Doko

yes,but is hard do mix races list to take the max of the new orders and also battletactics that need human,dwarf,elfs for diferents and same time use the conditional battlelines. but yes,i have started to do lists and i usually bring allways one tax of stellhems to unlock fusiliers as line and so i can bring 30 fusiliers and not only 20

fyreslayers are the worst army rigth now. oh and also your example,a figth of 15hgb(480) against 20 chaos warriors(400) gonna win the chaos warriors allways if they attack first and even going second win chaos warrior also only for clarify: 15 hgb 480 points(lets ignore the hero cost) 30 wounds with 5save and ward 4 26'5 rend 1 damage 20 chaos warriors 400 points(and a sorcerer that we ignore because cost as the dwarf hero) 40 wounds save 3 and ward with mortals 55'5 rend 1 damage(with khorne mark,his +1 attack +1 hit and wound from sorcerer) so if chaos warriors attack first do 18'5after save wounds killing half of the dwarfs unit if dwarfs attack first they do 13 after save wounds to chaos killing only 6 models. so you can see that for 80 less points the chaos warriors win the figth by a huge margin

this book have a problem, all the battlelines are useless. the steelhelms are skinks but expensiver the elfs are the same the dwarf are maybe the best option,but 130 for the battleline tax is expensive. so the units that you mention have two uses,one use them to give the +2 cast to sorcerer(we gonna play 2 or 3 sorcerers so we gonna need corpses) and second to refill the battleline tax. yes they are bad,overcosted and useless,but the other option are the steelhelms that are horrible also or pay 40 more points for longbeards. the darkshards i cant tell you nothing good,they are bad and umplayables,only 6'6 no rend damage for 120 and 10 wounds save5 cost 90/100 and not 120 but i gonna use mine darkshard as bleak swords(i built them as darkshards but i glued in the back the shield with the lance similar style to seaguard of old elfs)

after study the book i am pretty happy in general(i am usually pretty pesimist as you know) have some bad and good things. BAD things: -mixed races are gone,every buff is locked to a race and coalitions are gone also -internal balance is horrible,per example all the dwarfs are useless(i think i never have seen a warscroll so bad in entire aos as the gyrocopter)but then the hammerers are great,or the basic elfs are horrible but the elite elfs are great,the human artillery,the stellhelms and the ogre are horribles but the cavalry and foot shootings are good -the battle tactics are horrible and almost imposible to do -the book could have been named humas of sigmar and not cities because the 99% of the content is only humans -they have deleted the 90% of buffs,auras,alegiance skills,reliks etc also the sub factions are almost useless and dont give nothing. so it is pretty boring to do list and change things because we havent options. good things: -the book have pretty potent magic that is great this edition(a sorcerer with +4 casting gonna be great) -every race have build: -dwarfs have a damage bomb with the hammerers(sadly dwarfs got the worst balance and they are useless) -humans have two options,use the foot shooters with mortals with 6 or the bomb of cavaliers together the hero on horse to attack first and +1 atk -elfs are the winners of the book,the blackguard is the best defensive unit of the book,the executioners are also the best damage unit of the book(better than hammerers),the sorcerer is the best mage of the book,ohhhh and have the best combo of entire book that nobody seems have seen,the pirates for only 90 points buffed with the elf hero and the spell of elfs that make a unit ignore saves dish out 12'5 mortals wounds(ignore save that is as mortals),so a unit of only 270 points(30 pirates) dish out 37 mortals wounds that is insane! also have the combo of cavalry rerolling charges with the dragons while the carriot is doing 6 mortals when charge -now that we have lost almost every buff and aura of the old book we dont have to play castle builds and we have more freedom while playing. in general i think the book have potential to be competitive,in special the elfs are very good and the pirates bomb is maybe too much good but the problem are the battle tactics that are horrible and even if the book is competitive maybe dont win tournaments due to bad scoring due to these battle tactics

