VonSmall

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The Morboys natual +1 hit if a monster has died in the game seems to, on paper, syngergise really well with the Rogue Idol/Bonegrinz combo. If the rogue idol barrels into the opponents line, they have no option but to deal with it, meaning that every unit of morboys will get the +1 hit. I suppose my question really comes from what's better to have: * x20 Morboyz with natural 3 attacks each at 3+ hit, with the 6+ save for 240 Points or * x30 Savage Orruks with the 2" reach, 3 attacks while at least 15 are alive and 5+ save for 300 points From a survival standpoint the Savages can get to 3+ save whilst from an attacking one the Morboys can get to 2+ to hit which is pretty brutal.

Just to double check - as a mangler loon boss will typically be getting Doppleganger's cloak, would it then be worth trying out the sword of judgement for laughs on the Loonboss on giant squig? Would his re-rolls ability work with it too?

Thanks @Nezzhil! This does make me a bit sad but I totally get where you are coming from. I like the movement on the hoppers but their lack of save, very low bravery and 5+/5+ in combat just doesn't justify them for me when you get Boingrots for 10 points more. It's also a shame you don't get a small points drop for running a max size unit of herders. This could really fill a gap bodies wise and they are a decent call for a battleline unit. I'l continue to play with the list. I may drop one of the Manglers for 10 more boingrots. Re-rolling their movement from the battalion and +3" move, run + charge is at least somewhat reliable.

So without looking at what others have done in the past, I came up with the below list. While I really like the Loonking, you need to make him the general to get him command ability meaning you lose having squig hoppers as Battleline and suddenly your drops go fro very low to much higher. The Fungoid adds a drop but gives you the Squig Lure spell and potentially the extra CP for the run move. Does this look pretty standard? Any changes you'd make? Allegiance: Gloomspite GitzMortal Realm: UlguLoonboss on Mangler Squigs (280)- General- Command Trait: Fight Another Day- Artefact: Doppelganger CloakLoonboss on Giant Cave Squig (110)- Moonclan Stabba- Artefact: The Clammy cowlLoonboss on Giant Cave Squig (110)- Moonclan Stabba- Artefact: Backstabber's BladeFungoid Cave-Shaman (90)- Lore of the Moonclans: Squig Lure12 x Squig Herd (140)6 x Squig Herd (70)5 x Squig Hoppers (90)10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)10 x Boingrot Bounderz (200)Mangler Squigs (240)Mangler Squigs (240)Squig Rider Stampede (140)Squigalanche (90)Total: 2000 / 2000Extra Command Points: 2Allies: 0 / 400Wounds: 138

So I'll be back in the UK for July+August and would really like to put together a Squig list. I know it's not the most competitive with all the random movement but I would still like to try and make a list that could feasibly go 3-2 at a 2 Day event without losing the essence of a squig list. With that in mind, I was wondering if there were any non-squig units that I should really consider adding in to make the list just a little bit more reliable. My first thought was the Loonking for his spell casting, command point gain and most importantly his ability to guarantee a board wide Bad Moon for the Run + Charge. Are there any other non-squig units you'd recommend for some added reliability? Thanks in advance.

Absolutely worth giving him the fixin' beat. A mortal wound save (if non-book artifacts are allowed) is also a good shout.

Good point!

Agreed - when it gets you an extra CP worth 50 points, an artifact and the potential to get a load of points back. Absolute steal!

Yeah exactly that.

Hi @Ravinsild Slannesh is a really tough matchup for us as the number of wounds they do to us that get converted into slannesh points is huge. However, your list is actually one of the better ones for us because you have a couple of really good combo's you can pull off using activation shenanigans. It would involve you swapping out the Wurgog for a Weirdnob with Hand of Gork though. So...picture this. If you want to pretty much guarantee the charge you can do the following: Hero Phase: Buff up the Ardboys with Warchanter. Teleport the Ardboys 9" in front of the Slannesh line. Pigs use their Might Destroyers on the Maw Krusha who bounds up the board so he's within 18" of the ardboys. Maw Krusha then uses his Mighty Destroyers on the teleported Ardboys to make them charge (which you can re-roll with CP if failed) Movement Phase: Retreat with the ardboys so they are now just over 3" away from any Slannesh models. Combat Phase: Even if the Slannesh player has used the strike last ability on your ardboys, they cannot pile in an attack as they are not within 3" to enable their pile in. You, however, can now pile in because you made a charge move in the turn. It's janky and a bit gamey but it means you can get into combat and wipe something out without getting hurt back. The Slannesh player than has to use their first turn to clear your ardboys out. If you then get the second turn you can essentially either repeat by teleporting the other ardboy unit forward, or use the ability to allow the Krusha to charge/retreat and repeat the process. Another strength of this type of aggressive play if that by being up in their face you make it very difficult for them to summon units as they must do this more than 9" away from you. (Note: taking a Weirdnob would also make the Cogs a little defunct as you would never get the chance to cast it so you'd be gaining 130 points total.)

