Phasteon

My unpopular opinion: There is no „competitive“ vs „casual/narrative/fluffy“ List. There are just competitive vs. casual/narrative/fluffy oriented players. … at least when playing matched play. Every matched play legal list is a potential tournament list, there are just very effective, mediocre and bad ones. If you want to play matched play 2k points with min. 3 battlelines and all other restriction you‘re „queuing“ for a competitive game. If you want to be fluffy or casual go and play open play missions / battleplans from battletomes. Don‘t be mad about someone playing a „more effective“ list in a „casual game“ when it‘s your own responsibility.

I think its a good mix between „nostalgic this is warhammer-feeling“ with memorable Characters like Nagash (all Death-Characters really), Morathi (who got a whole new role in AoS) or Archaon (who „won“ the End Times technically) but with enough room for new players to enter the game (like Katakros or Kragnos). Fielding literal gods also makes games of AoS more epic imo. BUT Gotrek should have never returned. It’s ridiculous that you have to account for a ~500p „God of War“ Style Character that can easily wipe your whole army if you don‘t have a way to deal with him. Ngl, whenever I see him I dont want to play anymore (or watch the game). I LOVE Duardin in general, but why the f is he so powerful?? I always thought of him as a comic relief - like the One Punch Man of Warhammer Fantasy - for me he was never really a part of the Setting. I really dislike him and wish GW just made him a legends Scroll for narrative games rather than an Order „auto include“ As for other unpopular opinions: I think Lumineth Realm Lords are one of the best designed AoS armies, just like Ossiarch Bonereapers were for Death when they were released. Just like LRL feel like „High Elves but different“ OBR feel like „Tomb Kings but different“ - just like the third mummy movie was about an asian mummy, rather than an egyptian one. I think OBR are exactly what Nehekhara would have become in old world if Nagash succeeded a bit more.

Had another 4 (!) games today. 1# 1000p Kruleboyz (W) 2# 2000p Fyreslayers (L) 3# 2000p Stormcasts (L) 4# 3000p Stormcasts (W) What I really like about the new edition is how interactive it has become if you take the right units. Redeploy and Unleash Hell can decide games if used properly and you and your opponent have to account for it. Also the double turn around turn 3 is such a gamechanger. I had games where I hoped to win the priority roll to go SECOND just to destroy an important objective thats out of my reach, even if my army took a heavy beating for it. Then there is the dynamic between all-out attack/defense where you have to choose your activations even more careful and sometimes try to bait out one or the other so that you can get the upper hand somewhere else. „Activation War“ has become more relevant to me than before, now that MSU (mostly Stormcast Eternals) are so viable again. Sometimes my opponent has to charge 3-4 of my units but loses something important after every activation because of how strong most Stormcast units are. Sometimes its better to not charge at all. There are so many tactical decisions to make, regarding Grand Strategies / Battle Tactics, Command Abilities and Heroic Actions. You need to think about scoring, but also about deleting your enemy to stop him from scoring and you need to make all those considerations while building your list. Onedrop Alphastrike or multiple Battalions for more flexibility/ enhancements? Can I score every battle tactic? Can I score most battle tactics with a Monster for bonus points? Can I keep my grand strategy while denying my enemies? Also I love how the rules are written. Everything is just so clear. There was not a single question that wasnt answered via rules or FAQ. Bonus points for new army design: I like that Hammers of Sigmar give a simple 6+ ward and Dracoth Battleline instead of locked traits and artifact. Its so cool to choose a command ability as enhancement rather than being locked into one. I really hope new tomes are getting released sooner than later, following this design philosophy. For me 3.0 is 10/10 !

Not really, maybe you are just not that convincing? I dont have your kind of problem, I have a gaming group of 5 people that play regularly and now 2 more friends of mine started the hobby. Positivity can go a long distance. Greetings from Germany 😉

How ironic that TO tries to tell people how to identify and deal with toxic people while writing a DIY „how to build a community following my design“ Summary: - Dont be socially awkward - Let people do what they actually enjoy - profit

Good thing my 4 Fulminators will arrive today 😍 So hyped for my new battleline unit !

