Kairos Tejedestinos
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Posts posted by Kairos Tejedestinos
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On 6/21/2019 at 7:32 PM, TreelordRecent said:
I would just add that there may be a case to have a unit of 6 swords if you play dreadwood. As dreadwood allows you to place a unit 9 away from an enemy you may be able to get them all in, in turn one... but in most other scenarios 6 scythes may be easier to use.
Following some inspiration from the forum I have built a unit of 9 scythes to make the most out of dreadwood and the archrevenant... I am still to see how they perform.
If you are playing 6, would still take scythes 10 out of 10 times. They allow you to have a much smaller front and keep a high attack density, and they are also much better at holding ground when your opponent charges you and you decide to get the reroll saves. Also there are tons of abilities that can ignore rend -1, or they can reroll failed armor save rolls, and the -2 there is much better.
And from there, if you choose to take units of 3 kurnouth hunter with swords, it depends on the list, but you have to take into account that the only way to bypass the only 1 teleport for turn is with treelords, so you have to plan why you have them in the list if you do so. Anyways a fully buffed unit of winterleaf kurnouth hunters with swords can deal some really nasty damage.
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Ok, i am sure this has been discussed before, so i apologize for being disruptive if it was.
Few questions:
- With the new book, someone got to see where we deploy our wyldwoods ? Is it our territory or the whole table?
- How exactly does it work for the new deployment ? Do we deploy trees after every scenery has been deployed ? Or can we deploy wyldwoods as one of our "big scenery" options? I found this very confusing today playing a game, neither my trees or the moon for goblins could be deployed because of how we laid out the table.
- If not, how are we suppossed to even have a wyldwood on the table
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23 hours ago, Pandamina said:
Pinks at 180 pts and reductions across the board for us. Tier S army hype?
The biggest change are brimstone costing 60 points instead of 70. Changehost here we go again.
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42 minutes ago, Aezeal said:
Geminids will be 60 points..
And the cogs 80.
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5 minutes ago, kenshin620 said:
I've learn to never be too optimistic whenever gw mentions big changes outside of an actual codex/BT.
Anyone here remember 40k 5th edition? When they were making "the big faq that was suppose to fix everything" especially in regards to no one having access to Skyfire+Interceptor? That was a funny time.
6th edition. But yeah, that one was so shortlived you could call it an alpha for 7th edition.
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On 6/14/2019 at 7:36 AM, Honk said:
Translations are always tricky, especially when the rules are a bit messy and new madness is piled on top on a regular basis.
At least the FEC book has no blatant mistakes, like I heard from my Khorne buddy 🥳
I have seen translation with erronous numbers.
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So in your opinion a majtority of the competitive players only want to play one dimensional easy armies, correct?
Also, just stop with the intentionally, it does mean nothing. Yes, it could be intentional, but who cares about wether it is intentional or not. We are consumers, we can criticize something wether it is something our plastic crack dealers did intentionally or not.
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1 minute ago, Dead Scribe said:
I was referring more to a mindset. There is a competitive mindset in miniature tabletop gaming that is attracted to one dimensional play and they are catering to that with some of their armies. Thats what I believe anyway. I don't think it is unintentional or an accident.
Sure, but you are changing your mind. First you said that you have to appeal to everybody. That would mean making different archtypical army lists to work with varying degrees of expertise required to compete, not only to one type of player.
And my point is that the one dimensional play is reaching excessively simple and rewarding levels of competitiveness by bypassing core game mechanics.
Also yeah, nowhere i said it wasn't intentional. It's just how good old power creep reaches silliness.
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40 minutes ago, Dead Scribe said:
Again though, I don't see that as an unintended negative bug in the system, I see that as a known and desired feature for some of their armies to possess. The same development mindset exists in magic the gathering cards. To be desirable by everyone you have to appeal to everyone, and like it or not, some people want really competitive forces without having to go through a lot to learn how to use them properly. What we'd call one dimensional gameplay.
For people that want more of a challenge, other B or C tier armies exist.
In magic you don't have only one dimensional decks on Tier A, S or however you want to call tier 1, and even extreme aggro decks require interaction between both players while playing, being card draw randomness the one limiting factor.
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The focus on CA is counterproducent to the argument to be honest. It's not only the CA, but everything around it.
The problem with such CAs or abilities that alter the regular flow of the combat phase (you go / i go) is that it will be lead to broken gameplay really fast once you start to give it to units that can evaporate half or more their points per turn. I won't say that FEC are OP because of their terrorgheist, but it's a very crappy mechanic to be in the game in such state. Not only the CA, but attacking at the beginning of the phase.
