Sception

True, true. While I'm not convinced these poont changes were enough to make grave guard or morghasts grest on their own, they are enough that I'm personally looking forward to trying them out.

I could see trying to run grave guard as battle line at the new points. Especially in meeting engagements. Skittles lose a lot when you can only take them in units of 20 max, making grave guard look a bit better by comparison. Probably not something I'd bother with outside of grand host, and still doesn't compare well if you look outside of the faction. Yeah, grave guard can be stacked up quite a bit offensively, but so can most anything, and the guard still crumble at even the slightest breeze. Eh. Otherwise, I'm... ~mostly~ content with these changes. I would have greatly preferred wight kings coming down in points instead of necromancers going up. +20 for necromancers and +20 for shackles together hit my current lists pretty hard.

So the online reviews are coming in for the generals handbook, 2019, including in depth summaries of points changes. EG: https://youtu.be/ndUWz85b-yo Chat about the points changes has been going on in the various subfaction threads, but I thought it might be a good idea to have a central thread to look at them more generally. Quick summary of Death changes only Obviously these changes will need to be taken in the context of point changes throughout the game, of which there are too many to list individually here. FEC are clearly still too recently released to have any changes based on feedback (before you might ask, the same is true for skaven as well, so I expect rough match ups for the forces of Nagash against their ancient spoilers for at least the next year or so). Of the changes we did see, they mostly seem to be a mix of the expected expected (increases to dire wolves and grimghasts), and the hoped for (significant decreases to mannfred, neferata, grave guard, blood knights, small decreases to many nighthaunt units and characters). The increase to Nagash wasn't a huge surprise, but is still somewhat painful. The increases to Arkhan and the necromancer, I'll admit, caught me as an unpleasant surprise. A few months ago I might have expected increases to them, but after the FEC and SKAVEN book, I though GW was just making casters stronger and cheaper in general, so yeah that kind of hurts. I mean, I've long said that necromancers shouldn't cost less than wight kings, but that's because white kings are, and have been since the first handbook, pretty painfully overpriced and should have been decreased 20 points or more. At least, imo. So it's sad to see wight kings staying the same and necros going up instead. I'm still not sure how you can justify a wight king for 120 when a vamp lord is only 40 points more (EDIT: whoops, 20 points more), tougher, faster, killier, better mount options, better invocation, is a spellcaster, and has the same command ability - only it works on all death units, not just deathrattle. And even vamp lords feel a bit pricey to me at an unchanged 160 points (EDIT: 140 points, bit of a brain ****** there). I was also kind of hoping to see zombies go to 20 model minimum, with a slight discount compared to 2x10 at the current price. 60 for 10 just feels a bit high to me for how trash they are, and a 20 model minimum size would give them a unique role in meeting engagements beyond 'cheapest throw away minimum battleline'. Sadly, until GW is ready to put out some new models for them, I don't think we're going to see any serious look at the rules or pricing of zombies in AoS. As such, I didn't actually expect this change, so I'm not disappointed the way I am for wight kings not getting discounted. Another year of wishlisting, I suppose. In the mean time, there's more good than bad here. Grave guard still look maybe a little bit pricey compared to regular skeletons, they're MUCH more tempting to me now that they've basically switched prices with grimghasts. I could see them being particularly worthwhile as battle line in Grand Host of Nagash, especially in meeting engagements where skeletons can't be brought at full strength. Morghasts get another modest points decrease, this one bringing them within the legal ally allotment in 1000 point games, which may have interesting ramifications for Nighthaunt armies in meeting engagements. And speaking of Nighthaunts, grimghasts did see a slight increase - something somewhat expected, though frankly they were mostly only abusive in LoN armies and imo a better solution would have been to rescind the errata that allowed LoN to take them as native units instead of allies, but to make up for it many of their non-poachable units saw modest point decreases, including all three of the named heroes, so that's cool. In terms of endless spells, the shackles doubling in price hurts. It's not entirely unexpected, imo that spell was way too useful for something that could be so easily dropped in with a few spare points. On the other hand, I've always loved the purple son conceptually, and as a model. Even at half the previous price it's still probably overpowered for something that requires you to roll a bunch of sixes to have any effect at all, and can so easily be used against you - from a pure optimization standpoint I can't imagine the purple sun being a better use of 50 points than just taking an extra command point. But in terms of just-for-fun games I could at least see myself considering it now. Overall, I'm relatively content with these changes, at least in and of themselves. Still need to absorb the changes for other factions to get a sense of context - though for my personal games the most important context is the *lack* of changes to skaven, which I expect will lead to a year of uphill battles for my personal army. Your thoughts?

