TGCMactar Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 Hey guys so heres my skaven list so far... 20 stormvermin 1 Warlord 3 storm fiends what should i get next? and rip im pre sure that our store does matched play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayple Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 Do you like stormvermin? If so, more of those Which clan appeals the most to you? There are a number of really cool things to add, but your preference matters a lot in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGCMactar Posted September 15, 2017 Author Share Posted September 15, 2017 then what are the storm vermin or the storm fiends/ of of those 2 used for if i have to have them in 1 allegiance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayple Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 Both are battleline units only in their respetive allegiances. Stormfiends for skryre, stormvermin for verminus. If you want to field them both right now, you'd be in the chaos allegience, but would still need battleline units. Your alternatives are to either go 2000 points into Verminus, and ally in the unit of stormfiends and maybe a warlock (at 400 points, on the dot for 2000pts allies) - if so, your stormvermin becomes battleline, which is near. Clanrats would also work well here. Also consider the warlord on brood horror, amazing model with respectable stats. Verminlord warbringer is also in this allegiance. Or, you could go Skryre allegiance, and ally in a single unit (10 models) of stormvermin at 1000pts, or 20 models + Warlord at 2000pts. Your stormfiends become battleline in Skryre, and you get access to their command abilities and artifacts, which is really good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGCMactar Posted September 15, 2017 Author Share Posted September 15, 2017 thanks for the information! i think ill go with classic horde style of verminus over the lesser units more elite units skyre! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Clio Posted September 15, 2017 Share Posted September 15, 2017 Or just get three units of clanrats and then get skaven units from whatever clan you want. You'll be playing under "chaos" grand alliance then, but verminus doesnt have alliegance abilities anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGCMactar Posted September 15, 2017 Author Share Posted September 15, 2017 oh yeah! verminus doesn't have any of them! i haven't checked but skyre has it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayple Posted September 16, 2017 Share Posted September 16, 2017 Skryre has allegience abilities and artifacts (pestilens too) If you go verminus allegience, you can use chaos allegience abilities/artifacts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGCMactar Posted September 16, 2017 Author Share Posted September 16, 2017 is it still a legal list with the spire of dawn box? the skaven side Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Clio Posted September 16, 2017 Share Posted September 16, 2017 Spite of dawn gets you 2 battle line units of clanrats. Allowing you a legal 1k list for matched play. You'd need a third for 2k. It's a great deal, especially if you find someone to split it with. I used 3 halfs of that box to build up my own army. Got me all the clanrats I needed, and more for a ridiculously low price (for GW). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kugane Posted September 16, 2017 Share Posted September 16, 2017 5 hours ago, Professor Clio said: Spite of dawn gets you 2 battle line units of clanrats. Allowing you a legal 1k list for matched play. You'd need a third for 2k. It's a great deal, especially if you find someone to split it with. I used 3 halfs of that box to build up my own army. Got me all the clanrats I needed, and more for a ridiculously low price (for GW). I speak from experience sadly, I been trying to get a hold of some spire of dawn boxes for the sake of converting some rats. They are practically impossible to buy now, especially since GW took it off their website a short while before the General's Handbook 2017 release. I had to opt and get 2 Island of Blood boxes (priced 80 euro per box without any round bases). I guess they really want to sell those 30 euro clanrat boxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted September 17, 2017 Share Posted September 17, 2017 12 hours ago, Kugane said: I speak from experience sadly, I been trying to get a hold of some spire of dawn boxes for the sake of converting some rats. They are practically impossible to buy now, especially since GW took it off their website a short while before the General's Handbook 2017 release. I had to opt and get 2 Island of Blood boxes (priced 80 euro per box without any round bases). I guess they really want to sell those 30 euro clanrat boxes. I just saw 2 spire of dawn boxes on ebay for 75 us each. