Lucur

I have a similar build in mind: Astreia Lord Ordinator Knight Incantor - starfall Lord Relictor - high priest, translocate, mirrorshield 2x3 Evocats 2x5 Sequitors 5 Liberators 3 Ballistae It lacks the tauralon (i don't own one and wont get one anytime soon, because... dragons ), but the second unit of cats should help with scoring. I tried to get a 10 man unit of Sequitors in to benefit from Astreia more, but i also want the ballistae to take out support pieces. If i get a 4th ballista i'll drop the LordO, without allies he's not worth his points it seems. Might drop him anyways to get the Sequitors in (10 Seq and 2x5 Libs for BL) depending how playtesting goes. Re Astreia: i use her as a LAoCD all the time, i'm just curious if her warscroll is worth it this tome ^^

Just for reference, what tool did you use to calculate dmg and what numbers did you input? I get greatly different results (and yes i subtracted the lightning arc MWs 😛 ) Assumption: 3 models, 2 swords, 1 stave on the prime, all get full attacks. Dmg v 6+: 14.5 Dmg v 5+: 12.0 Dmg v 4+: 9.5 Dmg v 3+: 7.0 Dmg v 2+: 4.4 Probably you used 2 staves? I'd also argue that lightning arcs is stronger than drakes shooting MWs because it happens every fight phase.

Why Evocators' staves are down to 1" reach maybe. This might ofc be deliberate as well...

Re Judicator bows, if you run a unit of 15 i'd argue the shockbolt bows could clear a screen while the skybolt bows hammer high save units. They are vastly better against sv 5+/6+ targets. On a small unit i wouldn't bother as was said above, variance is out to get you in small numbers

Alright, put like this there's a bit of a point there, apologies. If Drakes get through the next points update unscathed i'll eat my words, but those won't stay that way imo. Considering Sequitors, they cannot be prized at the same point as Vindictors. They are plain better when compared unbuffed. Ofc Vindis buffed get to a 2+ sv which Sequitors can't, but Seqs get that sweet ward (MW anyone?) and they scale way better with extra attacks due to 2dmg. The reach is hardly an issue as you mostly want the greatmaces to strike, regular dudes are a nice extra (though maybe more important now than before). From there it's thunderstrike keyword that is the sole advantage for Vindis. Considering other competitive builds, i haven't played a tourney in some time, but the major issues i've ever had were the inability to score against blobs (read: splitting horrors). With the general update to scoring multi wound models and stormkeeps especially i think we are way better off than before. For most of those matchups we'll have to wait and see how things shake out, i'm optimistic our tools are better and way more diverse than a week ago. Of course there is a strong possibilty for another good early book that's power crept into oblivion within half a year. I just hope Gdubbs learned a bit from 2.0 and doesn't repeat that. I remember full well the hate for Sequitors and Evocators when noone else but NH had new tomes...yet ^^

The only thing in the tome that's out there is drakes. Granted, smells like selling stuff. Other than that, ofc there's some winners and losers, but overall this is waaaaay more competitive than the last tome, internally. Most units have a place and, besides drakes, new stuff doesn't knock anything out of the park. So, give me an insight how you get that oppinion. I have a mostly sacrosanct army, and i feel all my stuff got way better. Dracolines can compete with our hammer units nicely, Sequitors are a great battleline, though expensive, with an inbuilt ward and okay damage. Ballistae are way less dependent on support, even Castigators can do a bit of work now. So, unless you fine sir give me an insight as to why the sky is falling i label you a negative troll.

So with the leaks out, how do we run our kitties? Drakes may be all the hype so far but i don't own any, while i own thundercats and i'm keen to make them work again. Are you ready for rambling of epic proportions? We're okay with points with the slight hike to 280, getting another dice per model for lightning arcs. Cats don't need to charge to get d3 dmg. We lost rr1sv against shooting and staves are only range 1" now. I think a unit of 6 is no longer that viable, coherency and reinforcement restrictions be praised. Advantage of running 6 would be more efficient buffs/ commands, while needing way more losses before losing wizard status. Lord Arcanum on Dracoline is way better than before, also because spells are way better. Starfall or thundershock are both low cast value and amazing effect. Pack Alpha is way better than pride leader ever was. Soul flasks gone afaik takes abit of utility away, but overall better profile compensates that imo. For stormhosts i'm thinking hammers to gain a bit of survivability after clearing an objective or Celestial Vindicators for even more damage, me personally leaning towards hammers. I didn't memorize all the stormhosts, so i might miss some cooler combo here. For complementing units, i think a large unit of Judicators with the holy command to shoot twice works well, as well as vindictors cause they don't need much support. A Lord Relictor with translocate is too good to pass up. From there i think a ballista or two to camp in the back and plink away with the single shot. I also want to add a Knight Incantor or two but at that point points are pretty tight. What do you fellow furry feline afficionados think?