if you are counting on the ward4 then ironbreakers cost 230 because they need a dwarf hero to gives them the ward how is posible 10 wounds with save 3 and 6,6 no rend damage must cost 150 but saurius guard for 180 points have 20 wounds with save 3 and 8,8 rend1 damage ironbreackers are horrible now that we have lost every buff as +1 atk +1 wounds etc and have stats of 100 points unit. oh the ward4 is a faction rule,if you want start that direction we can compare to slanesh units with ward5 of his faction

seems all the dwarfs have got huge nerfs,only the hammerers have got a buff. runelord: lost the +2 to dispell,lost the ward6 prayer,the rend prayer got deleted with a huge nerf and now have gone of 2+ to 4+ and dont work for ranged.Umplayable for 100 points score:4/10 dwarfking: lost the +1 attack and inmune to moral,now only a damagestick that dont buff(only the joke grudge that is useless).umplayable for 110(even at 80 would be bad)score: 2/10 enginer:useless and only gives comanda to copters 0/10 gyrocopter:nerfed into the oblivion and the flamer now is only around 3 no rend damage for 90 points.umplayable even if would cost 60 but 90 is a joke score:0/10 gyrobomber:have half damage than every archer unit(4,4 rend 1 damage) and the bomb,is overcosted with 120 when must cost around 90 score:5/10 ironbreackers: got a big nerf in points and almost no change,they are pretty useless if we take in account that for same cost longbeards with shields are a upgrade score:3/10 longbeards:got a huge nerf into his buffs,lost all the buffs as the +1 wound but now got big buff to his damage score: with shield 6/10 with 2 hand axe 7/10 hammerers:rigth now need a faq because havent leader or music,lost the inmune moral and the mortals wound but got huge buffs in damage score 9/10 irondrakes: got huge nerfs,lost the +1 save to shooting,lost the +1 rend of runelord,lost the +1 wound of longbeards,need dont move to do the same damage than every other unit as reaver or slanesh blisbarbs but cost the same. score 3/ 10

by the way seems they have forgot the captain/music of the hammerers dwarfs

both got huge nerfs. hurricanum: -now dont have the 3d3 mortals,its only a dice per round,so until round 3 gonna do worse than old(and games end in the first two rounds) -the aura got destroyed,now it is only humans,also got nerfed the range and went of models within to unit wholy within -lost the aura of +1 cast so if hurricanum dont get a HUGE reduction in cost(to 200 or so) gonna be ****** the luminark allways have been bad and now is worse even,lost the aura of -1 castings,nerf to his range of ward6 also and again only for humans. add to this that wards dont stack and humans gonna have the ward5 of the new priest and then is obvious that hurricanum is better even if we dont know the points

i dont know if im getting the idea and how gw think; in 4 years since cities launch never have been competitive the melle dwarfs(only some time was used the irondrakes with bridge). and now they mega ultra nerf into the oblivion the dwarfking? old:+1 aoe atack and inmune leadership buble new: nothing,only a useless grudge skill that is a 1/3 of a +1 hit also the longbeard losing the +1 wound so,gw balance team think that if dwarfs have been bad for 4 years the fix is nerf them even more? only with this nerf to lomgbeards and king we have lost +1 atack +1 wound inmune leadership bubble that is HUGE for sure seeing this i can hope that the runelord now have lost the +1 rend prayer for somethimg useless also. clasical gw nerfing into the umplayable the old units so we must get the new models if we want can try play

karl franz would be also great in the vanguard,the mini is gorgeous(better than the new humans for many of us) and the box art would be great with a big miniature. i also i would love if it have a steam tank,i never got one because for me it is overpriced in money for the amount of plastic and how small it is,but if it is inside a box with disscount i would get it

we have bits showed in the article that havent been showed the unit yet, as the big two handed axe with two full armored hands. very posible the new elite foot unit that replace the greatsword unit

i have city of sigmar that all overlap(mostly 3k points of dwarfs) and soulbligth that also are vampire counts. i gonna keep them with ovals because wont have problem to use them as blocks of unit in tow with ovals

