Competitive Seraphon

[Aginor]

Yeah, it is pretty nice that he has rend and damage 2 ranged. With a little bit of luck he tears through some light infantry like a hot knife through butter. Savage Orruks or Skeletons don't even get a save against him.

IMO our best unit. Those 2d6 make it a bit random in attacks. But the heavy armor makes up for it a bit, so yeah, 300 points is OK I guess.
A great defender.

[Let's 'ere it for da boyz!]

Maybe we should see if a Mod can change the name of this thread to "Bastiladons are the ****".

[Aginor]

Well, we have other cool units as well!

Even though they are glass cannons I like our flyers very much, especially with the Shadowstrike Starhost (that my Orruk playing friend calls outright cheese btw).

[Let's 'ere it for da boyz!]

4 minutes ago, Aginor said:

Even though they are glass cannons I like our flyers very much, especially with the Shadowstrike Starhost (that my Orruk playing friend calls outright cheese btw).

Presumably as his Kunnin' Rukk  Lindbergh shoots your dinosaurs to ribbons.

I agree, the ripperdactyls are terrifying.  Particularly with that Shadowstrike bonus. If you could fit two of those battalions into a 2k list with Ripperdactyl units bigger than the minimum...yikes.

[Aginor]

No he plays mixed Destruction with a focus on Ironjawz. He loses most of our matches right now but he is in the process of optimizing already.
We both started playing only recently (last fall) and we both just picked units judging by looks. He got an Aleguzzler and some Scraplaunchers and both are...kinda underperforming. He mixed Greenskinz and some Savage Boarboyz and Ironjawz and it turns out that - while fun to play - the mix isn't too effective.

I had some more luck and picked something that actually worked fine together.

So what we do now: He is allowed to bring more points than I do, so we have approximately the same chance of winning. At 10% penalty I usually win, at 20% I usually lose. We alternate between the two. Last week I won a match with 20% less. He thinks that Seraphon are imbalanced and unbeatable while I try to explain him that Seraphon are outdated.

[Praecautus]

I love seraphon but when I put a carnosaur down I want my oppenent to be like the kids in Jurassic park when the water in the glass vibrates. 

If seraphon felt like that then more would play them. As it is they are jack of all trades master of none and that makes me sad ? 

[Aginor]

For me it is the other way round I guess. Those "one trick ponies" appall me a bit.

I want an army that provides me with more than just a few minor differently viable variants.

[Austin]

2 hours ago, Aginor said:

For me it is the other way round I guess. Those "one trick ponies" appall me a bit.

I want an army that provides me with more than just a few minor differently viable variants.

Well, not to be negative, but if this thread is anything to go by, Rippers and Bastiladons are sort of the overwhelming stars and seem like auto includes. I want that to be wrong, because like you I want to be able to have lots of options.

[Aginor]

That's why I don't use Rippers. Terradons are more versatile and thus more fun for me.

As for the Bastiladon....guilty I guess. I loved the model the second I saw it and I am happy it is also good.

But then... my lists could do without it as well. 300 points worth of Skinks (or a Troglodon and five guards, and I can also think of other combinations) would be just as much of a pain in the behind of an enemy, wouldnt they? The Basti is our best unit but I don't see it as a "must take or list sucks".

...in fact, now that I think about it I will have to do the math. 40 Skinks might really be better than the Basti in many regards. Movement, wounds, number of attacks, average wounds done and so on.

Five Razordons sound almost as scary as well....

[Austin]

8 minutes ago, Aginor said:

That's why I don't use Rippers. Terradons are more versatile and thus more fun for me.

As for the Bastiladon....guilty I guess. I loved the model the second I saw it and I am happy it is also good.

But then... my lists could do without it as well. 300 points worth of Skinks (or a Troglodon and five guards, and I can also think of other combinations) would be just as much of a pain in the behind of an enemy, wouldnt they? The Basti is our best unit but I don't see it as a "must take or list sucks".

...in fact, now that I think about it I will have to do the math. 40 Skinks might really be better than the Basti in many regards. Movement, wounds, number of attacks, average wounds done and so on.

Five Razordons sound almost as scary as well....

I am not arguing about the Laser Dinosaur With Other Dinosaurs Riding It being awesome. It is one of those models that GW hit out of the park.

I would just also like to balance it with Stegadons and Carnosaurs.  And I am as guilty as any other for using models just because I like how they look. Skinks will be my default battleline just because I don't like Warrior or Knights (at least until I figure out a way to get a bunch of the Dark Elf Cold Ones).

[Aginor]

Same here with the Skinks. Although IMO Saurus can look great if you paint them well. I am not that good at painting yet, so it is hard for me because the sculpt itself isn't _that_ great.

