zedatkinszed
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Posts posted by zedatkinszed
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What ever it is we have a fairly straight comparison with the launch of the new Hive War starter today. A boxed specialist game full of card, terrain and niche models (i.e more niche than Space Marines). Almost 8 hours later it's still available for preorder even in my FLGS.
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What happened here is a mess up at the logistical level - either stocking, tariffs, or a messed-up order from suppliers. Basic things that have failed either due to a MIS/software failure, human error or management, development teams and marketing not communicating properly (this last one is least likely given the book - the project clearly had a large budget that somebody in backend of GW made a mess of). Or due to the UK government's mishandling of their own Brexit strategy and their failure to brief, lead, manage and aid British importers and exporters through it. (Many many business owners keep saying their being blindsided by new UK rules every week - it's a really hard time to be a British exporter) GW won't mention this as to avoid being labelled one way or the other on the Brexit debate. But honestly that's not good enough.
Anything (WHQ:CC & Crimson Court for that matter) that sells out *preorders* in 75 minutes is a logistical failure. Compare how fast Be'lakor was back in stock. Reason being ... Be'lakor's made in Nottingham. Underworld's and specialist games, terrain and endless spells have the "designed in the UK made in china" stamp on them. Now, funnily enough WHQ:CC has the made in uk stamp on it - which is clearly not the case, as MANY people pointed out you can't make the cardstock in the UK. So Brexit is a STRONG element in this mess up.
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1 hour ago, DoctorPerils said:
Unless I'm very much mistaken (I don't rule that possibility out
) you don't copyright a term, you trademark it. Copyright infringement is about having sentences and artwork and such being copied, or even just slightly too similar, not just a few terms here and there.
Mind you, I don't disagree about your point about incompetence / system failure, but realise that a copyright infringement would also be a sign of incompetence. The reason I don't believe it's just a stock error or shipping problem, is precisely because otherwise there'd be no reason to not just produce a new batch - by all accounts, this was a licence to print money.
(on another subject, why did you quote my post but respond to someone else who was claiming the copyrighted element was the title? I know that the following wasn't your intent, but it does sort of feel like a jab at me
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Not a jab at you. It's a jab at that rumour because to paraphrase Monty Python - it's a silly rumour.
If there was any actual copyright/trademark problem like that a) it'd be public and b) they'd take the website down. End of story. As long as ageofsigmar.com/cursed-city/ is up GW are promoting the game - they just aren't promoting its SALE anymore. There's a world of difference.
Look you cannot restrict the use of two word terms as commonplace as "cursed city". It would be possible to restrict "Warhammer Quest: Cursed City". Take the names of DnD rulesets "Vault of the Dracolich" is trademarkable because Dracolich is not a real word. "Vault of the Vampire" is not trademarkable because 'Vault' and 'Vampire' are commonplace and commonly associated. Same reason Trump couldn't TM "you're fired". Now take, "Dungeons and Dragons: Vault of the Vampire" this trademarkable because the string of words is not common place, and because it is specific.
All in all, just because some dude on the internet saw that there is/was a game called Cursed City and then sees that WHQ:CC is no longer being sold - and then spreads a rumour that there might be a copyright issue - does not mean THERE IS one. It's a pure conspiracy - might as well say Archaon was on the Grassy Knoll in '63. Or that Cypher was RFK's second shooter. "Cursed City" is such a commonplace and use two extremely common place words that no court anywhere would entertain a claim for this and if they did the claimant would loose, and the only winner would be lawyers. No cease and desist order could be enforced and none would be issued within 75 minutes of the product going to market for preorder. That's just silly.
Re: the product being pulled: The reason any corporate pulls a product is because in the short term its a money looser. Corporates look at Quarterly earnings, especially in a panicked time like the pandemic. And in the context of a shipping stocking mess up this makes sense. The game could actually have lost an unrecoverable ammount of money if someone order 10 times of card lot A and 10% of Card Lot B. This is not easily fixed. But I still cannot fathom the silence
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On 4/27/2021 at 9:41 AM, DoctorPerils said:
There are rumours of some kind of copyright infringement (that reared its head after publication), so they actually can't legally sell more copies of the game than they already have
I don't know any more than that though
Probably BS. You can't copyright the term Cursed City (prior art rules that out) - this is pure conspiracy BS. If that were the case the ww.ageofsigmar.com/cursed-city/ would be gone. What's gone is promotional material for a product nobody can buy - which is good consumer relations. It was the first thing that annoyed me - that all the PR and marketing was still up a week after the sell out.