i am not a expert on slaves but........i think they are the army with more and best buffs in the game. i think they can get rally4,+hit,wound and save,+attacks and a huge etc etc first chaos warrior dont have war,but it is better than that, chaos warrior are 20 wounds with save 3 vs hgb 10 wounds with save 5 and ward4, in mathammer the ward4 is the same than double the wounds,so i said hgb have 20 wounds,because 10 wounds with ward 4 in practice is the same than 20 wounds without ward. so yes chaos warriors have better in everything and by mathammer they are also better even with that extra 40 points(in fact to be balanced hgb cost is 130 and chaos warrior 220) also seems i wasnt pesimist,we have allready 3 weeks of data with new general hamdbook and fyreslayers are at the botton with 35% win rate...........

i get it,but i was speaking about the last edition of fantasy models,almost all the actual fantasy models in aos are from around 2012/2013 that is only 1 or 2 years older than first stormcast,ironjaws,fyreslayers,aylvaneths etc so if the reason to remove these fantasy kits is because they are old,then that same reasoning get us to that all these launch armys of aos must be deleted 1 or 2 years later than delete the fantasy kits no? because in 1 or 2 years they gonna have the same years lived that these fantasy kit if they are removed now.

i started to play 7 years ago,and i knew all that but even then i started a general order army of 100% buyed new and not recycled of fantasy models: 20 longbeards 30 hammerers 30irondrakes 30 ironbreackers 20 dwarf warriors 2 dwarkings 3 runelords 2 gyrocopter/bomber 2 dragonlords 1 archmage 1 loremaster 5 wild ryders i knew that these models wasnt going to get more units or attention of gw(but i really i didnt think that they were to delete any of these after the purge of fantasy to aos neither) but im a old player that dont like the new aos models but love the old fantasy models. so i wanted play aos but i didnt liked the aos models,so i got the old fantasy models i dont get the persons that want the old fantasy units deleted of aos,whats their problem? rigth now if some players dislikes aos armys because they are too much weirds(vengolorian lord,teclis,flying fishs etc) but love fantasy models as dispossesed or bonesplitters can play to aos with these fantasy armys. if they remove fantasy models then these players wont play to aos and aos gonna loose some playerbase. so why delete these fantasy units? rigth now all are plus for aos and gw if they keep them. to save room? everything is direct sale of fantasy so they dont get any room to keep them. i really i dont see whats the problem with keep old fantasy units but i see many problems if they delete them

lol the increase in points is the lesser of the nerfs that we got and also if you read my post,i allready said that our best lists gonna be magma spam and grimwrath spam. the biggest nerf is the atack in two ranks gone that absolutely destroy and kill any build with vulkites,and without vulkites then the flamekepeer is useless also because it isnt worth it buff it with hearthguards. btw the solid core of troops with ward save are the hearthguard? because if it is..............there are many persons in competitive groups allready rolling on the floor of how heck hearthguard got a nerf but chaos warrior a buff and saurus warriors. hearthguards are a joke if we compare them to chaos warriors or saurus warriors and only cost 20 and 40 more points, heck they have save 3 and not 5, and also 20 wounds allways and not only when wholy withing6" and the hearthguard have 8,8 damage when chaos warrior have 12 damage and a big etc. hearthguards must cost 140 and even then they would be terrible in competitive due to the joke wholy within6 ward that is too much punishing

yes both saurus and chaos warriors have: 20 wounds with save 3(saurus not allways and it is 4+1) have 8,8 rend 1 damage(saurus also extra 3 mortals with bytes) cost 180/200 but our liberators per example a unit of 10 cost 220 than is more and have same wounds and save but less damage. liberators must cost around 90 points and vindictors 90 also