Because the stormcast reforging process explicitly includes burning away - or at least burying - any memories or aspects of the subjects personality or identity that would prevent them from serving Sigmar unquestioningly.

It's an auto-include because it costs no points and there's no reason not to take one, so you really might as well. Even if you have no archregents or infantry kings, it's still a bravery buff for nearby FEC units. That said, archregents are /so/ good that there's really no reason an FEC army wouldn't be running /at least/ one, if not more, and for every regent you run the throne is handing out essentially a free CP, which is a pretty big deal with feeding frenzy, to say nothing of GKoT summons, re-rolled charges, and inspiring presence - which will be pretty crucial if you like running big units of serfs & knights instead of going in for the new monster mash business. So yeah, the throne is an auto-include. Not as impressive or potentially game-changing as some of the other free faction terrain, certainly nothing as faction defining as gravesites are for the legions, maybe not the topest of top priorities for brand new FEC players to get on the table, but not something that any established FEC player should ever leave at home.

Looks tough. With only one extra CP, though, I worry it would have trouble consistently getting hunger off on both monsters, let alone using their summons. And I'm not as convinced that 40 ghouls is enough chaff to keep everything safe from alpha rush lists. Definitely scary though.

Again, though, can you really? The summoned ghouls cost a CP that could have been used on endless legions, and yeah, you can outflank them, but then they're likely out of range of the regents buff spell, and what else is the regent even going to try to cast, without access to faction spells? And neither get or grant death saves, the summoned ghouls can't benefit from endless legions, gravesites, or invocations, or vanhels, the regent doesnt get traits or items, loses the ravenous hunger CA, etc. I'm not saying they're bad or anything, but I really don't see legions being able to make even close to as good use of these guys as the native faction. Not like they do with grimghasts or chainrasps, and even then that's only because they can run them native, not as allies.

Do people really see the archregent as a good ally choice for Legions? No items on him, no lore spells, no chair to make his summon free, neither his own death save nor the ability to project one? He has his own signature spell, but who's he gonna cast it on? Himself? A summoned unit of 20 ghouls? And those ghouls cost a command point that could have been used to revive a unit of 30 grims or 40 skittles. I mean, don't get me wrong, regent looks *stupidly* good in FEC, maybe good enough to prop up the whole faction, but outside of it I'm not so sure.

If the main problems with what's there are points costs, that ghouls & hortors cost too much and archregents too little, then at least that's something that might see correction in future general's handbooks rather than having to wait for a 3rd edition update.

Corpse cart casting bonus doesn't stack with itself.

Oh, certainly there's decent potential for some casty business here. Arkhan plus a corpse cart fit in the ally restrictions for a 2k list, throw in an archregent, maybe a ghoul king or two, etc. Not sure what court or delusion would fit best w that. Still, would have liked the explicitly pro-nagash fluff that I had imagined might come with a casty court. I'll have to take a longer look at the fluff of the courts when the book comes out to see how they relate to the great necromancer.

Yeah, the foundation of the courts is less their narrative character, which is what I had expected, and more the core units they're supposed to favor as their battleline - horrors, flayers, monsters, or ghouls - with any narrative concepting built around that battleline preference after the fact. Since ghouls are already battleline that last one doesn't unlock alternative battleline options. I say "supposed to" because there are arguements to be made that some units are better served by other units' courts. Blisterskin is the flayer court, emphasizing the flayers' speed with a faction-wide +2 to move. But since flayers are alreadu pretty fast, an argument could be made that that move speed bonus better serves slower units like ghouls and horrors. In the end none of the courts were reall6 designed around the heroes, so my preficted magic/nahash-worshipping court didn't pan out. Which leaves me 0 for 3 on predictions for FEC 2.0, after wrongly predicting we would see new courtier models and a new plastic varghulf.

Thanks!

In text form? Cannot lisyen to video atm.

Can someone summarize the courts?