I think the Knight-Judicator is a pretty stand alone sniper that doesnt need much build around. Maybe Aventis and some other shooters to profit from the +1 to hit bubble of the Tauralon, but thats a lot of points. I‘d just put him randomly on a backline objective, trying my luck on keytargets with 6 or less wounds.

First of all, THANK YOU for this kind of thread! After reading through the last pages of the Stormcast Discussion I was aboot to quit the forum for a few weeks, because the negativity of so many people towards the army and GW in general is taking over again, which is just frustrating when all you want to do is reading and talking about one of the most exciting Editions (imo) so far! As you can already tell by this introduction I am VERY pleased with the current state of the rules and I am excited for everything that will follow. I think 2nd Edition was well designed as well, though battalions and buff-stacking went too far, to a point where you couldnt beat a LotL HGB unit if you hadnt some crazy combo yourself. Now its much more toned down and because of that more impactful when you can create a little combo here and there. I played OBR, Fyreslayers, KO and ofc my new Stormcasts so far and I really enjoyed every single game so far. The games were very close most of the time with t4/5 being the decisive ones. And even if a game was decided on t3 it was still fun to finish because both sides had still many units left to play with. That being said, I won all my SCE games so far, I think the army works really well and I love the changes to old units! The preview article did not lie! As mentioned Retributors (Paladins in General) & Judicators are big winners, they are doing such good work. All in all I am really hyped and I think its a great time to be in the hobby! Cheers!

Knight-Relictor denies negative effect of prayers and invocations on 4+. And I like the model. I will use him as I often play against Khorne and Fyreslayers. Same goes for the Knight-Arcanum. Auto Unbinding 1 Spell can be good value, but mostly against some one-trick-pony-builds that are getting extinct the more tomes are going to be released. Against the right opponent (using 1+ endless spells) the Arcanum is more consistent with her ability to block endless spells moving to their targets. Both Knights are relatively niche, I agree, but in the right situation they impact a game more than Lord-Relictor/Knight-Incantor. And sometimes good rules are about diversity. Edit: Also, you can include Lord-Relictor AND Knight-Relictor in the same „priest-heavy“ list to get both 2+ rerollable translocation AND 4+ protection bubble against enemy priests. Same goes for Arcanum/Incantor.

definately situational. If you need to survive you pull the maces, if you need to deal MWs you pull glaives.

I‘d go for 4 Starsoul Maces in a unit of Protectors, just for flexibility reasons. 51 Attacks (if all 10 get to strike) or 31 Attacks with almost guaranteed 4D3 MWs is not that much of a difference against Hordes for example, but against something like Kragnos with All out Defense you will need those Starsouls Maces with Unleash thy Hatred to get him down.

They can max. succeed on a 3+ but you can stack +2 to negate -1 rend and still have a 3+, which was more than enough.

Interesting, I guess it‘ll just be the SCE onedrop for them then?