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kugane Posted September 17, 2017 Share Posted September 17, 2017 15 hours ago, Flood said: I just saw 2 spire of dawn boxes on ebay for 75 us each. I see! I have been trying to get some in europe and couldn't find a single seller. I would have loved some 75 euro boxes haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted September 18, 2017 Share Posted September 18, 2017 4 hours ago, Kugane said: I see! I have been trying to get some in europe and couldn't find a single seller. I would have loved some 75 euro boxes haha. 75 USD is actually 63 euro :o. Even cheaper! Thats shipped too! I actually thought about getting some just for the rat ogres. Rat ogres are too expensive otherwise :(. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGCMactar Posted September 20, 2017 Author Share Posted September 20, 2017 what if i go the 3 storm fiends 20 stormvermin and spire of dawn skaven side. Is it legal and if so which allegiance would it be in? sry if one of you answered this just wanna be clear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiblams Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 The Spire of Dawn contains: - 1 Skaven Warlord (Verminus) - 1 Warlock Engineer (Skryre) - 1 Packmaster (Moulder) - 2 units of 20 Clanrats (Verminus) - 2 Rat Ogors (Moulder) - 1 Poisoned Wind Mortar Weapon Team (Skryre) - 1 Warpfire Thrower Weapon Team (Skryre) and your planned purchases: Storm fiends (Skryre and Moulder) Stormvermin (Verminus) This put you in a very odd position in terms on having a clan specific army. You have a whole mix of clans in there, which cover the following requirements for legal lists: Moulder - 1x Leader - Packmaster 1x Battleline - Rat Ogors Skryre - 1x Leader - Warlock Engineer 1x Battleline - Storm Fiends Verminus - 1x Leader - Skaven Warlord 3x Battleline - Stormvermin and Clan rats So it seems that you are actually best suited after buying all that to go Verminus and try to ally in other units... not ideal. or you could go Skryre, but that will need more Storm Fiends or some Acolytes. I was going to suggest going mixed skaven, but it seems that Clan rats are no longer battleline for that which is crazy! Hope that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 36 minutes ago, kiblams said: The Spire of Dawn contains: - 1 Skaven Warlord (Verminus) - 1 Warlock Engineer (Skryre) - 1 Packmaster (Moulder) - 2 units of 20 Clanrats (Verminus) - 2 Rat Ogors (Moulder) - 1 Poisoned Wind Mortar Weapon Team (Skryre) - 1 Warpfire Thrower Weapon Team (Skryre) and your planned purchases: Storm fiends (Skryre and Moulder) Stormvermin (Verminus) This put you in a very odd position in terms on having a clan specific army. You have a whole mix of clans in there, which cover the following requirements for legal lists: Moulder - 1x Leader - Packmaster 1x Battleline - Rat Ogors Skryre - 1x Leader - Warlock Engineer 1x Battleline - Storm Fiends Verminus - 1x Leader - Skaven Warlord 3x Battleline - Stormvermin and Clan rats So it seems that you are actually best suited after buying all that to go Verminus and try to ally in other units... not ideal. or you could go Skryre, but that will need more Storm Fiends or some Acolytes. I was going to suggest going mixed skaven, but it seems that Clan rats are no longer battleline for that which is crazy! Hope that helps. Where did you get that clanrats are no longer battle line? They are battle line for chaos grand alliance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiblams Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 2 hours ago, Flood said: Where did you get that clanrats are no longer battle line? They are battle line for chaos grand alliance. [Picture] Ah, I've just checked my GHB and that is indeed correct... the Azyr app needs some serious work as I chose Skaven and they didn't show and that confused me Thanks for the correction! Mixed Chaos/skaven is going to be the best bet for the OP then I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 7 hours ago, TGCMactar said: what if i go the 3 storm fiends 20 stormvermin and spire of dawn skaven side. Is it legal and if so which allegiance would it be in? sry if one of you answered this just wanna be clear Spire of dawn side will only give you 40 clanrats unfortunately. If you want to play at any point level beyond 1000 points, you need 60 at minimum (3 battleline, minimum unit size is 20). If you play at 1000 points, then the spire of dawn set will be OK as you only need 2 battle line. In regards to your allegiance, you are mixing all of skaven you have no specific allegiance. Your allegiance is the generic "grand alliance chaos" so you can only use the generic chaos traits and artefacts, which arent all that bad actually. To me, its worth using the generic traits/artefacts to be able to mix stuff up in terms of units. This also allows you to bring in some other units