DanielFM
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Posts posted by DanielFM
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11 hours ago, Acid_Nine said:
I think maybe get rid of the ishlaen guard and split up the thralls into two squads? spitballing here for it, but maybe you can get some allies to replace the ishlean, like maybe some of those daughters of khaine snaeks?
I agree the Ishlaen must go. Then, the decision to split the Morrsar or Thralls is difficult: the big unit of Morrsar is better with the Lord of Tides, but part of the quirk of the list is dropping 20 Thralls + Reavers + Eidolon -two thrall units don't help with that.
Good thing with allies is that I can:
A) field an Allopex as a count-as Scourgerunner Chariot and get to use the cool models with pretty unimpressive rules (but cheap points)
B) field 5 Heartrenders, which don't fit a lot the theme of my army but have super cool rules.
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Hi, with the thread dead I may as well spam with another list which, in retrospective, is quite similar to Akhelian Snail's 😂
However, mine is a bit unorthodox as I will go Briomdar and put the Reavers, chunky Thrall block and Aspect of the Sea in the enemy's face. Tsunami of Terror + Tide of Fear to ruin someone's day. Not-optimal but I want something to spice us up (beside the tried and tested Reverse Fuethan).
Only problem I have? It's 2040 points, and I don't know where to make the cut. Basically everything is untouchable but the Ishlaen and Morrsar. Either I remove the 3 Ishlaen and split the Morrsar in two 3 strong units (100 spare points) or remove 3 Morrsar (120 spare points). I know I don't give you much choice 😆 which one seems less weak?
I know something similar could be done with Steed of Tides and a different Enclave, but I would lose a spell. Plus, this gives me flexibility in case I decide to ambush other units depending on the opponent.
Without further addo, the list:
Allegiance: Idoneth Deepkin
- Enclave: Briomdar
Leaders
Isharann Soulscryer (100)
Akhelian King (240)
- General
- Trait: Born From Agony
- Artefact: Cloud of Midnight
Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Sea (440)
- Lore of the Deeps: Tide of Fear
Battleline
20 x Namarti Thralls (280)
6 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (320)
3 x Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (140)
Units
10 x Namarti Reavers (140)
Behemoths
Akhelian Leviadon (380)
Total: 2040 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 106
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6 minutes ago, Snitchey said:
Thank you. I plan on running at least 9 eels + Volturnos so the storm sounds like a better fit for me. I don't have malign sorcery (yet). What artifact would you put on the storm from the battletomb?
I asked that question myself 😂 so...
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6 minutes ago, Snitchey said:
Fair enough I hadn't done the maths just looked at the profiles.
In your opinion do the buffs the sea provides out weigh this given the sea is 40pts more?
The bravery buff and two good spells are really valuable. But you must build an army around it to take advantage of them IMHO.
General opinion is AotStorm is better for offensive eel armies and AotSea is better for defensive Namarti armies (or that's how I understood it).
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46 minutes ago, Snitchey said:
Thank you. I must of read all of the Deepkin ones at least 5 times, before I asked. Didn't want to ask a stupid question. Lol!
The part I keep puzzling over is whether to build an aspect of the storm or the sea. I really can't decide. Can someone please tell me what are the best points of either. I plan on running Volturnos and some eels. So the Storm would be good with the extra attacks. However is missing out on the sea who looks not much worse in combat with its healing spell and casting 2 spells too good to give up?
If you calculate the average damage from both units, the Aspect of the Sea has almost half the output. That's far from "not much worse in combat".
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1 hour ago, Arael said:
They are realm artefact from Malign Portents
Yeah, I don't love to use them over the ones in the battletomes (some are way better), but one must take them into account for competitive lists.
PD. Could you give me the measurements for the two halves of the Gloomtide Shipwreck? I want to build an alternative (water springs for my Desert Nomad Deepkin) and I want them to be as close as possible to avoid complaints.
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3 hours ago, Acid_Nine said:
artifact for the storm could be the ignax's scales, giving him a 4+ ward, making him more durable to attacks? or you could give him something like the etheral amulet, which lets him ignore rend?
spells could be steed of tides to throw him into combat, or maybe vorpal malestrom in order to throw out easyish mortal wounds?
