Kirjava13

I should stress that if you want to use Stormvermin, then by all means do so! They're just a different tool, one that is harder to get the most out of and much more specific in its use. If you're going to take them, then 40 is what you should go for and you need to make sure they survive and do a lot of killing. All that said, I have only ever used Stormvermin in a Skirmish game, so my advice is hardly gospel!

If only 4chan users didn't feel the need to be casually racist and homophobic.

You've hit upon the answer yourself, really. The Stormvermin are much more expensive than the Clanrats, and any improvement in survival or killing power just isn't worth those extra points. Given that it's bodies that (usually) control objectives, screen for more important units and nobly sacrifice for the cause, you can afford more of those bodies by using Clanrats, ensuring you have a flood of them alongside things that can do more consistent damage than Stormvermin.

@swarmofseals the Clanrats are more or less the same, with three differences: 1) the IoB/SoD Clanrats' arms are push-fit with a peg, while the boxed ones have a ball joint and must be glued; 2) the IoB/SoD Clanrats' shields are part of the model, while the boxed ones need to be glued on; 3) the IoB/SoD Clanrats' have slotta bases, while the boxed ones do not.

Ok, quick summary of my first tournament experience: dem rats did good. It wasn't a hyper-competitive environment, but people still played to win. Three games set over one day in a very cool little place in Linz, Austria, custom Battleplans of the organiser's design. Game 1 saw us start with an objective in our deployment zone and one in our opponent's that we had to seize. I faced a Slaanesh army- the named Keeper of Secrets, the mirror thing, the Masque, a some Daemon on another daemon's shoulders and thirty Daemonettes. My tail quivered nervously. Slaanesh has quite the rep at the moment. The Skaven edged forwards a little to try and find range on their weapons and the daemons raced to meet them. I threw down the Warp Lightning Vortex surrounding the mirror, only to find that it had a 2+ mortal wound save. No matter. The vortex took such a chunk out of his centre that what was left of that unit of Daemonettes retreated to hold his objective, playing no further part in the battle, and severely delayed another unit, ensuring that I was able to take on his infantry piecemeal. They proved a challenge nevertheless. Clanrats were butchered in droves, the cannon exploded after a disappointing overcharge and the Warlock Bombardier was dispatched by the Keeper of Secrets. But the Arch Warlock pumped the Stormfiends full of Vigordust, warp power and warpstone sparks. They blew the mirror thing to pieces, then turned their attention to the Keeper of Secrets and gunned it down, followed by the other Daemon character. A Slaaneshi endless spell popped up in the backline and hurt the Arch Warlock, but the Warpseer dispelled it with contemptuous ease the next turn, and the Stormfiends piled in to pound the Masque into the dirt. With his characters dead and his army thus unable to summon, my opponent almost gave up, but cunningly piled some Daemonettes in so as to be challenging control of my objective. He was literally an inch away from controlling it and getting the win, but the Warpseer's towering presence (and the Arch Warlock hiding on the other side of the objective) kept it in play, ensuring a draw. Game 2 was played lengthways down the table and was a purely violence-based scenario, with points awarded based on how much of your opponent's army you destroyed. The Skaven set up across from a grove of Sylvaneth, who fielded Drycha, a Branchwraith, a Branchwych, an Arch Revenant, 30 dryads, 6 Hunters with swords, 2x3 Hunters with bows and 2x20 Revenants. My Gnawhole placement here was key- I put one right in the back corner of his deployment zone, and another one half way up, with the third in my deployment zone. Honestly I never expect the Gnawholes to help much apart from the initial +1 to cast, so I was surprised to be able to use one to my advantage here. The one at the back made him so paranoid he tasked a unit of Revenants to guard it for basically the entire game, and the one in the middle became my Stormfiends' way into the heart of his forces. Vigordusted and warp-powered, they teleported half the length of the table and promptly blew the big unit of Kurnoth Hunters into kindling. This was essentially it really- the Warp Lightning Cannon blew a massive hole in one of the bow Hunter units (before exploding, as per), the Dryads got into a slugging match with my sword Clanrats (and lost) and the Stormfiends dealt with the remaining Hunters and Revenants. The only disappointment was the Warpseer, whose spells largely failed to go off and who ineffectually duelled the Arch Revenant. Win for the ratty fellows. The final game saw me face down the Beastclaw Raider army that had tabled a Stormcast army in the first round but come unstuck against Nagash and his pet spell portal. The charge of the Stoneclaw Brigade (four of them!) was brutal, but enough Clanrats remained intact and fighting that, when I got the double turn, I was able to bring them all down, like coked-up big game hunters, except with whiskers and machine guns. The Stormfiends, absolutely buzzing with every buff I could put on them, mowed down the Mournfangs, and it was over. Overall, I took a squeak-worthy second place, and celebrated by getting rather drunk. Takeaways: - Vigordust Injector is essential. I didn't use the Suspicious Stone once. - the Warlock Bombardier was only really useful for overcharging the cannon. I think the highlight of his day was beating a Revenant to death with his stick. - Warp Lightning Vortex is still very handy, but significantly less with its reduced range. Using it offensively is very tricky now. - the Battleshock immunity bubble that the Warpseer gives is incredible. Everything about the Warpseer is incredible. What a guy. - Skaven are adorable.

Quite apart from the tactical shenanigans Clanrats can enable, their low cost means you can use them for what they were born to do, which is be expendable. Get some way to make them immune to Battleshock (Screaming Bell, Warpseer, endless spell Bell, etc) and then get your opponent's best units tangled up in their furry corpses while you shoot and magic them to pieces. Armed with swords, in high enough numbers and with the right buffs, they can even do some damage! One of my units dragged down a Stonehorn through sheer weight of numbers yesterday.