I've always missed a halberdier and greatsword type for Stormcast, totally agree there.

There's a stormhost (or was it a warrior chamber?) called the Imperishables, with one Lord Celestant Settrus, if i'm not mistaken. Have at it.

Afaik there's only some statlines floating around and the whc preview with limited stormhost and battleline information. It's all in this thread, too, if you go back a page or two.

That is far from the truth, 40k didn't have a codex release for months before the current two releases. Black Templars for example were originally supposed to get their stuff in march, where they get previews just now and are still weeks away from preorder/ actual release.

I bow my head in shame and admit making a fool out of myself

Nope, thay can take lore of invigoration spells perfectly fine.

That's something they're moving away from in 40k as well. If the rumors prove true and we get homogenised weapon stats (hammers/swords on Liberators etc.) that would point towards less customisation options in the near future.

Get a few gryphhounds in for Zoocast Eternals!

All the while Kharadron shoot up a third of my army every turn and fly to the other edge of the board to do it all again next turn. RAI. No, a triple stormwinged drake is not the worst of our problems. And it's not like that drake is immortal. Sure it's abusive of badly written rules, and probably it's not intended. But come on, give the man a pause on the douchebag hype train (then again, i wouldn't play against that list on my sunday out beer and brezel hammer :P)

Did you check in with the TO? Because 3 times the same trait on one single mount might raise the occasional eyebrow ^^ Other than that this might be a fun list, 5 Evocators seem to underperform to me, but with a drake and the concussors as primary threats they might live for a turn to walk up.

I just reread the article, the knight's dragon has a different posture than the two troppers dragons have respectively (plus some srmor bit). So i assume we either get a different kit for the bossman and a kit of probably 2 for the unit or there's a proper choice in the pose of the mounts, which would be unheard of in recent kits.

I think they rather want to sell some more Dominion and stsrter boxes before revealing/ releasing the full kits with other options.

Or find a fellow sce player to split a box and a half This practice in general wouldn't even feel bad if we could increase unit sizes per model instead of multiples of the base size (which is now even more cemented with reinforcement rules, come to think of it -.-). This to me is the worst part of AoS... I want to speculate on the warscrolls a bit. Assuming a 3+ save (like Dracothian Guard), are the shields factored in? Or do we get extra rr1, ignore 1 rend or... ? Considering wounds, most monstrous cavalry have 5w so far, depending on the size of the buggers, this may or may not apply. Dragon breath? Tail attacks? Maws to swallow models whole? Dragon breath and bite were mentioned in the teaser trailer. I know, that's no serious thing to go vy, but it's the best we got and i'm excited might just be some extra MW output as with DG shooting. And finally weapon options. In general swords vs lances is a question of better standard profile with the swords vs massive boost on one round after the charge, but pretty much worse after, for lances. Since SCE lack melee rend2/3, i really hope the lances get in there. Not that i wouldn't like swords, but i need some rend2 in my life besides shooting. That's me done with the rambling for now, what do we think?

That would be what they did with both kinds of Evocators and the Knight Incantor/ Lord Arcanum on Dracoline, respectively. But buy does my wallet hurt already. I planned on picking up dominion next week, guess i'll save up for some dragon knights.

With how many cp one can get access to now, it would certainly be more powerful, as you could afford to just try more often (still failing too often to rely on it, but the risk/reward gets better with less investment, relatively). I still doubt it would be on the op side compared to other summoning, while ofc a 15 man unit of anything "for free" will most certainly swing a game.

I have no first hand experience vs Lumineth, but from what i read and hear, having Teclis and a 20 steong unit of Sentinels is basically half their army. They are therefore light on objectives, which means with quality MSU units you might contest their capability to score, while throwing something really dangerous (Evocators, maybe dracolines or Dracothian guard, even Yndrasta) towards Teclis. The man is squishy for his points, so a threat has to be dealt with. Thus they either save their ability to score or their center piece. If you want to tailor lists, don't bring casters v Teclis and (many) support heroes v Sentinel spam. Sequitors might be preferrable to Libbies due to fnp vs. mortals from spells and archers. Just my 2ct of theory Afterthought regarding casters, a Knight Incantor or two might still be valuable if you can dodge the sentinels to auto dispell protection of teclis...

We had this whole discussion already over several pages. There's disambiguity and an FAQ is needed, til then ask your opponent before the game (or the TO) make your point to them and let's move on in here, alright?

You need to hit for that once per game debuff to apply. I'd rather guarantee (-ish) i get it on the unit where it's needed.