that help out skaven, like a chaos sorcerer lord. I suggest a quick read through applicable parts of the generals handbook 2017, then get go on warscroll builder and play around with making lists. List building is actually pretty fun! Hope that helps, and good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 I plugged what you posted into warscroll builder. It comes out at 1350 points, so you would in fact need a 3rd battleline, so the list is illegal. Furthermore, this is a pretty oddball point value, as most people play at 2000 points, 1500 points, or 1000 points. You either need to cut 350 points or add 150 points in the form of battleline. What you can do is add a third unit of clanrats. That will put you at 1470 points. Close enough! Skavenlist2.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kugane Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 1 hour ago, Flood said: Spire of dawn side will only give you 40 clanrats unfortunately. If you want to play at any point level beyond 1000 points, you need 60 at minimum (3 battleline, minimum unit size is 20). If you play at 1000 points, then the spire of dawn set will be OK as you only need 2 battle line. In regards to your allegiance, you are mixing all of skaven you have no specific allegiance. Your allegiance is the generic "grand alliance chaos" so you can only use the generic chaos traits and artefacts, which arent all that bad actually. To me, its worth using the generic traits/artefacts to be able to mix stuff up in terms of units. This also allows you to bring in some other units that help out skaven, like a chaos sorcerer lord. I suggest a quick read through applicable parts of the generals handbook 2017, then get go on warscroll builder and play around with making lists. List building is actually pretty fun! Hope that helps, and good luck! You need more towards 120 minimum, due to groups of 20 being a big waste. Also half of the spire of dawn units have handweapons, which is sub optimal unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 2 hours ago, Kugane said: You need more towards 120 minimum, due to groups of 20 being a big waste. Also half of the spire of dawn units have handweapons, which is sub optimal unfortunately. Ya im just trying to help him make a legal list, not optimize it. He cant even play as of now. May as well get something together that allows him to put something on the board, then optimize later. In fact, a lot of spire of dawn isn't great. 2 rat ogres are not that good. Maybe in a unit of 6, but even then rat ogres are suboptimal in and of themselves, not to mention the "i cant hit a darn thing other than myself" poison wind mortar. And about the hand weapons. I know spears are better on average, but the hand weapons have been ok for me because i just use them as tar pits anyway. Although i modelled these in 8th edition, and back then hands weapons were the way to go. I dont feel like chopping off 120 arms and painting 120 spears lol. Ill make due with this. But i do agree. If i had to do it over, id do spears. It probably wouldn't make a big difference, but they look cooler with spears . To the OP. If you can afford to buy units individually and forget spire of dawn, that would be best. Kugane is right for sure. Your best bet is to run as many stormfiends and/or stormvermin and 2x warp lightning cannons. You can include verminlords (avoiding the curropter) for extra strength and support. This is expensive though, so if you don't have money burning a hole in your pocket, then spire of dawn is fine. Just dont expect to be "competitive." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGCMactar Posted September 21, 2017 Author Share Posted September 21, 2017 isnt the maximum for allies 400 in the new handbook? and if not you can have more than 1 different factions as allies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riavan Posted September 21, 2017 Share Posted September 21, 2017 I just mix the units of hand weapons up with the spears and claim they are all spears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted September 21, 2017 Share Posted September 21, 2017 50 minutes ago, TGCMactar said: isnt the maximum for allies 400 in the new handbook? and if not you can have more than 1 different factions as allies? Again, you are not under any allegiance, so you arent actually using any allies. Allies are to be able to branch out of a faction without breaking a specific subcategorical allegiance. such as "clan skryre" or "slaves to darkness." If you have no allegiance, you can use whatever your heart desires under chaos grand alliance. You can throw in plague bearers and blood warriors and archaon if you want. You are under the generic, non allied, grand alliance cbaos. You use the generic grand alliance chaos traits and artefacts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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