[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

I think one thing you are missing out on is the value of those impact mortal wounds occurring on the charge not during the combat phase. Charge phase mortals can bust holes in defensive lines/formations and there are some very dirty potential tricks.

This is especially true when you consider the mawkrusha destructive bulk+stomp combo. 1 extra mortal could be the reason your MK gets to punch through the line and get to stomp again.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

20 minutes ago, Mikelomba said:

Yeah there u can have 1 drop batt and enchancement barra... I dont know how strong 3 maws are

I've got a tournament coming up on the 25th, this is the list I think I'm running.

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Ironsunz
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Irrelevant

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)*
- General
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Command Trait: Mighty Waaagh! Leader
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)**
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Armour of Gork
- Mount Trait: Fast 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (115)**
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat
Orruk Warchanter (115)**
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat

Battleline
10 x Orruk Brutes (320)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Ardboys (170)**
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Orruk Ardboys (85)*
5 x Orruk Ardboys (85)*
 

Units

3x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)*
- Pig-iron Choppas

Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment
**Warlord

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 2000 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 2 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 127
Drops: 5

 

It's actually a variation on my current big Waaagh list but swaps the wurrgog+wardokk+lifeswarm to just take a second cabbage. Unfortunately I don't have the third painted yet so I can't try triple. Will test how I feel with 2, previously I just felt it lacked board presence and the cabbage was either squishy or weak. Hopefully the updated rules should fix both those issues.

 

@Warbossironteef

Swap the brutes down to ardboys to free up points. 5 Brutes aren't a hammer and the dual wield didn't get the rend upgrade. 10 ardboys is 10 points more expensive and has more wounds with an inbuilt ward save on 40%. You could easily go to 10 Brutes and 2 units of 5 ardboys. Another really great option would be to put an arcane tome on the footboss and use emerald lifeswarm.  It's healing effect is great and you can do some dirty positional stuff with it if you're clever.

 

 

EDIT: also that list needs to be bloodtoofs. You aren't getting value out of buffing up two more units of 5 but being able to charge after breaking your opponents screen not only gives more impact hits but massively limits their options.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

50 minutes ago, Mikelomba said:

Yo guys, cant stop thinking.... Why not 3 maw crusha and some brutes?

i mean 3 crushas 1 chant 2*5 brutes and 1*5 ards is 2k... Casualitity?

 

 

 

It's 1960...

Drop one of the brutes to ardboys and grab a 2nd WC instead.

[Need some Orruk warclans 3.0 list inspiration]

47 minutes ago, Iksdee said:

Thanks that is really usefull. What would u do with the weapon option of the 10 brutes? If i can i want to dodge buying older ork models, just because i already own these since fantasy and could really use something new and shiny for the army. How would u rate the undergrounds warband options?

Edit: Also would anyone mind if i use the old ork warboss bsb as a warchanter? Dont know the size difference to be honest.

Brutes would be the 2 handed hakka version. The 2" reach means they can fight in 2 ranks and the hakka just got bumped to -2 rend!

Any pure IJ list atm is going to be comprised of lots of goregruntas (if bloodtoof) or a solid core of brutes supported by a couple small ardboy units.

As to the WC proxy, I have no idea would depend on local clubs or the tournament you are attending. Always ask first.

[Need some Orruk warclans 3.0 list inspiration]

1 hour ago, Iksdee said:

What would be the best thing to do with these models with the new rules? To be honest i dont really know where to go from here. What would u add to these models?
Please help me so i can focus on building a fun army for this edition. Dont need to be competitive, just a legal list thats not complete trash is fine.
I am thinking about adding a unit of Brutes because i think they look awesome.

These are the models i own currently. I could also ally in almost any gloomspite gitz model.

Leaders:
1x Godrakk/ Boss on MK (needs to be included)
1x Wurrgog Prophet
1x Savage Big Boss

Units:
20x Savage Orruks with 1 or 2 units of Big Stabbas or 30x Savage Orruks. I was about to remodel these anyway so they can be any kind of Savage Orruk.

Thanks!

I'd say all the kruleboyz stuff is solid atm. For ironjawz 10 Brutes with the -2 rend option and a warchanter will be your starting point, the warchanter is 100% whatever you do for the +2 Waaagh points.

