CaptainNippon Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 The upcoming release of the 2nd edition has sparked my interest in getting into AoS anew and I'm planing to go with a Legions of Nagash force built around my Vampire Lord with wings (I love that guy and I already own the model) First thing would be to choose the right Allegiance. I was thinking about Legion of Night for the synergy with Skeletons ("The Bait") , the command trait "Unholy Impetus" and the Artifact of Blood "Curseblade". The idea behind the command trait is to field something alongside the Vampire Lord that is equipped with multiple melee weapons, so the buff from "Unholy Impetus" and "Blood Feast" maximise their effects. A Zombie Dragon or Terrorgheist seem to be the obvious choice here (for some reason there is no Varghulf in LoN). For Battleline units, Skellies look good to me. They benefit from "The Bait" and they are beautiful models. So for now I have the list below, with 400 points to spare for a Vanguard force: Vampire Lord – 140 10 Skeleton Warriors – 80 10 Skeleton Warriors – 80 Zombie Dragon – 300 ______________________________ 600 Points These are my first thoughts, but I'm not particularly well versed in all things AoS, so please feel free to chime in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 Zombie Dragon is pretty meh unridden imo. Vampire Lord on top as the general to give it access to rerolls , a better armor save, and healing, is far more potent. Unridden, the Terrorgheist is a much better choice. Skeletons work best in units of 40 with spears. They get more attacks, they keep those attacks for longer, they are less likely to completely disintegrate upon impact, and you get a 40 point discount. If you are not running them as 40, Dire wolves are a better pick imo (though I would use Fenrisian Wolves for their models). Such a unit will also get a bigger benefit from you lord. The TG/Zombie Dragon would get +4 attacks if it benefited from both your attack buff, the skeletons would get an extra 80 attacks (on top of the 121 they already have)! Combine this with a Necromancer to let them attack twice in one combat round (up to 402 total attacks). Speaking of which, Necromancers are pretty much a necessity with undead. I highly recommend at least 1. If you don't like the actual model, you can make some nice ones out of the College Arcane box. For Legion of Night specifically, Morgahast Harbingers and Terrorghiests are your best ambushing units. The former for their long charge, the latter for scream range. I prefer Halberds on the Morghasts, as undead lacks rending in general. You will want to keep your Vampire hidden behind terrain for most of the game. The foot vampire is VERY fragile and will be shot off the board almost instantaneously against half decent ranged or magic attacks. This will be less of an issue against pure melee armies, but you will need to pick your fights carefully as he can get easily overwhelmed even by scrub troops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainNippon Posted May 15, 2018 Author Share Posted May 15, 2018 14 minutes ago, AverageBoss said: Zombie Dragon is pretty meh unridden imo. Vampire Lord on top as the general to give it access to rerolls , a better armor save, and healing, is far more potent. Unridden, the Terrorgheist is a much better choice. Skeletons work best in units of 40 with spears. They get more attacks, they keep those attacks for longer, they are less likely to completely disintegrate upon impact, and you get a 40 point discount. If you are not running them as 40, Dire wolves are a better pick imo (though I would use Fenrisian Wolves for their models). Such a unit will also get a bigger benefit from you lord. The TG/Zombie Dragon would get +4 attacks if it benefited from both your attack buff, the skeletons would get an extra 80 attacks (on top of the 121 they already have)! Combine this with a Necromancer to let them attack twice in one combat round (up to 402 total attacks). Speaking of which, Necromancers are pretty much a necessity with undead. I highly recommend at least 1. If you don't like the actual model, you can make some nice ones out of the College Arcane box. For Legion of Night specifically, Morgahast Harbingers and Terrorghiests are your best ambushing units. The former for their long charge, the latter for scream range. I prefer Halberds on the Morghasts, as undead lacks rending in general. You will want to keep your Vampire hidden behind terrain for most of the game. The foot vampire is VERY fragile and will be shot off the board almost instantaneously against half decent ranged