Thanks for the suggestions, they are very interesting. I have a second artifact, so I could go with a spell-enhancing one for the Tidecaster. We have some decent ones.
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Hi, does this list sound better than my last one?
Allegiance: Idoneth Deepkin
- Enclave: Fuethan
Leaders
Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Storm (400)
Isharann Tidecaster (100)
- General
- Trait: Lord of Storm and Sea
Isharann Soulscryer (100)
Battleline
10 x Namarti Reavers (140)
10 x Namarti Thralls (140)
10 x Namarti Thralls (140)
Units
3 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (160)
3 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (160)
1 x Akhelian Allopexes (140)
Behemoths
Akhelian Leviadon (380)
Battalions
Akhelian Corps (100)
Endless Spells
Balewind Vortex (40)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 100
Balewind vortex is for filling points and help Tidecaster with the short range (plus another spell to help her contribute more).
Any suggestions for the artifacts and spell? I can't see the use for the ubiquitous Cloud of Midnight on the Avatar of the Storm. A turn doing nothing seems a waste for its profile.
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Food for thought: Seraphon's Bastiladon is 280 points for only 8 wounds and poor CaC (good shooting though) but an infamously annoying resilience.
Would you like the Leviadon to be more like it? Maybe 3+ unmodifiable/4+ vs mortals would be unbalanced on a 16 wound model.
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1 hour ago, JackStreicher said:
Agreed 🥺😭
@Drofnum Nautilar (+1 to Hits when charged) with a horde of Namarti thralls and a Leviadon could work quite well =} (it‘s quite a brick concerning movement though) ^^
Unfortunately it's rerolls (1s?) to hit when charged. +1 to hit would have been brutal for the Leviadon.
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2 hours ago, JackStreicher said:
Yes you don‘t profit from cover when you charge.
I always use the Leviadon, though I usually get punished hard for it.
imo it‘s just too expensive for what it does by a large margin. I would love to see it drop a little in price so I can add an additional Allopex or reaver unit.
so far the best strategy with the lev seemed to be if you screen it with 3-6 Ishlean which can charge or stay still while always having their 3+ save. But then you have a 500 point bundle that can at max hold one objective against small units while the rest of the army is obliterated.
or they alpha-strike the Leviadon to uselessness/death Turn 1 or 2.
That (and the other recent posts) is way more constructive.
It would be nice if it dropped 40 points? For sure. Could GW tune its aura to work better with the army? Clearly.
But neither will happen (if it does) until summer.
We can try to make it work the better we can, or leave it at home. What a pitty to do so, isn't it?
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19 minutes ago, Nos said:
I’ve not played any Deepkin yet so take this advisedly but having ready the discussion this page I think the broad narrative is one that plagues most meta orientated games in that they nearly always assume you will be playing an opponent with a powerful list that they know how to use. The interpretation of what you are asking goes from your intended “what are these guys like” to “how will this list fare against the best opposition in the most intense circumstances.” Which makes the game an utter bore and is why you increasingly just see Gav Bombs against 50 Eels every match. A game of fantasy and drama becomes a monolithic slog that endlessly replays on every other table and tactics give way to hacks, exploits and gimmicks.
It sounds to me like you’ve thought through how you want your army to play and why and I bet even if you lose 4 games and win only 1 with *your* army you’ll have more fun than winning 5 games in which you just throw eels and dice in someone’s face. And in my eyes you’ll be far more of a general if you win with what you have than just buying all of the unanimously overpowered units who intrinsically just win more often because of imbalance.
I’m not saying I know better than anyone else but if you’re enthused by your plans dont be put off them. Life’s too short to spend hundreds of pounds on plastic eels just to “win” at toy soldiers.
Yeah, you and me look at the game in the same way.
I want to learn to use the army I want to play, not to play the best meta army. Because there are a lot of fun, interesting suboptimal options and strategies. But only so many cookie-cutter, top lists.
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40 minutes ago, Drofnum said:
I believe its always been the case. I never really had it come up in AoS 1 though as i mainly played a gunline, so i could be wrong about that.
As Staunch Defender was kind-of-cover and carried a "doesn't work when you charge" caveat I always thought it was an exception to how cover worked.
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2 minutes ago, Drofnum said:
You do lose cover bonuses for any unit that charges in the turn they charge, its in the core rules.