Gordrakk is actually really solid in big Waaagh atm due to his CA multiplier being usable on destruction not just IJ.

I'd always recommend a wardokk to go with your wurrgog, it's a combo I absolutely love and have used extensively since the first warclans book dropped. It only got cheaper now which is awesome.

Allegiance: Big Waaagh!
- Grand Strategy:
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Wurrgog Prophet (170?) - General
Wardokk (85?)
Gordrakk the Fist of Gork (560)
Orruk Warchanter (115)
Total: 930 / 2000

That gives you ~1100 points to fill out how you want. Your battleline options are gutripperz, savage orruks, orruk ardboys and orruk brutes.

Ardboys would be your "I want to spend as few points on battleline as possible."

A unit of 10 Brutes at 320 is scary as hell atm with a warchanter buff.

Savage orruks would be your hard to shift huge blocks.

Gutripperz are the slightly more expensive/threatening and less tanky large block.

I would probably recommend a start collecting ironjawz, that gives you the warchanter and 10 (5+5) ardboys which combined with your savage orruks is the battleline sorted and you get 3ggs aswell.

After that it's whatever you fancy

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

@Boggler @Carnith

I think the big thing about ardboys is they are now solid points per wound and a pita for people to shift. There was a really dappy which was a foot hero or two then just the rest as ardboys. Throw insane wound potential out onto the board and force your opponent to deal with it. Probably runs a weirdnob with the +cast ability with a unit of 15 to try and dump into your opponents deployment zone turn 1. Only issue I could see is not having the dps for the gargants. 

Imo all the units now have their strengths and place which is nice. I do think if you're looking to hard invest I'd recommend the kruleboyz. Not least because it opens up big Waaagh for you to mix and match, an MK is a really solid choice for big Waaagh atm due to his CA duplication.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

1 minute ago, Maogrim said:

Thank you for the list, but with all due respect... who has the money to spare for 30 Goregruntas? 😂 

A fresh box of three is around 60€ in continental money.

No Comment...

21 minutes ago, swarmofseals said:

One other thing that I don't see many people consider with the stormdrakes is that they are 9 wound monsters. Taking a bunch of them is basically handing your opponent quite a few VP.

Mass monster spam both scores heavily (due to all the extra do x with monsters) but also bleeds vps heavily.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

2 hours ago, Maogrim said:

So, do you guys think that a Bloodtoofs list can compete with Stormdrake lists in terms of speed, power and resilience? 

Those dragon things look crazy good for their points.

Personally I think a proper bloodtoof list is going to be nuts atm. Your ability to get across the board and tie down the enemy in the first turn is insane, he pure utility granted by the bloodtoof trait is nuts.

The general strategy you will be aiming for is to seize control of the board and lock your opponent off the objectives using the after combat move. It also helps how ridiculously wound efficient gg's are now.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Grand Strategy:
- Triumphs:

Leaders - 485
Orruk Megaboss (140)
Orruk Warchanter (115)
Orruk Warchanter (115)
Orruk Warchanter (115)

Battleline - 1500
9 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (450)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 2
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)
- Pig-iron Choppas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)
- Pig-iron Choppas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)
- Pig-iron Choppas

Total: 1985 / 2000 (was 2220)
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Wounds: 175
Drops: 10

If you go for a really heavy gg list, this is 30 of them, you're putting a metric ton of highly mobile wounds on the board which can redeploy after the combat phase. It's bonkers the amount of space control you can manage.

EDIT:

5 minutes ago, 5kaven5lave said:

Think my first foray is going to be mostly ‘Jawz but with some Kruleboyz shooting and some debuff magic from the Vulture, see if it makes any impact as a Big Waaagh!!

Imo the IJ is probably the weakest part of the book with kruleboyz being the strongest. That said there is definitely some power in the IJ (at least 4-1 on multiple lists) and it's not that extreme. 

Note: The new Megaboss warscrolls all have the TOTEM keyword, which means they can use CA's at an 18" range regardless of being the general.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

4 minutes ago, Newtype_Zero said:

This is pretty much the list I had in mind. Do we know which weapon is the better option for GGs? I assume Hackas for the 6-mans and Choppas for the 3s? Or with the new Hacka rules, are those the go-to default now?