So I want to share my first experience with the new Tome vs. Bonereapers: His List: Katakros Zandtos Soulmason 2x 20 Mortek 2x 5 Deathrider Harvester My List: Lord-Imperatant (General: Master of Magic, Artefact: Arcane Tome (Thundershock? -1 wound spell) Knight-Arcanum Knight-Vexillor /w Apotheosis Praetors (Warlord) 10 Vindictors 3 Annihilators 5 Retributors (Hunters) 5 Liberators 5 Liberators 10 Judicators (Hunters) Triumph (Inspired) Enhancement (Holy Command) - Thunderbolt Volley - Unleash thy Hatred Summary: I won by points in the Battleplan where you need to burn objectives in order to score (8 VP if you hold it for 5 turns) - forgot the name - boy was it a fun game! Bonereapers after FAQ are still very hard to take down and Katakros CP stealing ability hit me hard one time where I couldnt all out defense my mystic shield Vindictors which cost me about 4 models (+1A Mortek still hurt!) But all in all I just used them to block anyway and they did it like 2 battlerounds against ~40 morteks + Katakros. Judicators with Thunderbolt Volley are BRUTAL. Took care of the Harvester in one go and shot the other shots into some Mortek to thin their ranks. (In hindsight I could have picked on Katakros as he was at only 5 Wounds remaining at some point, but I didnt want to anger the old man. Also Retributors are huge now! Before I would hesitate to throw them into anything really, this game they made short work of Zandtos and crashed into 5 Deathriders later just to completely obliterate them in one go. Should have let them fight Morteks I guess, but the forced his hand to burn his backfield objective t2 and secured me 8 points on my flank, so it was worth! The star(s) of the list! #1 Lord-„I can do everything“-Imperatant! SO happy with this guy! Being able to put out one of the most ridiculous debuff spells in AoS with a REROLL was huge! That + his guidance for the Annihilators t1 which assassinated his Soulmason AND his 2 free CP against a Katakros that robbed me 2 CP EVERY.SINGLE.TURN probably secured me victory big time. What a man! #2 Liberators!! Yupp, I‘m in love with my nostalgia boys. They held their own against Zandtos + Deathrider charge thanks to +2 Save (Shields + All out) AND put some hurt back thanks to better profiles and ley low the tyrant! Absolutely worth their 115 points and I will stick to those! honorable mention: - Judicators as explained before - Knight-Vexillor (12“ reroll charges was REALLY handy AND he revived 3 Liberators which then killed the remaining 2 Deathriders and secured my backline) The only thing I‘d probably change is the Knight-Arcanum - there is really no reason not to just pick an Incantor or Lord-Relictor with translocation instead, but she unfortunately has to leave anyway when Bastian Cathalos finally arrives, so no worries in that regard. Other than that Stormcast are very resilient now, the Hammers of Sigmar 6+ ward did some work here and there and I should probably buy some Fulminators for the future as those guys look mean on paper. Also want to try the following wombo combo: 4 Fulminators in a Vanguard (free 6“ run) with Steadfest March (run + charge) and then all out attacking into something big and scary t1/2 One general thing with the Tome that i felt: It has pretty much all the things it had before, just more limited in uses. e.g. Anvils double tap = thunderbolt volley Hollowed Knights run + charge = steadfast march Forgot the name but the +1A thingy = unleash hatred (Paladins only) As a Hammers of Sigmar player I pretty much got the best from everything. 6+ ward where I needed it double tapping Judicators +1A Paladins for bursting stuff And no wasted trait / artifact, which let me pick something actual useful for my second enhancement. Even without Gavriel* and Yndrasta which I used before instead of Retributors I never had so much fun playing SCE! *He was just good, because his CA was kinda cheesy, I‘m happy it is gone and he is no auto include anymore. Thats how internal balance should go. Anyway, hope my insight helps! Happy righteous thunderclapping to all of you ❤️

Evocators got slightly worse and Paladins got much better thats the only reason there is a choice right now. There is nothing wrong with Evocators, they seem so bad now because they were an absolute nobrainer compared to Paladins before. They still do what they do, Paladins just got a real Warscroll now.

Most spells have 12“ range for KNIGHTS (e.g. Knight-Incantor) and 18“ range for LORDS (e.g. Lord-Arcanum), same goes for the unique command abilities - probably to make the Lords more valuable.

Well, I‘m having my first new tome match tomorrow - going for the following: Lord Imperatant (General) - Master of Magic (reroll cast) - Arcane Tome (Thundershock? Spell that lets me roll for each enemy unit within 18“ (cuz he is a Lord) and on 3+ its -1 to wound) For 175p I get all of the value for my Annihilators, a free cp and a buffed up Lord-Level caster! Sounds pretty nice. Rest of my List looks like this: Knight-Arcanum (Celestial Blades) Vexillor w/ Apotheosis Banner Praetors (to guard my General) in a Warlord. 1. Hunters of the Heartlands 5 Liberators 5 Liberators 10 Judicators (with Double Tap Command) 2. Hunters 3 Annihilators 5 Retributors (+1A command) 10 Vindictors + pretty efficient General + nice burst damage with double tapping Judicators + almost everything is immune to monstrous rampage + i‘m super hyped about new Retributors Its pretty much my old List minus Yndrasta and Gavriel but with Retributors. Its a trade off I can live with tbh, as I dont like Yndrasta that much. Bastian will be hard to fit in though, not sure whats going to be replaced for him in the future, but he is a MUST buy from the point I saw the preview of this awesome model.