And the other point about Saurus Warriors: You cannot play 10 (or 12 like in the Start Collecting box) and be effective. You need lots of them (30+, which pretty much means 40) and a fitting hero (Sunblood) then they suddenly become quite good. Skinks have their uses even in small groups and without spedific heroes attached to them.

And yeah, the Dark Aelves' Cold Ones are better. I kiiinda like ours as well but the other ones beat them in almost every regard.
A few of the guys over at Lustria Online made some nice conversions using Dark Aelf Cold Ones, but they are a bit too expensive for me since I don't play Knights often. Now if they had 9" move at least...

[Bradifer]

I made a bunch of competitive list a while ago.

 I don't remember where I stored them, but here are a few rough versions:

Heavenswatch BastiHammer

Saurus Sunblood (120)
Skink Starseer (160)
Skink Priest (100)
- Priestly Trappings
Skink Starpriest (100)
40 x Saurus Warriors (400)
- Clubs
10 x Skinks (80)
- Meteoric Javelins & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (80)
- Meteoric Javelins & Star Bucklers
3 x Ripperdactyl Riders (140)
5 x Chameleon Skinks (120)
Bastiladon (300)
Bastiladon (300)
Heavenswatch Starhost (100)
Total: 2000/2000

 

Order Gunline (Written pre-SCE Update)

Skink Starseer (160)
Engine of the Gods (240)
Skink Chief (60)
- General
- Golden Sickle
Celestial Hurricanum With Celestial Battlemage (320)
Battlemage (100)
10 x Skinks (80)
- Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (80)
- Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (80)
- Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
3 x Skink Handlers (40)
1 x Razordons (60)
1 x Razordons (60)
Bastiladon (300)
Bastiladon (300)
Thunderquake Starhost (120)
Total: 2000/2000

 

I had others, like Eternal Starhost + Thunderquake starhost for unkillable defensive blob. Just seems bad for objectives, and also boring to play.

[kaintxu]

17 hours ago, Bradifer said:

I made a bunch of competitive list a while ago.

 I don't remember where I stored them, but here are a few rough versions:

Heavenswatch BastiHammer

Saurus Sunblood (120)
Skink Starseer (160)
Skink Priest (100)
- Priestly Trappings
Skink Starpriest (100)
40 x Saurus Warriors (400)
- Clubs
10 x Skinks (80)
- Meteoric Javelins & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (80)
- Meteoric Javelins & Star Bucklers
3 x Ripperdactyl Riders (140)
5 x Chameleon Skinks (120)
Bastiladon (300)
Bastiladon (300)
Heavenswatch Starhost (100)
Total: 2000/2000

 

Order Gunline (Written pre-SCE Update)

Skink Starseer (160)
Engine of the Gods (240)
Skink Chief (60)
- General
- Golden Sickle
Celestial Hurricanum With Celestial Battlemage (320)
Battlemage (100)
10 x Skinks (80)
- Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (80)
- Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (80)
- Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
3 x Skink Handlers (40)
1 x Razordons (60)
1 x Razordons (60)
Bastiladon (300)
Bastiladon (300)
Thunderquake Starhost (120)
Total: 2000/2000

 

I had others, like Eternal Starhost + Thunderquake starhost for unkillable defensive blob. Just seems bad for objectives, and also boring to play.

Why don't you add he battlemage to the hurricanes as it is an option and that way u don't need to pay the 100 points?

[Austin]

I like the idea of adding other Order units in to balance out weaknesses. I think in particular there could be Rend help from Sylvaneth.

Sort of as an aside, I wonder if the fact that Creative Assembly clearly knows that Seraphon (or as they are still saying Lizardmen) are marketing gold will rub off on GW and cause any future Seraphon releases to be bumped up.

[Bradifer]

5 hours ago, kaintxu said:

Why don't you add he battlemage to the hurricanes as it is an option and that way u don't need to pay the 100 points?

I think the intention there is to have 2 battlemages. One rides the hurricanum, other is on foot.

Choice is up to you which one. The Jade mage is good for extra healing on hurricanum or the monsters.

The Loremaster was another strong mage if you went a different direction. You enchant up the Bastiladon to make it more consistent.

I don't even play Seraphon at the moment. But I didn't like the idea of having to take a more order heavy army to make lizards work. Specifically undercosted Kurnoth hunters, which will get nerfed eventually. They benefits from woods anyways, which you will not generate.

I think 40-blocks of Saurus Warriors are under utilized. Have you ever tried to kill a mystic shielded block of 40 that ignores rend -1 and has 10 bravery, while it marches 10 inches a turn? Sounds difficult.

It's not cheap @ 400 points, but has way more bodies than any behemoth would, and way more wounds as well. Especially if it's conga-lined into range of a praying Skink Priest for save re-rolls.