I think hackas "might" be better, definitely for larger blocks. It's really close though.

My main reason for the swing would be that the primary time you will use GG's now will be in bloodtoof armies and the end of combat phase charge means you get a second shot at the impact mortals, so having them on a 2+ is actually really hefty. You put the wc buff on an MK then use the gg impacts to try and blast a hole through your opponents line.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

1 minute ago, Holy_Diver said:

You can spam Mighty from another hero in the same phase?

There's a command trait which lets your general use Mighty Destroyers even if another hero has already used it that turn.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

2 hours ago, Malakithe said:

As cool as that sounds I would be worried about battleshock taking out half the unit

It's why the MB/MK being able to hit multiple targets with CA's is so important. You can use IP on 2/3 Brute units at once, we are guna be super CP hungry though.

EDIT:

13 hours ago, Boggler said:

I really didn't think that I'd need another 6 GG's after this book came out... I went hard in to Brutes this past Summer LOL. To round out my army a bit more. I have 18 GG's, do I really need another 6? probably?

I have them but it will be ages before I paint them up. Personally I aim for ~4 drops as it gives you the extra enhancement and allows for the 2nd mawkrusha. With that in mind you're probably looking at something like this instead

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Grand Strategy:
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)
Orruk Warchanter (115)


Battleline
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)

Total: 1825/ 2000
Reinforced Units: 2 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 111
Drops: 4

Extra 1 (for the artefact) (2000 exactly)
5 x Orruk Ardboys (85)
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (90)

Extra 2 (Triumph and all out alpha) (1975)
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)

The 2nd mawkrusha means you can mighty destroyers 6 units a turn(!) which is conveniently a mawkrusha and 2 units of ggs. Plus the MK is just another huge threat on it's own. 

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

2 hours ago, swarmofseals said:

I'm 99% certain that you can't attack after a pile in from the Bloodtoofs ability or Mighty Destroyers. You guys are welcome to try to argue for this with your opponents, I just wouldn't recommend getting used to it.

The MD might get FaQ'd otherwise it's a pretty huge nerf. I can't see the bloodtoofs ever letting you attack, that would be bonkers.

2 hours ago, swarmofseals said:

Subfactions: All three have a niche, and I'm really not sure what to use. I think Brutes or Ardboys armies clearly want to be Da Choppas. Bloodtoofs I'll need to play with to figure out how useful it is. It certainly could be very strong but also could be pretty situational. Ironsunz could be sneaky good, especially with a maw krusha general with the built in reroll charge trait.

The fact that there is no downside to picking a subfaction makes them all great. Ironsunz is your standard, da choppas is for infantry focused builds while bloodtoofs is your gg focused builds. I love the current iteration of them, don't forget that while bloodtoofs/choppas are free utility with 0 cost the ironsunz is actually a CA. So if you trigger the Ironsunz CA off an MK you can charge with 3 units now not 1.

1 hour ago, Boggler said:

Reinforcement points really hurt Ardboys Rally spam. I'm sure I will pass the DPS check. Both weapons on the GG's are good options. Jagged Gore Hackas have better reach and you can attack units that are 5" behind a screen, if you manage to smash through the screen. 

EDIT: @Boggler you should be running bloodtoofs with that list and just drop the brutes/ardboys. Use the after combat move combined with alphastrike to seize control of the board.

EDIT2: After playing around with lists I think if I were doing a 1 drop alpha it would be this

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)
- Use Mighty Destroyers a second time
Orruk Warchanter (115)
Orruk Warchanter (115)

Battleline
9 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (450)
- Reinforced x 2
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Reinforced
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Reinforced
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)
5 x Orruk Ardboys (85)

Total: 1995/ 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Wounds: 160
Drops: 1

As far as alphastrikes go this is top tier. Your opponent will be bogged down for at least the first 2 turns while you seize the board and really pressure.