If you could get a burning head in there for the cannons to re-roll 1s to hit with shooting on the cannons you'll find they are way more reliable

Hi @5kaven5lave - the list certainly has some heavy hitters in it! The only thing I would say is that this army feels like a 'get in their face Turn 1' list. One of the big benefits of Big Waaagh is the bonuses to hit/wound which you won't be getting until around T2 at the earliest with this list. If you are wanting to go for the Alpha Strike i'd consider getting some more bodies in if you are able.

Hi @5kaven5lave - the list certainly has some heavy hitters in it! The only thing I would say is that this army feels like a 'get in their face Turn 1' list. One of the big benefits of Big Waaagh is the bonuses to hit/wound which you won't be getting until around T2 at the earliest with this list. If you are wanting to go for the Alpha Strike i'd consider getting some more bodies in if you are able.

@Aelfric Very interesting spot there! You are allowed to add in the items on Warscroll Builder and Azyr but this is certainly something worth checking with the FaQ team. Could be a game changer. Edit: Hold on - just checked the Orruk Warclans Designers Commentary: Q: If I take a Big Waaagh! army, can I choose artefacts of power from Malign Sorcery for the Heroes in my army? A: Yes.

Can see them bumping the cost of Ardboys to 100 but give them a horde discount whilst also reducing the cost of Brutes.

@Lanoss - Just double checked it and you are indeed correct. It would happen at the start. Alternative would be to ditch the Shaman and take another Warchanter with Luminary Rod. You are allowed to fire off the luminary rod at any time so could activate it before the Gorefist move and you're guaranteed to get a 9" line out of it. Edit: Or alternatively you could take a Madcap Shaman (80 points) with (30 points), give him luminary rod to hit your own unit in the hero phase, cast scuttletide and have your gruntas run near it if possible to take some more wounds and get an extra d6" @PlasticCraic - The advantage of the Gorefist in this particular build is the all the pigs get to move without burning a CP. You're starting T1 with 2CP so you burn 1 to move the Krusha and then potentially the second to re-roll a charge or pop a Waaaagh.

Just for a bit of fun, I've written a list that uses the above combo (with a possible example of the setup to maximise Green Puke - only showing 3 of the gruntas from each unit, you can deploy the rest how you like) as well as trying to make the most of Smashing and Bashing. The plan: Turn 1 Hero Phase 1. Green Puke with +1 cast from item (Trying to hit 2 Grunta units and Brutes - needing roughly 3" to get all of them). 2. Warchanters do their thing 3. Gruntas make their move from Gorefist 4. Teleport Brutes with Quick Duff 5. Mighty D on Krusha 6. Move Brutes and 2x Gore Gruntas D6" extra at the end of the hero phase (let's say 3" for a low average). Movement Phase 7. Move Krusha and Goregruntas Charge Phase You now have: Krusha having moved 24" Gorgruntas having moves 21" Brutes 6" away from enemy You're whole army has +2" charge move and smashing & bashing to pour the pain on. It'll be over quick one way or the other!

If you really want to get them into a fight you could always run some Bloodtoof Brutes. Green Puke them first (so you know for sure you're getting the D6" move from Mad As Hell) and then Quickduff Amulet them across the board - no guarantee but if you roll 3" for Mad As Hell you're only going to need to roll a 4 to get the Brutes in combat. Even rolling a 1 for Mad As Hell leaveas you needing a 6 to get into combat (same as Ardboys normally need). Again however, Ardboys do this more reliably but it is at least an option to fairly reliably get the brutes into combat.

Thanks for the kind words gents. The list is a really tricky one but the main issue I always find myself thinking about is how squishy the characters are. In a lot of games, with a bit of screening of the back line and smashing it up the board with the front unit, this isn't too much of a problem. However against armies that can either teleport in and shoot (ala Hallowheart) or now against Seraphon with extreme/unlimited range, high casting spells that don't require LoS that I find difficult to stop the squishyness becomes much more of a problem. This is why I opted for the Mirrored Cuirass on the Ardfist Warchanter who will often be further up the field supporting units whilst the weirdnob is at the back. He also gives that added mobility in the army from the Ardfist. Combo'd with Fixin' Beat you can keep him, and another character a live for an extra turn or two generally. I often toy with the idea of dropping the 660 points of Ironfist (Pigs and 2x5 Ardboys) in favour of a Brutish Cunning Krusha Megaboss for the added movement and 200 extra points of something. I'd still have the Mighty Destroyers and more movement from it but would need to give up the Luminary Rod (as I'm a stickler for Ethereal Amulet/Weird Un combo) and the Warchanter wouldn't get a mortal wound save. Not sure what I'd run with the other 200 points...maybe just the 2x5 Ardboys again in the Ardfist to keep the drops down? Dropping the Ironfist does drop the command points though and that doesn't sit well with me when running Ardfist. Especially if running a Krusha with the 3+ ignore rend, I'm going to be popping all out defense at some point and will still want a CP for trying to bring a unit back all the time.

