SwampHeart
-
Posts
850 -
Joined
-
Last visited
-
Days Won
5
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Gallery
Store
Downloads
Blogs
Events
Everything posted by SwampHeart
-
This is irrelevant because at current we cannot take Skin Wolves in BoC. You can in open or narrative play for certain but in matched play it is illegal, especially at tournaments. So even looking at their damage output from the frame of reference of BoC is meaningless. They work in mixed Chaos and are a good unit but they aren't a legal selection for BoC so it doesn't matter if they out damage everything the book - you can't use them in matched play. As to the debate of Enlightened vs. Bullgors - Enlightened are faster (and can take advantage of the movement buff of a shaman to be a base 19"), have a better range, and with a little practice the screen charge is basically fool proof. Bullgors are an OK unit that's fun to use - they're not anywhere near as potent as Enlightened from either a damage or flexibility point of view.
-
The FAQ was for clarity and simplicity - its there so that the BoK artifact section reads like more modern tomes where they simply say 'If you army has any <keyword> hero you may select blah blah blah'. It wasn't a change to who can take artifacts, just a change to keep the wording consistent.
-
That's not quite what the FAQ says - what it changed is each specific table isn't limited to a type of Khorne hero but each one of the tables still specifically tells you who can or cannot equip it. Basically it means you don't need a mortal khorne hero for murderous artifacts or a demon khorne hero for demonic weapons. However you still have to be a Khorne Mortal Hero to take a murderous artifact. A beastlord or doombull does not qualify.
-
If he's playing BoK then he can't take the Gnarlblade anyway because that's a Great Fray specific item.
-
We do not - per the FAQ those characters don't have artifacts.
-
We haven't really seen them yet - but that tends to be the case with AoS. The meta is slow to develop as people work through painting (and sometimes the pain of just acquiring the models), and testing the list. They have been to a few events but with poor showings - that said I think most of that comes down to poor lists.
-
Wholly within 12" - assuming you're running a single unit of Dragon Ogres its not too hard to keep them in range of the Shaggoth. If you were running multiple units it would be tough though. Even with a Shaggoth I only run one unit (of 6 personally).
-
Proxied it a few times while play testing various builds - its been fairly effective overall. My biggest issue is actually moving them around the table (even with movement trays once you get to combat it just takes time to pile in properly and the like). And while that's not a game issue it is a concern when you're practicing/playing in events with timed rounds. The battleshock wasn't a major issue and I was able to bring close to as much punch as I wanted (never can quite get enough), but ultimately it was taking too much time and my ability to play games out to a real conclusion was being impacted. I have tinkered around with 80 Ungors which still gets you a lot of bodies on the table but doesn't impact your play time as much. And at only 400 points they're not a bad buy at all to bubble wrap objectives or enlightened.
-
Taking Dragon Ogres without a Shaggoth is an inefficient choice. Dragon Ogres aren't a particularly effective choice but when you have a Shaggoth (General) they can then fill a battleline slot and become much more efficient with access to re-rolls and other buffs depending on your load out. 6 with a Shaggoth makes a good defensive pivot but I'd never field them without a Shaggoth because there are just better ways to spend the points otherwise.
-
Alas we cannot take him - he isn't StD which is our only ally choice. I truly wish we had a better ally selection because there is some grade A filth available if we did.
-
Same way I deal with most other lists - die in droves but score first. They hurt a little more because we have a lot of armor negation that they ignore, but that doesn't really matter when I knew I was going to lose three quarters of my army from jump street. I basically take the first turn and move all out towards the objectives (and to establish a wall in the middle of the table) and then just grind with them. They win the fights eventually, but as long as I had the scoring lead through turn 3 it rarely matters. Plus I can summon as needed to force them to pay attention to objectives they have left open - the added pressure helps against most NH armies that don't like to baby sit objectives.
-
I think @Magnus The Blue has it right - its a cheap battalion that's one drop capable (one of the reasons I love the Tzeentch one so much). As far as useful units specifically - centigors are just ace in general, they're fast, cheap and good at tieing up units/winning fights against other cheap drops. With ambush (which I have a generally negative opinion of) you need something that's threatening or else you're opponent isn't going to bother altering his deployment. Ambushing with Bestigors is probably your best choice, they're still fairly cheap with a smallish footprint but they hit hard. Maybe (depending on your Greatfray) a Beastlord as well, ambushing a Gnarlblade Beastlord is never a bad option. You might even consider cogs in the list or shackles one - the ability to control movement, and open avenues for you to leverage the battalion ability should help get more mileage. I've been tinkering with some of the same ideas for all the same reasons - Wrath and Rapture has me excited for the 'Rapture' part!