I'd say the other viable lists are double cabbage and/or infantry heavy lists.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

1 minute ago, Carnith said:

I’ll have to make some lists but I’m feeling most of my lists didn’t change. I barely got to use the waaagh for +1 attack, let alone +2 attacks. I need to bring back my foot boss it seems. Sucks that big waaaagh nerfed. It would’ve been nice if each faction had a 1 in 4 bring one of the other clans with. 

Ironjawz gets Smashing and Bashing, Ironjawz Waaagh! and the clan. Big Waaagh! gets waaagh! points and cross faction utility. Honestly I think they are about equal atm depending on how you want to build your list.

I'd say most Big Waaagh! lists should be getting ~5 WP a round before charges etc. When you add in charges etc. I'd say it's turn 3 you're going off but the list building is way less restrictive.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

3 minutes ago, Gothmaug said:

Smash em and Bash em only works on fellow units within 3", so it will have to be planned for carefully when you're figuring out which order to fight in. A lot less useful now. 

Na, just you have to be with 3" of enemy units. Nothing about being near your own unit. Even the oldest version was just "the closest IJ unit".

4 minutes ago, Gothmaug said:

The Kruelboys Sloggoth unit grants a +1 to hit 18" bubble, and hits only 150 points. I'll be keeping one of those in all my lists. 

Quote

"If you choose an Ironjawz army, all Orruk Warclans units in the army bust have the Ironjawz Keyword."

 

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

1 minute ago, Orkmann said:

Mighty Destroyer and the BT ability might need an faq, but I can see an argument that if you make a pile in move, that automatically means you can attack as well:

12.3 COMBAT ATTACKS
After you have made all of the pile-in moves for a unit, you must make 
combat attacks with each model in the unit that is within range of an 
enemy model

 

I'm really not sure that's now the bloodtoofs ability should work. That seems nuts, especially on the Waaagh! turn, you could comfortably put 4 units of GG's and 2 MK's in combat turn 1.

On the otherhand for a single CP a MK can now have 3 units make a charge at the end of the enemies charge phase  

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

So initial thoughts skimming through the review video.

Battle Traits etc.

• Where has my +1 to charge gone? Why has it been rolled into the waaagh, why would you do this 
• +1 rend for a turn is awesome and the fact its board wide is just fantastic!
• Ironjawz waaagh isn't a command ability.
• Mega bossy is the return of double MD, absolutely awesome.
• Mighty Waaagh! Leader is interesting for the no CP charge reroll bubble on the Waaagh! turn.
• Touched by the Waaagh! is actually quite a cool option, potential +3 to cast and also gives a point click d3 mortals. Intresting with the Arcane Tome artefact as it would give you a 2d3 mortals for your hero phase.
• The Megaboss Artefacts are alright.
• The mount traits are all actually kinda cool. Could easily see a use for all of them.

Spell Lores/Clans

• FOOT OF GORK IS BACK BOYS!!! A bit nerfed but still awesome.
• Ironsunz is still great
• Bloodtoofs and Da Choppas warclans aren't abilities, they are just passive abilities!
• The new Bloodtoofs ability is crazy good.

Strategies

• Show 'em who's boss is bad. It's just a worse version some of the core strategies
• Waaagh! is slightly different than hold the line, generally will be worse but situationally could be good.
• Krump 'Em All is a cool option.

Tactics/Battalion

• Time to Get Stuck In! is an amazing option to have, Limited to turn 1 and 2 but it's still awesome.
• Squish Da Puny Gitz is an amazing late game tactic, there are plenty of games where you can pick this after having already completed it.
• Destroyer of Empires is lulz.
• Ironjawz Fist, I mean it's not bad...I'm just not sure I'd ever use it over hunters of the heartland.

Gordrakk/MK

• Gordrakk got the always general rule!
• Destructive Bulk is actually pretty fricking solid. 
• Smasha and Kunnin are now both a flat 2 damage/mortal wounds which is way better than the old d3.
• Sweet Holy Gods Voice of gork and Skull-shacking Bellow are bonkers good, fricking amazing. The ability to target 3 units with each CA rather than 1 is just unreal.
• Riptooth Fist makes you a 3+ save.

Honestly, I fricking love everything about it, it's awesome.

Megaboss

• 8 attacks now which is solid.
• Ear-Splitting Bellow makes this guy a real choice now. Targets 2 units with a CA rather than 1.
• Can pile in and attack when killed!

