Pigbones Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 Just ordered the Start Collecting! box for Beastclaw Raiders, and I'm very excited! I guess I'm looking for advice on which build for the models, and where to go from here. Any suggested units, allies, battalions, etc? Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lysandestolpe Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 Since the stonehorn nerf, I've been reluctant taking more than one potential. Perhaps some disagrees with me here but I'd throw my money on Thundertusks. something like this: 1 Thundertusk Huskard 2 Thundertusk Beastriders Some mournfang a few Yethees. (spelling?) Some Saberdogs and a hunter That should make you have a pretty good 2000k list, as long as you don't let them kill you Thundertusks. And trust me, they will be the target. So use your mournfangs, yethees, and hunter with dogs to keep the enemy away from the Thundertusks so they don't end up in combat. As for allies, I'd get a Butcher or two. That way you can throw some spells like arcane bolt and mystic shield, as well as heal closeby Ogor models and throw Verocious Maw (spelling again). Good Luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakree Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 So this thread by @heywoah_twitch is about his own journey learning, trying and getting better with BCR post GBH2017, it's a really useful look if you know absolutely nothing. He's been experimenting with big groups of Mournfang. Also to parrot @Lysandestolpe butchers are a huge part of the new BCR, they fix a whole bunch of your problems and it really does come down to the more the merrier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pigbones Posted December 22, 2017 Author Share Posted December 22, 2017 12 minutes ago, Lysandestolpe said: Since the stonehorn nerf, I've been reluctant taking more than one potential. Perhaps some disagrees with me here but I'd throw my money on Thundertusks. something like this: 1 Thundertusk Huskard 2 Thundertusk Beastriders Some mournfang a few Yethees. (spelling?) Some Saberdogs and a hunter That should make you have a pretty good 2000k list, as long as you don't let them kill you Thundertusks. And trust me, they will be the target. So use your mournfangs, yethees, and hunter with dogs to keep the enemy away from the Thundertusks so they don't end up in combat. As for allies, I'd get a Butcher or two. That way you can throw some spells like arcane bolt and mystic shield, as well as heal closeby Ogor models and throw Verocious Maw (spelling again). Good Luck! Yeah, the Stone Skeleton nerf seems like a big hamstring. And the lack of spellcasters is frustrating, but allies helps to patch it. Thanks! Would you suggest larger units of Mournfang or smaller ones? 7 minutes ago, Malakree said: So this thread by @heywoah_twitch is about his own journey learning, trying and getting better with BCR post GBH2017, it's a really useful look if you know absolutely nothing. He's been experimenting with big groups of Mournfang. Also to parrot @Lysandestolpe butchers are a huge part of the new BCR, they fix a whole bunch of your problems and it really does come down to the more the merrier. This thread has been invaluable, and I've been following it for a bit. Thought I'd cast a wider net and see what came up, though. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakree Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 So there's a couple of thoughts I have, this is from the perspective of someone who was seriously torn between Ironjawz and Beastclaw. I was super sad when IJ couldn't ally BCR. Still take it with a pinch of salt because what I'm saying is coming from the perspective of an Ironjawz player rather than a BCR. That said I love the concept list building so will run around and do that sort of playing around with lists. Big thing I lack is the experience with the individual units. So I've been playing around with units of 6 Goregruntas, I've found having the bigger unit has a few advantages. Firstly is it takes better advantage of any buffs you can give them, +1 to hit on a unit of 6 is way better than 3. Second is that for combat priority having less units means you can activate more sooner, being able to finish all your attacks before your opponent really lets you cut down on his damage output potential while impacting your own less. Finally is that space wise a unit of 6 isn't that much harder to get into combat than a unit of 3. For these reasons I'm really in favour of doubling up on the units, with the 2" range the Gargant Hackers give I'd be even more in favour of this for you, lastly since the unit does higher mortal wound output with each model that ends in an inch a bigger unit means more free mortal wounds if you charge. Then getting the obvious stuff out of the way, 4+ to hit is terrible, fortunately since abilities affect all melee weapons, including mounts still, they fix this problem very easily, as such anything which gives +1 to hit is going to be awesome