Malakree

You get hand of gork, Wurrgog with his lulz mask and 6ggs with a warchanter buff. Both Ironsunz and Bloodtoofs are unbelievably good while the current IJ strategy involves using IJ Waaagh and blowing your opponent off the table with -3 rend. Most games should be over before turn 3. Something like that gives you a 1drop that has a ton of impact mortals, gets all the bloodtoofs after charges and can hit with -3 rend across the board.

Most Kruleboyz armies are just running Big Yellers for the Man-Skewer battleline. Big Waaagh is essentially a way for IJ/BS armies to get access to Kruleboyz shooting which is a tool they just don't have access to. Equally Ardboyz provide something that neither of the other factions does, an 85 point tanky battleline unit. If you run your normal Kruelboyz, swap with Big Waaagh and then just change your hobgrots for Ardboys, I'd say you've actually not lost that much in terms of potential.

For me yes. That +1 to cast takes him from being a bit meh to being an amazing wizard for his points. All of the swamp lore spells are amazing but cast on a 7/8, the +1 to cast makes them way more reliable. while the +1 to unbind makes the mortals that much more of a threat in a meta which has a lot of wizards. He comes with a 6+ ward, is ok in melee and has the mandrake for times when you really need a spell not to go off. I'm just getting my painting stuff setup after moving last November. need to finish my dominion stuff then get him but this is what I'm wanting to build towards. A bit jank but honestly I really don't like the current Ironjawz playstyle, I find it to be lacking in depth strategically/tactically and this lets me use Big G aswell.

Personally I don't like arcane tome on MK, I found they are really squishy without a ward and against a lot of the top tier armies atm you can't cast anything anyway.

My personal feeling is that the only reason to go Big Waaagh right now is you want to run Gobsprakk as it's a massive buff to him. There is some arguments to be made about using Ardboys as a screen for your boltboyz but I suspect you'd better off just taking Big Yellers with Hobgrots. The first list I want to build towards once my stuff comes out of storage is this. Mainly because I have almost all of it already painted. Only thing I would need is to finish 10 Brutes (next job) then get/paint Gobsprakk himself. EDIT: I kinda agree with the lack of models bit. Most people are going to be building up towards Big Waaagh lists and I'm not sure the Breaka-Boss is all that great in Kruelboyz. +1/+1 on the other hand makes them pretty terrifying, even at just 6 attacks 2+/2+/-2/3 is solid levels of damage for 180, I wonder how it compares to brutes...

The can't be auto-slain is huge, 6+ ward was just added onto his spell save anyway, he now counts as a 30 models for objective purposes at full wounds. I'd definitely say he's extremely usable now, not Morathi levels but the changes actually make him worth putting in a list now.

He now has the survivability to go with his crazy damage output and the extra utility of the 3d6 charge is great especially since it applies to himself. EDIT: Also worth noting the huge unleash hell nerf is great for us.

OMFG Kragnos just got amazing...

It's similar to what I'd want to run actually. The big bosses are weird though, what did you use them for? Actually they are really good for filling out the extra warlord aren't they.

God that is one of the most unreadable lists I've ever seen, apparently the app wasn't designed with usability in mind.

Something which was suggested at the Leister GT this weekend was to have two different Ardboy options like the SC dragons. 5 Ardboys for 80 points, Battleline Unique 10 Ardboys for 180 points: Battleline So that you can either take them as cheap chaff/battleline or as larger units which can be reinforced to take advantage of the rally rule. I'm hoping personally that Brutes come down a fair bit, maybe to 140/145 points, so that fielding them in large numbers becomes easier and more attractive. Big G dropping massively (possibly as low as 450 points) and getting the ability to be fielded in any destruction army. Best way to do that would be to allow the Megaboss on Foot to effect 3 units with his command ability propagation. It's so key to the army working atm that having two separate sources of it makes a huge difference in your ability to spread out. Honestly the biggest problem at the moment is internal points cost rather than external. When you compare us to the top teir armies we aren't making massive waves. At the Leister GT top IJ was 8th, then 2nd was 19th, compare that to Petrifex Nagash, Seraphon and SoB all of which had 2 in the top 8. A second consideration is just how overcosted Kruelboys/Bonesplitterz are, if they come down in points then we may see more Big Waaagh! armies turning up which would allow for a much more paced game. Leister GT Speaking of Leister GT, I went 2 wins, 1 draw, 2 losses. Although that's not actually true as I was penalized the first game due to "late registration" getting a loss with 0tp instead of a win with 17tp (my opponent got a win with 3tp ). My game 2 opponent got absolutely smashed on bottom table because I'd been artificially placed there and Lastly the draw was actually a win by 1 VP but BCP could only process a 10tp result as a draw. So functionally I went ~3/1. With that said I ran the same list model wise I ran at BOBO (where I got obliterated). The changes were. General went Megabossy with Armour of Gork. This just fits how I use him so much better and the wizard feels meaningless in the current meta. I took Mean 'Un over Smelly 'Un on my aggressive Cabbage. The 15+5 ardboy blocks was split into 5+5+5+5 as I found having to have a warchanter wholly with 12" of the unit was just way to restrictive. I had two main takeaways, the four blocks of 5 ardboys was just better. Not only did it allow for better screening but it made it so much easier to have a battleline unit alive at the end of the game. Secondly Mean 'Un is super fun and surprisingly useful just because everyone is running battle regiments for reduced drops. One of my highlights was stomping a demon prince for 9 mortal wounds immediately followed by doing 7 mortals to a unit of horrors. Multiple times the Stomp spiked and was game changing.

