Aezeal
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Posts posted by Aezeal
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1 minute ago, Isotop said:
"Q: A Sylvaneth Gnarlroot Wargrove can include an ORDER WIZARD, and a Sylvaneth Winterleaf Wargrove can include an ORDER unit. Are such units allies?
A: Yes they are. However, because they are part of a Sylvaneth warscroll battalion, they do not count towards the number of allied units you can include in a Sylvaneth army, and their points will not count against the number of points spent on allied units for a Sylvaneth army in a Pitched Battle. Note that although they don’t count against these limits, for all other rules purposes they are treated as being allied units, and therefore can’t be given artefacts of power, know spells from its spell lores, and so on."
(https://whc-cdn.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/Core-Rules-and-Bases-Sizes-EN.pdf, page 8 top right corner)
I knew what this meant in effect (the no artefact and spells part), I though you meant you couldn't take hero's as the order unit in several battalions in addition to that in some new FAQ.
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17 hours ago, Gwendar said:
...Until I won the priority roll and teleported them the hell out of there, leaving them stranded for 2 turns trying to waddle back into the action. Being able to split your opponents focus so heavily by dropping a huge ranged threat that can just poof away next turn is amazing and I can't wait to emphasize it some more at 2k. I'll make up my 1k League game against Seraphon this week so I'll be sure to post it up as usual.In most games with objectives the opponent will probably not do that and just move to and stay on an objective.
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54 minutes ago, Heksagon said:
Hi. Additional non-sylvaneth heroes counts as allies (it's been FAQued), and Allies, unfortunately can't take any Artifacts, even Realm Artifacts.
Wait, which FAQ was that exactly?
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On 1/24/2019 at 9:58 PM, Thalandor said:
Lessons I learned from the games:
The Alpha Strike is strong enough to single out key units/heroes, even with 2 spots filled by Eternal Guards.
Wanderers have little staying power and once all the once-per-game abilities are used and casualties are stacking up, I struggled to deal any real damage.
1 Wayfinder with Hail of Doom Arrow and Essence of Vulcatrix has absurd damage potential, but it is difficult to find the one right moment to use it.
Most players dont know much about Wanderers and overestimate or underestimate a lot of our units.
Sisters of the Thorn are useless against armies who don't rely on melee combat, in general, they have a hard time making their point costs worthwhile, even with two big Shield of Thorns targets.
Protectiv Volley doesn't work at all when the hard hitting ranged units are set up in reserve and the NP himself sits somewhere else.
Stag riders are the best option, maybe even the only option, to cap objectives that are more than 11,9'' away from the border edge.Thanks for this. Some of it is obvious but the confirmation that SotT aren't worthwile is nice, I won't have t try it. The Wayfinder build is nice. And using wildriders for objective taking seems indeed their only real use, and the best unit we have for that role.... doesn't mean they aren't overcosted sadly but means I'll have to try them again I guess, especially in the batallion they're possibly less a waste of points than the sisters.
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On 1/24/2019 at 9:05 AM, rosa said:
Me too!
Any ideas are very welcome
I'd say using a dryads or branchwych and do something with greenstuff making a cape or something and add a bunch of spites. I've not done this (never tried greenstuff) but I'd say that should make something fitting. Maybe something in the hands which resembles some priestly artefact (something NOT a weapon mainly) or something which resembles some acorn or other nature thing (I'm using some odd roundish dried plant stuff on my bases which would fit for example).
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On 1/21/2019 at 12:28 AM, Gwendar said:
I never intended for this to be an ultra competitive army, but rather something to take with my girlfriends DoK army for doubles to provide some shooting support. Still, the theory was that Living City could potentially net me some woods throughout the game which would help with objectives a bit. These lists that we're seeing at Cancon have no EG or any other screening units, so I'm really curious to see how they do.
Too bad SotW and GG have atrocious melee profiles. I guess it's better than nothing, but without some screens (hell, Dryads can actually out decent numbers) I just don't see anyway to make the army work well competitively.
Dryads are great if you have a forest.
I just think most wanderer units including the shooters should get a slight price drop.
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18 hours ago, Gwendar said:
Overall thoughts
I still really love the army, but oh man is it incredibly defensive and very hard to push out of deployment in against faster armies. I will definitely be including 20 or so Dryads at 1k because there's absolutely no way to win objectives games without an additional anvil. Kurnoths continue to prove their worth, being such a great Hammer+Anvil unit rolled into one nice 200 point package.
I have another 750 point game and a couple of 1k games next weekend so I'll be sure to get those posted as well. Thanks for reading!And this was without objectives... so you could actually teleport at will and still do something towards winning the game with your archers. In objective games they could just move to objective and stay there while they die getting shot at. And if they do that a few turns they'll probably have won even if tabled.
