L.Bromley Posted December 22, 2017 Share Posted December 22, 2017 Hey guys so I’m heading to slaughter at the end of January and I’m torn between lists so looking for a few pointers. This is the list I’m thinking of taking. Neferata vamp lord on abysal terror - cursed book 30 dire wolves 5 dire wolve 5 dire wolve 4 morghast archi mourgul 2000 on the nose. plan would be use the block of wolves on your front line as your first wave, use the AT spell on them and a mystic shield, also nef’s Ignore rend gives these 20” move with a 4+ save ignore rend (ideally there would be a corpse cart near by but I can’t squeeze it in) if Nef runs then the wolves could also be -1 to hit. The rest moves in a bubble behind with a big debut to hit, Nef, mourngul and cursed book can lead to -3. Any thoughts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillofNagash Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 I like this, have you had any practice games? I am working on a similar list, all theory at this point, but would love to hear how yours ends up working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Bromley Posted December 23, 2017 Author Share Posted December 23, 2017 I’ve been playing with blocks of 20 wolves for a while and they have been surprisingly effective, yes skellies and zombies are more reliable and durable but the movement is so important they win out for me. i have used the Nef-mourngul combo loads and despite the mourngul getting worse its still really strong, -2 to hit is really strong. in GHB1 I played loads of sayl’s + something nasty (usually stormfiends) and wanted to recreate it hence the abysal terror and morghast although people don’t like playing compendium models. my wolves were originally on 40’s but I’m rebasing them on cav basing so I can put them side on, one for board space (30 wolves can stretch across the entire board) the other reason being when the wolves tank and the rest of the army can catch up the Archai and mourgul have 2” reach so can fight over the top. Another key point is that ALL the big hitters, Archai-mourngul-abysal terror can fly, so wolves hold everything up and the big boys just pop over the top and mop up. in practice games the army has been 80% successful, obviously it can fall apart to strong first turn shooting and the target Neferata or the Abysal terror. If that’s the sort of army your playing against I try and big up the Archai (24 wounds with a 4+, +5, +6 save) or even the mournful as most people have had a bad experience of one. final point is the real hero’s of this army, and that is the two 5’s of wolves, the army has so many distraction pieces that these guys will just sit on objective scoring you points all day long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonnaWorkForFood Posted December 26, 2017 Share Posted December 26, 2017 Cheers mate , I can see where this is going and i play a very similar list . The thing is that you are going to strugle really bad with gunlines . Tbh i would probably lose the mourngul since i find it really expensive for a 400 points tarpit . I always include a 40 block of skeletons or two with a wight king and a unit of bat swarm . Imo they pack a better punch than the mourngul and are just as resilient and you ll still have -3 in shooting . The thing is tho that they are slow as hell . -3 is really good but it is a one trick pony, once someone learns how it works there are ways to go around it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Bromley Posted December 26, 2017 Author Share Posted December 26, 2017 8 hours ago, GonnaWorkForFood said: -3 is really good but it is a one trick pony, once someone learns how it works there are ways to go around it Your right, it is a bit of a one trick pony but I only play in tournaments with this list ( I usually play very narrative driven lists when just playing casually) and in a tournament all games are one trick pony lead. gun lines are an issue but I have found that I’m in combat in turn one so the gun line is not reall that scary, unless I’m playing free people. the mourngul has its bonuses, but I’m thinking of dropping him for Arkhan (yes the skellies block is a really solid choice it just lacks the speed that the rest of the army has, and I think movement is more important than resilience) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonnaWorkForFood Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 21 hours ago, L.Bromley said: Your right, it is a bit of a one trick pony but I only play in tournaments with this list ( I usually play very narrative driven lists when just playing casually) and in a tournament all games are one trick pony lead. gun lines are an issue but I have found that I’m in combat in turn one so the gun line is not reall that scary, unless I’m playing free people. the mourngul has its bonuses, but I’m thinking of dropping him for Arkhan (yes the skellies block is a really solid choice it just lacks the speed that the rest of the army has, and I think movement is more important than resilience) More so than resilience i find the skeletons to be a decent attack choice . If your archai die your damage output is cut by half . I understand that this type of army needs to be aggressive to build its defenses and speed is key to that . In my meta tho i play a lot vs