-
Gavespawn's Artifact works best (IMO) on a Beastlord, he has a high volume of relatively accurate attacks with a built in re-roll of 1s to hit to help mitigate the downside. This is one of the few ways I think a Beastlord actually works really well in a list - he becomes a very solid blender. The command ability is very solid but requires planning, I think the best way to implement it is to summon spawn rather than purchase them in your list. When you purchase them their random movement can be very difficult to account for when trying to plan out a turn (stacking the command ability on a single unit multiple times is a game changer) - however when you summon them you know where and how they can come in and thus you can plan for it much more easily (and can bank the points needed so you can guarantee it). Unravelling Aura is solid, there's not much to it but its nice because its just an always on ability. The last trick with Gavespawn that I really like is using our 'make a spawn from a dead hero' ability to create really tricky scenarios for your opponent. This requires some understanding how pile in mechanics (closest enemy model) and things like that but you can really use that spawn to make it hard for your enemy to pile in or get closer to an objective with clever positioning. Sorry for the wall of text there but I hope that helps a little with Gavespawn specifics. Outside of those most of the army works just like any other BoC army - cheap bodies, a few good if glass hammers, very fast. My general suggestion is to focus on board control - learn to fan out fast score early, you're going to lose models by the handful but who cares if you jumped the lead early and can grind out protecting it. Hopefully this is more productive than complaining about SCE (its tired and old, they're an army and some people even like them).
-
Looks like a pretty solid list but I think you're probably going a little too heavy into the characters. I'd drop the Volcanic Axe Beastlord for sure. I'd also probably swap out the 10 man Tzaangor unit for a few more Ungor units to give you more effective screening options. Those 2 changes free up 270 points - maybe pick up 2 Raider units for 160 and another Ungor unit for 60 - that'll leave you 50 left over for either an extra CP (always helpful) or an Endless Spell of your choosing. I think between the big block of Tzaangors and Enlightened you've got a solid hammer and a solid blob - using summoning should get you good backfield presence and you can use your Ungors to harass and block out the table.
-
Can't use him, he's Brayherd. At least not in matched play.
-
I actually don't like the GW models, I'm converting mine out of Marauder Horsemen horses and Gor bodies. Its a big time intensive but its easy green stuff work.
-
They're a rock solid unit. That said I've tried them in large numbers and never been in impressed. I use mine in 5s just to run and grab objectives or charge light shooting units and the like. Their base size is a bit unwieldy and can be very hard to get wholly within for the GBS if they get too big. But as you said they are incredibly fast and relatively punchy - I normally use 2 units of 5 in many of my lists as very early game missiles and to deal with things like LoN dogs.
-
That's why you need the All Seeing Eye + a Battalion! Worst case scenario you start out with 3 CP and best case I'm sitting on a bank of 6. Sure I never use anything but the 3 book ones but when you've got that many you can spend them freely.
-
I've actually come around to really liking this. It means that I'm free to marshal my CP for the 3 main book abilities which are super useful. I don't mind spending 2 CP a turn for 2 6" runs because I know I'll still have CP for battle shock and that's my only other real need. At first it was frustrating because it doesn't feel great - not having this huge trigger that is a combo starter. But once I stepped back from it and realized that it really just helps move us more towards our primary competitive goal (aggressive, early game sustainable board control) I saw it as a strength. Its another element that I'm sure frustrates players who want BoC to kill and punch their way to victory but its actually a subtle strength that basically steers you towards winning with our army via stunting and stalling your way to victory.
-
Can slotting in the Phantasmagoria from BoC be a valid option? I would think giving you the benefit of fitting several units (thus lowering drop count) as well as unlocking a decent cheap core screen in Ungors might be workable. Phantasmagoria is expensive at 200 points but do the benefits justify its inclusion or are cheap Kairics the better mandatory battle line option?
-
EDIT - Not sure, re-read the specific rules and I don't know that I have a solid answer.
-
Played in another 3 game 1 day-er this weekend. Decided to try something very different from my usual builds. Went 2-0-1 with the list and got 2nd (lost out to DoK) but it was fun to go in a different direction than usual. the list was: -Dragon Ogre Shaggoth - General (Ancient Beyond Knowing), Hailstorm -Great Bray Shaman - The Knowing Eye, Vicious Stranglethorns -Tzaangor Shaman - Gryphfeather Charm, Tendrils of Atrophy -40x Ungors - Spears -10x Ungors -10x Ungors -10x Ungor Raiders -10x Ungor Raiders -10x Bestigors -6x Skyfires -6x Enlightened on Disc Phantasmagoria of Fate
-
Thanks for the insight - I think its definitely a different vein than my original line on Skyfires originally was, but I'm going to change up my build and get some tests in with Skyfires now.
-
It's a very open Battalion - basically 1-4 of any non tzeentch hero, 3-8 [Core Units, basically Gors, Ungors, Minos) and then 0-8 [Any other non tzeentch unit in the book], 0-2 Ghorgon or Cygor. It gives you the opportunity for your units to deal MWs to units in a radius when they die.
-
You said "Ironically i think BoC battletome is just not good enough to field hordes of models competitively." which implies hordes are a bad competitive choice. I disagree, hordes are a great competitive choice, just for a different reason than their ability to kill things. You didn't say 'BoC horde armies aren't good at killing things' you stated flat out that BoC horde armies aren't competitive. If I've misunderstood the words you chose, I apologize.
