NauticalSoup
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Posts posted by NauticalSoup
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@PlasticCraic It's a great article! Your review is what compelled me to expand into Big Waaagh! in the first place. I now have the minis to play Bonesplitterz but I haven't actually done so yet, more out of laziness than anything.
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This all tracks. I suppose then it would stand to reason you'd get more mileage out of them in a Bonesplittaz list especially with the relevant allegiance, when you can't just slot in Gore-gruntas.
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I doubt it would change much. They'd be slightly more efficient in their 10-man configuration. They'd still have garbage bravery, be super fragile, annoying slow and have no warscroll abilities of note.
It's also worth noting that Evocators should always be built with exclusively grandstaffs and zero of the other weapon. They're better against virtually everything, even stuff with good saves.
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I would search for the 'bossfist' in this thread, I recall the two new battalions were discussed at some length.
In short they're both pretty gimmicky and require you buy into a lot of minis that most people will otherwise probably not recommend. Multiple Megabosses and lots of Brutes.
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@NikitaCrab132 @PlasticCraic @Bululu
I've seen a fair number of lists that have a single minimum size squad of boar boys to satisfy battle-line requirements after they've got their big blobs sorted. I haven't really tested it because my boar boys are as-yet unbuilt, but I would think that with a difference of only 10 points at minimum size boar boys can do a lot more work for you than a too-small chaff squad of savage orruks.
Maybe I'm wrong though. They do look nice, however.
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Consideration: it looks like you're using one of the 32mm bases the fyreslayer came with. Ironbreakers are just 1W models and are on 25s. Not sure what you're planning to use them army for, but that's a pretty big base size difference. Big enough to be... concerning.
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10 hours ago, jhamslam said:
They could honestly condense so much stuff it isnt even funny.
Like Retributors, Protectors and Decimators should just be one Warscroll - Paladins
Protectors, Fulminators and Tempestors should be one warscroll - Dracothion Guard
If they reeeeallly wanted to? They could put liberators and judicators into one warscroll with different weapon options, since theyre both battleline.
Most of the useless battalions could be condensed to 2-3 battalions per chamber instead of having all these unnecessary mega battalions.
And so on
While I fundamentally agree with the notion, It'll never happen because they don't want to rebox stuff and current GW seems to care about having discrete unit names from a marketing perspective. They don't even clearly list dual-kits on their website, you basically have to already understand this practice to figure it out.
Seems like they're going down the road of SKU hell like they did with fantasy before, though. Stormcast is already bloated with a ton of redundant unit choices and kits. Can't be good for sales.
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Now that we've seen the new figures I'm hyped. I know a lot of people are probably disappointed by the fact that it's a single kit, or the adherence to the visual design cues of the old WHFB giant/aleguzzler, but what we've got is exactly to my taste. Gargants being allies in all GAs is just icing.
Me and my best bud have destruction armies and we're planning to collaborate on a shared Gargants army either to augment what we already have or to play solo. All that's left is to see how the rules fall!
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1 hour ago, Aryann said:
I don't like that giants can be taken by any army. They loose their uniqeness.
You could find giants in a variety of armies for pretty much their entire history until quite recently. Also, this is actually more unique, no? Being confined to a narrow allegiance like every other faction wouldn't be unique at all, it would be bog standard for AoS.
Also, gonna be that guy - it's lose not loose.
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31 minutes ago, PlasticCraic said:
I've written an article that you guys might be interested in 👍
Love your articles! Looking forward to more Gargant related content in the future, your coverage of the Orruk Warclans book is what really got me into AoS.
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2 minutes ago, Fastner said:
Hey all,
New to AoS and looking to get into Warclans. Found a lot of answers to my various questions about the faction here but one thing that I'm still not certain of is the optimal weapon breakdown for Brutes. Can't figure out if it's worth taking a Gore-choppa upgrade or just sticking with the pair of choppas, and what to take on the Boss Brute.
- Most people seem to take the gore-choppa. It's more efficient before you get the warchanter buff, but then you won't always have the buff. Might as well take it. Also it has 2" range. I'd take the gore-choppa.