Rules Question: If I give the Arcane Tome to my Lord Imperetant.. 1. Does he count as Stormcast Wizard and get a spell from the Lore like other Wizards? 2. Does he count as „Lord“ for ranges? RAW yes, but it sounds a little cheesy

Rules Question: Zombies have Save - Corpsecart can give +1 to Save rolls for Zombies. How can a Zombie ever roll for a Save when it has no Save value? Is there a rule that says „a Save characteristic of - is treated as being 7+„ ?? Im kinda confused and I face Gravelords soon.

Dont you worry, GW called them Vindicators themselves in the Warscroll Builder. They fixed it already, or maybe it was some kind of insider joke.

Well yeah, but those 40 Zombies backed by a Vampire Lord AND a Necro are 25% of the opponents list, while 10 Liberators are like 10% of yours. And they should be able to block them for long enough so you can pressure other parts of the board / get an advantageous charge with something that can wipe the Zombies or just killing of the Vampire Lord + Necro, which leaves the Zombies pretty much useless.

Luck is the right word, I dont see Zombies deal more than 4-5 wounds in total, as they have 1 attack each that basically does dmg on a 6 to hit. With up to 20 models in contact (more would be unrealistic) its 4-5 MWs if he spikes the hit roll. Rest either doesnt wound or is saved. I‘d simply but something that has a) many wounds b) ward or c) is cheap against them. Eg 5-10 Liberators will do, or anything within 9“ of the general in a Hammers of Sigmar army. Bonus point for Decimators, as they should tear through a Zombie horde in one round of combat.

If I were GW / designer in general I would listen to fans / people who love the product and give constructive / positive ideas how to improve and just ignore the haters. If I‘d get comments like „Omg GW you suck, you ruined Slaanesh, how can you not see how obviously bad the rules are“ I‘d just think to myself even IF it was the case „weeeeell you now got yourself another year of waiting now, gz now go ahead and buy it anyway nerd lol“ A bit exaggerated tbf, but who in their right mind really thinks that you get a positive result by aggressively yell for a change you personally want (maybe not even the majority of people). This community is full of manchilds..

I feel excited for every army I play (Fyreslayers, KO, OBR and the SCE I just started again due to Dominion release) Changes to CA and Monsters make me excited for my Vostarg, since I‘m fielding 2 Droths anyway which now got so much better, also no more need for LotL makes list building more interesting again, I am really eager to combo Vostarg + Runeson CA for +1 hit/wound in a bubble. Also smaller board will make that run + charge t1 much more impactful. I dont have to say much about KO, as every change so far made them better in my book. Also triumphs are a big! Being able to +1 hit/wound on the Ironclad with all out attack while still being able to get +1 save after unleashing hell sounds so strong. OBR are ofc in a weird spot, I think they will FAQ it sooner or later, but as for now I really think using mystic shield multiple times with Arkhan can be a big W, while also being more survivable due to heroic actions (bravery 10 helps with the heal). Also Arkhan shutting down CAs sounds interesting. If they get access to the generic CAs its just straight up getting brutal. But I‘m most excited for the new SCE, the models look fantastic and there is so much synergy just within the Dominion box. Cant wait to get my first games of 3.0 in!

Just because those people yelling about balance and rules flaws are the loudest doesnt mean that they are right or even a majority. I think this point came up often enough by now, if you think the devs created a „bad“ game, by all means go ahead and play something different. Just because YOU personally dont like the design choices they are not „obviously“ bad/wrong/whatever. Not talking to someone specific here, just generally speaking.