Is mono FEC playable?

[Pazuzu]

Hi, I'm new in this game system, I've made a couple of matches with khorne bloodbound but I'd like to try something else before start an army (I've got a lot of miniatures from warhammer fantasy and 40K to proxy In friendly matches before buying something), I was looking at the flesh eaters and I thought about something like that to start (buying just two starter sets and few else things):

Leaders
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Zombie Dragon (400)
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist (400)
Varghulf Courtier (160)
Crypt Ghast Courtier (80)

Battleline
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
10 x Crypt Ghouls (100)
10 x Crypt Ghouls (100)
9 x Crypt Horrors (420)
- Flesh Eater Courts Battleline (Crypt Haunter Courtier General)

Units

Battalions
Ghoul Patrol (100)
Is something like this playable for you? I'm not looking for the most competitive build, but I would like to be able to play every match even with some difficulties. What do you think? And which is the best setting for my heroes? I'm in doubt between red fury and ruler of the night for the general and I don't really know which artefacts suite better to these heroes

Thank you fo any comment!

Ps: I'm Italian, so, I apologise if I made grammar mistakes 

[Ghoul King]

I'm a newer player myself, but I think this list looks very good. I would suggest the Ruler of the Night command trait for your general and the Cursed Book for most of your heroes. The exception to this is the Varghulf Courtier who would probably do better with a Tomb Blade.

[Ollie Grimwood]

I've played against a similar list and it did seem very powerful, my opponent did tell me that it struggles against armies with good/save resilience. He specifically pointed out treemen as a real issue. 

I was using a Greeskins/Ironjawz mix and had all sorts of trouble. The ability to regerenate models was a real thorn in my side and the Vargulfs seemed very effective for their points 

[StuG]

I run similar, but swap out ghouls with horrors and run abbattoir.

I find it runs well while your leaders are regenerating lost models, coupled with the trait makes your wound save better makes a tough force. Unfortunately once your leaders fall it starts to crumble in true undead fashion.

I'm feeling strongly drawn towards the mourngul just lately, that thing whilst not FEC, i think it does fit in aesthetically if you paint it similar to the rest of your force.

[Criti]

40 minutes ago, StuG said:

I run similar, but swap out ghouls with horrors and run abbattoir.

This. 

My most regular opponent plays Flesh Eaters and multiple big units of Horrors backed by multiple Horror Heroes and a pair of Ghoul Kings.

The combination of rerolls, Black Hunger, the Death Save, and multiple sources of Horror regeneration creates a very solid attrition wall.

The speed of the Horrors and the redundant Horror Heroes make it difficult to take out the Heroes before there's a boatload of dice in the opponent's face.

Of course, it doesn't hurt that he rolls so damned well he's pretty guaranteed to have full strength units no matter how many casualties I cause.

[Pazuzu]

thank you to everybody, for your suggestions I imagine something like this: 

Leaders
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist (400)
Crypt Infernal Courtier (140)
Varghulf Courtier (160)

Battleline
9 x Crypt Flayers (480)
- Flesh Eater Courts Battleline (Crypt Infernal Courtier General)
6 x Crypt Flayers (320)
- Flesh Eater Courts Battleline (Crypt Infernal Courtier General)
6 x Crypt Flayers (320)
- Flesh Eater Courts Battleline (Crypt Infernal Courtier General)

Units

Battalions
Deadwatch (160)

Total: 1980/2000

and I've to say I kind of like it... But I really love to see small ghouls nearby the big monsters, are they that bad? they are so cute... Then I like the idea to deploy a small part of my army to have the control on the first turn. But I've 0 experience at all so I'm listening to all your comments! 

About the mourngul... that piece is just amazing so I considered being less "racist" and consider to take him in my court, the reason he is not there is just that I've got a zombie dragon in the starter pack and I've not that many money to spend... but in the future... They have the same cost in points!

[Criti]

I love Ghouls... but I say that as the guy playing against FEC.  Units of 30 Ghouls I can make evaporate all day long.

[Pazuzu]

19 minutes ago, Criti said:

I love Ghouls... but I say that as the guy playing against FEC.  Units of 30 Ghouls I can make evaporate all day long.

Ok, that's brutal but it explains the concept pretty well...