or magic attacks. This will be less of an issue against pure melee armies, but you will need to pick your fights carefully as he can get easily overwhelmed even by scrub troops. That's a great writeup, thanks! So Terrorgheist and Necro it is. The Vampire on foot seems a bit fragile indeed, so how about giving him The Shard of Night instead of the Curseblade? If I want to make use of Unholy Impetus, I definitely want him in combat As for the Skellington horde, I definitely see your point, but my initial idea was that the Terrorgheist and the Vampire can both fly and get where they need to be much faster that the Skellies would - especially with the potential to Ambush. On the other hand, Vanhels is a thing, too. I guess I can chose what to buff depending on the situation. Vampire Lord 140 Necromancer 110 40 Skeleton Warriors 280 Terrorgheist 300 ____________________________ 830 points For the remaining 170 points, how about a unit of Vargheists? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobjen99 Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 You need to fill the battleline tax, in 1000 pt games you need 2 battlelines . I would recomend direwolfs, they are fast and good for grabbing objectives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainNippon Posted May 15, 2018 Author Share Posted May 15, 2018 23 minutes ago, Tobjen99 said: You need to fill the battleline tax, in 1000 pt games you need 2 battlelines . I would recomend direwolfs, they are fast and good for grabbing objectives. Thanks for pointing that out! I'm not a fan of the direwolves miniatures, so I'd rather get a small unit of skellies with Swords to guard the Necromancer. Allegiance: Legion of Night LEADERS Vampire Lord (140) - General - Command Trait : Unholy Impetus - Flying Horror - Artefact : Shard of Night - Lore of the Vampires : Soulpike Necromancer (110) - Lore of the Deathmages : Overwhelming Dread UNITS 40 x Skeleton Warriors (280) -Ancient Spears 10 x Skeleton Warriors (80) -Ancient Blades 2 x Bat Swarms (80) BEHEMOTHS Zombie Dragon (300) TOTAL: 990/1000 WOUNDS: 84 LEADERS: 2/4 BATTLELINES: 2 (2+) BEHEMOTHS: 1/2 ARTILLERY: 0/2 ALLIES: 0 / 200 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 7 hours ago, CaptainNippon said: Thanks for pointing that out! I'm not a fan of the direwolves miniatures, so I'd rather get a small unit of skellies with Swords to guard the Necromancer. 5 wolves are faster, stronger, and sturdier than 10 skeletons. Also leaves you enough points for a 2nd Necromancer (those buffs and debuffs can swing games). As far as models go, check these out instead:https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Space-Wolves-Fenrisian-Wolf-Pack-2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainNippon Posted May 16, 2018 Author Share Posted May 16, 2018 2 hours ago, AverageBoss said: 5 wolves are faster, stronger, and sturdier than 10 skeletons. Also leaves you enough points for a 2nd Necromancer (those buffs and debuffs can swing games). As far as models go, check these out instead:https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Space-Wolves-Fenrisian-Wolf-Pack-2017 I suppose I can make those work well enough – thanks a lot! Allegiance: Legion of Night LEADERS Vampire Lord (140) - General - Command Trait : Unholy Impetus - Flying Horror - Artefact : Shard of Night - Lore of the Vampires : Soulpike Necromancer (110) - Lore of the Deathmages : Overwhelming Dread Necromancer (110) - Lore of the Deathmages : Decrepify UNITS 40 x Skeleton Warriors (280) -Ancient Spears 5 x Dire Wolves (60) BEHEMOTHS Zombie Dragon (300) TOTAL: 1000/1000 WOUNDS: 79 LEADERS: 3/4 BATTLELINES: 2 (2+) BEHEMOTHS: 1/2 ARTILLERY: 0/2 ALLIES: 0 / 200 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralZero Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 Well, money wise, those wolves cost double than dire wolves. You have 10 (2 units!) dire wolves in the box. This is the cheapest (yet efficient) battle line you can imagine. The only thing that I don't know: are the bases of dire wolves round/elliptic or rectangular (as shown at GW) ? Someone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainNippon Posted May 16, 2018 Author Share Posted May 16, 2018 5 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: Well, money wise, those wolves cost double than dire wolves. You have 10 (2 units!) dire wolves in the box. This is the cheapest (yet efficient) battle line you can imagine. The only thing that I don't know: are the bases of dire wolves round/elliptic or rectangular (as shown at GW) ? Someone? I usually buy second hand anyway, so pricing is less