Incompetence / System failure is what happened here. The reason we can bank on that is the silence. GW's silence is because the problem is commercially sensitive. If it were copyright that would be a very public battle. If it were a shipping problem they'd be able to explain that and have investors understand and claim against insurance. If it's their own software/warehouse/people mess up - that's something that would damage investors' confidence and rightly so.
The tariff issue is hard to get away from - it would still be a mess up. If tariffs are the issue it would be damaging because it would damage the made in UK image of GW. (Yes I know and you know it's made in China but this is/was a mirage).
My money was on a shipping disaster (product overboard that kill WHQ:CC's commercial viability) but this *potential* stock mess-up is effectively the same thing. And anyone managing people working from home knows this is exactly the kind of thing we all have nightmares about.
It is still damned annoying that GW is not giving the game a second life - I mean there are ways around this. Sell the boards
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1 hour ago, Scurvydog said:
There is no point to all this marketing and hype if you cant buy the product at all.
This is what's annoying people most. Products that won't don't or can't be bought with ads and hype for MONTHS! I mean GW made sure every influencer got a copy so the product could be advertised, but failed to supply FLGS or the public or their own online store properly.
Indomitus was the same. I mean jeez guys - delay the release. It's not rocket science.
2 hours ago, Souleater said:Ach. Disappointing but the double whammy of Covid and Brexit must be a frickin' nightmare to deal with.
In fairness, I agree. This past 12 months has been a 100% communications/marketing mess. They could have delayed everything and been open about it months ago - everyone gets it, Covid is a nightmare, we can empathize we're living it too! If they had done that and maximized production times and made sure product launches were adequately stocked (a basic law of sales btw) that would have been good planning.
But when you promise something and fail to deliver that's 100% different. When you don't tell anyone that a product is a limited run. When you don't have 10-20% supply level when the market is awash with cash (sorry to anyone who is struggling but the fact is right now more people have spare cash because they aren't spending money on Petrol, public transport, holidays, business lunches, or well... clothes). That's a recipe for disaster, and all points to a business plan not working post Brexit and during Covid.
Let's imagine something else for 1 second. Let's imagine GW made the models and printed everything in the UK and added 50% to the RRP - we'd buy it. Now imagine if instead of running out of pre-orders they delayed releases and went 100% made to order (you know like Reaper) - we'd buy it.
What GW did, it seems to me, is work through Covid on a pre-covid supply/demand model. And kept their focus on in-store supply levels instead of digital (and also accounts for the 3 party supply levels). Which has to be about the real estate costs of the physical shops. Because it's not a model that makes sense otherwise.
And my heart goes out to the guys who run Warhammer shops through this pandemic but GW must should have made this statement a long time ago.
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10 hours ago, Joseph Mackay said:
The problem with made to order is all card product is made in China, they can’t just print more whenever they want like they can with models.
among the speculation and conspiracy theories I’ve seen:
-brexit adding tariffs because the China made components exceeded a 30% allowance of total content. The extra costs make it not financially worth making more. They sold what they had from their initial run at a huge loss and decided to discontinue it.
-the contract with their Chinese printer expired and the company no longer exists so they’re trying to sort out a new one (this one seems odd since no other product has been affected, yet all hardback books are printed in China too).
-gw did it on purpose to fuel fomo (fear of missing out).
-gw underestimated demand based on Blackstone Fortress sales (40K is a bigger seller than AoS so presumably they looked at BSF sales and made less than that - supposedly the stock should have lasted 6 months).
-nobody was supposed to say it was a regular range item and they’re removing those posts because it was a mistake. Theory being it WAS limited and they chose not to announce it so scalpers wouldn’t buy it all.note that this is all just what I’ve seen posted around various places and none of it is my opinion or anything
First - yes they could print where ever they want to - it's just more expensive to do it in the UK.
The China thing is a conspiracy theory but a valid one. The silence is really interesting. Either something happened that is hugely embarassing or hugely political. So this is possible.