Warchanter/Weirdnob

• Warbeats are now on the warscroll not an ability, so you always get 1 per warchanter but can't get a 2nd using enhancements.
• Brutal power is now with 12" of 10 Ironjawz models, not wholly within 12" of a unit with 10.
• Green puke is still bad

Brutes

• Wait...Wait what. Enemy models with a wounds characteristic of 1 with 3" cannot contest objectives. Holy gods.

Ardboys

• Pretty hefty nerfs on the profile now the old 3 attacks 4+/3+/-/1
• Bravery 5 and the banner is +1 (so 6 total)
• Drummer is now +1 to charge not +2
• Shields are now a flat 6+ ward
• If the unit uses the rally ability while wholly within 12" of a friendly warchanter you reinforce on a 4+ not a 6+

Goregruntas

• Apparently we are bravery 6 across the board now....
• Impact hits are now 3+ or 2+ if they have the spear.
• Otherwise it's the same.

Points/Roles

• Ardboys are 85 for 5 as battleline, actually pretty solid. With the reinforce rule a unit of 15 could be a real pain to shift.
• Brutes as battleline at 160 feel fair with the new rules.
• Footboss is down to 140 which honestly makes him a steal.
• Warchanter is 115.
• 90 points for a weirdnob shaman, ok that actually makes him a pretty good choice. 6 wounds for a 1 cast wizard isn't actually bad.
• Goredrakk at 560 seems actually pretty solid.
• MK down to 480 is also great.
• Goregruntas are now 150 for 3 but only batteline in bloodtoofs!

Thoughts

Actually I'm really happy with how this turned out. Ardboys/Brutes now fill distinct roles as the core of any IJ army. The ability to multiply your CA's from megabosses is just amazing, combine that with all 3 of them getting buffs and it's super nice. The points reductions for foot characters is just so good and the warclans are ace.

Honestly other than a few things missing which I really liked (my poor +1 to charge) yeah I think this is great and pushes us in the direction that IJ should be going.

EDIT: Ok I missed the Mighty Destroyers no longer letting you pile in and attack, that's a horrific nerf which possibly outweighs everything else.

[AoS3 - Kruleboyz Discussion]

3 hours ago, Magnus The Blue said:

12" range and 7+ to cast.  I don't fancy getting that close to Gotrek with a Wizards to maybe remove his ward

Spell Portal is made for stuff like this. Combined with some boltboyz can just remove his dirty ginger beard from the board before he does anything.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

46 minutes ago, SunStorm said:

Depends if Ardboyz still have the banner option to give them +2 bravery right? 

I'd have thought you'd just reduce the banner to +1 in that case. 

 

1 hour ago, ShaneHobbes said:

By all accounts it sounds like they are going to be 4+ on their stats. The +1 would be the best scenario given that info. But I agree save rerolls need to go away.

On the killaboss with stabgrot warscroll it has

Quote

The save characteristic of a Killaboss with Stab-grot armed with a Boss-Hacka and Skareshield is 3+ instead of 4+

So it's not unreasonable to think there might be a similar rule for the riptooth fist.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

1 hour ago, C0deb1ue said:

I get that, I just don't think it's particularly "devastating". Yeah its a good change and they were severely lacking before (especially vs ard boyz) but it's hardly game changing. Anyway still need the rest of the info.

It's the functional equivalent of every other unit in the game getting -1 save, while it may not seem massive remember that a unit of 10 brutes is often going to be buffed with the +1 damage.

That's the difference between -1 and -2 vs an unbuffed 4+ save. You're more likely to do 12+ damage with -2 rend than you are to do 10+ with -1. It's actually really important.

1 hour ago, ShaneHobbes said:

Honestly I would be okay with a lot of heroes going to a 4+ save with an ability on their warscroll giving them + 1 save - making them realistically never better than a 3+. There is too many 2+ heroes in this game atm and capping most of them at 3+ (looking at you Archeon) is fine by me.

I'd rather they just removed save rerolls. I really hope it's a full blown 3+ and not a 4+1.