Reflections on Seraphon So on Saturday I played in the Tabletop Simulator 1-Day event using Big Waaagh and came away with 2 Majors Wins (Vs Cabbage Big Waaagh & Legion of Chaos Ascendant) & a Minor Win (Vs Slann & Kroak Sotek). List below if interested: All the games were absolute belters , but I'd like to focus in on the Seraphon game simply because it was against an army that from my own personal experience we lose far more often than we win due to the Slanns domination of the magic phase and endless skink screens stopping us from getting to grips without getting shot off. It was also the culmination of learning from the many beatings I'd taken from them. Allow me to explain: In the run up to this event I'd played the new Seraphon around 10 times and been hammered in all but 2 of them - either being shot off the board from behind skink screens of smashed to bits by Saurus shield walls. Rather than rage at Seraphon, I wanted to try and think of some creative strategies for handling the lizardmen and there were some key lessons & important reminders during these games that I took away and wanted to share in case anyone else found it useful. Caveat: These by no means put us on an even playing field, but at least may give some alternative approaches. Kill those priests early! Don't both trying to kill the Slanns who sit at the back behind their screens and saurus buddies - it's the skink characters you want to go for if you have any type of ranged threat as their buffs are so good at making units better. Example: In this particular event I ran a Weird Nob general with Bursting With Power allowing him to take the obvious Hand of Gork but also Wrath of Gork (normally used to discourage teleporting heroes and small units). The Weird Nob was deployed front and centre and rather than run a block of Ardboys or Pigs up the field with Mighty Destroyers, you can do this on the Shaman (he's also allowed to run!) to bring him in range of Skink Characters who generally are deployed further forward to extend Slann casting and buff Salamanders/40 model blocks. With Shamanic Skullcap and +2 to cast by giving up D6 waaagh points (and with the Slanns only on their natural +1 to unbind at this stage) I was able to do 8 mortal wounds to the priest meaning the skinks/salamanders were no longer doing the mortals on 6s. When the movement phase came around the Weird Nob just ran back to the relative safety of his own lines A Different Use for Waaagh! Points Against magic heavy skink /salamander builds we don't need to be hitting/wounding on 2s so trying to maintain 20 Waaaagh points isn't a priority here. Instead, try blowing your Waaagh points on Casts + Unbinds. This will at least mean you stand a decent chance of getting a teleport off or unbinding a Comets Call to keep your Warchanters/Weird Nob alive a little longer. A cheap way to get a wizard with a potential extra +1 unbind is with a Wardokk doing a Weirddokk dance. Zog'Em! (Otherwise known as Mad As Hell) I'll be the first to put my hand up and admit that I often forget about the Zog'Em rule. But with damage coming at you in both the magic and shooting phase, this could give your army some serious extra movement each turn. This is huge against seraphon who are themselves rapid. In the list I took at the weekend I gave the weirdnob Bursting with Power which gives him both a second spell and an additional cast. The main use for this additional cast is to use Green Puke before teleporting (normally you can use Green Puke with Brutal power but this will come at the end of the phase, after you have teleported). Now you can puke away into your own unit, teleport them and give them an extra D6" move. This can be huge for that important charge you want to make. Oops, did I shoot my own unit? Possibly my new favourite item is the Luminary Rod. For those unaware of what it does here is the wording: Once per battle, pick a point within 9" of the bearer that is visible to them and draw an imaginary straight line 1mm wide between that point and the closet part of the bearer. Each unit other than the bearer that has models passed across by this line suffers D3 mortal wounds. Now the key thing here is that it does not specific when the item is used...so you can technically use it in any phase of either player's turn. For me, there are two key roles here which I'll share below: 1) This item can effectively act as another Green Puke which can be used in another phase to fire through your own unit and move forward. Using a unit of Ardboys as an example: (Mighty Destroyers + average of 2D6" From Green Puke then later Luminary Rod + Move + Average Charge Roll) 4"+7"+4"+10" = an average threat range of 25" without a teleport in sight! Also, if you roll poorly for the Green Puke roll in the hero phase you don't then need to blow the luminary rod later in the turn. 2) By far my favourite use of this item though is against teleporting units, and against Seraphon in particular - Salamanders. Most teleport rules say you need to land more than 9" away from the enemy which is great for us as this is exactly what we need in order for Zog'Em to kick in. So, picture this. The Salamanders (or other nasty unit) lands...you immediatly shoot the luminary rod through your own unit and can move them D6" in any direction. You now have a 66.7% chance of rolling a 3+ which is what you need to not only get out of shooting range of the salamanders but also any potential charge as they need to be within 12" to do this too! If you get the following turn you can then show them how hard Orruks hit when not getting shot up! 😈 Anyway - this may have come as no news to anyone but hopefully someone might find it useful. Keep on Waaaghing!