My own personal belief is that it's a 'mess' up (TGA won't let me write the correct word) over a conspiracy. Either IT WAS a limited run and the marketing team(s) messed up by assuming it was like BSF. Or they were mislead.
Other possibilities are:
- A shipping container fell of a ship (seriously this happens a lot) and was uninsured. Thus the product has therefore lost more money than it can ever recoup. And GW made the decision to kill it.
- Covid is killing production just like PS5 sales (seriously have you tried to buy one) and other computer components (video cards). Because Chinese companies are not being honest about their workforce and production capacity. Most likely IMHO.
- The Suez Canal thing had an impact and GW don't want to admit it. Not sure why that would be.
- Brexit stuff. This is very possible. And would explain the silence as GW don't want to be labelled either way.
- Something genuinely weird happened on the pre-order day and scalpers managed to order everything. I mean every single site selling it was crashing. It is strange and if they did indeed think they had enough for 6 months the maths of 75 minutes just doesn't add up. I mean that's rock concert sell out speed. So this is unlikely. And honestly the 6 months stock thing makes no sense. If that was true they wouldn't appear to be killing the game and letting hinted at expansions fade to dust.
All this aside what I'm really annoyed about are the UK companies taking money for alleged "made to order" copies of CC - which have not been announced.
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1 hour ago, SirSalabean said:
To add to that plenty of third party retailers are taking back orders, my go to one is being sent a restock later on too. I know there’s often miscommunication between what Warhammer community say and what’s true but they literally told every comment mentioning availability that it will be a long term thing just like black stone fortress.
In fairness no GW have not said anything of the sort. Their replies are along the lines "we'll tell you when we know" and "currently there are no plans to return this to the webstore."
We're all expecting CC to be around like BSF. And to be clear so am I. But GW's communication on this is amazingly bad.
Also just look at the website. The CC page says "No Longer Available Online".
Crimson court (which also sold out on preorder day btw) "Temporarily out of stock Online"
I'm sadly thinking there was a genuine mess up here. CC was NEVER meant to be a limited release but GW are acting like it is. If this was like Indomitus and they wanted to cover their blushes with a made to order run - they would have done it. Genuinely that was a demand issue. This isn't this is a supply issue. Also to be frank it's a marketing mess up. Every influencer got a copy. The game was hyped to hell. And no warning about stock was given to customers by GW or by GW NDA reviewers (b/c of GW embargos - which is a fair enough practice). To me it looks like Marketing made a plan AS IF this was a full proper release. Not a release with a supply chain problem. So I think they've gotten screwed over too.
4 hours ago, alghero81 said:Now, this release was going to be incredibly popular as it is crimson court, but this complete lack of copies worldwide for a product that makes no sense to be limited must be because of Covid and who knows maybe even evergreen.
NOBODY plans this kind of thing. And even in Covid this is avoidable. The only thing I can think of is the Evergreen / Suez Canal blockage. This was a disastrous product launch because every time GW talk about CC now it will just annoy everyone apart from the people who got one.
The problem right now is not the unavailability of the game it's the silence from GW about a) what happened and b) what's going to happen. This might well be because they don't know!! But the issue remains, the corporate silence is not helping. It's not adding to FOMO - it's making ppl resent the company. GW need to say something and soon.
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1 hour ago, eciu said:
Btw. is there any chance that Cursed City heroes will be releases as a separate release (all 8 together or one by one) ? Was it done for Blackstone Fortress or previous WHQ games ?
There is a chance - The Ogroid and Gaunt Summoner from Silver Tower were released. In fact they were all released from Silver Tower. However, Blackstone Fortress only saw the villain, Chaos Lord getting a separate release, Obsidius Mallex.
It's really very hard to tell. Silver Tower was at the beginning of AOS and was a trial run for the Karic Acolytes and Tzaangors and new blue horrors - all of which got their own eventual new release. Shadows over Hammerhal is anomalous as it had ZERO new models so all previously existed.
All in all Blackstone is probably a better comparison as AOS is a lot more mature but it all depends on what GW's strategy with this was.
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1 hour ago, Lenwe Seregon said:
Hi guys,
I just jumped on their live chat to ask what the situation was with cursed city as well and this was the reply..
This is a "holding pattern" communication. Basically they can't answer the question - because they either haven't got an answer or they aren't allowed give an answer.