1 hour ago, Carnith said:

For the record, I hope the ardboyz are misprint. Though I'm surprised at how much vitriol I've gotten thrown my way on the different social media for just posting this. 

It's a massive nerf that hits them in multiple different ways, both the -1 to hit and the loss of the rend are painful enough dropping to bravery 5 is just kicking them when they are down.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

42 minutes ago, Beliman said:

Not sure that a comparison like that would be fair. Even between the big blob+killaboss, their role on the battlefield has nothing in common. Profiles are a bit misleading too: one has a lot of bodies, the other has a big base, one can fly and has Monstruous Rampage and Hero Actions, others need their 10" move Hero near them, etc...

I don't disagree, the question was originally asked if I would rather have a Killaboss on Gnashtooth or an MK if his save was dropped to a 4+. That's the comparision on a pure raw stats, with the 2 Gnashtoof being 100 points cheaper and the big block being 5 points more expensive. Yes they fill different roles and have different purposes but in statistical isolation you would take the block of boys everytime. It has so much more board presence in the current 2+ unrendable save era.

32 minutes ago, Iksdee said:

Also if u kill one killaboss u get half the numbers on the other 10 wounds.

The mawkrusha would profile instead and can't be in two places at once. The point was that statistically the MK is just worse than 2 Gnashtoofs which are 100 points cheaper.

12 minutes ago, Warmill said:

RIP my ironjawz at this rate, I love them for feeling like a smashy bashy army not a load of pillowfists. Hopefully the warscroll has some tasty abilities but I'm not sure it'll make up for the feeling of da boyz bouncing off chaff. At least in the 1.0 ironjawz book you could have them dishing out 7 or 8 attacks each to make up for the mediocre profile.

God I hated it so much, with the exception of the klaw boss. I got dice cups which have exact numbers of dice just so that I could do the dice maths quickly. On the plus side Brutes look devastating now.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

3 hours ago, Beliman said:

That's an interesting question.

I never saw a Killaboss (or two) as a big thread, but I was always scared to phase a crusha. Maybe this 4+save will change that feeling (or maybe not).

2 killaboss on gnashtooth are.

• 20 wounds with a 3+ save.
• 8 attacks on 3+/3+/-1/2 that do 2 mortal wounds on a 6 to hit instead.
• 8 attacks at 3+/3+/-2/2

Meanwhile the Mawkrusha is

• 18 wounds with a 4+ save
• 9 attacks on a 3+/3+/-1/2
• 8 attacks on a 3+/3+/2/3

Statistically there isn't much difference between the two. If I wanted a direct comparision of what I'd take instead it would be a killaboss with stabgrot and 20 Gutripperz. You get a 3+ on the killaboss, he gets the lookout sir, there's 40 wounds of gutripperz which can only have 1 model flee from battleshock and it's 45 attacks which do mortals on 6s.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

11 hours ago, Carnith said:

I’ve seen ard boys. 
Bravery 5 and their attacks went to 1” 3a 4/3/-/1

Holy gods, what on earth could have convinced them that any Ironjawz units need LESS bravery..? hopefully we get a corresponding points drop to ~75 for 5.

Big one I want to see is the Footboss warscroll. If he still has a 3+ save it suggests the riptooth fist is functioning like a shield, if not then at least kruelboys seem to be bonkers.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

10 hours ago, Boggler said:

So, the Killaboss on Great Gnashtoof has a shield so he has a 3+ save. Right?

Would your MBMK trade half their attacks for a 3+?

And a 200 points reduction in cost, easily.

EDIT: Sorry did I say 200, I meant 300. Oh and those 4 attacks he makes actually just do flat mortals on 6s to hit instead.

So the real question is.

Would you trade a Mawkrusha for 2 Killaboss Gnashtoofs and 100 points in change?

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

1 hour ago, Underworld40k said:

I am personally just trying to avoid feeling like we have gotten the shaft before the new edition is in full swing.

Welcome to the destruction forum. Where desperate optimism is the only reason anyone still plays the grand alliance.

[AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion]

46 minutes ago, Underworld40k said:

Cant say i am thrilled with the 4+ MBoMK but this is still early days in 3.0 and might be the general trend for a lot of the factions as they get updated.

Annihilators