Rules that affect A unit or ANY unit

[Frozenbeast]

A question has been raised in other topics speaking about certain warscroll abilities that affect "a" unit (friend or foe), see skin wolves or hellstriders, and it was not clear whether in the presence of mutiple units with the same rule in range of activating the rule itself, the buff or debuff stack or not. E.g. skin wolves have a rule that says "units within 3" of A unit of skin wolves, have their bravery reduced by 1". Now, as per english grammar this means (correct me if I am wrong please) 1- evry unit within 3" is afdected and B- multiple unit of skin wolves can affect one enemy unit.

Now I don't recall any FAQ ruling this out (but if you do please can we have a link or a reference?)so if any of you guys can help out on this...would you go with the grammar? Meaning an ability saying "a" means the effect stacks if multiple abilities are in range and an ability saying "any" means it does not stack?

 

[BaldoBeardo]

1 hour ago, Frozenbeast said:

A question has been raised in other topics speaking about certain warscroll abilities that affect "a" unit (friend or foe), see skin wolves or hellstriders, and it was not clear whether in the presence of mutiple units with the same rule in range of activating the rule itself, the buff or debuff stack or not. E.g. skin wolves have a rule that says "units within 3" of A unit of skin wolves, have their bravery reduced by 1". Now, as per english grammar this means (correct me if I am wrong please) 1- evry unit within 3" is afdected and B- multiple unit of skin wolves can affect one enemy unit.

Now I don't recall any FAQ ruling this out (but if you do please can we have a link or a reference?)so if any of you guys can help out on this...would you go with the grammar? Meaning an ability saying "a" means the effect stacks if multiple abilities are in range and an ability saying "any" means it does not stack?

 

I always read stuff like that as binary. Either you meet the condition or not.

E.g. "Is the unit within 3" of a unit of skinwolves" is the test - that's either a yes or a no. Multiples don't change the answer to more yes.

If yes, then you apply the effect, which is -1 bravery.

In situations where stuff does stack, the wording is typically "this unit", rather than "a unit".

#hellstridersdontstack

[Arkiham]

Pretty sure basically nothing stacks now unless it says this

this model

this unit 

[Sarkazim]

@Frozenbeast
I've really tried to stay out of these discussion because I still struggle with when to apply this as well.  Honestly the best answer you're going to get is 'On a Scroll by Scroll' basis.  My Dark Riders suffer from the same thing with their ability, and it's always a point of argument.  When it comes down to it, you really just need to ask your group, or if you plan on going to an event then it's ultimately up to the TO.  I believe this was recently done with the Cauldron of Blood.  The player cleared with the TO prior to the event and was very up front about it.  While it would be nice to have a clear cut answer for every unit out there so we could all be on the same page, they're just not there yet.
(Off Topic: I know the discussion is here on TGA somewhere, but can't recall it.  Maybe @Chris Tomlincan tell you since I believe it was his event?)

The 'Nothing Stacks unless X' scenario appears to be the more popular way to resolve things.  Just to throw a bit of a curve ball, we're instructed to resolve multiple abilities independently of each other.  
 

Quote

Q: If several units can use the same ability at the same time, must you say how many of them will use the ability before you carry it out? Or could you carry out the ability with one of the units, and wait to see the outcome before deciding whether the next unit uses the ability? ...
A: The latter – you carry out the ability one unit at a time, and can wait to see the result before moving onto the next unit. ...

Now the example given in the FAQ does only talk about assassins, and refers to an ability which isn't an Buff/Debuff, so doesn't have a lingering effect after it's resolved.  I like to think that this best explanation on why the Bloodshield stacks.  There are 2+ Cauldrons on the field, you pick one of the shield abilities, check it's conditions, and resolve it.  Then it's up to the Player to decide if he needs/wants to use the next one, and so on and so on.

This does muddy the waters a bit when it comes to some of the abilities where we are scratching our heads.  Like the Hellstriders Enrapturing Standard.  So you have 2 units with 'Enrapturing Banner'.  You pick one of them, then apply it granting the -1.  Then you get to the second unit, apply it and then do we get to apply it again?  We've met the criteria so why don't we get to apply another -1?  It's unclear.  So it goes back to a case by case basis.  In this case, common sense would have to kick in and think about what would happen if someone ran his entire army as Hellstriders?  He'd never be able to hit them in melee.  I'm aware that there are players out there who will try, or build their army to 'not abuse the rule too bad'.