Third and final game went just as planned. The Stoneclaw Stampede turned an awful lot of Clanrats into furry marmalade but I got the double turn going into BR2 and got two unhindered turns of unloading Stormfiends (jacked up with MMMWP, Vigordust and a spark) into his ice cows. Between that and the overwhelming magical superiority, I tabled him by the end of turn 3. More detail later. Victory has been bought with a pile of dead Clanrats.

Game 2 against Sylvaneth was a win, though annoyingly all his characters slipped through my grasp. Last game now, against a stampede of Stonehorns and Mournfangs. I will hopefully just feed my Clanrats to them slowly.

Game 1 is over. Undecided, but I am taking a moral win because I listened to @Gwendar's advice and killed all the heroes by turn 3. I lost basically all my Clanrats and one Stormfiend, so Skurrilious Maus is chalking this one up as a victory. Next game: Sylvaneth. Bring me my weed whacker.

There are rules for placing them. They have to go 8" from a table edge and must be at least 3" from enemy units or objectives and at least 1" from other terrain. That said, the rules for placing faction-specific scenery got an update in the General's Handbook this year. I can't recall it exactly, but I think the distance to other terrain increased.

So you guys have seen the list I'm taking. I've got my ranged Stormfriends, my WLC, my spells and that's it as far as ranged goes. Skeleton Pope has 16 wounds, a 3+ save and a 4+ mortal wound shrug. I am preemptively failing my Battleshock test.

By the Horned Rat, how do I deal with an army which consists of Nagash, Arkhan and three units of skeletons? I am squirting the musk of fear.

Anything more than a 'one hero, terrain piece, endless spells' release would be great tbh.

He's being hyperbolic but it's a valid point. Stormcast had the Vanguard update the year before that, then the Sacrosanct update last year. How long have some armies gone without an update?

Sure, we needed a 'stealthy' pretend dreadnought for Spess Mehreens to play with, definitely needed that and not, say, updated anything. Yes, yes, I know. Just wanted to get it off my chest.

So I know what I might end up facing on Thursday. The other players have: Sylvaneth; Nurgle; Slaanesh; Seraphon; Legions of Nagash; Skaven; Beastclaw Raiders; Stormcast; Ironjawz. I'm sure there's at least one more player with a DoK army, so this might not be everything, but I need to start thinking about dealing with these guys. Anyone have experience fighting these armies? I've only fought Stormcast and Sylvaneth, and one game against Slaanesh way back when.

Building my first new model in a while- swallowed the bitter pill of the price and got the Verminlord, so I have until next Thursday to throw him together and get him at least a little painted.

Looks great man! You've really nailed down the subtle different shades of green, and it looks suitably ominous.

Might be interesting but unfortunately I only have five Stormvermin, having cannibalised almost all of my bits to make Jezzails and Acolytes!

My reasons for taking the Clawlord are as follows: - I have the Skryre General model, and I think it's cool af. - He buffs the Clanrats. - I have 100 points left over otherwise. I could swap him for another Warlock, to get even more spells going on (that would net me six total). If I take out the Clawlord and the Gravetide I have 120 points to play with- it's immaterial at this point as I have submitted the list, but I could play around with Endless Spells... I wonder how much a Balewind Vortex would help this army?

Ok, so I had to submit the list by 23:59 today, and as such have handed it in as-is. I am free to choose Command Traits, Spells and Artifacts later, so my thoughts are turning to these things. I guess MMMWP! for both the Arch-Warlock and the Warlock Bombardier. The Warpseer will be my general, I think. Lore of Ruin is only for Grey Seers, I believe, so he doesn't get to choose a spell? For Command Trait, Master of Magic sounds like a good one, giving him +2 to cast when he's standing by a Gnawhole. For the Artifact... not sure. Suspicious Stone is one I've seen thrown about, giving the Warpseer 4+/5+/5+, rerolling the 4+. Not bad. Or should I put a Vigordust Injector on the Arch-Warlock? Should he be the general? What's the best Command Trait for the Clawlord (Verminous Valour and Powerful might keep him alive for longer; Malevolent might make him a nastier fighter; Savage Overlord helps stop Clanrats cheesing it** from Battleshock)? Will the Bombardier achieve anything?* So many questions. *No. **Stop it. Thoughts as they sit just after midnight: Allegiance: SkaventideLeadersKcasnar Koil (300)Verminlord Warpseer- General- Trait: Master of Magic - Artefact: Suspicious Stone Skurrilious Maus (160)Arch-Warlock- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!Shirk Maus (100)Warlock Bombardier- Lore of Warpvolt Galvanism: More-more-more Warp Power!Vernikt Morsliht (100)Clawlord- Mighty Warlord Command Trait: Verminous ValourBattlelineSlash-Pack (200)40 x Clanrats- Rusty BladeStab-Pack (200)40 x Clanrats- Rusty SpearSkitter-Pack (120)20 x Clanrats- Rusty BladeUnitsMausfiends (520)6 x StormfiendsWar MachinesThing-Zapper (180)Warp Lightning CannonEndless Spells / TerrainWarp Lightning Vortex (100)Suffocating Gravetide (20)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 0Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 172

Like me! I've got the battleforce, start collecting and a few other bits and bobs, and I'm holding off on starting with them (even though that damned Carnosaur was the model- besides the Stormfiends- that got me back into Warhammer) because I desperately want a plastic Slann!

Quite impressive in and of itself really if my local GW is anything to go by, given that it has the Start Collecting box and literally nothing else.

You would hope he'd have a guide griffhound or something.