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13 hours ago, Atreyu said:
@Aezeal thank you for your picture. The Bases look great. Great idea i totally love it
Im unsure wether to get the grass mat or the muddy field mat from deepcut studios
Was debating that myself at the time. I chose grass for 2 reasons.
1. My bases are mostly grassy with some rocks, not that much mud.
2. There are wheel tracks visible in the mud. Now there are wheeled machines in AoS and there would obviously be carts and carriages outside of battles.. but still it gave me a WWII vibe. (ofc you'll not notice any of this when playing since you completely forget about the mat anf focus on terrain so it's not that important).
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Hey Atreyu,
I use the
https://www.deepcutstudio.com/product/wargames-terrain-mat-grass/
I have the mousemat material one.
You can see it well on the site ( and I don't feel like unrolling mine)
I said I get you some pics of the mouse mat forest bases too, I'll just put them in here.
Those are from a 3x3 swap mat.
https://www.deepcutstudio.com/product/wargames-terrain-mat-swamp/
Got 15 out of it, just drew lines around a GW base with a pen and cut just within the lines with scissors. ( edit: wait I had another one not in the pic.. so 16.. way more than I've needed so far)
The swampy stuff sees to resemble trees quite a lot branches etc. Works for me.
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22 hours ago, overtninja said:
@Gwendar Alpha strike is well and good, but strong, reliable shooting helps over the whole game. I'd much sooner take the waywatcher for character sniping (he's still amazing at it, hitting on 3s if he doesn't move even with Look Out, Sir), and SotW always do me proud, especially given how many Chaos factions I play against and see around in general. Those ballista are no joke, but I'd much prefer the elves who hit and wound always instead. Besides, elves look cooler imo.
@Popisdead Yeah, cavalry in general sacrifices a lot in AoS in return for moving fast, but given the nature of the game it makes sense that they do. I do like that a Spellweaver's signature spell can bring up to 3 models back, though, since it's really good for the points if you cast it on cavalry. As far as whole-army composition, they are easily the most mobile thing we have, and grabbing objectives with something that can fight decently is nothing to scoff at. It would be nice if they were a bit cheaper, but I understand their price point give how strong movement is.
We pay for movement yes... and it's worth something... but in never armies it seem they don't have to pay for it a lot.... which seems like a slight (cough) imbalance.
22 hours ago, Gwendar said:@overtninja True...I suppose you're right. I just had these grand conversion (or replacements) for the crew and ballista, but I already have the other Waywatcher and SotW built and painted. Damage wise they aren't awfully far off and I really feel that you need 3 Ballistas + Ordinator to make them really strong. I think it's just leftovers from a few months back when I wanted to build into Greywater fastness build using 4 Ballistas and Steam Tanks...anyway.
How have you dealt with positioning the SotW? I played another 500 point game yesterday and I feel with the 18" range that it's really hard to prevent them to not get charged and they inevitably die or get taken down to half in the first round of combat. Now granted, they tend to take more wounds off a unit (or snipe a character) so they earn their points back\close to it, but I really feel like I could be doing something better with them. Maybe the issue is just sending them in alone and once I go Living City I may not have the issue since they can be accompanied by a screening unit.. although 6" isn't much to work with and I worry about fitting 20 in that short distance.You really need melee in front of your shooters (and then hope they can't teleport behind you or fly) . In the current game shooters (and especially our shooters with 20"or less range) cannot get out of reach of melee at all.
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3 hours ago, overtninja said:
I would guess not, since they are summoned, and thus not part of the battalion at the list-building step.
I'd agree with this.
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On 1/6/2019 at 12:57 AM, The Red King said:
Some work in progress shots of my Eternal guard with Dryad masks. Converted spellsinger. And a glowing way stone marker that turns on and off.
I like that spell singer
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On 1/6/2019 at 10:03 PM, scrubyandwells said:
my key pieces should've been more than 4" behind my screening 2x10 Dryads and 5 Spites.
Why is that?
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17 hours ago, Lanoss said:
It does say it’s a terrain feature that cosists of up to 3 citadel woods
Therefore inferred as a single terrain feature??
yes if you place them as one it's one terrain feature.. and no teleporting between the bases of that terrain feature.
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7 hours ago, WABBIT said:
@Aezeal ok thanks for explaining. I probably overreacted however what I said it still not incorrect. It’s a conflicting opinion is all. We can agree to disagree but I do believe sotw are better and they should be being the elite archers since waywatchers were removed as woodelves. GG are battleline and have more accessibility, wounds per point cost, larger unit, rend one shot, easier to move and fire without losing effectiveness etc making them very useful to compliment the sotw. Having an opposing opinion doesn’t make it incorrect.