Another example are the hearthguard berserkers completely buffed. I won't say that block is OP, but sure as hell it makes everything possible for trash one dimensional gameplay.
Imo, attack at the start of the phase shouldn't exist as CA or ability. Only spell, or gimmicky allegiance. Also the attack twice CAs should be like the slaneesh one, where you don't get to attack twice inmediatly. And sure as hell i wouldn't give both at the same time to any army because then he is likely to attack 4 times before his opponent gets to attack one completely breaking a core mechanic in the combat phase that is players taking turns to attack and making important choices in which order to activate.
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On 5/30/2019 at 3:43 PM, daviseford said:
Basically, yes: Hit print in your browser and you will get print-friendly formatting. As far as a button that says PRINT - I'm working on it
This is great. Will you update the sylvaneth one when the battletome is released ?
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When theorycrafting about what changes can the GHB bring, remember that those are printed months in advance. I expect idoneth, LoN and DoK to take a hit in the units that are taken most commonly. No horde discount or a price bump for combat eels are a given. The important part is where they put the discounts
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Gnarlroot
TLA, regrowth @ 300
Branchwraith, chalice, nurturing, throne of vines @ 805 Spites @ 60
5 Spites @ 606 Kurnouth hunter scythes @ 400
Endless spell
Spiteswarm Hive @ 50
Vortex @ 40Branchwraith vortex, throne of vines and spiteswarm hive (if you get vines in, your opponent is going to have a very hard time to dispel her). From there on, she will be getting dryads and trees every turn. TLA silent communion trees, casts his own spell for extra damage or verdant. Kurnouth hunters and TLA teleport after being buffed in the hero phase by the spiteswarm and wreck stuff.
1000 point games are kind of weird tho.
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Yeah, probably i am being unjustifiably bitter
1 hour ago, Aezeal said:This is somewhat unfair to gw.. It's not ambiguous. As it's written you have Verdant and the a table of Deepwood spells.. nothing at all says Verdant is a Deepwood Spell. The heading of Deepwood starts below Verdant too.
I think if you deploy 6 in a double line of 3 - ends touching- you'll still have some room for teleporting within 6" of those forests. It will also keep the area small so you can work roind other terrain. I think this is what might help dreadwood.
Non gnarlroot and chalice doesn't seem like an option. The combination of spellsinger and chalice can't be done.
You are right, i am overly excited, i should stop for today
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- I mean exactly that. That we don't get TLAs to have a chance to summon every turn anymore for free, so we rely on Verdant, Acorn and our different casting artifacts to reliabily get woods out, and no TLA help (outside once per battle).
- The unit must be wholly within 6" of the awakened wyldwoods, not only within. No more conga-lines. Same for teleports. Obviously this was coming for Sylvaneth as it did for most other armies, so it isn't unexpected imo, but something to take into account.
- Yeah Verdant not being directly clarified as Lore of the deepwood is somewhat weird. How it is written is really ambiguous.
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Also, only one unit can navigate the realmroots at the time, right? Only the Treelord types kind ignores this.
And another question, i am missing the page on how to deploy our first awakened wyldwood, how does it work now.
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About the list i posted earlier, from the two games i got today, most of it is about gnarlroot:
- Damage output is barely enough. I can see it having problems with more horde centric armies with good negate wounds rules (such as DoK), but it can also snipe the character that improves those saves. There is potential and it is a playstyle that fits me.
- Woods occupy way less now (i am taking for granted that you can only summon about the size of 1 citadel wood at the time, since we don't know yet what size we can accomplish with the new trees, and their layout will be more limiting, i prefer to take for granted it will be worse than it will be just to get used to, if i am wrong, good, if not, i am already prepared), and withouth TLA's ability to get woods every turn, it's more harder to fill the gaps in scenery early before your opponent attempts to bully you. I find that the ability to get guaranteed or almost guaranteed woods every turn is fundamental to our mobility. Dreadwood can bypass it, but then they require CPs.
- I see it really hard to get 30 dryads being effective while remaining within woods for the -1. It requires a very particular gameplay and mission objectives to work.
- Same happens for teleports and big units, not to speak about how easy it was to teleport unit arounds with little troubles, we will find ourselves more constrained.
