dmorley21

It’s silly to be angry about Kruleboyz when the books were designed at least 4 years apart for a different rule set. I think it makes more sense to look at recent books to make educated guesses about where a new Nighthaunt book will go. Army-wide frightful touch? Possible now that we’ve seen Kruleboyz. A spell or something similar granting mortals on a 5+? Based on LRL, it could happen. Dropping opponent bravery by 2 if they’re facing two or more units of ghosts? Soulblight does that, so very possible. I’m curious to see how deepstriking works with the new Stormcast book too, as that might give us clues for future rules. It’s also worth noting that there was some turnover in the rules writing department this spring, so it’ll be interesting to see if that shakes things up. I’d imagine these books get written about a year before they get released.

Yeah, I should have been clear. The bonus to charging helps with fishing for Wave of Terror by making it less likely that you will fail a charge if you re-roll it. Yeah, I tried two units of 5 but they just got wiped out too quickly.

This is great information, thanks for sharing! As for the cavalry bases... I rarely had success getting every model in a unit of 10 Hexwraiths able to attack in combat in 2.0. I didn't find that any worse except when fighting a single large model (you can't encircle an opponent entirely, which is lame cinematically), and in some instances found it easier to get more models into the fight thanks to the better pile in rules. I still think Reapers shine due to their 2" range. A unit of 20 Reapers will always outperform a unit of 20 Bladegheists or Harridans in my experience. In 10s, that's very different. I feel you on the mortal wounds, but I think Spirit Hosts have been hurt the worst due to coherency rules. I'd consider taking them in a unit of 9 to be an anvil supported by a Black Coach / Ruler of the Spirit Hosts / Emerald Lifeswarm / Rally; etc. But at this point, I just don't think you can rely on 9 to be an offensive threat. You're just not going to get enough of them into your target IMO. So this is something GW could have done a much better job clarifying, but the Leader for battalions does not need to be a general. It can be any hero of your choosing.

I've gotten some more test games in now, and have some thoughts. First off, I want to stress that these are very much test games and that this new ruleset has a lot going on and will take some practice (though I quite like it overall - but it's not an easy game to pick up). Anyway, some more thoughts: Nighthaunt can now do the death thing of bringing back models fairly well. All armies have access to Rally and Emerald Lifeswarm; but when that is combined with Ruler of the Spirit Hosts or Lady Olynder as general, a Black Coach, and the Guardian of Souls; it's not that difficult to replenish a unit anymore. Charging out of the underworlds is just gone as a strategy. Without the +2 from Chronomantic Cogs and/or Death Riders, it's just not a viable strategy. That being said, Chronomantic Cogs still has play. If you take enough casters (3+) and run Cogs, Emerald Lifeswarm, and a mortal wound nuke spell; it's a feasible strategy. And the +1 to charge ability doesn't hurt when fishing for Wave of Terror. Reikenor without an endless spell that you want to cast feels like a waste of points. Overall, I think Nighthaunt are slightly more competitive than they were last edition before Broken Realms: Be'Lakor, but weaker than the list I ran after that book. They don't rely on heroes as much anymore, and benefit from the new way of scoring for about half of the battleplans. Also, the new pile in rules pretty much make the new coherency rules a wash for us. I felt like I was able to get more of my Harridans and Hexwraiths into the battle then before, except when fighting just one large single base behemoth type of model. My Reapers didn't struggle last edition and don't struggle this edition with getting into combat. Final thought: The battleplan you play has a major effect on the game. With the new way of scoring, you're typically only fighting over one objective, with many not that protected and thus it's easy for Nighthaunt to use movement shenanigans to change the structure of the game. I've held units back until turn 3 in every game so far just because of the tactical advantage it was giving me. It allows our army to do more focus fire. The core of the list I've been running is: Emerald Host Battle Regiment Battlaion: Lady Olynder (general) Krulghast Excruciator Guardian of Souls or Reikenor or Dreadblade Harrow 20 Grimghast Reapers 20 Grimghast Reapers 10 Chainrasp Horde 10 Hexwraiths 10 Dreadscthe Harridans 1 Black Coach I've then been playing around the edges with a fourth hero, another small unit, and endless spells; and haven't settled on a definitive list.