of an issue. I found 10 Fenris Wolves for 25€, which is good enough in my book. I'd rather spend a few more bucks and field the models I actually like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoalaSnok Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 12 minutes ago, GeneralZero said: Well, money wise, those wolves cost double than dire wolves. You have 10 (2 units!) dire wolves in the box. This is the cheapest (yet efficient) battle line you can imagine. The only thing that I don't know: are the bases of dire wolves round/elliptic or rectangular (as shown at GW) ? Someone? The bases are rectangular, so you need to buy 2x5 oval bases as well. Still cheaper than the fenrisian wolves, and honestly you should buy oval bases for them too if you want to play them legally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave8210 Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 Can someone give my a breakdown on this 402 attacks. With the best will in the world I get 322 attacks which is still a lot! 40 skellies x 1 attack + 80 attack for number of models + 1 for seneschal + 40 for vampire command ability = 161 doubled for vanhals danse = 322 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainNippon Posted May 16, 2018 Author Share Posted May 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, Dave8210 said: Can someone give my a breakdown on this 402 attacks. With the best will in the world I get 322 attacks which is still a lot! 40 Skellies = 120 attacks +40 for Blood Feast (Command ability) = 160 +40 für Unholy Impetus (Legion of Night Command Trait)= 200 +1 for Seneschal =201 x2 for Vanhels = 402 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted May 16, 2018 Share Posted May 16, 2018 59 minutes ago, Dave8210 said: Can someone give my a breakdown on this 402 attacks. With the best will in the world I get 322 attacks which is still a lot! 40 skellies x 1 attack + 80 attack for number of models + 1 for seneschal + 40 for vampire command ability = 161 doubled for vanhals danse = 322 Skeletons get +1 attack at 20+ and +2 attacks at 30+. So a 40 man unit will have 3 attacks each +1 for the champ, for a total of 121. Add 80 for the double attack buffs = 201. Pile in and attack twice with Necro = 402. 8 hours ago, KoalaSnok said: The bases are rectangular, so you need to buy 2x5 oval bases as well. Still cheaper than the fenrisian wolves, and honestly you should buy oval bases for them too if you want to play them legally. Until GW bothers to rebox them, any guess on their base size is just that, a guess. There are comparable models both on ovals and on 40s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainNippon Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 After digging a bit further into the Battletome, I'm not quit sure anymore whether LoN is the right way to go with the units I want (not) to use: - The Zombie Dragon is inferior to the TG when used with ambush rules - I will not use Morghasts, which really shine with ambush rules - My Winged Vampire Lord is lacking Protection So another method would be to use Legion of Sacrament instead. With Shroud of Darkness, my Vampire General becomes a lot more survivable against enemy shooting. I wonder how Emissary of the Master compares to Mastery of Death. A guaranteed 3" at the start of the turn might be better than a reroll. Legion of Sacrament does complement my two necros very well, too, with the +1 on cast rolls. I like the big block of skellies, but somehow I feel like I want more small units to make better use of the resummoning abilities. On the other hand, throwing a 40 strong Unit of Skellies into anything and just bringing it back in full strength is a tempting prospect as well... Allegiance: Legion of Sacrament LEADERS Vampire Lord (140) General Command Trait : Mastery of Death Flying Horror Artefact : Shroud of Darkness Lore of the Vampires : Vile Transference Necromancer (110) Lore of the Deathmages : Overwhelming Dread Necromancer (110) Lore of the Deathmages : Fading Vigour UNITS 5 x Dire Wolves (60) 40 x Skeleton Warriors (280) Ancient Blades BEHEMOTHS Zombie Dragon (300) TOTAL: 1000/1000 WOUNDS: 79 LEADERS: 3/4 BATTLELINES: 2 (2+) BEHEMOTHS: 1/2 ARTILLERY: 0/2 ALLIES: 0 / 200 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 Playing at only 1,000 points with undead can be REALLY rough. It pretty much takes that just to get the staples of a working list (Necromancer, skeleton horde, some type of hammer, a 2nd battleline, a 2nd hero with Deathly Invocation). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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