That would be crippling. Only way to justify that is if nagash/teclis/morati etc. Were going up by 100points.

Mawkrusha up to 510 Gordrakk down to 480 Warchanter down to 110 Weirdnob down to 80 (same as wardokk) Footboss down to 135 GG's up to 160/165 Brutes down to 150/155 Ardboys changed to 10 for 180 That would be my initial thoughts. Mawkrushas Right now double MK is basically mandatory, it's so fricking good it's unreal. Increasing the cost would hurt the alphastrike style of two tanky MK's rushing across the board turn 1 which is so obnoxious. On the other hand Big G is no where near as obnoxious due to his 4+ normal save and lack of a ward save. This would be a boost for Big Waaagh! aswell since he fits nicely into it. Warchanter Warchanters are mandatory, they make the army work and without them it falls apart. Given the amount of character removal around they need a drop. Weirdnob Currently people are taking an arcane tome over a weirdnob, it's just to expensive for what it does. No Warscroll Spell, no abilities and kinda squishy. You're paying entirely for single cast/unbind with no pluses, it's basically a wardokk without the added utility or a fungoid with no +cp. Footboss With the massive increase in points to the MK a points drop here helps offset with the CP spreading issue. GG's With the -2 rend they are just so unbelievably good. Highly mobile, great damage and the bloodtoofs rule is just insane, a points cost here again hits the alphastrike style which is going round atm and just generally brings them more in line. Ardboys Right now they fill the "chaff" role with very mediocre damage but they take up reinforcement points to be anything more. Increasing them to 10 makes them solid without reinforcement points, brings them inline with the other two Orruk basic infantry (Savage Orruks and Gutripperz) while allowing them to be fielded in a massive unit if you really want to make use of the rally rule. The points cost comes because they do have the rally rule and a size increase just generically benefits from that. Brutes Points cost reduction to bring them down to around where gg's were. Right now they are solid but just don't compete with either GG's or MK's. This would make Brute centric armies, thus da choppas, more attractive while offsetting the cost increases elsewhere.

For me it's purely I don't have the third. Previously 2 was standard and 3 was extreme, now the third is really needed just for redundancy if nothing else.

So after several more games I've come to the following conclusions. Ardboys They work really well in 5s (duh) and the 15s are solid but require way to much babysitting from your warchanter. Its so easy to end up outside of the bubble and/or get tied down. While significantly better than in 10s the new bravery stat, and fact it has to come from the boss, makes them incredibly command point intensive in an army which always needs more as it is. Warchanters 2 just isn't enough, you always need more of the buffs and if even one dies your damage tanks. Brutes/ggs are so much worse without the buffs.

Rockguts are solid right now, they hit like trains, have reasonable survivability and the kit is super nice in terms of customisability and just extra stuff on the sprus. You also need them in blocks of 6 or 9 so that's a great option. Apparently some of the new Kruelboyz troggs can be used in GG aswell.

Did another tournament over the weekend which went reasonably well. My List General thoughts, I really missed having the armour of gork ward save, it felt like my 2nd MK was so much softer. That said bash 'em ladz is amazing if you get it off at the right time and mystic shield on the tankcrusher is so so good. I'm not using the GG's to their full potential and the Ironsunz CA combined with no skilled leader made the 15 Ardboys feel far less tanky than they did. All that said the list is solid and I'll be running it at bobo more because I can't paint stuff atm than not wanting to tweak it. If I were to alter the list I would swap the 3 ggs and 15 ardboys to 10 Brutes and 5 ardboys. Games - will update a bit later

The Big thing is that though you have the two separate wings which are stuck the connection between them allows for a lot of variation in terms of how they get in.

