Acid_Nine

with a mountain spirit tagging along there is some value letting it fight at the top bracket. The stonemage can be useful when using some spells like Unrelenting Calm to avoid battle shock without a Cathallar or Voice of the Mountain to cause table wide -2 battleshock tests.

hey, we had the same thoughts, just one post removed! I honestly think that we will have this in leu of having combat heroes for now. I do think that we may have more heroes when / if tyrion or another element temple comes out, but for now it makes sense if we are able to give a warden something. Worst case scenario it's something like a +1 to hit item... worst case is we can give them any relic, even the ethereal amulet, and can give everyone the effects of that relic.

The vampire lord also has a better save, can heal themselves in two different ways (blood chalice or doing wounds) and can raise casualties of nearby units by D3. I think the stone mage can be good, but I do not think they are hybrid fighters like we have been wanting. And I agree, I just hope there are some relics that go on High wardens or something, just to have something that is not on a squishy caster. Still, I am excited to see what the utility relics are, and you cannot go wrong with relm relics like Aetherquartz broach.

I think I may paint them either like ziatec or iliatha, but I for sure want to use those turboshift paints. listened to the bad dice pod cast and man they are loving on teclis. Half the conversation was about him, and they do mention how the sudden drop lists hurt him a lot. They didn’t really talk about armies without him though, and I think they obsessed about him way way too much. With every unit being a wizard we can still throw so much magic around without him, and the twin stone may be the biggest lynchpin for us to use. Sad that the rune of petrifaction is so bloody expensive though. also, I think with the way they talked about screening and covering space is valuable. The LRL really have to be careful to not stay attached to the shining company rules. If we need to spread out we should, if we need to charge we should. It’s not a in stone restriction, so we have to be careful to know when to hold the line and when to spread out.

When I said "Around here" I did mean in my local area, not on the discussion board, and will edit that. Right now though, we don't have a lot of the lore, information about nation's fluff, information on paint schemes or anything like that. All we have is german translated rules and the lumineth articles (and the army box stuff.) talking about gaming will tend to drift towards the competitive side. it's a two player game with one person that wants to win, and we are discussing things that will help the army win. I just gave a whole paragraph on theoretical tactics on a list I feel would be fun and how I would use it, I dunno if you consider that high brow tactics or not, but I was trying to start a conversation on starting on the first turn. If you want color scheme stuff specifically go make a new discussion topic for the things you want to discuss, and I am sure people will show up and discuss it if they are interested. if you wanna look at painting schemes and stuff, I suggest going to r/AgeofSigmar on reddit. They have lots of fun stuff there.

I believe that the supposed mechanic you touted is about as unfrair as you made the lumineth the Lumineth idea to be honest. What if an Ogor Mawtribes list comes into contact with a gloomspite or hammerhall list? Turn 1 sure, the maw tribe can use their stuff no problem. But as soon as the maw tribes come into range then they won't be able to do anything. because the opponent can generate an absurd amount of CP's. Also, the CP doubling is a spell, and a very high costing one at that sitting at an 8+! you have to plan meticulously around it to get it off consistently without using teclis, and have to use either a charged up twinstones to add +'s to it, or play as zaitrec to get at least a +1 to it. If something goes wrong in the generation, then it stops. if you're using Teclis, then there are other problems that have been discussed in the lumineth thread to death such as him being squishy and prone to alpha strikes.

Honestly, we we may be better off going first against armies that rely on rushing and in your face tactics. I don't know about teclis, but I feel with out magic we can set up for their turn and a potential double turn fairly well. I will show what I mean below. I dunno about playing outside of tournaments myself. We have pretty much all tournament players around here (in my area), so lists gotta be tough where I am to survive unless you really talk things over about having fun games. As for lists without teclis, yea we don't need him for every list. There is some fun things we can do that arguably may be stronger, and things that are powerful without it. Here is one of my latest lists using Iliatha, but it can easily be changed to a list with the other two non mountain countries. I could change one of the sentinels in the above list for another squad of Dawn Riders and consolidate the hanging squad of wardens to one of the bigger ones. to satisfy the battalion limitation. So! Plan I can see for turn 1 in my list if I go first (and everything works according to plan): First thing I would do is spend one aetherquartz onto an archer squad so that they can cast twin stones, and set that down in the middle of everyone. Next, I would start casting Power of Hysh on the sentinels until I get to like a +3/+4. one warden squad drains the stones to get an easy cast of Protection of Hysh, needing at least a 4 on 2d6 if it's at a +4. Then, other warden squad casts Heavenly blessings, the dawn riders cast power of Hysh, and the General casts Unrelenting Calm on one warden squad. with another +4, Cathallar casts Total eclipse, which makes my opponent use 2 CP instead of one. Everyone moves forward, and assuming I maintain formations and spacing, present the opponent with a staunch line of spears while allowing my sentinels to rain arrows on the opponent and having the mountain spirit provide his -1 to hit bubble over the front lines. I try to shoot the enemy's squishier units as range allows to soften them up while my lines move towards the objectives. based purely on this without considering the objectives, I have: 1 squad of 20 wardens with a 4+ ethereal save, -2 to hit (avalorn and shining company) and re-rolling 1's for armor save. I have a second squad of 20 wardens with a 5++ ward save, -2 to hit (shining company, Avalorn if I position right) and re-rolling 1's for armor saves, both having battle shock immunity through Cathallar and Stonemage. I have 3 squads of sentinels with a 30" threat range, and 1 angry cow ready to support the most afflicted side. Granted, this does not help too much against things like plague claws and mortek crawlers, but I believe against most normal armies this is a line of defense that would take some considerable thought to overcome, or at least some maneuvering. If I play my cards right, then this can last even during a double turn. or not. This is all theory hammer after all, and I need to put brain power somewhere.