- Give the boss the claw.
- The optimal weapon for brutes is actually the hacka when you take more than 5 of them and most of the lists for those few people who have attempted to use brutes at the comp level seem to emphasize the unit of 10, which would play to its only strength over the Ardboy, the ability to concentrate attacks on a small patch of real estate. As an SCE player, I can tell you that 40mm bases are a ****** without 2" weapons.
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2 hours ago, Grudgebearer said:
Hey guys,
I‘ve skimmed through the latest tournament results and it seems that SCE are not in the best spot on a competitive level at the Moment, has anyone of you had some good success with stormcasts lately and what are the current go to lists for competitive play?
Thanks in advance for your help
Usually it's a block of 9-ish Vanguard-Raptors with Longstrikes and a couple squads of Aetherwings. Liberators as battleline because everything else is too expensive. Sometimes Evokitties to smash things. Not a heck of a lot of variety. Mostly it's just build around the Vanguard-Raptors and shoot them twice a turn while avoiding letting them get charged.
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@ccconner777 Is 2" of move on a fast flying unit REALLY worth giving up a sizable chunk of extra damage? If you're planning to MD move it up first turn anyway I dunno if you'll find the extra bit of range all that necessary.
Also I'll say it because someone's going to - 6 gore-gruntas is the magic number coupled with a warchanter buff. And even with hackas 15 brutes will struggle to pile in and fight if they don't take any casualties. Conveniently, an(other) Ironjawz SC box consists exclusively of models that would be good additions to that army.
And it's worth keeping in mind you can't call an Ironjawz Waaagh! if a Megaboss isn't your general. This may not matter if you're suiciding it up the board turn one just worth remembering.
Personally I'll always prefer the double big guy combo in Big Waaagh! cuz Bonezplitterz just have so many ways to buff the idol. Giving it speed and flight buff feels almost necessary to make the two of them work in tandem.
One last thought - the teleport is probably more useful for its threat than anything because it'll fail too often to plan around. +2 to cast isn't bad but we're not approaching Big Waaagh! and Bonesplitterz levels of cast bonuses. It'll suck if you whiff it and your opponent snipes the Weirdnob leaving your huge block of Brutes to wander up the field on foot, which even with a free MD every turn will take... a while.
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@Marcoangelo33 Fully built. First because it meant I could start using them in games immediately, but also because there's a bit of work in getting them to stand properly with the very loose 'contact' fits of the hands on the stabba. I usually only bother with subassemblies where the fully constructed model will make it difficult/impossible to reach spaces, especially with an airbrush, I didn't find it necessary with big stabbas with the spear stuck pretty far out and the orcs not packed closely together.
Actually I don't think I sub-assembled a single Savage Orruk unit, come to think of it... the way they all have their arms held up makes them pretty convenient to paint as one big chunk.
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7 hours ago, Aezeal said:
I read just what you say (not much knowledge about the soecific warscrolls otherwise)
I understand means internal balance is suboptimal between battleline and non battleline, and while battle line is supposed to be a bit of a tax it's more than average in this army).
However being the cheapest battle line in a given army is apparently a huge thing in this case making them better than the other choices. Not having cheap speedbumps and cheap battle line is a design choice I think. It represents the eliteness(?) Of the army .. an army which has an otherwise broad choice of units and tactics I'd like to point out.
That's the idea - problem is it's wrong. SCE units aren't actually elite and are almost universally understatted for their price and base size. There's a reason that nearly every tournament SCE list is a carbon copy! Just peek into the SCE discussion for a couple hundred pages of forlorn sighs and angry rants if you don't take my word for it.
The Liberator would probably be in the running for the only viable troops choice even if you took away it's weapons and armour save - it can be the shittiest unit in the book and still be the only viable option purely on points. Which definitely qualifies it for a discussion as one of the worst warscrolls around.
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4 hours ago, Aezeal said:
If they are still used that much they ain't that bad. The other battleline options are obviously worse if you pick libs over them.