Personally I'd look at something more like this. Allegiance: Ironjawz- Warclan: Ironsunz- Grand Strategy:- Triumphs:LeadersMegaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)- General- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa- Command Trait: Skilled Leader- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)- Mount Trait: Smelly 'UnOrruk Warchanter (115)Orruk Warchanter (115)- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)- Lore of the Weird: Da Great Big Green Hand of GorkFungoid Cave-Shaman (95)- AlliesBattleline10 x Orruk Brutes (320)- Pair of Brute Choppas- Reinforced x 110 x Orruk Brutes (320)- Pair of Brute Choppas- Reinforced x 110 x Orruk Ardboys (170)- Reinforced x 15 x Orruk Ardboys (85)Units6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)- Pig-iron Choppas- Reinforced x 1Core Battalions*Warlord**Hunters of the Heartlands***Hunters of the HeartlandsTotal: 2000 / 2000Reinforced Units: 4 / 4Allies: 95 / 400Wounds: 154Drops: 9 Dropping the 2nd MK allows you to put in other big threats. The unit of 6 ggs gives you devastating alpha potential and ironically not being battleline denies the broken ranks battle tactic. You then get 2 big units of brutes, both a 5 and 10 ardboy unit which allows for a defensive and offensive objective unit.

It was pretty nice, I just can't roll 6++ ward saves on an MK. On my ardboys it makes them basically invincible but on my MK I can't save anything...

So I was at a larger tournament last weekend with a lot of really good players. I went 3-2 but was 2nd worst of the large quantity of Ironjawz. Most went for Goregrunta heavy lists but double mawkrusha was basically universal, there were a bunch of other intresting things which I'll go through after my own experience. My list Mainly I wanted to try out the blocks of 15 Ardboys. I had to take bloodtoofs to get my battleline, it was worthless the whole tournament. If I had the extra ardboys that would have been three units of 5 Ardboys, a triumph and the Ironsunz clan which would have been infinitely more useful to me. So the games were as follows. Win on First Blood vs Fyreslayers Loss on Feral Foray vs Sylvaneth Loss on The Vice vs Gloomspite Gitz Win on Apex Predators vs Kharadron Overlords Win on Survival of the Fittest vs Nurgle Overall I guess I'm ok with my results. The list produced a bunch of grindfests which won me games but didn't net me overwhelming victories. Now onto my own observations around the list. Ardboys. I loved the 15 block, it's so much better than a 10 it's unbelievable due to how much harder it is for people to blow it up and the fact you can position the unit to guarantee yourself at least 1 rally. That said two blocks of 15 was absolute overkill, I found one of them would lock down a hyper crucial choke point then the other would bumble about not really able to find the sapce to do anything. Given the choice I'd swap one block of 15 back into a block of 10 Brutes or even 6 GG's. GG's/Bloodtoofs These were absolutely useless to me, overwhelmingly I used them as very expensive screening units and when I did get them into combat they had a negligible effect. I could have swapped both these for 5 ardboys and it wouldn't have made a difference. MK's I think we all know how good they are right now. I liked fast un and used it to good effect several times, the armour of gork was ok and did what I wanted. Amulet of destiny is solid as hell while the 5+ CP generator was so tasty. Warchanters How do I squeeze a third into my list... Battalions The battle regiment was worthless, most people were running 1/2 drops and with the unit of 15 ardboys I didn't actually care about being forced to push them up. I think hunters of the heartlands would just be way more useful. Other People So there were several other things floating around. Overwhelmingly the consensus among so of the best players in the UK seemed to be that with the recent GG buff the best build is easily 2MK, 3WC and 6/6 Pigs plus whatever else you can fit. One of the really common combos I saw, and which seemed to do really well, was Amulet of Destiny + Smelly one on the second MK. They then took Arcane Tome on the general with the Master of Magic command trait and Bash Em Lads. Turn 1, put mystic shield on the Tank Cabbage then throw it across the board while laughing. Master of Magic makes the odds of both spells going off much better and generally makes them far more usable. Most people seemed to lean towards Ironsunz or GG heavy Bloodtoofs lists. There was only 1 choppas list which I'd put down to a combination of people not having 30+ brutes and it being really hard to fit 2 MK's, 3WC and 30 Brutes into a list. My List Changes So I have another way more casual tournament next weekend. I'm going to be swapping back to Ironsunz, trying out the other MK setup, swapping out 15 ardboys for 10 brutes and getting rid of the Battle Regiment. Hopefully this is useful for people despite my ****** poor performance!

@5kaven5lave You're light on bodies. Maybe another 5 ardboys to get a unit of 10? Then another Wardokk for 80, get an arcane tome on the warchanter with it?

The 2" actually helps with coherency and getting in range.

Maybe not in 3s but I'd still edge on the hakkas.

Ok wow these are great. Makes everything so much easier to use and the GG buff for hakkas is amazing for bloodtoof heavy lists that really want to use ggs in 6s. The extra range and rend is solid as hell while the +1 to mortals is great for double charging. Man I wish my gg's didn't all have choppas, might need to do some fixing on the prebuilt but unpainted ones.