That is fair, but if you do charge with the shining company all you are losing out on is a -1 to hit and the wall of spears ability. The mortal wound output you can dish out can make up for that if you cast light of hyish (Trust me, I know that’s a big fat “IF” there, even for a 6+ to cast) plus, you can supercharge them with the aetherquartz to allow them to cast both that and heavenly blessings, and with the right faction you can give them re-roll one’s to hit for some extra nastiness. Plus, defensive buffs don’t matter if you can swing before the enemy, which happens with most factions besides Slaanesh and slaves to darkness when you charge. Problem with the stoneguard seems to be that they need the stone mage to hang around and buff them, and she is so squishy, and they have the same attack volume as the wardens while having less dudes.

So talking about teclis aside, does anyone struggle to place where Stoneguard would fit into a list that is not the mountain specific one? for like, 40pts more the wardens can have more attackss, same number of wounds, Bigger board presence and is a wizard that can cast a spell that lets them ignore rend or a spell that lets them get mortal wounds better. just seems to be more utility there to be honest. I think the mountain spirits and stone mages are great, but I think the guard is a bit lacking without them having magic...

Depends on what you would like to do. If you wanna have magical support slling spells around them and buff their wounding rolls to a 2+, then hallowheart is a good choice in general. OTherwise, having them be part of Hammerhal would be fun for an all cavalry list, and you get the potential for Aventis Firestrike to be helping them out as part as hammerhal. Living City gives outflank to them, but they do not have a shooting attack to take advantage of the extra movement it gives with the strike and fade rule, but it allows them to get nice and close!

I think it depends. If you're using the wardens to just make sentinels or dawnriders battle line, then I think they could be useful in MSU, mostly as speed bumps to keep them from getting to the big guys. I don't know if sentinel spam is a good idea, but I think people forgot that they could move and shoot stull, which at least means they can get around to objectives, especially if they cast speed of Hysh on themselves. Also, I think Teclis may want to go 2nd in a match up? we have time to get our buffs off, including the Heavenly blessing. put it on teclis to make that 4+ save a 4++ save, give the protection spell to him, and use the rest as you see fit. We do not have too many blasting spells, so we're not missing out on too many chances to blast people.

Honestly I wouldn’t mind petrifax if they didn’t get that extra rend on whatever unit they want. It turns a defensive army into an absolute blender with the right general, and I admit it feels bad when your expensive units like morrsarr guard just bounce right off, doing no damage before getting wiped out by a mainline unit worth 240pts like there was no contest. in my experience, when you face petrifax mortek guard, you have to make sure can bring an equally powerful unit like that, make sure the Mortek guard strike after you and that the unit you chose unit options to do an insane amount of mortal wounds. And make sure you can kill their bone shapes /katakros before they heal up all the hard work you just did. And make sure you kill the gothizar harvester before they can keep bringing more dudes back based on casualties in a general area around them. And make sure you have the volume of attacks with high enough rend to actually break their armor even if you have mortal wounds. And make sure you devote enough resources to a unit that effectively cost like, 12-18% of your opponent’s army in just baseline units... but hey, if you can do all that then it’s a peace of cake as long as they don’t roll good deathless minion rolls!

Does anyone know the Rockpicks rules? is it a mortal wound on a 6+ to hit in addition to a wound roll, or does the attack sequence end after you roll a 6 like in wardens? I do wonder what an FAQ will bring too. maybe the shining company rules will change like the plague monk's did just to make it less confusing, but to be fair I think it could also be fairly prone to abuse.

Getting that preorder today motivated me to do the most tedious part... drybrushing the pillars. And I did it. I finished my second temple, in all it’s glory! Now to start working on the display board...

do you have to give the champion a hammer like that then? cause it doesn't make sense that the champion's weapons is such ****** to use. Do they also get to do mortal wounds? And thank you @Tiberius501, I like list 3 the most, but I feel it really needs to add the runes of petrification. I just like that spell a lot, and think it could be useful just to add another source of mortal wounds.

