AoS Cities of Sigmar Battletome 2023 Discussion

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

1 minute ago, Thugmullet said:

Iv been putting the artifact on the lance actually.

It's 3+ 3+ - 3 rend and 4 damage on the charge. With the order for an extra attack it's 5 attacks. All goes to plan he's also following strait on from the strike first dragon on same unit. It's a lot of fire-power. Drops off if he's not on the charge but I just gotta trust I can get the charge off first and they should kill whatever they touch. There best buddies my griffon and dragon.

If I was using the hammer, would go with the lance/hammer combo, as well, for what it's worth. I think it makes sense to kit out the Griffon for a really scary charge/alpha strike. It has really good mobility and with counter-charge/engage the foe, it seems very scary. -4 rend on the charge with counter-charge is no joke, and getting counter charges had been really easy in my experience.

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

I recently had my last league game with my Cities list. Just want to share my experience with the army because I probably won't run it again until 4th ed comes out.

Overall, I am happy with my performance in the games I have had. I went 3-3, but that doesn't necessarily reflect the actual performance of my list, which was Hallowheart Steam Tanks and Fusiliers. Two of the games I lost were lost to time in the 3rd round, after I had essentially already tabled my opponent. My games would frequently go a similar way: I would lose some points and my Steelhelm screens (sometimes Fusiliers) early, but keep my Steam Tanks and buff pieces alive into the late game, where I would clean up.

I had three games pre-nerf and three post. Pre-nerf, the list was absurd. I had a game against OBR where I basically shut them down from turn 1 and lost no units. I was punching well above my weight with the Alchtemite buff, taking on units that I honestly had no business beating. Fusiliers really were point-and-click, destroy a unit at that point, but Command Corps healing was also pretty insane. I frequently healed up a Steam Tank from its last legs back up to full in a turn.

Post nerf, things got a lot harder. Fusiliers definitely started to kind of suck. They still performed OK with the Master of Ballistics +1 to hit and wound, but their Unleash Hell became a lot worse. I believe the expected damage of Fusilier Unleash Hell is about 5 or so rend 1 wounds. Before the nerf, you could add about 7 mortals to that, which definitely changed the math a lot.

I find it hard to judge how strong the Cities allegiance abilities are. A lot of people in my play group continued to blunder into Counter Fire even after becoming aware of its existence. For those who remembered, it mostly just served to shut down small incidental shooting and made them position more carefully to avoid giving me a free shooting attack. Overall, I don't know how to feel about it. It is by far the ability that caused the most feel-bads in my games (I killed an Ogor Tyrant full to dead before it could get off a big charge because it shot me with its pistol, for example). My most used orders were probably Advance in Formation and Counter Charge (which is great and super fun). I very rarely used Engage the Foe, because my list just does not make good use of it (it is great on Cavaliers), and I never once got Suppressing Fire off successfully.

My worst performance with the army was against Kruleboyz, who in many ways seem perfect to counter a magic-heavy shooting army between Gobsprakk hurting you on unbinds and Grinnin' Blades making units untargetable outside of 12". I also missed my Zenestra prayer the first 3 rounds of that game, so that sucked.

Some of my best moments came from me hitting a clutch Pall of Doom and disabling a key units with it. The Battlemage was really hit-or-miss, but the hits were really impactful: Shutting down Katakros, or essentially doubling the damage Fusiliers by forcing a huge battleshock loss. I also really enjoyed some fun interactions from Orders.

Final verdict, I guess, is that I enjoy how this army plays. Currently I feel it is a bit difficult to build the thematic list I have in mind. Running both Fusiliers and Tanks spreads you too thin, the current rules kind of incentivize you to go all-in on Tanks (even post nerf, due to battleline requirements) or run human goodstuff (previously with Fusiliers, now probably with Cavaliers). But that is set to change in 4th edition, so I am excited about that.

[Satyrical Sophist]

1 hour ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

I recently had my last league game with my Cities list. Just want to share my experience with the army because I probably won't run it again until 4th ed comes out.

Overall, I am happy with my performance in the games I have had. I went 3-3, but that doesn't necessarily reflect the actual performance of my list, which was Hallowheart Steam Tanks and Fusiliers. Two of the games I lost were lost to time in the 3rd round, after I had essentially already tabled my opponent. My games would frequently go a similar way: I would lose some points and my Steelhelm screens (sometimes Fusiliers) early, but keep my Steam Tanks and buff pieces alive into the late game, where I would clean up.