Got my first test game of 3.0 and have to say... it's going to take a lot of reps to get it down well! Ended up only playing three turns because there was so much to learn, and definitely forgot to Redeploy a couple times when it would have made a big difference. At first blush, I will say: I like the new scoring system a lot. Played first blood, and only having to control two objectives was neat. Rally can be really swingy... and also don't leave a unit underpowered thinking it's no longer a threat. My example: I used rally to try to bring back some Grimghast Reapers, with 11 rolls. Brought back none. Meanwhile, I had left a unit of 5 Dawnriders with one horse left, and on the same turn that I brought back no Reapers the Lumineth player managed to bring back 3 Dawnriders. That was a major swing. Don't forget about redeploy! I did, and it cost me the game (granted, we only played 3 turns, but it would have made a huge difference as two units only just made the charge against a unit I could have redeployed). I really miss Cogs. I think I'll have to give the new version a spin, but really miss the 2" charge. It makes charging from the underworlds so much more difficult. Just one test game, and a lot more practice will be needed! Okay, wait, one more thing because it was just great and lucky: Lady Olynder managed to kill a Cathallar, Windmage, and 10 Wardens in a single turn. The heroes were at full strength too.

Yeah, Myrmourns are probably the biggest losers in the book this edition. There are other similar units that got hit like this in other books. Skywardens and Endrinriggers in KO can no longer go up to 12, meaning no Aethergold, for instance. One of those small things that it will take a new book to fix.

Gotcha. That’s a tough one. I really miss the old cogs. And I though you said you got WoT with the Reapers? That’s why I figured 5-8. Also, All Out Attack would have added some punch there - I’m guessing you used it elsewhere? Sturdy castles are definitely difficult to chew through, but glad you had some success in your second game.

@Landohammer What was the scenario/setup in your game against LRL? I'm surprised with PotFW you weren't able to get at them with your non Undworlds troops. I've found that unless Teclis gets his aura spell off, the Lumineth castle is easy to chew through. Even with what you were up against with your Reapers, you should have ended up dealing 5-8 wounds on average. Dealing only one stinks!

I still see both Emerald Host and Reikenor's Command being valid choices. The -1 Save part of Emerald Host is useful with so many heroic monsters running around. And keeping a general alive is quite important, as it grants you an extra command point (Reikenor's Command features two generals though) but also makes the Slay the Warlord battle tactic tougher to achieve. It's a slam dunk for our opponents to take outside of Emerald Host, but with Emerald Host you can make them think twice... and anytime Nighthaunt players can get their opponents to think twice, it's well worth it. A couple other things I've thought of or seen worth discussing: Warhammer Weekly was really high on the Mortalis Terminexus endless spell on this week's episode. I'd been too busy hoping it would change to be like the old Cogs to really notice, but it is a rather nice mortal wound bomb, especially against armies that like to castle. I think our army has two grand strategies that work for us - the battleline one (Hold the Line) and the one where you have to claim more terrain than your opponent (Predator's Domain). I see the latter one being the better right now, due to the army's ability to go where it wants. Two Mournguls is useful for both the Monstrous Takeover and Savage Spearhead battle tactics. Being relatively small bases (for a monster) that you can deepstrike almost guarantees getting these battle tactics. I saw two because they'll claim 3 VPs with Savage Spearhead. The trick with the Mournguls is keeping them alive so you don't sacrifice VPs, which if I ran them I'd try to buddy them up with a Krulghast to give them the 5+ Ward.

It’ll take some actual games, but I see Nighthaunt as being pretty much in the same spot as they’ve been.

@anorek I run a similar list with Olynder in Emerlad Host. A few things: First, I’ll second that Bladegheists are better in 10s than 20s. I always tried running small groups of Hexwraiths so Olynder’s command ability could work on multiple units but in gaming have found that the unit of 5 gets deleted too quickly to be effective bodyguards. A unit of 10 serves me a lot better for that purpose, even with it being inefficient for attacking. Fianlly, I think you need another hammer unit. Luckily, just going 10 and 5 Hexes and 10 and 10 Blades should do the trick.

It’s in their actual battletome.