So Here are some more lists, this time with spells chosen. List 1, Endless spells, less wardens, lots of dakka. List 2: 3 drop Battalion list (with copius amounts of endless spell blastings. ) List 3: Battalion of the one I like the most So I have a lot of redundancy in spells, and that is planned. depending on the situations and when my elfs are not huffing Light Dust, then they have a choice between either doing the light of Hysh spell, or the protection spell depending on what is about to happen. if something big is about to happen and they start huffing that dust, then the squad most in danger can cast both on themselves and brace for a hard hit. / go on the attack. Stoneguard is there for extra bodies and damage absorption, but can be switched with Eltharion if I don't find them doing well. The mountain spirit is a pretty good multiplier all around, even without his command ability to hand out minuses to hit, and with the stone mage he could always hit quite hard. Speed is on the Archers because they are the least likely to be hit in CC, and need less buffs. Of course if you choose Ziatec then you can have even more choice. @LuminethMage yea, that is why I choose spells when making the list. gives an extra layer to think about. Eh ****** it. List four, Araliths only club:

Honestly I have a few ideas that seem like they could be pretty good. Using dawn riders as Endless spells delivery devices for turn 2 seems like a good way to send things forward, or using them directly from the Wardens a turn when you expect to recieve a big charge. I feel like the "cast extra spell" is going to be the aetherquartz ability I use the most too. For example, before combat I could theoretically use that aetherquarts reserve and cast empowerment of hysh and the protection of Hysh on themselves, charge into a unit alongside some dawnriders or the mountain spirit. Also, just spitballing here for some ideas I had. The mountain spirit's debuff of -1 to hit on anyone is particularly good, seeing as it's free and can (probably) stack with the Shining company's -1 to hit to give a whopping -2 to hit on units. He cannot buff himself with an extra attack, but his damage is potentially insane, and combined with a +1 to hit on his quartz he can potentially kill 10 chaos warriors in one turn if all goes well. The dawn riders also seem like they could act as marker lights, casting sparkling lights on targets for the archers to hit when it's time to block out the sun. Wardens casting self buffing spells look to be pretty good, but I would keep that to either the protection spell or the extra speed spell, just because it seems like it could be useful. Lots of utility, but the main things I think will be correct spell choices.

Preorders live, and managed to get my copy! Quite happy with it, and it’s going to be a long wait till I get it shipped

yup, works for skitarii it will work for this. Refrigerator magnet sheets are cheap and you can cut it to any size. Metal is a big more tricky to get down to size, but I managed to get a piece of sheet metal that I cut into shape once, just gotta do it again.

I think you hit the nail on the head with the state of warhammer, so well done and well written! I just want the game to be fun for everyone (while keeping my sun metal blades 😏)

I never saw it that way, but fair enough. Thanks! yea, I saw it almost as soon as I wrote it. Still, it's a cool ability and thanks for the translation!

See the thing I just dont understand is this. What Vanari units can use command abilities? From what I have seen there are no vanari heroes that can do it. Do you just pick one and let it go for Iliatha?

@swarmofseals You bring up some pretty good points. I don't know if the Lumineth have answers to things like the Mortek Crawlers or plague claw catapults besides trying to kill them with sentinels. We need a lot of spells, but don't have too many bonus's like Hallowheart does, nor do we have cheaper wizards like I think we need. Our big god model is squishy, but if we get him to work then look out. I do feel like we needed more models and more rules that would be good, but I do not know if it is all doom and gloom. Maybe we need some point adjustments (or maybe other factions need point adjustments), and we can certainly use some more units and more models to bring us up to a higher level, but I still think these guys have their place. The mortal wound potential can be insane if you have good dice, for example, and maybe the magic is a bit more tame compared to hallowheart or tzeentch (you know, the two masters of magic factions. ) but I believe they could do well. we don't even have the full book, just translations, so We'll see. I remain hopefully optimistic for it.

Could you add the regular mountain to this too? maybe with the +2 attacks from standing still and buffing himself? I think he'd do well compared to Avelanor with his easier wounding value and the extra rend. Also, I'm having a hard time deciding on which list I really wanna play. I like the idea of a formation just for added command and relics and drops given, but I feel like I'm missing out on the best endless spell, Rune of Petrification. I could drop one squad of dawn riders, but then I have less mobility and less spells, or I could remove the stone guard I have there, but I feel that they would be useful to hit the enemy with damage and to force people off objectives... So two more lists, one with Dawn riders and one with the added punch of endless spells.

Not only that, but it seems there is two buffs they could have with the Mountain Spirits giving +1 attack and the stone mage giving an additional rend on top of everything. Combine those two and they may be even deadlier than mathed out as above. Plus I wanna see the regular mountain spirit's damage rolls, as I think he may be better with the additional wounding and rend.