[Lord Veshnakar]

On 2/24/2017 at 5:12 PM, Ollie Grimwood said:

I've played against a similar list and it did seem very powerful, my opponent did tell me that it struggles against armies with good/save resilience. He specifically pointed out treemen as a real issue. 

I honestly think Treemen with Oaken armor are an issue for anyone in truth. Just especially the armies with low mortal wound output to surpass 2+ saves.  It usually has Gnarled Warrior too which ignores any rend unless it's -2 or better. Gaping maw from a Terrorgheist can really beat them up but that takes some luck.

FEC is a phenomenal army though. Loads of attacks, and the regeneration of FEC units near characters in the hero phase is their big strength. Crypt horrors + Vargulf/Crypt Haunter Courtier nearby will make people really rage. Rolling 6 dice and getting a 4 wound model back on any 5+ every hero phase can be maddening for some opponents.

[Bradifer]

I think it comes down to your opponents making your list competitive or not.

 

Either you're going against a list with long range that can just snipe away your heroes, or you're going against some other army with just a bunch of random enemies on the table. The first list will cause massive problems, and the second you will eventually pull ahead, because 2-4 rounds of combat into it, you create an advantage that your opponent just can't keep up with.

Sylvaneth just has problems for all armies right now. While they aren't winning big tournaments, most games don't occur in a big tournament setting either. If one guy at your local store has a hard Sylvaneth list, it's gonna be hard to topple him when he can give -x to hit in combat, have 2+ rerolling 1's, ignore rend -1 armor save, reliable healing, mortal wounding uncounterable terrain pieces and extremely efficient elite units, well, lots of armies have a hard time with that guy on Sylvaneth. At least if your army doesn't have reliable mortal wound output (FEC does not).

FEC should be fun, just be aware if your opponents are more competitive, well then you probably want a mourngul to present a truly difficult threat while they just snipe your heroes, if your opponents lists aren't as strong, drop the mourngul and just have fun, but be aware FEC can take over prolonged games if your opponents don't play against you correctly!

[wayniac]

From what I have seen, no.  You really want to add in other things from the Death alliance.  I have been trying to make mono FEC work and it seems every game I just get crushed with little or no effort on the part of my opponent.

[L.Bromley]

@Pazuzu I'm also a mono FEC player an I find them really fun to play with (only been playing for 6 months an don't know anything else so have nothing to compare in to) I really like your list, really fast an manoeuvrable, great for objective scoring, I think one thing that a lot of FEC players are missing out on is using or ghoul kings command ability for risk free summoning. I use my GKOTG to bring on flayers late in the game an they are great for stealing last minute objectives.

[wayniac]

1 hour ago, L.Bromley said:

@Pazuzu I'm also a mono FEC player an I find them really fun to play with (only been playing for 6 months an don't know anything else so have nothing to compare in to) I really like your list, really fast an manoeuvrable, great for objective scoring, I think one thing that a lot of FEC players are missing out on is using or ghoul kings command ability for risk free summoning. I use my GKOTG to bring on flayers late in the game an they are great for stealing last minute objectives.

Do you find that not having the points there at the start of the game is a detriment?  My concern has always been the GKOTG is a huge target, and can easily be killed with overwhelming firepower (that so many armies have nowadays...) and then you just lost not only a 400 point model, but whatever points you set up aside to summon those horrors/flayers.

[L.Bromley]

2 hours ago, wayniac said:

Do you find that not having the points there at the start of the game is a detriment?  My concern has always been the GKOTG is a huge target, and can easily be killed with overwhelming firepower (that so many armies have nowadays...) and then you just lost not only a 400 point model, but whatever points you set up aside to summon those horrors/flayers.

Not really, I play double winged beastie and a block of 9 horrors, all juicy targets, the terrorghiest normally try's to deploy near arcane if possible, cast my additional 5+ save spell an if I can get a mystic shield off then brilliant, being 160 points down at the start is no biggie, I also find that most players forget you have access the the flayers.

my list is normally

GKOT

GKOZD

2 x Vargulf

3 x 10 ghouls

9 x horrors

3 x flayers

now if I didn't have to deploy battle line I would change the list an take a ghoul king on foot an bring in the ghouls that way (sort of a low budget ghoul patrol). I know lots of people think FEC aren't that competitive but since using the command ability I am 3 major wins from my last 3 games, prior to this I was 50/50

