Pitloze

I mean playable as in actually worth it playable. Olwyr with 2 man mournfang is not worth the points. You might as well go Eurlbad now because you can get a decent list in at 1950 with 2x4 mournfang.

Too bad I guess. Edit: Actually you can make a decent 1950 Eurlbad list now. So that's something.

You still can't play Olwyr at 2k... Lame. Lowest I can make it is 2010...ffs. No point changes for Eurlbad?

Reason is why I asked is because contrast paints to overlap well because they are so translucent. So you have to be careful about colors overlapping and creating colors you don't want (blue and yellow creating green for example). And a lot of Troggoth schemes have overlapping painting parts. But also a lot of Drybrushing. I would love to see someone's model if they tried it already!

Do you guys things Troggs are good models to use contrast paints on?

It has to be Ironjawz or BCR. Looking at my Gutbuster range I don't see any of them with those metal teeth.

Could also be Ironjawz.

I've been thinking about that "wounds counts as models regarding objectives" rule idea that's been floating around here. And seeing that every army that gets a book these days has one overpowered asset I think that what I'm about to suggest is more than fine: I think the normal "wounds counts as models" idea is cool for Gutbusters as an allegiance ability (if they combine the Ogors into one tome). But for BCR I think it would be thematic if wound characteristic counts double for sake of capturing objectives on a turn for a BCR OGOR unit which charged in that turn but nothing in a turn where they did not. Reason being is that I can picture Ogors themselves being smart enough to sumo enemies around. The wild animals they ride don't care about objectives. But the combined weight of their animals and themselves is like getting hit by a dump truck. So to respresent enemies flying away and not being able to help capture objectives I think the double wounds idea would be cool. Better than forcing enemies to move back a couple of inches like the old Slaughterpriest prayer. This means BCR players have a lot more flexibility in how they play. You can now play a bit more patiently. Because if you have a 14 wound Frostlord you can now realistically take an objective from a 30 man unit if you kill enough of them in the combat phase. If you give away first turn you give away your alpha strike but now you can counter attack to take objectives. This will make a 420 model actually terrifying. AS IT SHOULD BE! Sounds OP. But is it really? At this point in time BCR has one play style; everything goes forward. Alpha strike, die slowly. At least this way BCR can TAKE objectives and not just hold them for one turn just because you got first turn. And since you don't have the ability on turns where you haven't charged maybe players will retreat more often. We are not Khorne. Ghengis Khan's Golden Horde did a lot of hit and run tactics. There is nothing in the lore to say that BCR are berserkers. They are very much in control in combat so this would make sense. I kinda want to playtest this in my group. But people still think a 420 model doing 6 mortal wounds on 2+ is the ultimate form of OP... So I dunno how well this will go over.

I like the new tempo. It makes tomes last longer before they become irrelevant.

If the points don't change (much) then you can still squeeze in 90 Vulkites even when you have 4 Magmadroths (1 Runedaddy, 1 runeson, 2 runesmiters). And if you can, then people will. Especially if Magmadroths are worth taking now. I feel they should have rethought the entire army. Or adjusted prices, but that would not have happened anyway. Fyreslayers would have been my first army if they didn't cost double that of any army. So I'm a tad salty.

If the new book doesn't fix Vulkite spam I don't see how Fyreslayers will be any more popular than before. It's still by far the most expensive GW army (barring FW stuff). I love the army and the look of it. But that price tag is stupid.

Are these all the reveals or will there be more to come?

If mortal fists get the "unmodified roll of a 6" change like Bloodwarriors did will they become a viable loadout? I'm building my Ogors now and I'm not sure if I want to bother magnetising all of them.

I wasn't criticizing you. I think I was low key hating on our battalions. Forcing a Huskhorn in there for stuff that we mostly already have (run and charge, mortal wounds) doesn't really do anything for us. I would love to give Braggoth's a go if Gore-Gruntas weren't that difficult to collect.

I tried your list. It was against Nighthaunt so take all this with a grain of salt since they play fairly unique. It was Border Wars. I took first turn. used the CPs to rush the neutral objectives. failed my charges (they were all 9 or higher). So I decided to sit on the objectives. In his turn he got all his stuff in combat and teleported behind me so I could not retreat anyway. Rend didn't work against him so the damage output was very low. Also didn't even get Geminid's off but I doubt that would have made a difference. Personally I really dislike the Huskard on Stornhorn in anything other than Eurlbad. And even in Eurlbad he is only offensively as good as a Frostlord but still dies to rend pretty easily. I also have a hard time finding a decent artefact for a Huskhorn. I don't want them too deep in combat so Thermal rider is out, he has 4+ save so amulet is not fantastic. I went with Gryph Feather charm and it worked okay ish. I also really missed my Butchers. I usually play two and the tease of getting +1 to hit make them worth it IMO. They sometimes get a spell off. Which is fun. But best of all my opponents are usually more scared of the Butchers than anything else lol. I'm not sure I'm going to bring Endless spells anymore. I think Triumphs are better than Spells. Since even 7's are hard to get off with Butchers or Fungoids. And I like the back up option of casting Mystical Shield if the Everwinter fails me.

Reason why I asked it is because I like to use my Mournfang as wrestlers to try and pin enemy units down so I can take objectives with my Stonehorns. If you retreat I don't know how you take back the objectives you then give away? And if you get a double turn you don't really have that oomph? I'll try your list out tomorrow at game day.

What do you mean with hitting turn one retreating turn two? Don't you then give an entire turn away to your opponent?