- Drycha is a beast, full stop. Her role has changed, nothing wrong with that. Her shooting being 18" know means you don't need to commit her as hard as before, and her shooting is very good at sniping support characters when in gnarlwood ( average 3,8 MW + 5,1 rend -1 wounds against characters with the lookout sir!, most characters just melt). Her spell is better, but i didn't face an army where i could take advantadge of it, but with the new book we have always 3 known spells, so that isn't really a problem, it just gives us more tools for our toobox.
- Branchwraith with Throne of Vines + Staff is amazing. You are getting woods and dryads every turn very easilly, outside turn 1 (where you can actually use different spells with other characters). Chalice is also really nice (you also get to use it for dispels ^^), i am thinking ways to incorporate it with someone in a vortex, we will see. For example for a non Gnarlroot Branchwych general trait spellsinger, chalice in a vortex with deadly harvest and unleash spites could put some serious MW damage out at the ranges of 15" to 21" inches, even tho i find myself having such a hard time dropping Gnarlroot for now.
- Rerrolling ones from gnarlroot really make our shooty stuff stand out much more. Not only the kurnouth hunters, but Drycha and treeman get use out of it. And then in the combat phase is not bad at all. I like it because all our characters are support characters with an extra buff by default.
With that being said i will probably make more changes to the list, but i always prefer to play it for a while until i get more used to it, to feel to what i really think needs to be changed. For starters the Lords of the clan battallion is the first to go, and forget about the vesperal gem. I really like the branchwraith casting two spells, and with gnarlroot, i am forced to take the chalice, , something i feel it will constraint my teleports to get dryads and woods where i want. That would free me 560 points if i remove battallion, TLA and Treelord.
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On 5/30/2019 at 6:32 PM, Sleboda said:
Yeah, at that price I've gone from a guaranteed 'buy the range at launch' stance to 'probably won't get any' stance, unfortunately.
I was really very excited to get them, but now they are just too pricey for what they are. Remember, to use them as designed you are going to burn through pots very quickly. So, not only do you get paint jobs that are lower quality than if you used standard paints and a traditional set of techniques, but you pay much more per model in paint cost.
Pass.
To be honest, that depends in the painter. Most people will get the same or better results with some experience on contrast paints than they will with the regular method i way less time.
So the time they save with better results is something to take into account. For the most experienced painter i am sure some pots might be useful, but if you already an advanced painter, you tend to have the knowledge to be more resourceful and how to get around to get the effects you want.
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Tomorrow if i have the time (and some actual gameplay) i will answer in more depth @Mirage8112 but the Brainchwraith i don't think it's something you can really drop out, Free screens are too useful to give up, much more than what the branchwych brings to the table. The reason why i feel i need 3 items is because i want atleast 3 things:
1 - Summon trees each turn reliabily. All our mages can summon trees now, having more artifacts spread out to cast it easilly helps this goal.
2 - Summon more dryads each turn . I don't need that much teeth if i can just force my opponent to kill screens and teleport away.
3 - Cast regrowth reliabily with extra heals. Probably the TLA with verdorous harmony should have regrowth for this goal instead ofthe one with the chalice. But then i can't use the verdorous harmony TLA to summon trees neglecting your opponent their dispel when i really want those trees in that spot for sure.
Verdorous harmony is in there just to not lose damage output as i lose hunters. As i said, it's something i want to try out, not set in stone, but i don't see the other spells as important or impactful.
It might be true that the list lacks teeth to even an avoidance list (the point is to be teleporting your units most of the time, that's why LoS isn't really that big of an issue) in that case, i will just get an endless spell to get the +3 charge, and switch the kurnouth hunters to a 6 man scythe unit to act as a hammer. With how the list is laid out i can (in theory) reliabily cast the endless spell and use the teleport to get the kurnouth somewhere to dish out good damage and have the rerolling ones.
Edit : Anyways the criticism is welcomed, don't think i don't appreciate it.
Edit 2 : I think verdorous is an useless spell when it comes to dryads to be honest. The point of the spell is to get an additional kurnouth hunter imo (when it dies yeah), since 1d3 dryads, spites or revenants isn't really that big of a deal.
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About the lists look solid right now. I don't really like the Dreadwood choice for the list tho, harvestboon probably could do better imo. Better trait for durthu, better Command ability most of the time, you could even ignore the Arch-revenant altogether.
Also a question to the english speakers here, can you summon an awakened wyldwood for each TLA your army has, or only one no matter how many TLAs are in your army? If my english is right, it's only 1 wyldwood no matter how many TLAs.
