Mr.Mournfang Posted June 20, 2018 Share Posted June 20, 2018 Hello everybody ? I'm relatively new to AoS and new to this board. I am really interested in getting into some BCR, even if they seem not to be in the best shape atm. But I really just want to race around with some big monsters smashing into enemies ? So I got some ideas for lists and need some feedback from you List 1: - Frostlord on Stonehorn (420) - Huskard on Stonehorn (340) - Stonehorn Riders (320) - Troggoth Hag (360) [Allies] - Mournfang Pack (160) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Endless Spell: Chromatic Cogs (60) 1980 / 2000 pts I was also thinking of switching one Mournfang Pack for an Eurlbad (170) or Jorlbad (160). List 2: - Huskard on Stonehorn - Stonehorn Riders (320) - Stonehorn Riders (320) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Butcher with Cauldron (140) - Endless Spell: Chromatic Cogs (60) - Battalions: Eurlbad (170) or Jorlbad (160) 1980(1990) / 2000 pts Here I might also be able to switch the Battalion for another Butcher. Any feedback and or suggestions? Which list might be better? Are the chromatic cogs worth taking for a BCR army? Thanks again in advance!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Mournfang Posted June 20, 2018 Author Share Posted June 20, 2018 Or List 3: - Frostlord on Stonehorn (420) - Huskard on Stonehorn (340) - Stonehorn Riders (320) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Mournfang Pack (160) - Butcher with Cauldron (140) [Allies] - Butcher with Cauldron (140) [Allies] - Battalion: Jorlbad (160) Sorry for second post, but somehow I wasn't able to edit this in ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heywoah_twitch Posted June 20, 2018 Share Posted June 20, 2018 I have some questions to better help. How competitive are your local folks? What do they play? What models do you like too much not to use? How many decisions/what kind of play style do you naturally gravitate towards? You seem to like mournfang a lot - or is that mostly just to qualify for battalions? You're aware of our situation so I'm sure you're no WAAC man, but then again having the tools to win in friendly games is still something to strive for - no one likes always losing. Since you're asking about lists I'll be focusing more on viability, and so some cautions: The cogs seem too expensive and I don't think we run enough bodies to lock the opponent into enough combats for the extra move it gives them not to hurt us on their turn. I like cogs in armies that will actually just kill you if only they could get there like DoK or Ironjawz, or ones that go full tarpit mode once they do like Nurgle or STD. Huskard on Stonehorn sits in the awkward place of too fragile (vs frostlord) but more expensive than beastriders. He doesn't have a weapon that an artefact would help, but something like ethereal amulet still just gives him a 4+ which isn't that great. I think he's only really worth playing in a eurlbad (which makes his damage the nut, and lets his pile-in help mournfang). Jorlbad is a battalion that helps you get into combat, but the problem isn't getting there - it's doing well once you do. It also helps against battleshock for units that do not need help against battleshock. Also stonehorn can already run and charge. I don't think it's very good. Offensively, Mournfang damage is very unreliable. Defensively they aren't a great deal, and only 2 models is bad for objectives. To make them good they need a huge amount of extra points of support units and even then you're fishing for 1-in-3 rolls for hit buffs. You can do it, it just means the whole army will kindof be dedicated to making it happen - and so it's up to taste. Plus it's goofy conceptually: You're taking an unreliable unit and unreliably buffing them so they can unreliably become reliable sometimes. We're all still testing stuff and it's very early, but I think the name of the game is having either a thundertusk general for yeti battleline or a hunter general for frost saber battleline. If I had to make a sampler platter bcr list with mournfang it would look something like this: Spoiler 170 - Eurlbad, Aqshy Realm 340 - Huskard on Stonehorn, Thermalrider Cloak (+4" move and flying) 360 - Huskard on Thundertusk General, Everwinter's Master, Ignax's Scales (4+ mw save) 280 - 2x butcher allies 320 - stonehorn beastriders 320 - 4x mournfang 160 - 2x mournfang 50 - choice of endless spells / command point / frost sabers to taste 2k Hope this helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlasticCraic Posted June 21, 2018 Share Posted June 21, 2018 The Olwyr Alfrostun can now fit into 2000 points and cominbed with the Eurlbad gives you some really nice benefits (especially if you like Mournfang), plus of course the two extra Command Points. It can also make you a one drop army, and comes in at 1920. That puts you on a one-drop army if you wanted to throw in a couple of Frost Sabres or take a 3rd Command Point (possibly overkill), or you could ally in something like a Fungoid Cave Shaman. The (significant) downsides are: - If you ally in a wizard such as the Fungoid Cave Shaman, you become 2 drops and therefore vulnerable to the Alpha Strike. - You are paying for 2 extra artefacts via the Batallions (taking you up to 3), but can only afford to fit in 2 heroes. - The Frostlord on Thundertusk in particular is a suboptimal hero and feels like a huge tax. 420 points for him is crazy. Overall by the time you've fit the minimum requirements, you can only fit in 3x 2 Mournfang, which is a shame. It could be a really interesting build if you didn't need to waste a quarter of your army on an overcosted combat hero that doesn't want to be in combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Mournfang Posted June 21, 2018 Author Share Posted June 21, 2018 9 hours ago, heywoah_twitch said: How competitive are your local folks? What do they play? What models do you like too much not to use? How many decisions/what kind of play style do you naturally gravitate towards? As I am relatively new to AoS I'm not really sure what they really like to play style wise. I have seen some Ironjaws, Stormcast, Nurgle, Fireslaysers and Nighthaunt. So they might be all over the board 9 hours ago, heywoah_twitch said: You seem to like mournfang a lot - or is that mostly just to qualify for battalions? I mostly chose them, because they seemed to be the best choice for Battleline to me. And also because of the Battalions. If I don't go for any Battalion, what might be a better choice for Battleline then? You mentioned sabres and yetis. You got any list ideas with them? What about some Beastriders as Battleline? I saw you ran some Mournfang in the past as well. Have they changed so much that they are not worth playing in the new AoS or have they always been not so great? Is it worth running multiple Thundertusks instead of the Stonehorns then? Or go for a mix? 8 hours ago, PlasticCraic said: The Olwyr Alfrostun can now fit into 2000 points and cominbed with the Eurlbad gives you some really nice benefits (especially if you like Mournfang), plus of course the two extra Command Points. Oh I didn't know that. I must have calculated with some old points then Sorry for all the questions, but you have already been a lot of helo. Greatly appreciate your answers!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanatical-mushroom-addict Posted June 21, 2018 Share Posted June 21, 2018 I'm relatively new but, as you can tell from my name) I love grots, and I would recommend using multiple shamans of all varieties for the solid magic spam. At 80 points each for the fungoid and moonclan grot shamans you could take as many as 5 for the allied detatchment. While I wouldn't recommend this for obvious reasons (spell duplicates not being allowed) three in total works quite well. I would go with 2 fungoid for the ability to put out an extra spell and reroll failed saves, cast and unbinds once per game and their durability, even though their basic spell is pretty meh. However, it is good if they get piled in on yet somehow survive. The moonclan grot shaman has the curse of the bad moon which is my favourite spell (once finished off two wraiths and a vampire lord in one turn and my opponent surrendered there and then) and as it is scored on a 6 on 2d6 due to magic mushrooms they are quite reliable. Also if for whatever reason you aren't casting curse of da bad moon then a 3+ arcane bolt isn't bad either. If the three of them focus a character who's out of position or something they could potentially (in the right circumstances) do 3d3 damage with either +2 or reroll. Thats not bad when combined with another wizard or a charge. Because the fungoids can cast two spells per turn once per game they could make up for the other fungoid dying. correct me if im wrong but that seems good to me and it has worked in my games so far (800 points btw). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heywoah_twitch Posted June 21, 2018 Share Posted June 21, 2018 We can't ally in any of the grot factions, sadly, so no grot shamans or any such. Though the fungoid is special and his herald ability lets us get him. 1 hour ago, Mr.Mournfang said: I mostly chose them, because they seemed to be the best choice for Battleline to me. And also because of the Battalions. If I don't go for any Battalion, what might be a better choice for Battleline then? You mentioned sabres and yetis. You got any list ideas with them? What about some Beastriders as Battleline? I saw you ran some Mournfang in the past as well. Have they changed so much that they are not worth playing in the new AoS or have they always been not so great? Sorry for all the questions, but you have already been a lot of helo. Greatly appreciate your answers!! First of all you don't need to apologize for asking questions in your own thread that you created to ask questions! I played mournfang in the past because I was trying to make them good, but no, they've always been quite underwhelming. They have a reputation for missing all the time (with their 4+/3+ weapon profile with only 2 good attacks per model). They have lots of wounds per model, but not per points spent, and if they haven't charged their quality declines even further. If you have a butcher and if he rolls the 1-in-3 chance for a +1 to hit buff and if you put it on a 4-man unit of mournfang and if they get a charge off on that turn, then they become properly killy. Whether all that's worth it depends on room in your list and if you were using a butcher already. Also if you're the kind of person who just rolls hot non-stop, then you've chosen the right faction. We have a tiny chance of doing awesome damage if you are absolutely allergic to rolling below a 4 during combats. The old Let's Chat: Beastclaw Raiders thread has some of us spitballing list ideas on the last 2 pages as the points were spoiling that you could check out, but everything's pretty up in the air at this point. Yetis have a bunch of attacks and have a very strong 6" pile-in ability. They're cheap and are at -1 to be hit in combat, but with a 6+ armor save they evaporate if anyone shoots them, or attacks them with rend, which is very common. Counterpoint: if they're shooting yetis they aren't shooting thundertusks. Counter-counter point: many armies can shoot both, often on turn 1. Frost Sabers get no respect, but they are not bad at attacking and have good movement for costing almost nothing. The reason they are so cheap is they are made out of tissue paper and have low bravery. Very often taken as battleline with a hunter general to be able to fit the max amount of beasts in a list, or with a skal for an extra artefact, though 150 is a tall order for an extra artefact and a cat-only deepstrike. Boy I wish we had 80 point runesmiters or soulscryers that can deepstrike anyone along with them instead of 370 for a hunter and 4 cats... Beastrider battleline are nice. They are pretty fragile for something that is supposed to be extremely durable, but filling a battleline slot while qualifying for a eurlbad is nice. I'd probably not take them unless filling a battalion requirement, though. Thundertusks oblige you to run more thundertusks, as it makes the huskard's heal more likely to work (and you really need the heal). This puts the non-huskard versions in a bad spot, since the damage of frost wreathed ice goes down really fast as they take damage. Too fast, imo, and I'm hoping for a warscroll tweak of some sort for these guys. Many people ran 3 or 4 huskards very early in '16 before moving to stonehorns in the latter half of the season, and there's been talk of trying out those lists again. I think payce? suggested it in the main thread, and I plan on trying it this week. A lot of the stuff we're all trying is very skewed while we figure out what's good (4 frostlords! no, now 4 thundertusks! no, now a eurlbad and wizards!), so it's probably a nightmare from a prospective buyer point of view. I always caution to wait for the full release for more info, but magnetizing behemoths can go a long way in future-proofing your army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemzo Posted June 21, 2018 Share Posted June 21, 2018 2 hours ago, heywoah_twitch said: A lot of the stuff we're all trying is very skewed while we figure out what's good (4 frostlords! no, now 4 thundertusks! no, now a eurlbad and wizards!), so it's probably a nightmare from a prospective buyer point of view. I always caution to wait for the full release for more info, but magnetizing behemoths can go a long way in future-proofing your army. Hit the nail on the head