Wtf did it change in AoS 2.0?
I'm sorry for my oversight.
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6 hours ago, JackStreicher said:
I agree, 280 seems about right 😜
Yup if you want to play a bunch of sub-par units which in turn need to get charged (which means killed) in order to profit fromt the buff (of which again Allopexes, and the Leviadon don't profit from). Namarti spam it is then? You just lose your mobility if you have to play around the lev. Mobility is sadly what keeps the IDK alive since we usually lack the numbers of other units to contest objectives.
Edit: Counting in Allegiance Abilities: The squig can run 5D6 inches. This will get him most likely where you need him.
😒
I think we play different games. What if you play Reverse Tide and you don't get first turn? Yeah, the Leviadon cover is useless.
What if (how dare you) you ambush a Leviadon with a big unit so they take and hold an objective?
What if you maneuver the Leviadon so it runs and keeps a charging unit within the bubble?
PD: am I missing something and cover stops working if you charge? Or is it that you think it's impossible to charge with a unit and still be within the aura? *Real edit: I wasn't aware cover doesn't work if you charge. Sorry. It doesn't wholly invalidate the previous argument.
Reply to the Edit: what are you talking about? Running 5d6 and charging? Yeah, if the moon is where it should be when you need it (first battleround it's in the corner, no effect. Second battleround it can be in a quadrant or in the center of the table). The Leviadon moves 12+1d6 and charge in the second turn. Consider me unimpressed 😜
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10 hours ago, JackStreicher said:
@Joseph Mackay look at the new Rules for the colossal squig which is only 300 points:
-1 to hit, MWs on the charge, dmg and spawning squigs when he dies, 8 attacks hitting (2+, 3+, rend -2) of which each 6 to hit deals D3 MWs, another 10 attacks and one shooting attack at 16 HP, 4D6 move and a 5+ save.
pretty much better than the Leviadon in every way (the -1 to hit is huge).
As above, the Colossal Squig is an afterthought to the actual Battletome, some rules tacked to a model with no real balance with the rest of the real army.
Anyway, it does 8.88 unsaved wounds (against 4+ save models) not counting the mortals, and the Leviadon does 7.33 (not counting the mortals either). Not that big of a difference. The CS is -1 to hit in CC and only a 5+ save against anything else, the Leviadon is 3+ always and can be made inmune to shooting (Forgotten Nightmares). The Squig has the summon (5 squigs, that's...60 points?) if it dies, and the Leviadon has the cover aura (which is far from useless, it can be played around if you are willing to adjust a little).
Is the Leviadon worth 80 points more than the Colossal Squig. Not really. Should it be 300? I don't think so.
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13 minutes ago, JackStreicher said:
Chaos Gargant, Dankhold Troggoth, Ghorgon, Bloodthirster, slaughterbrutes, Comossal Squigs, Troggoth Hag .
The comparison is so heavy-handed that it gives almost no information. You say they have more damage output, but the models you mentioned vary wildly (and not all of them outdamage the Leviadon). You then discount 1 less save and 2-4 less wounds as if it was minor, and proceed to ignore the Leviadon gives a pretty significant buff (while most you mentioned give nothing). Plus almost none of those shoot
With all that taken into account, it's very difficult to see if those 180 points of difference are fair or not.
A Drakesworn Templar is way closer for a comparison, IMHO. Or a Maw-crusha.
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5 hours ago, Luke1705 said:
Neither the soulrender nor any of the deepkin battalion are viable if you want to place highly in a tournament setting
As far as your list goes, I’d change the sea aspect to storm. I’d also ditch the shark and the turtle, but I assume those are the models that you like that you know aren’t so great
I see. It felt somewhat off to field Namarti and not the Soulrender, losing the chance to revive them. But 100 points for only 1d3...
Mor'phann has a big opportunity cost, Namarti Corps is 100 points (maybe worth it with 2 Soulrenders?). I guess if I don't go full tilt Namarti Reviving horde it's better to leave the Renders home.
I feel the Akhelian Corps is nice, though? Both the Allopex and Leviadon are in it to allow it and to be better. And yes, it's a "like the models" decision.
How should I equip the AotStorm? I have two artifact slots and a command trait to assign.