This is kind of counting unhatched chickens, since we don't even know that the royal family is staying around yet, let alone in its current form.

I like the grail more the more I look at it. The horses still seem to have too much risk of being thrown back in your face for me to get excited about them yet. I still like the wall, at least mechanically. Movement impairing abilities are fantastic, and the wall's effectiveness and long range in that regard seems quite viable to me. The terrain isn't bad - I mean, it's free, it *can't* be bad. I was just hoping for... I don't know. More somehow. An extra CP or two per game isn't bad at all, but isn't likely to significantly change the way your army plays, the way those warp tunnels might for skaven, or the way gravesites (which, while lacking discrete models, still fill more or less the same role) do for the Legions. I'm not sure what I was hoping for - casting bonuses? Increases to the range of spells or command abilities measured from an abhorrant sitting on the chair? fighty buffs or recursion for mordant units in a radius? I'm not sure. Again, the chair is good, especially for free. It just seems like something your reagent will deploy next to for a free turn 1 summon, and then your whole army will move away from it to chase objectives / enemy units and for the rest of the game you'll forget it's even there. All in all, the previewed content is growing on me, but still doesn't have a lot of *WOW* factor. I'm not underwhelmed by this stuff, but I'm not overwhelmed either. Just regular whelmed, which leaves my previously expressed griping about the apparent lack of expansion to the FEC's actual model/unit range (still time to make me eat my shoe on this GW!) as my primary emotional response here. I honestly kind of wish that, say, Seraphon had seen the update first. Like skaven, they've still got a robust enough oldhammer range to not be crying out for new models & units - an updated book, some spells, a terrain piece, & maybe a new hero choice really would do them pretty well for an update, and skaven vs. lizardmen is a classic enough feud to get people excited for a box set of mostly existing models. Then FEC's update could have been saved for when they were ready to actually expand the range, even if that took another year or two. But whatever. It is what it is. None of this stuff looks bad exactly, and the book still has time to turn my frown upside down.

I'd be a lot more enthused about it if it worked for the summoning abilities of mounted ghoul kings as well. With the Regent being added, I just don't see a lot of place for infantry ghoul kings, which means you're only getting a single CP out of it unless the archregent's point cost comes in low enough to make doubling up on them a viable option. Though I suppose battalions might provide a reason to still run the infantry king. Fingers crossed, I guess.

The barricade part of the spell/model is a pointless distraction. The selling point of this model is that it's a long range AOE movement debuff and roadblock (non-flying enemy units have to walk around it as it's an enemy model, they can't just climb over it like a normal barricade) that should, at the very least, force your opponent to burn a casting attempt to try to dispel it. If it's as cheap as, say, the shackles or pallisades, the nearest generic equivalents, then I could see it being a viable option. Maybe even something I'd consider in a Nagash list. Not as good as the skave warpstone triangle spell, but still something that might see play. Compared to the shackles it can't do damage, can't trap enemy models, and is less flexible in positioning, but it has 6" longer range and the movement debuff is automatic instead of having to roll for it and it's a lot harder for enemy units to walk around. @Requizen Good point on the chalice being decent support for a monster or monster-mounted hero. That does slightly improve my feelings about it.

I'm less impressed with these spells than I was with the skaven spells yesterday. The chalice, unlike the skaven bell, isn't predatory, so you can't move it in subsequent rounds to keep it in position, though admittedly conversely it can't be moved out of position by the opponent. It's ability seems like it would best support big ghoul hordes, but then the 'wholly within 12 inches' language becomes problematic. The horses have a fantastic move speed for a predatory spell, but unlike the skaven rat swarm spell they aren't faction friendly, so your opponent can send them right back at you. They'll have to be pretty darned cheap to justify that risk, particularly with being exclusively a damage source and not having any other debuffing or utility applications. The barricade's description - a wall of writhing corpses grabbing at enemy units - is fantastic and fluffy, but the model doesn't live up to that at all, just a plain old fence with a few seemingly inert bodies strewn around it. Still, mechanically it's probably my favorite of the bunch for the long range, the move penalty it imposes, and the fact that as a non-damaging spell it's pretty easy to cast and probably won't cost many points. At first blush it's the only one I'm particularly inclined to run, but points costs will be an important factor, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if players more skilled & experienced in the game & this faction find selling points I'm not seeing yet in the other spells. All in all, I liked the skaven spells better, and probably would have been more enthused about these had I seen them before those spells rather than after. I don't think they're terrible, though. As for the terrain, well, I mean, free is free, right? Again, I would have been more enthused about this had I seen it before the, imo, significantly superior skaven terrain from yesterday. The bravery modifiers don't strike me as that significant. Summoning without CP on the archregent is nice. Basically amounts to a free CP per game, which is appreciated given how valuable those are for FEC in the new book. Mostly seeing these don't push my feelings very much one way or the other. Still kind of shrugging at both the spells and the chair and desperately wishing they had done something to help the FEC's actual model range instead, and still mostly looking to the battletome for hope of turning my somewhat unimpressed reaction to this release around.