The list i am going to try out first is going to be:
Gnarlroot
Drycha @ 320
TLA, Nurtured by magic, the vesperal gem, regrowth @ 300
TLA, chalice of nectar, verdurous harmony @ 300
Branchwraith, spirit song stave, throne of vines @ 805 Spite revenants @ 60
5 Spite revenants @ 60
5 Spite revenants @ 60
5 Spite revenants @ 603 Kurnouth Hunters with bows @ 200
3 Kurnouth Hunters with bows @ 200
1 Treeman @ 200Battallions
Lords of the clan
OutcastsCP : 2
Total : 2000I chose Gnarlroot for a few reasons:
- Rerolling 1s to hit work with shooting, not only melee. That way i can attempt to play a shooty/magic attrition list (i am a WE player at heart, i love kiting :P), and even if i decide later on to switch the kurnouth to scythes, i don't need to rely on charges or paying 100 points for the arch revenant (which i won't have, thx GW) to get the rerolls. Also drycha rerolling ones on her 20 attack shooting attack is pretty nice.
- Easy extra healing. Vesperal gem + nurtured by magic means 1d3+1d6 auto heal when needed. Or 1d3 heal + other spells. Good thing that now we can summon trees anyways!
- Good casting artifact. Chalice of nectar. I wanted to make a cast heavy list, and we already struggle getting artifacts for all characters.
Now on the list. The idea is use revenants as chaff. The branchwraith will first turn be as far away as possible and cast throne of vines, and then summon some dryads, from there on she will be teleporting (which does not count as movement) and summong driads and trees. TLA's will summon trees of their own and then use their spell. And meanwhile i dedicate myself to score and chip away. Not sure what spell for drycha. Treesong is probably the one i will end up, just to get rerolling to wound on melee, since many things in the army wound on 3+ (even if their damage output is subpar).
Changes that could happen:
I could remove one unit of spite revenants and get endless spell that gives one unit +3 to charges. I think i would so if i changed the kurnouth hunters to a big 6 man scythe unit, but only for that.
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Just to reiterate what @tman3257 has stated.
The Slaneesh FAQ exists for a few different reasons:
- Those rules, as already stated, have the exception built in where no contradiction will happen between strike at the start of the phase and attack at the end of the phase effects.
- Locus happens at the end of the charge phase and Horrible fascination at the start of the combat phase, so you could Locus the Terrorgheist, so he would attack during the combat phase like anybody else, and then at the start of the combat phase you would use horrible fascination to force him to attack at the end of the phase since it wasn't able to attack at the start of the phase. This FAQ corrects that, because you could do it even in your opponent's turn.
About the FAQ : effects "cancelling each other".
If it's our turn, Stomp will cause the FEC player to attack at the end of the phase. Both rules (attack at the start of the phase and attack at the end of the phase can't be fullfilled at the same time or canceled out, therefore the last one in the stack will be the one that will be applied, in this case, the Stomp).
It's very much RAW yeah. I don't think you should have much problems about this.
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Just now, Mirage8112 said:
You quoted the command ability, not the core rule for running:
Correct i missread you and thought you were talking about at the double. But yeah i am positive you are right.
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Just now, Mirage8112 said:
Its the exact same wording as running in the core rules; when you run, you roll a dice and add it to the core move characteristic. They’re just saying you don’t have to roll the dice and auto-run 6”, but it still counts as running.
Not really, i already posted it above. But yeah it is very likely it will count as having run imo, most battallion abilities are being lackluster these days.
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Yep @Warheadsbylink is a fast fella. That was also FAQed for Morathi (Which was the first named character that had that conflict if memory serves me right)
Q: Some of the temples of Khaine require that the general take a specific command trait. What happens if an army is from such a temple and has Morathi as its general? A: Morathi is a named character and therefore cannot have the command trait (she can still be your general).
@Freejack02 indeed the wording is very poor. Let's see how it ends up, because it could be amazing. Durthu moving 21" (yeah, some buffs required... and the thermalcloak) inches would be worth the sight. Just for those interested this is the wording for at the double's command ability which is somewhat relevant imo.
"At the Double: You can use this command ability after you make a run roll for a friendly unit that is within 6" of a friendly Hero, or 12" of a friendly Hero that is a general. If you do so, the run roll is treated as being a 6."
AoS 2 - Sylvaneth Discussion
in Sylvaneth
Posted
Pretty sure with the new models they will be smaller in that regard. Problem is, when will that be