Azamar

I don’t see why it wouldn’t? They're cast just like any other spell

Late to the discussion, but the idoneth ability will usually be on units that are more powerful than the FEC ones. +1 attack on a morrsarr’s weapons hurts more than +2/3 attacks on a ghoul and so on, and even the stronger FEC units usually have a worse hit roll. Speaking as an idoneth player with no interest in collecting FEC it doesn’t seem so very bad to me (undoubtedly strong but not broken). time will tell though I guess.

I spy some Bretonnian heraldry on the FOC’s endless spell fence thing. Well, the fleur di lis anyway.

Not 100% sure but weren’t these changes from the beasts of chaos battletome, and wrath and rapture? I seem to remember skyfires going down a bit in price when BOC came along

They already did. In airships. Results were... mixed. 😛

It’s based on the number of models at the start of the phase

If you use your spearmen and archers as “counts as” dreadspears and glade guard you can still put together a serviceable army. You’ll only have the order allegiance (although the artefacts are decent) and synergy will be a bit all over the place, but with a bit of thought in army selection and deployment it can work. I doubt it would hold up in an ultra competitive environment, but if it’s for local club/flgs play you should get by just fine- my mixed aelf army does ok

In competitive lists they’re generally left out, I think, because they’re not optimal for your points. The allopex costs the same as a unit of ishlaen or thralls and does much less damage than either. The leviadon has a similar issue- it does good damage but for the points you could have 6 morrsarr , or 30 thralls which would have more versatility and damage output, albeit without the cover bonus. That being said, in a more casual setting I bloody love them both. The allopex does kind of suck, but every so often it does bite the head off an important character, and visually in an Akhelian force it breaks up the sea of eels nicely. It sounds like people get a bit more mileage with them in larger units at high tide, but I would have though this would make battleshock risky. The leviadon meanwhile has consistently performed for me. I take it as part of an Akhelian corps which makes it great as a stable core/ rally point for the army, and if you can get it into combat at full health, with lord of the deep on it at high tide, it makes an excellent battering ram. Plus I get a Great A’tuin vibe off the model. I can’t see me leaving mine out of my list any time soon.

Warscrolls still seem to stick around in the app if that helps- wolfriders are there under gitmob for example

Remember if a unit charges, it is still eligible to fight even if there’s no enemy models left within 3” (check out the pile in rules on page 230 in the main book) . With a 3” pile in and a 2” range on the spears, it’s hard for your opponent to completely leave the morrsarr guard out with casualty removals.

The list I had in mind came 7th at Blackout earlier this year but was more of an eel spam than I remembered (and no eidolon): basically 2 tidecasters, a souldscryer, 3x10 thralls and 18(!!) morrsarr in 2 units and 3 ishlean guard. I reckon Jackstriecher’s list looks like a good way to use Thralls- like he says, focusing on one or the other between them and eels works better as several characters only buff one type of unit. But a thrall list with a few scattered eels in could still work (although I should add I don’t play in competitions so my view might be skewed)

I’ve seen a few builds based around a tidecaster general (to reverse the tides) and a mix of thralls, eels and the aspect of the storm with the fuethan enclave. This allows run and charge on the first turn then high tide on turn 2, which generally messes up anything the thralls can reach. Ultimately depends if you’re taking your army to tournaments or competitive clubs. If not, then fill out with what you want. I’ve squeezed a leviadon, allopex and an aspect of the sea into my 2000 points list and seem to be getting away with it! As for eel nerfs, it would be unusual for the warscrolls to get changed but it’s likely they’ll go up in points a bit. For armies with volturnos and massed eels that will be punishing, but if you’ve got a good balance of units then it may just mean a few tweaks to fit your army into your points limit, or no change at all if other units you have come down in cost (reavers and allopexes seem likely and possibly the leviadon as well)

Mole people as the next destruction battletome. You heard it here first

Ive has a few games now with the following list, and seem to be having a fair bit of success (albeit in a non competitive environment) Sorceress on black dragon (general) -Impossibly swift -Incorporeal retainer Sorceress -anklet of epiphany Sorceress 10 bleakswords 10 bleakswords 20 darkshards 20 executioners 20 black guard 5 drakespawn knights 1 hydra. Thrall warhost Quicksilver blades I’ve had 3 games with this army - 1 against legions of nagash based around a death march with supporting morghasts, and 2 against a khorne gore pilgrims army, accompanied by a bloodthirster, skarbrand and 30 bloodletters- all of them went pretty well. I’ve been using each unit of bleakswords as a screen for one of the elite units, using terrain where I can to stop enemies going round the sides. Assuming there’s no double turn, and against a tough target or several units close together, this gives the elites potentially three lots of melee attacks (pile in to the charging unit once the screen is dead, then in my turn the battalion ability attacks followed by a normal charge and combat) before anything can hit them back, which has proved devastating when it goes right. The best performing unit in the army seems to be the black guard. In the first game they(with admittedly some help from the darkshards) tore through a unit of black knights and 4 morghasts using the above tactic, and they saw the bloodletters off pretty handily in game 2 as well. A special nod to the executioners as well, who underperformed against the undead, but killed skarbrand in both games against khorne- the first time inflicting 16 mortal wound on him in one go. My opponent wasn’t thrilled by that, but given there was a unit of bloodletters kicking around doing mortal wounds on a 3+, I wasn’t brimming with sympathy! 😛 As a final note- so far the sorceresses have survived every game, and a couple of times have been close to the only models still alive- the ultimate goal for a darkling coven host I think! Edit: sorry, I have no idea why that’s come out in massive text!