I think you still don't understand the point I was trying to make (though you might disagree on that one too ofc) because I don't specifically disagree with you on that point (I have no opinion on which is best tbh and I certainly think both have a role in the army and complement each other). It was more about separating them being elite in the lore and better per model from total unit effectiveness and rules per point as I tried to explain but probably me not being a native english speaker/writer makes it hard to get the point across correctly or maybe I even didn't understand your post correctly.
On 1/2/2019 at 10:31 PM, Aezeal said:I didn't mean to say you where incorrect in your view on which of them was best. I actually didn't mean to go into that at all (except in the last paragraph).
But I'll leave it at this because I can't explain it better anyway
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On 12/30/2018 at 12:36 AM, WABBIT said:
‘This is a completely incorrect statement’’ and rather arrogant to boot.
You even agreed sisters of the watch are elite if only in lore so you’re argument is confused at best.
-Sisters of the watch don’t count as moving when they ‘teleport’ - that is correct.
-That this subject was debated earlier in this thread - also correct.
-SotW are considered elite- some may disagree but I’m pretty sure most agree glade guard are the rank and file while sotw are elite.
-I never mentioned points. So no statement error there either.
sure they have different roles, more wounds for gg objective grabbing, easier to move etc and rend is useful vs some armies so a mix is usually best. I’m allowed to voice opinion on which is best no need to dismiss it like that. I wasn’t trying to get into a huge in depth discussion again as it’s already been done. Power wise SoTW do better but there are many caveats and situational circumstances that can alter both units effectiveness.
This is a friendly forum. This isn’t the first time you’ve had a go my posts.
I think we don't understand each other (Maybe how I wrote the reply had something to do with that - and possibly I didn't understand your posts):
I didn't mean to say you where incorrect in your view on which of them was best. I actually didn't mean to go into that at all (except in the last paragraph).
I meant to say: The fact they are elite is just based on the lore and because they have better stats per model (which reflects the lore): we agree there since you say that in this reply too. Waywatchers where the elite archer unit and now sisters are (which makes me sad.. but that is another discussion).
The reason I found your reply incorrect was because you mentioned: they are better now as they should be because they are our elites and you mention this in relation to them getting a boost in effectiveness (the not moving rule in combination with teleporting - which is related ot balance.. which is reflected in points - which is why I mentioned them), my point is that: that rule is just a balance thing and doesn't make them elite. for example: if they have that rule but GG where 80 points per 10 models the GG would be way better in game but that wouldn't make them the elite archers in the lore or per model in stats.. it would just mean GW hadn't balanced them correctly. Or shorter: whatever the rules: SotW are the elites in the lore so a mention of balance related stuff to them being elite is not relevant because they are seperate things in my opinion.
Which is why I ended with the fact that balance wise there is no uniform conclusion on which of the 2 is better ingame so that means the balance must be about right.
PM: I see you are also annoyed by me saying "completely" and I can see why that is. The first parts of your reply (the short one) are obviously correct and I just meant to say that I found the last part incorrect(I hope my explanation of why I thought it was incorrect is clear now - even if we might disagree on that because I still have that view). So while I will stand behind my reasoning of why
On 12/30/2018 at 12:14 AM, WABBIT said:making the sisters of the watch much better than glade guard are now and as our elite archers they should be.
is incorrect. I will admit the rest was obviously fact - as you mention in your latest reply and I'm sorry if my phrasing of the reply using the word "completely" added insult to
injurydisagreement, it was not intended that way so sorry for that. And if you still don't agree with my reasoning about the stuff above I hope we can just agree to disagree on that part. It was more intended as a sort of academic/irrelevant discussion.On 1/1/2019 at 8:03 PM, overtninja said:I'm really not keen on going too heavy into ranged attacks, so really it's about efficiency and what other weight a ranged unit can lift.
But wanderer melee isn't all that good for it's points (well EG isn't BAD.. but doesn't do much damage either).
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2 minutes ago, WABBIT said:
Yeah look further back in this thread (or the old version of this thread) this was debated before and GW confirmed it does not count as having moved making the sisters of the watch much better than glade guard are now and as our elite archers they should be.
This is a completely incorrect statement.
They are elite archers because they are better per model regardless of points. And they've always been that.
Balance means that both should be somewhat equal in effectiveness for their points or have different roles that have a somewhat equal value. Being elite is more a lore thing and doesn't (shouldn't) mean you they are more point effective.. that just makes them overpowered in comparison to the GG.
Luckily there is still enough discussion about it so that probably means GW got it somewhat right.. both have similar roles as shooters but not quite the same (GG alpha) so that makes the exact comparison difficult enough for it to be an issue that isn't completely clear: both are used and both have fanbois in here.
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13 hours ago, Nick907 said:
But they do have it, and it is hard to think of a better attack then teleporting in with a 20" -3 rend shooting attack. Glade Guard also take damage better, since you'll only lose one shot per lost model.