They're used because they're the cheapest way to meet your battleline requirements - your average SCE player will assume it's just a mandatory 300 point tax for playing SCE, and that the only thing they'll accomplish if you're lucky is to eat a charge and die. They serve no other purpose except being an overpriced speed bump. Sure, the other options will do more work, but they all require more investment which instantly writes them off. I've seen the case made that if Sequitors were 110 points and default battleline you would still take the Liberators because every point spent on a unit that isn't Raptors or Evokitties is a point wasted.
That's the absolute state of SCE right now.
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Looks like I was correct - the preview suggests gargants will closely follow the thematic and visual cues of the existing giant model.
Makes perfect sense for making the faction feel cohesive and honestly I'm VERY glad. I like WHFB giants, if they were super 'sigmary' or had a totally distinct design I'd be a lot less enthusiastic than I am!
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There's no requirement to use either Arrowboys or Stikkas, one of the strongest Big Waaagh! lists floating around atm, Dalton Copeland's, uses a full block of 30 each.
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1 hour ago, Fellman said:
Most new armes ar based on a mixup of historc cultures. Wath do you think Sones of Bermhat wil be based on and what are your hopes? Im holding my thumbs for old Skandinavien gigants
But they aren't really a 'new' army, are they? They'll almost certainly be intended to mesh with the visual style of the extant giant model. AoS armies are considerably more homogeneous in their design flavour than Warhammer Fantasy armies.
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1 hour ago, Lanoss said:
The sheer damage output of a unit (at any size) outweighs Ardboys imo. people can throw averages out but the performance on the board really shows their strengths.
Pages and pages of this thread have been devoted to this discussion already - if you want to use Brutes that's cool, but point for point they can't outperform Ardboys in pretty much any category. They don't have any useful warscroll abilities (unlike Ardboys) so their performance on board, as you put it, pretty much just amounts to the math.
I think the one corner-case was a ten man unit with hackas which can bring slightly more power to bear on a slightly more concentrated patch of real estate - which incidentally is EXACTLY what GGs do. It probably goes without saying they're better at it.
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The humble Liberator is always my go-to for a bad unit. They're understatted, their shields suck, they have no banners or drummers, they have terrible bravery, their weapons hit like a wet noodle and they are totally barren of useful warscroll abilities. And SCE is still required to shove in 15 of the goobers because they're the only moderately affordable battleline. They also have no reach weapons despite their heug bases, which means that as soon as you go above minimum size they'll struggle to pile in and fight (not that they'd do much damage even if they could).
You're left with an overpriced minimum size screening unit that punches down and melts to even the most pathetic overtures of aggression. They're a tax on any SCE list and while any unit can serve as a speed bump, they're a particularly expensive and unimpressive speed bump even by speed bump standards.
I actually wonder if after more than a year of battletome releases anyone still has to suffer a battleline as awful as the Liberator.
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11 hours ago, cplhicks said:
I'm new to the Ironjawz side of things. Is the Jagged Gore Hakkas the best choice for Goregruntas?
People use both the choppas and the hackas. The hakkas perform better in situations where you haven't taken losses and are fighting in a bottleneck. If you take losses before your big charge or if you can fit them all in the choppas perform better. I prefer the robustness of the choppas, personally. Also in Big Waaagh! the choppas benefit a lot more from the +1/+1 maths since the hacka charge bonus is reduntant and the extra attacks is better.
Either is probably fine though.
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19 hours ago, Latty said:
Have any Bonesplitterz playerz undertaken the task of magnetizing their orruks? I started on a box today and it is quite the time consuming process... And then I look over and see all the extra weapons to paint now
The time and effort required had me just buying more. I can't really imagine every deploying more than the 20/20/20 Kunnin' Ruck or the 30/30 Big Waaagh! standard package anyway so there didn't seem to be any tangible benefit to magnetization.
Also since they're all flesh the seams from magnetization would probably make them look a lot worse.
AoS 2 - Orruk Warclans Discussion
in Destruction
Posted
Interesting. In my experience small points games are pretty unpopular in Sigmar thanks to the way close combat is structured. At 1k you can't bake in sufficient screening so the guy who gets off the first good charge will probably just win.