For larger units, the KoSoES +1 attack is better than +1 to hit. The smaller one is an aura ability, which works a little differently. That's in the Core rulebook FAQs. It's 280 points in that document that the GHB lists as being legal, so that's its current points. Big Drogg Fort-Kicka is another ally/mercernary well worth considering. As a heroic monster with 35 wounds, he's easily our best anvil. He also has a lot of high rend attacks, which is something our army lacks and causes an additional -1 to bravery for units within 3. This works well with a unit of Dreadscythe Harridans. If only the mega-gargants weren't so expensive actual money-wise.

No, the Mourngul is legal per the GHB 2021. Page 46 mentions all of the publications that are matched play legal, and says the Compendium: Monstrous Arcanum is matched play legal for models/units that have not been moved into legends. That's the Forgeworld publication of warscrolls. So the Mourngul is legal unless it gets moved to Legends, but will likely be updated with a new Monstrous Arcanum. I think/hope that will naturally happen as we discuss our experience with Nighthaunt in AoS 3.0. While we can certainly theorycraft, I really feel like you need reps (probably at least 10 games) before you can start saying what should be changed. I'd imagine Nighthaunt will get a book in 2022, so I'm sure we'll be wish listing after a few months!

You can’t give All Out Attack and +1 Attack as they happen in the same phase and units can only receive one command ability.

Yeah, until Forgeworld releases a new Monstrous Arcanum it counts per the GHB (unless it gives moved to Legends). As is, I see a lot of potential running two with a Krulghast.

Did something take away the keyword? It still has it in the app.

I’m still not impressed and don’t own them to test them out. I think Emerald Lifeswarm is really good though. On the turn you cast it, you get 2D3 wounds or models back. Adding that with other things like the Black Coach, Ruler of the Spirit Hosts, Spirit Torment, and Lady Olynder makes for some solid resurrecting for an anvil style unit.

Yep! It’s a really powerful enhancement, especially if you take Cogs. Also, I should have mentioned this before in here, but I started a new thread for discussing Nighthaunt in AoS 3. A bunch of other factions had one already, so I felt one was needed for the ghosts as well.

@Ranzou Those are both pretty interesting. I especially like how you put your core units in the Hunters in the Heartlands battalion. One of the things that I'm really interested to see is where average drops come in at. The first list I plan on trying is: Emerald Host Battle Regiment: Lady Olynder (general) Dreadblade Harrow (Pendant of the Fell Wind) Krulghast Cruciator 20 Grimghast Reapers 20 Grimghast Reapers 10 Hexwraiths 10 Chainrasp Horder 10 Dreadscythe Harridans Black Coach And then Reieknor outside the battalion. My thinking is that at two drops, I'll probably have the drop most lists. I doubt too many lists will be on drop. I would take second almost every game, knowing I can hide my units in the back or off the board to prevent a turn 1 alpha against most forces. That would set me up to either take a double turn or to at least avoid getting doubled 1 into 2 and have an additional command point. I think it would realistically prevent me from being double until rounds 3/4 unless I choose to be as players will probably want to take the second turn in round 3 a lot now. I like the idea of dictating the flow of the game, and think it fits in well with the movement shenanigans that the army can do.

Unless I’m missing something, that doesn’t help Reapers, does it? Yeah I do see Mannfred as having a lot of potential. I don’t care for the model, and am going to start a new army this edition, so I don’t think I’ll try him out. But I think he could be a lot of fun. Honestly, there’s several decent options in Soulblight. Yeah. The new GHB lists which books are still matched okay legal, and the one that features LoG is not there.

I figured it is time to switch the discussion thread with the start of a new edition. I also know a lot of Nighthaunt players are down on the faction, but I remain excited. My first list is going to be a two drop, as I think being able to choose to go second will be a way to give the army a boost. I was also interested by the list that can be found at Goonhammer here: Goonhammer Article with Nighthaunt List So let’s start by talking about what lists we’re planning to try and what our experiences are with actual gameplay. Cheers.

Is there something that says unlocked battleline units can't be reinforced twice?

Isn’t October typically a month for larger releases? With the Hobgrots clue, I wonder if it might be AoS Chaos Dwarves.

Only Mortarchs in Ossiarch. The ones in Soulblight don't get this ability, and if you take Nagash in Soulblight, you don't get this ability. I assume this is to represent how highly militarized Ossiarch is.