Sisters are better against chaos(situational), better if they don't move (Wanderers move alot), and better if they get charged (pretty awesome). Otherwise Glade Guard slightly edge them out.
Regular shooting conditions: 30 GG = 10 wounds, 20 SotW = ~9 wounds. Glade Guard win for the purposes of 'Protective Volley' and any table-edge teleportation attacks. The 'Arcane Bodkins' with -3 rend only add to the Glade Guard's already higher value.Teleporting doesn't count as having moved right? I thought that was the last consensus here backed up by some FAQ's etc.
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9 hours ago, Drillz said:
What’s a good number of dryads to have on hand for most matched play
for 2K points? at least 50 I'd say. But I prefer to start with at least 1x20 and 1x10. Then hope you can summon another 20 during the game (I've not had THAT much luck with summoning I have to say. There needs to be a forest, there needs to be room in that forest 9" outside of the enemy - who will prefer it if that room ISN"T there.... and there needs to be a somewhat high roll that isn't countered).
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9 hours ago, PUFNSTUF said:
With the Faq to Drycha which range profile is best to take for her?
Depends on what you want her to do I guess.. it hardly changes much IMHO so if you had reasons to pick a ranged attack before those reasons are still valid. I take her as an anti horde monster since we have nothing else that does it that easily.
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On 12/5/2018 at 4:01 PM, Easytyger said:
I wanted to do this. May I ask how you cut the mat up? Just scissors?
sorry for late reply but yes. I just drew line around an original base and used the scissors just within the line. Then drew the circles in around an empty tape thingy which had the same size (measuring the position a bit from different sides)
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On 12/18/2018 at 8:08 AM, Twh30 said:
Haha true not a friendly list
can say that is power list so work backwards from that, say take her out add ancient kurnoth hunters and extra branchwych or make unit of 10 dryads into 20
I don't think Alarielle in a 1K list is that bad tbh.. her buffing shines better in a larger list and smaller lists still need to get objectives.
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On 12/19/2018 at 4:01 PM, a74xhx said:
Well there was this:
Q: Do the enemy units that Drycha Hamadreth attacks with her Colony of Flitterfuries have to be visible to her? A: Yes
But I'd hope everyone was playing that way already.
Hadn't interpreted it that way myself... I'd see all AoE things as not needing line of sight.. but I never play flitterfuries anyway since I aim for battleshock tests on big units if I use her.
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16 hours ago, overtninja said:
@Dead_DuardinI used GG as a group of 20 last game, their bonus to hit for unit size was lovely. After they use their Arcane Bodkins they are basically just a bit of bonus firepower, but that shooting turn does work every time. If you use the battalion, you can set them up exactly where they need to be and get that enhanced shooting off, so even if you lose dudes after that it's okay, I think. They are really there for that one round of shooting. If you don't have the battalion (at lower than 2000 points, for instance, which is what i've been playing), you have to set them up later so you get them in the right place and keep them from being in fire range, or use the general trait to teleport them all to where they need to go and get the shots off that way. I think my local meta is really shooting-lite, so I had no issues keeping the unit healthy, but if you face a lot of ranged attacks and spells 30 is probably just good to hedge your bets.
@Gwendar I have 20 of the old metal ones and my goodness did they do work last game. I managed to string them 2x10 and scoot them into a positin to keep things off an objective and adopt defensive stance, and they held the line for like two and a half turns against a GUO (who rolled poorly) on one end and a Nurgle beastie on the other. I was genuinely surprised at how durable they were, until my opponent backed up the mortal wounds truck on them and obliterated them in like a turn haha (sad).
Having used them in all my games so far, I think they bat far above their points value if they are doing what they are good at - being a somewhat mobile wall that simply does not yield. It's an important tool in the army, as we really need to keep things off our ranged units so they can do the heavy lifting in our army. They really need to get in position and hunker down, and they wilt like a dandelion on a hot sidewalk if mortal wounds come their way, but outside of that they are aces.
As an aside, I used Kurnoth last game with scythes and tried to fight some Putrid Blightnights. It did not go well for me, even with them and Dryads going at it together. Those gross fat dudes are super rude and cut through them in a single gross fat round of combat. Not the best showing for my dudes, but I don't think they are a bad unit by any stretch - but it's clear that nothing in my army should go anywhere near blightknights and I should just shoot them off the table with SotW instead. 😛
Yeah the Blightkings are severely undercosted in comparison to the Hunters.. and even those arent bad
AoS 2 - Sylvaneth Discussion
in Sylvaneth
Posted · Edited by Aezeal
The one I replied too from Heksagon, but I just interpreted it incorrectly. Nevermind.
And thanks for your explanation since due to me interpreting it incorrectly I feared stormcast heroes where out for us and it's good to know this isn't the case.