mortals wounds, and can flat out ignore spell effects (not just damage).

 

What do you think?

 

[Melcavuk]

I’d change the spell to do D6 mortal wounds on a flat roll of an 8 and loss the 8 mortal wound element as it’ll hike up your point cost in potency.

id of varied the move a bit more, slaanesh faster, Nurgle slower and the others in the middle to reflect their gods better.

Other then that seems pretty solid across the board but points wise I’d go roughly 260 as aside from minor differences in damage output they’re flat better across the board (same wounds, either higher save or move with fly, higher bravery, built in ward save, self healing and god buff)

[MitGas]

I really like your vision of DPs - I'd instantly field one with that warscroll. The spell is too potent when you roll two sixes IMO but apart from that he seems quite okay, if a bit on the cheap side of things if his point cost wasn't changed with such a good warscroll (also, the casting value should be higher than 6 IMO). He's like a better Ogroid Thaumaturge - could stand up to a Megaboss in close combat and yet a very potent caster. Exactly what a 1337 Champion of Tzeentch should be like (and used to be back in older editions, before all champions of Tzeentch got turned into frail nerds). B)

I really hope the DPs will get a new warscroll similar to your design with the new Darkoath/Everchosen/Whatever battletome as I'd love to field one.

 

[kenshin620]

Yea I suppose war blast 8 wounds is a bit much!

I think I would change it to

Chaos Warp Blast has a casting value of 6. If successfully cast, pick 1 enemy unit within 8" of the caster and visible to them. That unit suffers D3 mortal wounds. If the casting roll is 10 or more, the unit suffers D6 mortal wounds.

So now it's a souped up arcane bolt. Cast value of 6 isn't that bad compare to something like Vindictive Glare which is 12" and is casting value 5 for d3 mortals. Unless should default spells cost more since theres no trade-off on spell selection?

Cost wise I think pushing it, 180 (yea probably be a no brainer take 3 of them at that!) more realistic 200-250 range depending on the prince. I mean right now in their current 160pt form isn't really worth it (I'd say they're worth more 130-140.). Obviously by making them a wizard flat out bumps their price 20-40 points. Then each buff is around 10-30pts worth.

[Carnith]

The spell is fine imo, it's only on a double 6 that you get access to 8 mws, and thats rare enough.

Why did you make their talons down to 1 dmg from their 2 damage previous incarnation. What about daemon princes that go double talons, or is that not a thing that can be done cause of 40k bits?

[kenshin620]

7 hours ago, carnith said:

 

Why did you make their talons down to 1 dmg from their 2 damage previous incarnation.

Oh I think that was a typo! I'll fix that for later things (doesn't help the custom warscroll builder doesnt save magic half the time)

On the topic of double talons, that is an interesting idea for an option. I mean yea maybe since the 40k bitz may look a bit weird but then again we do have the KO faction, and the soul grinder is a thing (honestly surprised at this point they don't make Mauler/Forge Fiends into AoS)

[kenshin620]

Heres the updated warscrolls, fixed the talon damage and changed the spell to be Arcane Bolt 2.0.

I think I made a very redundant rule for Tzeentch, I should probably just give it the Arcanite keyword and be done with it! (Although I think the limitations of the warscroll maker makes the format look weird with 2 rows of keywords)

 

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