His list comes in at 1910. Did he know the Cave Shaman went up in price? I assume he was gunning for 2 extra CP.

Just the CHANCE of getting +1 to hit is priceless for a BCR army. I run two butchers and getting the +1 to hit twice on a unit of Mournfang actually makes them very scary. And even if that all doesn't work you can always get mystic shield out of them. Which is very valuable for me. I basically have three chances at getting rerolling save rolls of 1 for my Frostlord.

My goal at the moment is just hobby and game days. No specific tourney list or counter list. Minus to hit do suck. The hope I have right now is that Destruction will get a resurgence just like Death did last year. Just waiting that out while I paint my stuff. And when the new destruction stuff comes I pray that we get plastic Yeti's. But FEC didn't get their plastic Varlgulf so I'm kinda scared that we won't either. I know Thundertusks won't do much against Death. But neither do Stonehorns I feel. The Thundertusks at least has SOME pressure. And for your list. I was kinda scared it was going to be Gutbuster heavy. But this actually puts me over the edge and I will start collecting Gutbuster this year. The only thing I'm confused about are the 3 Ogor's with Iron fists? I thought they sucked because rend negates them? I do have 3 Ogors left from my Butcher conversion so if they are worth building that would be a cool way to use them up. And it's 25% of your TOTAL army. If you check warscroll builder it counts that list I posted as 8/2. Meaning it falls under the 25% of your army being allies rule and is legal. That's also what I have 2x2 Mournfang.

As a BCR player. You're not wrong...

I know we are not doing well. But I actually don't like the dirty snowball mechanic at all. And I don't own any yethee's so I try to run Stonehorns mostly. This is my this list most game days: Allegiance: Beastclaw Raiders Mortal Realm: Aqshy Butcher (140) - Pair of Stump Blades and Great Cauldron - Allies Butcher (140) - Pair of Stump Blades and Great Cauldron - Allies Frostlord on Stonehorn (420) - General - Trait: Everwinter's Master - Artefact: Thermalrider Cloak 4 x Mournfang Pack (320) - Gargant Hackers 4 x Mournfang Pack (320) - Gargant Hackers 2 x Mournfang Pack (160) - Gargant Hackers 2 x Mournfang Pack (160) - Gargant Hackers Stonehorn Beastriders (320) - Option: Blood Vulture Malevolent Maelstrom (20) Total: 2000 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 280 / 400 Wounds: 111 But it's not cutting it against Death. Either they ignore rend or they swarm me with 1 dmg skeletons. Thundertusks at least have a chance at sniping their heroes. I was actually thinking of swapping the Maelstrom and Beastriders out for a Stonekard. But without Eurlbad he feels really weak. I kinda brushed the Tuskards aside because I that even with their innate heals I felt they were still fragile at 4+ save. And at 2k it's 720 points to field them. And I don't want to sacrifice the Butchers to help bring more body's on the table to defend them. Because I really like the butchers. Thus the option to run a Tusklord seems tempting to put everything on once chassis. I do hear you on the Endless spells though. I have been having trouble getting them off. And I don't think we ever used Triumph's in our games. I should look into it. What would you list at 2000 points if you had to make a list with two Tuskards and no yeti's?

Yeah makes sense. But in current list the only I have is from two Butchers (and the Butchers are there to stay). So if I want to actually get him into combat I might be out of range of their heals. I have a ton of magic users with chaff in my meta. So my Stonehorns can get bogged down. Thus I want to try and use a Thunderlord so I have some flexibility. Snipe some heroes and then try and survive the chaff. I have two Thundertusk lists that I feel are not too cheesy but can still perform: Thunderlord. A more balanced and aggressive list. I could also swap out the Thundertusk Beastriders for Stonehorn Beastriders and add a 20 point endless spell: Allegiance: Beastclaw Raiders Mortal Realm: Ghur Butcher (140) - Pair of Stump Blades and Great Cauldron - Allies Butcher (140) - Pair of Stump Blades and Great Cauldron - Allies Frostlord on Thundertusk (420) - General - Trait: Everwinter's Master - Artefact: Gryph-feather Charm 4 x Mournfang Pack (320) - Gargant Hackers 4 x Mournfang Pack (320) - Gargant Hackers 2 x Mournfang Pack (160) - Gargant Hackers 2 x Mournfang Pack (160) - Gargant Hackers Thundertusk Beastriders (340) Total: 2000 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 280 / 400 Wounds: 111 Tuskard. list build around keeping my Tuskard alive and him healing the Thundertusk Beastriders and having the Mournfang act as blockers: Allegiance: Beastclaw Raiders Butcher (140) - Pair of Stump Blades and Great Cauldron - Allies Butcher (140) - Pair of Stump Blades and Great Cauldron - Allies Huskard on Thundertusk (360) - General - Blood Vulture - Trait: Everwinter's Master - Artefact: The Pelt of Charngar 4 x Mournfang Pack (320) - Gargant Hackers 4 x Mournfang Pack (320) - Gargant Hackers 2 x Mournfang Pack (160) - Gargant Hackers 2 x Mournfang Pack (160) - Gargant Hackers Thundertusk Beastriders (340) Emerald Lifeswarm (60) Total: 2000 / 2000 Extra Command Points: 0 Allies: 280 / 400 Wounds: 110 Any thoughts on it?

What is the best self healing Artefact available to us in the realms or factions? I want to try and run a ThunderLord. Is it still the pelt?

Oops. Well I only have 2 50mm bases left. So I'll just go with 1 Tyrant and 3 Ironguts then. Just have to be creative with the two handed weapon part then.