3 hours ago, JackStreicher said:Other races pay for a model of higher dmg output with 1 save less and 2-4 HP less 160-200 points. But 380 points seem justified to you?
The Lev should be at 250-280.
Can you please name those models instead of vague references to them?
29 minutes ago, wanderingrogue1 said:I'll be taking namarti corps with a render to heat 1 to try and proove this wrong
They ain't great tho
I think if you go full res combo it's relatively nice, if not great.
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11 minutes ago, Arael said:
I think there is not enough punch in this list, fuetan inverse tide list are based on their Morrsarr to break the enemy while namarti hold objective, you have only 3 of them, ishlaen will do the same job of trhall while allopex and leviadon will never be able to do the work of the Morrsarr.
Moreover u have taken the "defensive" version of the eidolon limiting another time the hammer of your list.
Just my 2 cent.
Ok, so you think if I changed the Aspect of the Sea for the Aspect of the Storm and the Ishlaen for Morrsarr the list would be slightñy better?
I'm still trying to make my head around how do people take advantage of first turn Flow Tide. Ok, running and shooting (rerolling 1's to hit) with Reavers is the obvious one. But who should run and charge? Morrsarr wouldn't be able to benefit from it and also benefit from High Tide while having charge bonus.
Please explain me if you have it sorted already
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Hi, what do you think of this casual-competitive 2000 points list? Going for variety, the models I like and some competitive synergies.
The idea is Fuethan Reverse Tides. I didn't decide on any traits/relics/spells yet (advice welcome)
Allegiance: Idoneth Deepkin
- Enclave: Fuethan
Leaders
Isharann Tidecaster (100)
- General
Isharann Soulscryer (100)
Eidolon of Mathlann, Aspect of the Sea (440)
Battleline
10 x Namarti Reavers (140)
10 x Namarti Thralls (140)
10 x Namarti Thralls (140)
Units
3 x Akhelian Morrsarr Guard (160)
1 x Akhelian Allopexes (140)
3 x Akhelian Ishlaen Guard (140)
Behemoths
Akhelian Leviadon (380)
Battalions
Akhelian Corps (100)
Endless Spells
Soulsnare Shackles (20)
Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 100
Thanks!
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6 hours ago, Nos said:
Someone a few pages back suggested Tempest Lords with a Dracoline list. Has a nice synergy with Dracolines Pack Leader and serves a combat heavy leader well with Command Trait.
Tempest Lords give enough CPs to do Knight Heraldor+run 6 (1 CA)+Pack Leader (as many CAs as possible)+self-Empower for a nuclear alpha-strike Dracoline unit. Three a unit are nice, 6 would be hideous.
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On 1/10/2019 at 3:34 PM, DanielFM said:
Hi, I'm a new Deepkin player (well, mostly just the owner of a ID battleforce
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I wanted to know your opinion on one matter: is the Soulrender worth it without Mor'phann and/or Namarti Corps? I like the concept and model, and I would like to use Thralls and Reavers (MSU or not). But in a Fuethan Reverse Tide list (which I would favour) only 1d3 casualties and mediocre CaC punch don't seem like a lot for 100 points.
Any thoughts on this from tournament players?
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Hi, I'm a new Deepkin player (well, mostly just the owner of a ID battleforce
).
I wanted to know your opinion on one matter: is the Soulrender worth it without Mor'phann and/or Namarti Corps? I like the concept and model, and I would like to use Thralls and Reavers (MSU or not). But in a Fuethan Reverse Tide list (which I would favour) only 1d3 casualties and mediocre CaC punch don't seem like a lot for 100 points.
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This may have been said already (and maybe it's a tough pill to swallow to BoC players) but Bestigors shouldn't have received their buff and stayed at 120 points.
They outclass any heavy hitter battlelines out there.
3 3+ 3+ -1 attacks (sometimes rerolling ones) with good movement, run and charge and 4+ save is crazy for these points.
Compare to Namarti Thralls or Grimghast Reapers, both pretty new units.
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The Rumour Thread
in Age of Sigmar Discussions
Posted
Idoneth Deepkin Lord of Tides Command Ability:
Wholy within 12", only +1 attack (you must spend extra CPs to get extra attacks) and only useable during the third turn.
How is that not uber lift? Only downside is that the FEC you can try to dispel.