thanks! that makes it easier and i get it know,it isnt so bad as i tougth then

i dont get how work the new atack when die. per example as i read it: vulkites attack to a unit that does mortals wounds when models die as zombi or magadroths. 1-vulkites attack an kill a bunch of enemy 2-then the enemy does mortal wounds back and kill 5 vulkites that attack when die 3-enemy active the unit and kill 15 vulkites 4-these 15 vulkites died cant attack because this unit allready used attack when die one time before? or other situation: 1-vulkites are in combat with two units(a and b) 2-vulkites attack 3-unit A attack and kill 10 vulkites that attack when die 4-unit B attack and kill 20 vulkites that cant attack when die because allready used attack when die one time? plz as work the rule,im confused

for their stats some models are far yet even after so many reduces in cost as: yndrasta 220 karazai 400 krondys 450

seems we are back to botton tier next season. every competitive build used vulkites and the flamekeeper. now that atack in two rows have been deleted the vulkites come back to be useless and umplayables in block of 30 and also the nerf to atack when die..... so now that vulkites are useless and auric continue being the worst unit in entire aos then we only have hearthguard as playable unit but even then they got a nerf. i dont get who is the genious in gw that think a unit with 8,8 damage rend1 as hearthguard cost 160 but other units with same damage as idoneth thralls cost 120. i know i usually i am pretty negative but i hope im wrong,but i think this season our best(and even our best gonna be low middle tier) list gonna be the spam grimwrath heroe with one or two unit of vulkites to use to give look out sir to the heroes and the magmadroth spam list.

oh also fyreslayers got other two extra nerfs. now vulkites attack when die got a huge nerf flamekeeper hability got other huge nerf and now only affect models died by attacks or habilitys and not every model died. so if it isnt enougth be a army without mages,have vulkites with base 30 and only 1" range,and also a middle tier army with only nerfs in points,now also extra nerfs to habilitys also......

zombies are useless now and must have got a decrease and not increase, now they only do mortals if the zombi is wholy within 3" making umplayable units of 20+ zombis

this edition with mages being broken,atack two ranks gone etc i hope for reductions to fyreslayers but we got increases when almost everyone got decrease......makes sense. how is posible a unit as hearthguard berzerkers with 8,8 rend1 damage cost 160 but other similar units as idoneths thralls for 120 have 14+ rend1 damage or even seraphons saurius,have same 8,8 rend1 but extra damage with mortals of bites,have 20 wounds(that is the same than 10 wounds with 4++)that is the same than hearthguard but without the wholy within 6" of fyreslayers, AND have save3 and not save 5 as hearthguard for only 20 points. and his other version with poleaxes in worse even,160 points for 3,3 mortals???? even the nerfed black knigths have same 3,3 mortals for 130 points or lumineths archers for same 160 points do same 3 mortals but at 36" and not melle,is a joke...... hearthguards berzerkers had to cost less but got increase and vulkites now that cant atack two ranks are u playables but got zero changes. but armys at the lvl or better than fyreslayer as khorne,slanesh,ogres,goblins,lumineths,idoneths,seraphons got huge buffs and fyreslayers only increases? as allways gw dont know math and in 3 months when fyreslayers have 30 win rate they gonna then reduce every unit quoting goonhamer that write better than me about fyreslayers changes: Why? Points increases. Because Fyreslayers were doing really well, apparently? Also, the only army to receive only increases without any decreases meaning many other armies are squeezing in more units. Battlesmiths and Hearthguard Berzerkers are up 10 points each to 160, and each Invocation has increased either 10 or 20 points. The Invocations do give an incredibly easy Grand Strategy to score, sure, but they’re not that strong for what they do compared to many endless spells.

it isnt 8, you are forgetting that new kits are new warcrolls also. so per example the new weird ogre thing is a new scroll that dont replace nothing old,so if we add this new scroll one old scroll must be deleted. citys gonna get cut 8 scrolls yes,but in truth gonna be 8+ the new warscrolls that dont replace old scrolls. per example if we get other 5 new kits with new scrolls that gonna be 5 old scrolls removed in top of the 8 i dont know if i am explaining it well. we had 62 old scrolls before now gonna have in total 54 but of these only (random number here) 30 are old scrolls and then 24 are the new humans scrolls. so in total we got 32 scrolls removed and not 8 the numbers are random but i dont know if you get my point