It’s a built in cone of shame I think. Certainly looks like it would be hard for Karnak to reach his <ahem> bits.

Don’t you need a couple more units for a grudgebound war throng? Or am I missing something here. I’d considered trying to build an army around that battalion myself, but I found the amount of units to take limiting (as it’s hard to fit in many units larger than the minimum unit size)

Rincewind and the luggage from Terry Pratchett’s discworld Series.

I’m would say start with the minimum units for the battalion and work from there. A sorceress, 3x10 of the darkshards/ swords/spears, 10 executioners and 10 guard is 880 including the battalion cost and a good framework to build on.

To my knowledge there’s no rule against stacking different abilities unless the wording of the abilities specifically says otherwise. Yes the abilities have similar wording, but there’s no reason you can’t use each ability in turn. They are not rerolls. Note ignax’s scales only work against mortals, not normal wounds, so it isn’t identical to witness to destiny.

Yes, as does master of defence. So if you take that, an archmage and ignax’s scales, it’s possible to have a Phoenix with 4+ 4+ 6+ 6+ every time it takes a mortal wound. Your opponent may throw a tape measure at you if you attempt that one though, so proceed with caution.

Looks like a good starting point- I’m planning a similar list. But you will need to split those dreadspears up into smaller units unfortunately- you need at least 3 units of dreadspears/darkshards/bleak swords for the thrall warhost

A few months ago I would have said keep the riggers as is, and if you want a mobile weapons platform put the special weapons on the skywardens. Now they’re the same cost, if you wanted a dedicated heavy weapon unit you could feasibly go with either. If you’re planning to get the riggers into combat keep to the saws. I havent tried them myself, but if you’re taking units larger than 3, then a grapnel hook or two is apparently well worth it. Purely wishlisting, but I would love to see them tougher and with synergy with the ships: 4+ save and 7 bravery: they’re dwarves/ duardin after all skyhook: reduce rend to -1 and range to 18” volleygun: no change skypike : increase to wound to 3+ pistols: change to 6”, 1 attack 4+/4+, -1 rend 1 damage cutters: change to 2 attacks, 4+/3+ no rend 1 damage. Opportunistic privateers, change to: if this unit made a charge move, add one to all hit rolls in the following combat phase. If this unit also disembarked from a sky vessel, improve the rend characteristic by one for all melee weapons in the following combat phase. Makes them less about sniping characters, and more about descending from their ships and swashbuckling! God knows what that would do to their points cost though. Frankly I would just settle for another battleline choice at this point.

I’m one model away from having a fully painted 2,000 points now, and looking at the blackout lists I’m taking almost exactly the same as one of the blackout competitors! Not either of those two though. My list is the same as the guy in 69th place ? 69 is, objectively, a better number than 6 or 7 though, so it’s still a winner in my eyes.

The artefact on the fishes? I guess there’s nothing to say you can’t do that, but still feels wrong to me. You should at least add a little crab waving a big sword to the base!

I took my Idoneth out for a 1500 point test drive earlier this week- opinions on the list are always welcome Akhelian king Born from agony Armour of the cythai Tidecaster Steed of tides Eidolon aspect of the sea Abyssal darkness Battleline: 3 ishlaen guard 3 ishlaen guard 3 morrsarr guard 1 allopex Allies: Darkling covens sorceress Endless spells: Quicksilver swords Malevolent maelstrom I was up against my friend’s experimental LON army, with a vampire on zombie dragon and two units of blood knights, back up by more vampires, chainrasps and lots of undead puppies, for a border war. Hard to tell how effective the idoneth were- I know it’s not the done thing to blame dice but my friend really could this time- the zombie dragon’s attempt to break through ended up with just one dead eel, and the dragon taking something like 6-7 wounds, thanks to great saves for me and terrible ones for him. That pretty much continued for the rest of the game, leading to a deepkin victory. Even so, the army feels strong- they’re individually tough (for the most part) and their amazing mobility meant I could keep zipping everything around to where it was needed, picking most of the fights and keeping the softer targets safe from harm (the morrsarr survived until the final turn, when the zombie dragon finally worked out how to hit something, and the squishy wizards were safely out of harms way all game) I can see why most might drop the allopex for more eels, although mine was a champ in this game, holding an objective and using its size to block resurrected units from reclaiming it. Undecided on the eidolon so far- he failed more spells than he cast so I don’t think I got the best of him, but he was Tanky as hell in cover, and with healing and his bravery buff was an excellent anchor for the rest of the army- probably saved me a few costly battleshock losses. The aspect of storm might be better for damage, but the sea’s +3 bravery buff is great against death armies.