Sarouan

He didn't say it was because of accessibility he quit the game. He said he was burned out by the game that he barely played anyway. That's why I keep pointing the mistakes of the "other side" blaming blindly GW for anything, no matter if it's fake or real. Being angry is always understandable. Trying to find false reasons to justify your anger is not. Don't shift the cause on others while you are part of it.

For the comment about "whining", Kasper didn't disparage him for his disability, but the fact he said he was already done with AoS anyway so free warscrolls removed or not, it doesn't matter to him anymore. About the other part, sounds more like an advice than anything else (a bigger tablet is indeed what I'd rather use than my phone for an app, my sight isn't good as well - there are products specifically made for people with a very bad sight, after all). Not very diplomatic, I agree, but what Red King wrote was being rather quick to judge from what he thought he read. Red King's bad reaction isn't better, here. And anyway...it brings nothing good to the debate in favor of free warscrolls as well. Because you can still use "for free" meanwhile, it's thus even more convenient right now for that reason. We also don't know how long this "open beta" phase will last. As far as I'm concerned, it could take months or even maybe years. Not sure about the claim they didn't make the app for the players but just for the money, actually. The part about making money is indeed here, but reality is rarely all black and white with human intent - it can actually combine both. It's easy to believe GW as a whole is all evil and calculating in their decisions. But to me, the idea of a specific app gathering all the rules needing to play AoS on a mobile (phone or tablet or laptop, whatever) is pretty much what I'd call a player-friendly tool that is relevant to the new tech tendancies. Doesn't mean all players have to use it as well. Never forget that behind corporations, there are humans. And they're not all evil managers doing nothing but gather lots of money.

Looks more like a treasure hunt. New campaign for AoS ?

Removal of free warscrolls on GW webstore has nothing to do with human disabilities. Maybe stop the disingenuous comparisons to try to make something look more outrageous than it is in reality - especially when it leads you to judge someone solely on whathe wrote.

Hypothetical case again. Let's take a situation : I play a game with someone and he uses an army I'm not familiar with. I chat with him and inform him that, asking if he can present his army and what they do in game. Usually that's done during the deployment phase, he makes a short resume for units when he places them. Most of the time, to be honest, main information is asked when the unit does something relevant with a reaction / action from our part. Like when I'm wondering if I do charge with my units or not, and so on. It's not harassing your opponent to ask him info you're not aware to when it's relevant without being annoying. After all, it's natural if he does the same if he's not familiar with your army either. Or if he's simply a new player. That kind of information should be shared first before the game, I feel. And like I said before, convenience was never in question...because if it's just that, I'll make you remember that the app exists and you can consult that kind of information the same way on it. Especially because it's something that's clearly made to be consulted on your phone. Actually, in that case, I believe the app is more convenient than browing on the GW webstore after every unit and then click on the link below to get the said warscroll. For now, since it's in beta and not behind a paywall, the money argument doesn't apply. And if it did...for the kind of situations you brought ? If it's really something that bothers you and you feel better using your phone to "check" on your opponent without disturbing his turn, maybe that could be worth the fee GW may ask for it if it's not too high (or if it's included in Warhammer + and already have a subscription). I guess Hollowhills could have written "The End of Free Warscrolls on GW Webstore" to be complete, but I don't blame the shortcut here.

This is why they do. Core rules for AoS are available for "free", and there are still warscrolls in the 3rd edition package plastic boxes they sell - just less detailed. Easy to understand, though. With "free warscrolls", it makes the job easier for third party to gather the informations for their own "app" or assimilated. It's actually very consistent with their IP protection to keep this behind their own app and youtube partners rather than the webstore. Gives more control for them. That you may not like this is understandable, though.

Nurgle is just said to be the most generous of the four in delivering them, that's all. It's the universal chaos star that's the true clue, to me.

I'm not, but you wouldn't be hestitating so much to interrupt your opponent during his turn by simply asking him what does his unit do if you weren't at ease with him. What I mean is that your cases are all hypothetical to find something that may be in your favor about free warscrolls being available anytime. The thing is : they actually don't need to be useful in this situation at all. You can play a game without feeling the "urgent need" to check the free warcrolls on GW's webstore. That kind of information can be answered in game directly by your opponent after all, can't that ?

There are ways to talk with your opponent without disrupting their turn, you know. It's called "socialising". A game doesn't have to be a battle to the death to see which one is the winner and to detect immediately who may be cheating. I'm part of the "old school people" who never use their phone during a game doing something else on internet. I always thought it rude. You're with someone in the real life : better to give him your full real life attention as well, is that how I see it. Ah, youngsters nowadays ! Seriously, though, I know I'm some kind of dinosaur. I still write my army lists on paper and I can't help myself but needing a good old book to read the rules. I guess I must look silly playing at home with my small table carrying the core rule book, the battletome, my FAQ printed, my army list. But hey, different generation, different habits !