[wayniac]

Just now, L.Bromley said:

Not really, I play double winged beastie and a block of 9 horrors, all juicy targets, the terrorghiest normally try's to deploy near arcane if possible, cast my additional 5+ save spell an if I can get a mystic shield off then brilliant, being 160 points down at the start is no biggie, I also find that most players forget you have access the the flayers.

my list is normally

GKOT

GKOZD

2 x Vargulf

3 x 10 ghouls

9 x horrors

3 x flayers

now if I didn't have to deploy battle line I would change the list an take a ghoul king on foot an bring in the ghouls that way (sort of a low budget ghoul patrol). I know lots of people think FEC aren't that competitive but since using the command ability I am 3 major wins from my last 3 games, prior to this I was 50/50

That looks like a really good list actually.  You don't find that three units of only 10 ghouls don't matter?  I've been thinking of things and it always comes back to just a ton of ghouls, like units of 20 minimum, or even 30.

[L.Bromley]

7 minutes ago, wayniac said:

That looks like a really good list actually.  You don't find that three units of only 10 ghouls don't matter?  I've been thinking of things and it always comes back to just a ton of ghouls, like units of 20 minimum, or even 30.

I used to play an obvious ghoul patrol list, double terrorghiest, zombie dragon, ghast, 60 ghouls in ghoul patrol (30,20,10) an while it was fun it didn't really have the combat punch I wanted. I find a block of horrors backed up with a vargulf is a real focus point for my opponent, they will always want to target the big guys but no one wants to fight the horror block, if you can get them near the GKOZD an get his spell off then they are fantastic, rerolls to hit and wound. 

As originally stated though I have only ever played the flesh eaters, they do lack rend attacks that's why the flayers are great, summon them on at the energy board edge an target shooters and war machine( are real weakness) or to steal objectives that are defended by cheap battle line options

[wayniac]

17 minutes ago, L.Bromley said:

I used to play an obvious ghoul patrol list, double terrorghiest, zombie dragon, ghast, 60 ghouls in ghoul patrol (30,20,10) an while it was fun it didn't really have the combat punch I wanted. I find a block of horrors backed up with a vargulf is a real focus point for my opponent, they will always want to target the big guys but no one wants to fight the horror block, if you can get them near the GKOZD an get his spell off then they are fantastic, rerolls to hit and wound. 

As originally stated though I have only ever played the flesh eaters, they do lack rend attacks that's why the flayers are great, summon them on at the energy board edge an target shooters and war machine( are real weakness) or to steal objectives that are defended by cheap battle line options

I must try this.  I've been struggling with the obvious ghoul patrol/horde of ghouls type of list and it seems to fail miserably (however there are a lot of Sylvaneth players at my GW and IMHO Sylvaneth are a very tough matchup for our noble kingdoms).

Many thanks for thy tactical insight, fellow noble king! Long may you reign!

[The Obsidian Lord]

I won't deny FEC imho are solo playable from what I've experienced so far, but I will admit I've not had that many games. But I do like to throw around two units of 6 horrors and a Courtier in the Attendants at Court Battalion alongside the Death Book Ghoul King, which I've been told I am able to still use as long as I use -all- his Death book stats, so it means I swap out that summoning Command Ability for +1 to hit and wound in an 18" bubble, using that twice thanks to the Attendants at court Battalion means Pretty much -everything- I have in rage of that bubble hits on 2+, follow it up with the Black Hunger spell and the Shenanigans begin!

I do play to start fielding more flayers though hopefully! Needa wait till my next payday before I start that up though

[wayniac]

I think I am definitely going to experiment with the death book ghoul king, because I really hate not getting a command ability (since they all deal with summoning and I rarely, if ever, put aside reserve points).  Getting that bonus seems like it would go really nice with a big block of ghouls buffed to the gills  

[The Obsidian Lord]

3 hours ago, wayniac said:

I think I am definitely going to experiment with the death book ghoul king, because I really hate not getting a command ability (since they all deal with summoning and I rarely, if ever, put aside reserve points).  Getting that bonus seems like it would go really nice with a big block of ghouls buffed to the gills  

Yeah I had a game this sunday gone and a block of 20 ghouls with that buff took out a Soul Grinder in their combat step, and a group of 9 horrors took out a bloodthirster. It is absolutely brutal I love it <3