sylvaneth , stormcasts and mixed order lists , so i had to minimize the drops because my lady nef was getting sniped before being able to build defenses and the armys potential never reached its peak. All in all its rather solid list but with so little threats it will go down to a battle of attrition and this is were i think skeletons would help . Either way the nerf in mournguls rend did hurt a lot so i find my self taking it in more casual games since i find the model awesome looking . Im really interested how it will go and im looking forward for a battle report if you feel up to it . Best regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Bromley Posted December 27, 2017 Author Share Posted December 27, 2017 So finished a game earlier today against free people’s army and took a slightly tweaked list. Neferata Arkhan Vamp lord on abysal terror - cursed book 30 dire wolves 5 dire wolves 5 dire wolves 1 corpse cart 4 Morghast Archai so my oppenent had 3 blocks of handgunners 2x20 & 1x30, 2 hero on griffons. 20 greatswords, the machine with the swirly planets that gives plus 1 to hit and some foot hero’s. we was playing the scenario star strike. He had a formation which meant he had the choice of first or second but was out of range with everything so gave me the first turn, I had deployed with my 30 wolves in a long line with my bases turned horizontally so it ran along the entire board, I then placed a pack of wolves either side then a sort of half moon of Archai in front, Nef on the left the ATpushed up behind the Archai and Arkhan on the right. Corpse cart was on the far left to give boosts for Nefs and AT spell but also where most of the terrain was to help provide cover. turn one went exactly as planned I took damned terrain on the 30 wolves then got all the spells off (no thanks to the corpse cart) Nef cast dark mist (on a five) and used her command ability, Arkhan gave them a mystic shield and the AT cast hellish vigour (on a 4) , all super charged up they flew 20 over all the terrain that should of blocked them leaving a 5” charge (spoilers, they made it), the Archai ran so did the corpse cart and mortarchs and AT just slotted into position. The wolves went into all three units of handgunners but they get to shoot the enermy as they charged, as my opponent told me abou5 all the bonuses they get I was really worried it was 2s then 2s, rend 1. Then I counted telling him all units are minus 1 because of Nef being so close and I ignore rend and I had a 3+ save as I tailed the wolves so I stayed within 9” of the cart, he hit with about 45 gunners and then did 37 wounds, my save roll was strong (really strong) only taking 7 wounds. Combat went in my favour as it was now 3s and 3s, killed 23 gunners in combat and took another 6 wounds. I lost 2 wolves to battle shock but the gunner took a pasting as they are bravery 5 losing 19 more to battle shock across the 3 units. his turn he failed to cast with the whirly machine, then moved both griffins over the wolves and on either flank of my Archai, a good charge and he was into my squishy center, in shooting he ignored the wolves and put the 20+ shots into the Archai killing 1 and doing 5 wounds to another. Combat and he moved the great swords into the wolves on the right, then the giffin on the left rolled high and went into the back of Nef but the one on the right rolled low and had to move into the Archai, he did four wound to Nef, her minus 1 to hit pretty much saved her, then pilled into the other griffin with my AT, barely did any damage but now he was at minus two to hit because of the book and Nef, he couldn’t touch the Archai and in return they did 12 wounds. The great swords were surprisingly good despite the -1 to hit as they got bonuses to, they killed 5 wolves and I lost another 2 to the gunners but I killed 9 gunners clearing the right unit, I lost 3 to battle shock and he to lost a hand full. Priority went to the free people and I was worried but the wolves still had all the buffs and was proving an absolute tar pit, he cast a spell or shoot with his planet whirly thing and it killed 8 wolves(brutal) leaving only 8 but now out of range of the corpse cart, his gunners killed the wounded Archai and put 3 wounds on another, combat was a slog fest, the Griffin vs Nef went first but only did 3 wounds he fluffed the lot, Arkhan piled into the other griffin and finished him off, the sad part was seeing how Neffs -1 bubble was drastically reduced due to damage and now no longer protecting the wolves, the great swords went in and despite ignoring rend and having a three up the gunners and great swords killed 7 leaving the lone pup, two Archai piled into the griffin for 6 wounds and Nef finished him off with her jet dagger. my turn two and I buffed the two Archai with a shield and dark mist and the AT hellish vigour and moved and parked them near the plant machine, Arkhan did curse of years on the foot general doing 4MW and then popped him off with an Arcaine bolt, the AT went into the great swords along with Arkhan and my two small wolf packs moved into position to claim both objectives, Neff moved behind Arkhan to offer the debuff, the great swords flopped at minus two and 13 great swords fell to the AT and Arkhan, before I could attack with the Archai my opponent called the game and