If I was going down the Krusha route I'd probably be including an Ironfist as this gives the army the flexibility of double Mighty Destroyers and means you aren't relying so heavily on your Weirdnob Shaman's Hand of Gork for your army manoeuverability. That being said, I love the Ardfist as it means you can jam your big blocks of Ardboyz up the field to grab objectives before all the army buffs kick in and have a chance of potentially bringing them back. Something like the below could work but I'm not convinced as the body count is very low. If you rolled 1 for Waaagh points on the general you'd be on a maximum of 9 Waaagh points turn 1 where I like to be on 12 to have the 6++ save.

So I've been looking at a lot of lists that are flying around / being talked about at the moment, particularly with regards to the amount of massive threat range shooting and/or magic that is creeping in. Big Waaagh relies heavily on the general being alive so resilience is key as you can't always rely on keeping him hidden. More and more i'm looking at the Krusha boss with Ethereal Amulet and Werid Un thinking that, while expensive, he may be the best bet. Once he gets to 20+ Waaagh points he's still a total beast. What are your thoughts?

I might be missing something from a battalion but I thought the fantatic warscroll says you can only put one unit of fanatics with each unit? "A unit cannot be with more than one unit of fanatics"

Hi everyone, So with Seraphon being a bit of the new hotness, I thought I'd share my experiences so far. Be good to hear how others have been faring. Here's the list I run (I gave a bit of a strategy break-down a couple of pages back - minor change was on the weird no shaman to allow him to cast teleport and green puke twice to support aggressive movement). I've played 3 games against them now with my Big Waaagh. Game 1: The first game I played my usual strategy of sit back, giving turns away in order to deny the double and build up Waaagh! points. Comets Call and teleporting bastiladons soon put an end to my characters. After that point I couldn't establish a grip on objectives and was screened out from the squishy units at the back. End Result: Got smashed on VPs. Reflection: This got me to thinking, maybe I need to go against the usual strategy and get a bit more aggressive against Seraphon, if nothing else to try and pin them in and maybe get the sacrificial units back on 4+ from Ardfist. Game 2 & 3 were similar affairs with one exception, one was Starborne the other was Coalesced: In both games I was able to out drop the lizards giving me the shot at Turn 1 which this time I took. In both games the general rolled 2 Waaagh Points, giving me 7 from him and the chanters/wardokk. This went up to 13 with the command ability and after a succesfull teleport and charge 15 Waaagh Points (so close to 16!). I got lucky with both the teleport rolls which were pretty high. The shaman was able to cast most of the green pukes to allow the small units of 5 ardboys to grab objectives in the first turn. In both games the Ardboys smashed what they hit in the first turn and were then wiped out in the Seraphon players first turn. They came back once and this pretty much ended the game as in my second turn I then had another 15 ardboys teleport in and pigs run up and charge preventing the Coalesced player from being able to grab enough objectives. Against the Starborne the ardboys didn't come back. I won the roll for second turn and, as all the firepower had previously gone on the ardboys and I knew my characters were safe for a turn, I gave the turn away to prevent a double. I took some damage on units but the key pieces were left alive and I was able to push hard (with some help from Waaagh Magic) in my second turn with army now fully buffed. I cleared out everything bar 2 bastiladons, the slann and a skink starpriest. At this point I firmly had the objectives and my opponent called it after some theory hammer of how he could get objectives back. Conclusion: So, 2 for 3 against Seraphon and playing aggressive with Big Waaagh worked so far. Not the normal strategy as I normally like to sit back for a couple of turns to build up the Waaagh buff, but pinning such a mobile army in place with a strung out unit of Ardboys worked a treat. Will keep giving this a go. If that first unit gets in combat and then comes back from the dead it's such a morale hit for the opponent having effectively lost a whole turn dealing with a unit that then comes back - but obviously this should never be relied on.