Vampire lords aren't exactly the most thematic fit as allies anyway. The abhorrent delusions are apparently catching - I'd imagine regular vampires would go out of their way to avoid FEC, and those who didn't would soon end up as ghoul kings themselves. Admittedly from a purely mechanical perspective it would be nice to stack the vamp lords CA with the FEC's ravenous hunger CA, but not letting you do that is probably a deliberate choice, much as I expect we won't be seeing the summonable keyword added either, to avoid stacking native attack buffs with the necromancer's signature spell. So from both a thematic and a mechanical perspective, I can certainly understand why the FEC's ally options are so limited, and in and of itself it doesn't bother me too terribly much... except that the lack of ally options, and lack of synergy with some of the options they do have, doesn't exactly help the bigger problem that is their limited selection of models & units in faction. Still, corpse carts in particular seem like a decent fit - rolling banquet wagons that provide some appreciated spellcasting buffs, don't cost to terribly much for what they do - whether in points or in dollars, and fit in well enough with the faction's overall aesthetic sensibilities.

on a more optimistic, if a bit less on topic note, the skaven endless spells & terrain were previewed today, and mechanically they look really good to me. Obviously points costs will be a deciding factor on the spells, but it seems like the designers maybe have a good idea at this point of what makes for an actually good endless spell. In particular, the opponent can push the skaven predatory spells out of position, but they can't use them against the skaven player, so buying & casting them will never end up giving your opponents weapons to use against you, as with previous predatory spells. Fingers crossed that tomorrow's preview shows the same for the FEC spells. I'm certainly more optimistic about them today than I was yesterday based on prior endless spells.

Spoiled for negativity. Was going to have a more positive post spoiler takeaway, but apparently i cant close spoiler boxes, so why bother.

I mean, the Arch-Regent doesn't look too terribly hard to convert from a normal ghoul king. The most distinguishing features are some wingy flappy dealies on the forarms that should be reasonably reproducible from spare vargheist bits out of the horror/flayer box (specifically the tiny extra pair of wings from the vargheist champ), plus a random extra shoulder pauldron that could come from about anywhere. Maybe a bit of reposing & a fancier base. If you wanted to take it a bit further, maybe a tattered greenstuff robe or cape? Maybe a fancy crown, perhaps steal the one from the top of the wight king's head? A fair bit of hassle to be sure sure, but if the archregent is literally the only thing out of the carrion empires box you want (and with the lack of other new FEC models it very will might be), then conversion is probably a better option provided you've got some hobby experience under your belt. I'm leaning towards fancying up my existing half-done ghoul king conversion a bit rather than grabbing a whole box set for just one model, though the official model is admittedly very nice in this case. Another alternative option might be any old necrarch vampire lord models or conversions you might have lying around, provided my previous prediction of a nagash-worshipping, magic-oriented FEC court pans out.

That would be nice, and certainly a creative use of the keyword mechanics, something that haven't been at all used to their fullest. I don't expect it, but it would be nice. Slightly more likely - if still not something I'm pinning any hopes on - would be battalions including units not otherwise allowed as allies, something we have already seen here and there, iirc. A GKoTG with some bat swarms flocking in its wake would be pretty cool, for instance. Give the formation a deep strike rule similar to the one 'mount command trait' previewed and they'd be an interesting option to mitigate enemy shooting, or at least keep enemy ranged units honest in regards to needing screens. A neat idea, even if the old and awkward bat models mean its probably not something we have any chance of seeing.