explained why, the great swords would of fled to Battle shock and the thinks the Archai would of done over the planet machine. overal the plan worked brilliantly, now I’m not an idiot and I know not ever game will play out that way but I was really impressed with how it went, you need to be super aggressive and my opponent pointed out that I should use Arkhans ability to cast other death spells at plus 3 if the cart is in range to guarantee that all the buffs go off as planned. I was shocked at how gooey my combat bubble was, it hits like a tonne of bricks but anything solid hitting it and I would of been in real trouble. have organised two games at the weekend, playing Overlords and then stormcast with stardrakes, any tips would be fantastic as I imagine these are the kinda things that I will be facing in Sheffield at the end of January. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonnaWorkForFood Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 13 hours ago, L.Bromley said: So finished a game earlier today against free people’s army and took a slightly tweaked list. Neferata Arkhan Vamp lord on abysal terror - cursed book 30 dire wolves 5 dire wolves 5 dire wolves 1 corpse cart 4 Morghast Archai so my oppenent had 3 blocks of handgunners 2x20 & 1x30, 2 hero on griffons. 20 greatswords, the machine with the swirly planets that gives plus 1 to hit and some foot hero’s. we was playing the scenario star strike. He had a formation which meant he had the choice of first or second but was out of range with everything so gave me the first turn, I had deployed with my 30 wolves in a long line with my bases turned horizontally so it ran along the entire board, I then placed a pack of wolves either side then a sort of half moon of Archai in front, Nef on the left the ATpushed up behind the Archai and Arkhan on the right. Corpse cart was on the far left to give boosts for Nefs and AT spell but also where most of the terrain was to help provide cover. turn one went exactly as planned I took damned terrain on the 30 wolves then got all the spells off (no thanks to the corpse cart) Nef cast dark mist (on a five) and used her command ability, Arkhan gave them a mystic shield and the AT cast hellish vigour (on a 4) , all super charged up they flew 20 over all the terrain that should of blocked them leaving a 5” charge (spoilers, they made it), the Archai ran so did the corpse cart and mortarchs and AT just slotted into position. The wolves went into all three units of handgunners but they get to shoot the enermy as they charged, as my opponent told me abou5 all the bonuses they get I was really worried it was 2s then 2s, rend 1. Then I counted telling him all units are minus 1 because of Nef being so close and I ignore rend and I had a 3+ save as I tailed the wolves so I stayed within 9” of the cart, he hit with about 45 gunners and then did 37 wounds, my save roll was strong (really strong) only taking 7 wounds. Combat went in my favour as it was now 3s and 3s, killed 23 gunners in combat and took another 6 wounds. I lost 2 wolves to battle shock but the gunner took a pasting as they are bravery 5 losing 19 more to battle shock across the 3 units. his turn he failed to cast with the whirly machine, then moved both griffins over the wolves and on either flank of my Archai, a good charge and he was into my squishy center, in shooting he ignored the wolves and put the 20+ shots into the Archai killing 1 and doing 5 wounds to another. Combat and he moved the great swords into the wolves on the right, then the giffin on the left rolled high and went into the back of Nef but the one on the right rolled low and had to move into the Archai, he did four wound to Nef, her minus 1 to hit pretty much saved her, then pilled into the other griffin with my AT, barely did any damage but now he was at minus two to hit because of the book and Nef, he couldn’t touch the Archai and in return they did 12 wounds. The great swords were surprisingly good despite the -1 to hit as they got bonuses to, they killed 5 wolves and I lost another 2 to the gunners but I killed 9 gunners clearing the right unit, I lost 3 to battle shock and he to lost a hand full. Priority went to the free people and I was worried but the wolves still had all the buffs and was proving an absolute tar pit, he cast a spell or shoot with his planet whirly thing and it killed 8 wolves(brutal) leaving only 8 but now out of range of the corpse cart, his gunners killed the wounded Archai and put 3 wounds on another, combat was a slog fest, the Griffin vs Nef went first but only did 3 wounds he fluffed the lot, Arkhan piled into the other griffin and finished him off, the sad part was seeing how Neffs -1 bubble was drastically reduced due to damage and now no longer protecting the wolves, the great swords went in and despite ignoring rend and having a three up the gunners and great swords killed 7 leaving the lone pup, two Archai piled into the griffin for 6 wounds and Nef finished him off with her jet dagger. my turn two and I buffed the two Archai with a shield and dark mist and the AT hellish vigour and moved and parked them near the plant machine, Arkhan did curse of years on the foot general doing 4MW and then popped him off with an Arcaine bolt, the AT went into the great swords along with Arkhan and