I had three games pre-nerf and three post. Pre-nerf, the list was absurd. I had a game against OBR where I basically shut them down from turn 1 and lost no units. I was punching well above my weight with the Alchtemite buff, taking on units that I honestly had no business beating. Fusiliers really were point-and-click, destroy a unit at that point, but Command Corps healing was also pretty insane. I frequently healed up a Steam Tank from its last legs back up to full in a turn.

Post nerf, things got a lot harder. Fusiliers definitely started to kind of suck. They still performed OK with the Master of Ballistics +1 to hit and wound, but their Unleash Hell became a lot worse. I believe the expected damage of Fusilier Unleash Hell is about 5 or so rend 1 wounds. Before the nerf, you could add about 7 mortals to that, which definitely changed the math a lot.

I find it hard to judge how strong the Cities allegiance abilities are. A lot of people in my play group continued to blunder into Counter Fire even after becoming aware of its existence. For those who remembered, it mostly just served to shut down small incidental shooting and made them position more carefully to avoid giving me a free shooting attack. Overall, I don't know how to feel about it. It is by far the ability that caused the most feel-bads in my games (I killed an Ogor Tyrant full to dead before it could get off a big charge because it shot me with its pistol, for example). My most used orders were probably Advance in Formation and Counter Charge (which is great and super fun). I very rarely used Engage the Foe, because my list just does not make good use of it (it is great on Cavaliers), and I never once got Suppressing Fire off successfully.

My worst performance with the army was against Kruleboyz, who in many ways seem perfect to counter a magic-heavy shooting army between Gobsprakk hurting you on unbinds and Grinnin' Blades making units untargetable outside of 12". I also missed my Zenestra prayer the first 3 rounds of that game, so that sucked.

Some of my best moments came from me hitting a clutch Pall of Doom and disabling a key units with it. The Battlemage was really hit-or-miss, but the hits were really impactful: Shutting down Katakros, or essentially doubling the damage Fusiliers by forcing a huge battleshock loss. I also really enjoyed some fun interactions from Orders.

Final verdict, I guess, is that I enjoy how this army plays. Currently I feel it is a bit difficult to build the thematic list I have in mind. Running both Fusiliers and Tanks spreads you too thin, the current rules kind of incentivize you to go all-in on Tanks (even post nerf, due to battleline requirements) or run human goodstuff (previously with Fusiliers, now probably with Cavaliers). But that is set to change in 4th edition, so I am excited about that.

With 4th being an index release I've been very much pausing all my cities stuff. I'm wanting to be hopeful, but there are a lot of variables. I'm a bit concerned that the magic lore choice might not support going mixed species very well. 

[Neil Arthur Hotep]

2 minutes ago, Satyrical Sophist said:

With 4th being an index release I've been very much pausing all my cities stuff. I'm wanting to be hopeful, but there are a lot of variables. I'm a bit concerned that the magic lore choice might not support going mixed species very well. 

I still have 10 Fusiliers waiting to be built and painted, but I am waiting for the indexes to see how I will do it (visually, 2x10 or 1x20 formation). For the time being, I am focused on getting a Spearhead ready, because that is for sure going to be useful to have.

But yeah, I am curious about what lists will look like, as well. My list is almost guaranteed to change, since I doubt after the changed to magic and subfactions, a list like current Hallowheart will still exist. There are also other changes that are no doubt coming. The Command Corps, for example, currently has battleshock mitigation on the Soul Shepard, but battleshock is not even in 4th edition.

I am definitely interested in the new rules. Maybe I will get to run the three Tank list I had originally planned this time around instead of having to compromise on two.

[Satyrical Sophist]

41 minutes ago, Neil Arthur Hotep said:

I still have 10 Fusiliers waiting to be built and painted, but I am waiting for the indexes to see how I will do it (visually, 2x10 or 1x20 formation). For the time being, I am focused on getting a Spearhead ready, because that is for sure going to be useful to have.

But yeah, I am curious about what lists will look like, as well. My list is almost guaranteed to change, since I doubt after the changed to magic and subfactions, a list like current Hallowheart will still exist. There are also other changes that are no doubt coming. The Command Corps, for example, currently has battleshock mitigation on the Soul Shepard, but battleshock is not even in 4th edition.

I am definitely interested in the new rules. Maybe I will get to run the three Tank list I had originally planned this time around instead of having to compromise on two.

Some of the rules changes look like they are much more adjustable than they used to be. Look at Rally. Before giving a 5+ rally was really good, and a 4+ insane. Now if they wanted they could give you +1 or +2 to the roll and it's capped in how much improvement. They could even make the surgeon give rally for free, or reroll failed rally rolls within whatever. I just hope they do the cool stuff