for you. The current ways to do this in the list building portion are Butchers rolling 3-4 on the cauldron give +1 to hit to a target unit. Braggoths Beasthammer gives +1 as long as your GG's and Mournfang have a hug buddy. So obviously the butchers are the easiest, most versatile and least restrictive of the two, the other does add some interesting options though. Quote LeadersFrostlord on Stonehorn (460)Battleline4 x Mournfang Pack (320)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders Battleline4 x Mournfang Pack (320)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders Battleline3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)- Ironjawz Battleline3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)- Ironjawz BattlelineBattalionsBraggoth's Beast Hammer (260)Total: 1640 / 2000Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 91 List Option Beastriders (360)Total: 2000 / 2000 Is going to be your base beasthammer list realistically. You're lacking a third battleline, which is a pain, but it's all one drop and hasn't actually spent any allies points. The fact Braggoth Himself also benefits from the +1 is super nice plus the chance to pile in twice can be vicious. Also notice that this list really doesn't care to much about battleshock with the mournfangs having 6 wounds a piece and the goregruntas at 5. It's hard to pull of but if you can land the mythical 8" charge from the GG's and combine with a second pile in things are going to melt. Probably a fluff list more than anything else but could be an interesting start point. From a Financial perspective this could also be an amazing place to start. The start collecting is, as you know, 1 Big Beastie and 4 Mournfang. As I noted at the bottom of the list adding a Beastrider gives you your third battleline, fills your points to exactly 2k and is exactly 2 start collecting boxes. The expensive portion here is going to be the 6 Goregruntas which is basically 2 start collecting Ironjawz boxes (3 gg's are £48, the start collecting gives 3ggs and is £50). That said it also gives you a solid start to an ironjawz army if that ever takes your fancy. Overall a very simple list that is built from 2 Start Collecting Beastclaw Raiders and 2 Start Collecting Ironjawz. Comes in at £160 if you order it from secondary retailers (-£40 because you already have one of the SC boxes). Quote Allegiance: Beastclaw RaidersLeadersHuskard (380)- GeneralButcher (140)- AlliesButcher (140)- AlliesBattleline4 x Mournfang Pack (320)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders Battleline4 x Mournfang Pack (320)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders Battleline4 x Mournfang Pack (320)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders BattlelineTotal: 1620 / 2000Allies: 280 / 400Wounds: 98 List Option Another Huskard (380)Total: 2000 / 2000 4 x Mournfang Pack (320) Becomes 6 x Mournfang Pack (480)1 x Gorger (60)Total: 1980 / 2000 This is the otherside of the coin. 3 big units of Mournfangs, with 2 butchers and a Huskard, which type is up to you. The advantage here is that you aren't limited to having an expensive Frostlord on Stonehorn and can instead opt to go for a Huskard on either Stonehorn or Thundertusk. The list options then let you add in either a second huskard or to up one of your Mournfangs up to a massive 6 models, 60 points onto a Gorger and 20 points spare. In terms of choice and flexibility this list is way better than Braggoths, the list itself doesn't have any set in stone requirements so if you want to change it up later the whole thing won't go ****** up. From a Financial perspective you're looking at 2 butchers and 3 Start Collecting Beastclaw Raiders. which will give you an extra Beastie but means that you will have the options in models not just the list. Building on this is whatever you feel like but honestly you aren't going to need much more than that. The only reason you would is if you decide you want to swap to a monster mash in which case you will need a few more SC:BCR boxes to fill your quota. The more flexible of the two lists which gives more utility at the cost of reliability, is built from 3 Start Collecting Beastclaw Raiders and 2 butchers. You probably can't get the butchers from secondary retailers so those will cost you £36 each (they are also fine cast which is /puke) but the SC should be fine. As a result you're looking at £192 (£120+£72) with the £40 off because you already have the first SC box. As a final point both these lists are based around Mournfang and a +1 to hit buff. Obviously you can go the Monster Mash route with tundertusks out the wazoo, either as mass Huskards or a Torlbad to get the 1 drop. That will require a few extra Icefall yhetis though. Quote Allegiance: DestructionLeadersHuskard on Thundertusk (380)- Chaintrap Huskard on Thundertusk (380)- Chaintrap Huskard on Thundertusk (380)- Chaintrap Huskard on Thundertusk (380)- Chaintrap Battleline2 x Mournfang Pack (160)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders Battleline2 x Mournfang Pack (160)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders Battleline2 x Mournfang Pack (160)- Gargant Hackers - Beastclaw Raiders BattlelineTotal: 2000 / 2000Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 84 Quote Allegiance: DestructionLeadersHuskard on Thundertusk (380)- Chaintrap Battleline3 x Icefall Yhetees (120)- Beastclaw Raiders Battleline (Frostlord on Thundertusk General)3 x Icefall Yhetees (120)- Beastclaw Raiders Battleline (Frostlord on Thundertusk General)3 x Icefall Yhetees (120)- Beastclaw Raiders Battleline (Frostlord on Thundertusk General)Thundertusk Beastriders (360)- Beastclaw Raiders BattlelineThundertusk Beastriders (360)- Beastclaw Raiders BattlelineThundertusk Beastriders (360)- Beastclaw Raiders BattlelineBattalionsTorrbad (160)Total: 1980 / 2000 ORBITAL STRIKE GOOOO! So don't take what I presented as gospel. Whatever route you choose to go down you really want that second SC:BCR box and then it's up to you. I hope this helped at least a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pigbones Posted December 22, 2017 Author Share Posted December 22, 2017 23 minutes ago, Malakree said: So don't take what I presented as gospel. Whatever route you choose to go down you really want that second SC:BCR box and then it's up to you. I hope this helped at least a bit. It's actually very useful, and has given a lot to thing about, at least so far as how I want to play the army. Thank you so much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakree Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 8 minutes ago, Pigbones said: It's actually very useful, and has given a lot to thing about, at least so far as how I want to play the army. Thank you so much! Cool, one of the aspects of the game I really enjoy is the list building aspect and just playing around with the different options. Personally I need to finish a bunch of stuff for my Ironjawz but after that that Beasthammer list looks like something I'd enjoy so it's been useful for me as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turragor Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 I'm painting up 2 mournfang and a custom built butcher over the holidays. I'll reach about 1500 points then. Then I'll be looking at finishing building and painting a thundertusk. And my experiment with grots needs to be trialled a lot. I know @heywoah_twitch had a run with them in that thread but was against a ranged list so they would do little there. In my view having 20 for 100 pts or 40 for 200 pts gives you quite the blockade against a few army types that like delivering units at the 9" range. What I need to playtest is how bad are they movement wise on average after they have performed their buffer roll... or do you just never stop their roll area denial? hmm 4 or 5 rounds of area denial in one half of the table while the big units focus on the other half - for example - could be handy in some circumstances. Depends on who you face (I think thats key). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pigbones Posted December 22, 2017 Author Share Posted December 22, 2017 34 minutes ago, Turragor said: I'm painting up 2 mournfang and a custom built butcher over the holidays. I'll reach about 1500 points then. Then I'll be looking at finishing building and painting a thundertusk. And my experiment with grots needs to be trialled a lot. I know @heywoah_twitch had a run with them in that thread but was against a ranged list so they would do little there. In my view having 20 for 100 pts or 40 for 200 pts gives you quite the blockade against a few army types that like delivering units at the 9" range. What I need to playtest is how bad are they movement wise on average after they have performed their buffer roll... or do you just never stop their roll area denial? hmm 4 or 5 rounds of area denial in one half of the table while the big units focus on the other half - for example - could be handy in some circumstances. Depends on who you face (I think thats key). I've definitely been looking at Grots and Skall Saberpups, weighing pros and cons and things like that. And I'd much prefer to convert my own butcher as well. I've actually followed you on Insta for a bit now, and can't wait to see it finished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turragor Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 11 minutes ago, Pigbones said: I've definitely been looking at Grots and Skall Saberpups, weighing pros and cons and things like that. And I'd much prefer to convert my own butcher as well. I've actually followed you on Insta for a bit now, and can't wait to see it finished. He has the end of a bone in his mouth, a mohawk on the way and a small fur cloak has been added together with some furs under his butt to make him sit better on the chest. I might put a dining table in between him and the cauldron! Its getting out of hand and I love it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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