my two small wolf packs moved into position to claim both objectives, Neff moved behind Arkhan to offer the debuff, the great swords flopped at minus two and 13 great swords fell to the AT and Arkhan, before I could attack with the Archai my opponent called the game and explained why, the great swords would of fled to Battle shock and the thinks the Archai would of done over the planet machine. overal the plan worked brilliantly, now I’m not an idiot and I know not ever game will play out that way but I was really impressed with how it went, you need to be super aggressive and my opponent pointed out that I should use Arkhans ability to cast other death spells at plus 3 if the cart is in range to guarantee that all the buffs go off as planned. I was shocked at how gooey my combat bubble was, it hits like a tonne of bricks but anything solid hitting it and I would of been in real trouble. have organised two games at the weekend, playing Overlords and then stormcast with stardrakes, any tips would be fantastic as I imagine these are the kinda things that I will be facing in Sheffield at the end of January. Seems like a fun game !! Now for ScE i havent had any experience vs a stardrake list but i think that your best bet for that is to tarpit it and spam arkhans spell and bolts since it can easily go to +2 with reroll . From what i ve seen if you see a hurricanum you ll have to give it priority cause it can spam mortals with no to hit . Did my nef 18 mortals last game . Plus it gives those checky judicators +1 to hit and most likely they will be out of range of your bubble . In case of a hammerstrike target the procecutors aka pizza boys first or they deliver the paladins closer than 9' and since they probably wont fail the charge they can dish some pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xspire Posted December 29, 2017 Share Posted December 29, 2017 The VLoAT sticks out like a sore thumb. It's a pretty big points sink after the points increase. Yes it has a great spell but it's not worth that many points at all, especially in a tournament list. It will go down like a bag of bricks to any army that has decent MW capability, all they need to do is focus it to wipe out your OTP approach, which is why it's usually best to not go for OTP in a tournament unless you have multiple ways of getting it to be successful. Also Arkhan is 20 points more and look how much better he is. From the looks of it your list could really use that 300 points elsewhere - especially with that many DWs and Arkhan, a mounted Necromancer (or two) seems to be a good choice. (Also synergises with the corpse cart). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kaven5lave Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Gonna piggyback this thread if that’s cool to ask for some advice on my GA Death list. I’m just cobbling together stuff I have. I’m not expecting it to win anything, just wondering if there’re any huge flaws in it: AGKoT Arkhan the Black Necromancer Crypt Ghast Courtier Crypt Haunter Courtier 20x Crypt Ghouls 20x Crypt Ghouls 20x Skellies 3x Crypt Horrors 2x Morghast Harbingers? 1970/2000 Basically I bought the Death Battleforce, realised it wasn’t great, and wanted to shoehorn some FEC in there. Any feedback much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageBoss Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 3 hours ago, 5kaven5lave said: Gonna piggyback this thread if that’s cool to ask for some advice on my GA Death list. I’m just cobbling together stuff I have. I’m not expecting it to win anything, just wondering if there’re any huge flaws in it: AGKoT Arkhan the Black Necromancer Crypt Ghast Courtier Crypt Haunter Courtier 20x Crypt Ghouls 20x Crypt Ghouls 20x Skellies 3x Crypt Horrors 2x Morghast Harbingers? 1970/2000 Basically I bought the Death Battleforce, realised it wasn’t great, and wanted to shoehorn some FEC in there. Any feedback much appreciated. I would at the very least split the skeletons into two 10 man units (20 man is straight up the most inefficient way to run them), and merge the 2 ghoul units into a 40 man unit. Not sure Arkhan is doing much for your list. Neferata might be a better choice. I don't feel you have enough horrors to justify spending the point on their courtier. At 3 man, they are likely to be killed very quickly before any regen attempt can take place. Archai might be better than Harbingers for you list, as they bring punch that you are lacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kaven5lave Posted January 1, 2018 Share Posted January 1, 2018 Thanks dude, that’s mega helpful. Splitting the Skellies and merging the Ghouls, wanted to take Archai in the first place so will take them. Will swap the Haunter Courtier for 3 more Horrors I think. Keeping Arkhan keeps me under 2k and he looks cool as fook so gonna retain him for rule of cool purposes and to maintain my Skeletons and Ghouls theme. Plus that Curse if Years spell is amazingly fluffy. Thanks again for the advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Bromley Posted January 4, 2018 Author Share Posted January 4, 2018 So last night I played against Kharadron Overlords ??????????????? over by turn two that is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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