Oh yes, like the cities of sigmar having a warband list for Warcry in the white dwarf before the Order Alliance Book was released. Nowadays, I don't take into account what's inside the White Dwarf as anything for the future. I maintain my bet is on Slaves to Darkness !

Battletome Slaves to Darkness, this we'll have !

I do understand you believe that removing free warscrolls is anti-consumer practices, but I don't. Since we're into beliefs and not facts, well...what can we do but agree that we disagree ? Come on. If you play GW games (meaning, using GW miniatures and, most likely, other GW stuff like paints and rules), you know you're going to spend a lot. If the app is at reasonnable price, people will take it. Because convenience. As for the battletomes...let's be honest, new players will most likely be told to buy it anyway, free warscrolls or not. And while you making demos to new players, you don't have to make him pay for all of that. People doing that usually have their own ressources / books, or can always have a deal with a shop manager to access to some they don't. They can use that the old way before free warscrolls existed, like I did before. I'm pretty sure they won't disappear suddenly because of that. That some players disgrunted by the removal of warscrolls may be pushing new players to piracy, yes that will certainly exist. But that's a person's problem, here, let's be clear. If you're that angry with GW, better chances are that you'll be making demo for other games than AoS... Well, yes, GW makes more money...that was always the point. Is it a bad move for AoS's popularity in the future ? I tend to think it could, but to be honest, I feel like this version of AoS being more "technical" would be more playing that part. Now it's only my feeling (as good as anyone else's, to this point). The warscrolls are just a small part of the game, after all. I never said that or "cheered them" like you seem to think and besides, EA's practices are not the topic here.

Your opponent come with a book, right ? Just ask him to show you the book. Is it troublesome ? Maybe...but I don't know, checking the warscrolls on your phone while your opponent is playing just to see if he's "telling you the truth" sounds way ruder...

I know ! But that means it's always a veteran that knows how the game is played who show the new player how it works. It was indeed convenient to do this way. Now ? Well...veteran players doing demos will use more books than before, I guess. Or the app.

Except that youtube products and GW products don't have the same impact with what you feel is "anti-consumer practices". Youtube is solely only able to be used online on their platform. AoS can be played with miniatures anywhere you set a physical board and you can buy rules in a book. You don't have to be all digital to play AoS. So the removal of free warscrolls has actually not the same impact as trying to sell videos on your phone with the screen locked, talking about the product as a whole like you said. Free warscrolls was just a convenience for AoS. It wasn't a main feature of AoS.

Well, I mean...it's the fact people feel they are pressured to buy the book to have the rules that they are so concerned about the removal of free warscrolls that is clearly getting out in this thread, at least from those who are the more vehement. So yeah, money is the factor here. Because for convenience...there's the app to keep consulting the profiles online whenever you want, isn't there.

Well, he certainly doesn't start by the warscrolls on the webstore, because they won't be telling him much at the beginning. He asks someone who plays first and gets a demo ideally. And it's better to direct him towards the battletomes instead (especially when they're in a store and most shop manager - even GW ones - will allow you to show you what's inside for illustrations of their arguments). Like I said, free warscrolls on the webstore aren't for new players. They're for people who know the game. That's a fair question ! How do you think people playing 40k or Warhammer Battle before did ? The old way...by asking people who do / reading articles online, read your opponent's book or buy the book yourself if you really want to be knowledgeable on a higher level of competition. Like I said, convenience was never in question for free warscrolls. But it wasn't a product in itself. It was simply a rule given by GW "for free", with no guarantee it would stay that way forever. In fact, if you're talking about the real products like miniatures, you can argue that the warscroll present in boxes before the new 3.0 package is indeed not the same "value" than the one present in the new 3.0 package (there's still something to play, but less detailed and "updated"). However, for boxes that do not have the 3.0 package, warscroll is still the same. In fact, you have even older boxes with an even older version of the warscroll inside. Does that mean they are all products giving less value for the money ? Not sure about that. As for the real rule products - meaning books and campaign boxes...they are not concerned by the free warscrolls for an obvious reason. That it was a convenience that's no more there, I agree. As for the paywall...well, yes. That's why I'm saying the main issue is that they don't want to pay for the rules. They don't want to pay for the app for the same reason. That's not at all what warscrolls do. They give the rules of the unit, but units aren't just something you take out of context and - most importantly - from their army's synergy. Online reviews and social media discussions are much more relevant for that purpose. And they'll still be around. Exactly the same for40k and Warhammer Battle before. If their players managed, you will be able to as well. Is it more tedious and less convenient ? Of course it is ! But if you're so determined not to pay just to "see what things do"...don't worry. You'll still find a way in the end. Like 40 players and Battle ones before you. Don't get me wrong, I'm not happy free warscrolls aren't around anymore. But trying to build an argument out of "I don't want to pay for the rules" to justify using free warscrolls instead of, you know, the books....well, we all know that the end reason is money, be it for GW or the customers. Of course if there's a "free stuff", it's the free stuff that will be used. That's not "missed sales" or "free advertising"...that's just human nature taking the most convenient and cheapest way. Free warcrolls combined the 2. Now they're not there anymore ? Depends of your motivation to keep having "free rules" or want to "see what things do" before buying.