on that one! I got into AoS with BCR a few weeks and am a little baffled. I didn't like the idea of magnetizing heads (for painting reasons) and just glued the thundertusk head on my Start Collecting model. Still not sure if that was the right decisions... But for now, I'm just going to paint up 1000 points, get some games in, see what I think, then add some more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemzo Posted June 21, 2018 Share Posted June 21, 2018 What do you think about this for a first 1000 points, with the Start Collecting box as the core: Huskard on Thundertusk 2 Mournfang (Battleline) 2 Mournfang (Battleline) 4 Frost Saber 3 Yehtee 3 Yehtee With the new points, I think that comes out to an even 1000. It might be better to drop one of the Mournfang to get a Hunter, so the Frost Sabers can ambush - but I wanted to use all of my Start Collecting box. How would you improve that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitloze Posted June 21, 2018 Share Posted June 21, 2018 I like that 1000 pts list. What is good points wise does not translate well into $$$. Plastic yhetee and Frost sabers models would do BCR sooo much good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sieggi858 Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 2 hours ago, Pitloze said: I like that 1000 pts list. What is good points wise does not translate well into $$$. Plastic yhetee and Frost sabers models would do BCR sooo much good. I just use Fenrisian Wolves as my Sabers. Completely different animal, but I hate the weird resin Sabertooths and figured giant Dire Wolves would still fit the “ice age” theme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlasticCraic Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 4 hours ago, Gemzo said: What do you think about this for a first 1000 points, with the Start Collecting box as the core: Huskard on Thundertusk 2 Mournfang (Battleline) 2 Mournfang (Battleline) 4 Frost Saber 3 Yehtee 3 Yehtee With the new points, I think that comes out to an even 1000. It might be better to drop one of the Mournfang to get a Hunter, so the Frost Sabers can ambush - but I wanted to use all of my Start Collecting box. How would you improve that? I like it! If you are willing to annoy people, you could also run dual Tuskards: Tuskard with Vulture Tuskard with Vulture Yeti Yeti Frost Sabres 1000 on the nose A lot of people run a big deathstar centrepiece at 1000 points, and in plenty of games you will just take it right off the table. Would mean 2x SC boxes though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemzo Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 2 hours ago, PlasticCraic said: I like it! If you are willing to annoy people, you could also run dual Tuskards: Tuskard with Vulture Tuskard with Vulture Yeti Yeti Frost Sabres 1000 on the nose A lot of people run a big deathstar centrepiece at 1000 points, and in plenty of games you will just take it right off the table. Would mean 2x SC boxes though. I have another thundertusk in the mail, but only the 4 mournfang painted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pitloze Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 6 hours ago, PlasticCraic said: I like it! If you are willing to annoy people, you could also run dual Tuskards: Tuskard with Vulture Tuskard with Vulture Yeti Yeti Frost Sabres 1000 on the nose A lot of people run a big deathstar centrepiece at 1000 points, and in plenty of games you will just take it right off the table. Would mean 2x SC boxes though. I take it Tuskard makes Yeti's Battleline? Also 2x SC boxes for BCR is a steal for what you get anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlasticCraic Posted June 22, 2018 Share Posted June 22, 2018 Just now, Pitloze said: I take it Tuskard makes Yeti's Battleline? Also 2x SC boxes for BCR is a steal for what you get anyway. Yes mate, from the photos kicking around it is now anything on a Thundertusk as General to trigger the Battleline if. And I agree, it has to be one of the best value boxes on the market. A really solid purchase, 2 will never go astray and set a great foundation for building the army further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Mournfang Posted June 23, 2018 Author Share Posted June 23, 2018 Wow thank you all so much for your help an the input. Really appreciate you taking the time to respond in detail!! You guys are what makes this community great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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