Usually people playing in private groups. Of course, it doesn't concern people playing at official GW events - well, maybe very cheeky ones. Because if you have the rules, you don't need to check the warscrolls on the webstore. They are in your book. Same for people here complaining about free warscrolls being removed as a big deal in itself : personnal subjective opinion with no numbers backing them. Yes, it was very convenient. Convenience was never in question. Thread went on more than that, though, and that was the other arguments I was answering to.

Oh, that. They didn't change the free warscrolls that were on the webstore with the 3.0 FAQ. Was the same when they were available on the webstore. Nothing said they were updated at all, you had to check manually yourself if you didn't follow the meta of AoS at the dates FAQs were updated / expansions came.

Improving your products ? What are you talking about ? Free warscrolls on the webstore aren't "improved products" in themselves. How do you see the recent battletomes for Stormcast Eternals and Orruk Warclans for 3.0, then ? Because they are a different version of the rules themselves, and what you could call an upgrade of a previous product (in this case, battletome for the previous edition). Or are you advocating GW shouldn't make new editions at all ? That's another debate entirely.

Yeah, that's why I said it's more tedious now. But it still doesn't stop you from doing it if you really don't want to buy the book. I bought the book even if I don't intend to play Stormcast Eternal as my main army, by the way, because I can and it's more convenient to me.

So it doesn't matter if they were on the webstore or in the app, if you don't feel downloading everything anyway. And yeah, it's a lot of work either way. Playing AoS up to date isn't easy !

With reviews online, it's not a problem to have them. Even more with 3.0, since they're even less of them and options now (the way subfactions are treated is a big part of it, of course). Granted, but in that case, it's still easy to have what you need from a review. It's more tedious, indeed, but if that's your only argument, that doesn't stand IMHO. If players really don't want to buy the book and want to have just the rules of one allied unit, they won't just stop at the warscroll missing from the webstore. About the "missing sale"...TBH, I'm not sure people stopping at that - not having the warscroll easily available without having to pay - are actually thinking of always buying miniatures from the GW webstore, in the end. If you just need the rules and don't care to have the official GW rules at hand, I'm pretty sure you also don't mind using miniatures from other sources. GW can't miss a sale that was never intended at the beginning, after all. It's possible now via the app and the code from your battletome, actually. And if you don't want to use the app...warscrolls updates can be found in the FAQ now (like they did upgrade the army endless spells when 3.0 came). So not having the warscrolls on the webstore isn't a problem in itself here.

Nope, they're stocked on www.games-workshop.com . Moreover, they're still there. It's just the link that was removed on the webstore. Found this one through Google search typing "warscroll" with the name of the unit : https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/warhammer-aos-liberators-en.pdf or https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos-warscroll-freeguild-greatswords-en.pdf Of course, it's the 2.0 version. For Stormcast Eternals, they're not the updated one. About the "free advertisement" argument, I do get your point from a customer's point of view. Believe it or not, as a customer myself, I do agree with Runebrush here : rather than keeping them on the webstore, I would simply move them on warhammer-community. However, if I was in the shoes of GW and seeing what is the content of new battletomes...I do see why they took another road in the end. Warscrolls are now a huger part of the main rules than in 2.0 - and thus the battletome's rule content. If they were still "free", there's even less incentive to buy the books afterwards, IMHO. Obviously, it really concerns the veteran players most of the time. Battletomes are still very good value for the complete newbies ; having the lore, a good painting guide and all the rulesto play your army in the same book. People really using warscrolls on the webstore are more those who know the game for quite some time / did buy the books from previous versions and thus don't need that muych the lore and painting guides - they're just looking for the rules. And they know warscrolls are half the battle (points and core rules can be quite easy to find on reviews online / can be found in the general hanbook for older versions). Which is why they are angry GW didn't put the new 3.0 warscrolls on the webstore, because it's more tedious to gather the full rules from reviews now. The battletome looks the more convenient way...for a price, and that's the real issue IMHO. They don't want to pay for the rules, in the end.

Free advertising ? Not really. People wanting to see the warscrolls are people who already know the game. Actually, it's more a deterrent to impulse buy miniatures : if you want to see the warscrolls, you want to be sure if it's interesting first in game. The traffic here is more about "jamming" the sales than anything else. Which is why I said it can be a problem in the end.