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3 hours ago, JackStreicher said:
About Cursed City:
GW stated on Facebook (Comment) that Cursed City will be around for a while. So keep calm, they‘ll produce more. Due to COVID everything just taking longer.
11 hours ago, Greyshadow said:Just got told by my local GW store staff that Cursed City is only going to be done as a single production run. Once sold out then that's it apparently
. If you really want it then perhaps don't hold off too long. There were quite a few copies on the shelf at my store in Australia. Also was told that it was far more popular than expected.
2 hours ago, Joseph Mackay said:Yes I’ve heard the same here in NZ, email from HQ said it’s limited
What ever the story is GW are doing an amazingly bad job at communication. This is just bizare. It looks like the Web/marketing/facebook team have no idea what's actually happening either. Anytime they're asked it's a "when we hear we'll let you know" - well duh it's your job. And the customer service people are syaing "no current plans to return [cursed city] to the website."
But it was clear from Uncle Adam's video on Cursed City that the word was out that this preorder was going to sell out wicked fast. GW just need to do whjat they did with the delayed Sylvaneth release 18 months ago and tell us what's going on.
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What I think is likely:
IDK
SCE (there's always an SCE release - even Beastgrave had Ironsoul's Condemnors - here's an easy one - they just use the ETB Castigators)
Chaos Warriors (not just STD marauder types - actual chaos armoured warriors). There are usually 2 Chaos bands in each season. (Nurgle & BOC; Tzeentch and StD; Skaven and Khorne) And the current/new Chaos warriors are monopose already.
CoS of some kind (maybe Duardin but maybe humans)
Death (they've done skeletons and FEC, and ghosts so either Vampires, Bonereapers or pure zombies with a Necromancer).
But that leaves out destruction completely. So I'd not be surprised if there were new rules for Giants to be somehow used, especially with SoB on the horizon.
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On 9/3/2020 at 8:28 AM, foxicious said:
I just finished my first kitbash since years. It is nothing too complicated, but I am still pretty proud of it 😁. May I present to you, my new Slaughter Queen!
GW please take note: this is how future Slaughter Queens should look!
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On 9/1/2020 at 11:00 AM, WathLab said:
Did some of yours broke ? Which part in particular ? I'm about to assemble mine, and I love the minis so much...
On 9/1/2020 at 6:12 PM, Lucentia said:The plastic on mine seems the same quality as your standard GW kit as far as I can tell. Morgwaeth's spear is a bit fragile cos it's so thin, but I haven't noticed anything unusually brittle.
Generally. Yes but like @Zamik says
On 9/1/2020 at 6:51 PM, Zamik said:I managed to snap one of the sacrificial knives right off the handle, but it glued back easily.
All glued back fine. It was like I touched Lethyr's left hand sword and the whole blade part detached. Same with Morgwaeth's spear bottom third. It just was broken when it came off the sprue and I'm a very very careful clipper with very very sharp snips so I don't know how it happened. It didn't look broken when I looked at the sprue.
All easily fixed though. Just strange.
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Did anyone else find the plastic on these minis to be unusually brittle?
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1 hour ago, Graywater said:
My fear is that you're right and the morathi book is our source for updated rules. This is my dear because it doesnt fix the hagg nar problem from our book. The only way hagg nar still isn't the most powerful temple by far is to release a new temple that is even stronger than it, which just makes our issues worse. I really would like to see our temples reworked to allow some battleline-ifs (snakes should be battleline in khailebron and lifetakers in hagg nar), as well as change some of the abilities so hagg nar isn't auto take and kraith isn't garbage.
When the new DoK Battletome comes it needs to forget and re-imagine the temples completely. Hagg Narr is a monster and it's why DoK are seen as an S (skewed) Tier army. All the other Temples are 'for fun only' which is a real shame.
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3 minutes ago, Graywater said:
That ironscale is great. The dual box has only our best models in it, being the snakes and harpies. Im now hoping we get a battletome released alongside the dual box like we saw with FEC and skaven, or ogors and OBR. I just want a decent way to run an all snake list!
Honestly I'm surprised we haven't got a new Battletome announced on the back of this. We have 3 new units, 1 might even be battleline (if GW keep the tradition of making warcry units battleline).
I guess the Morathi book is going to basically be a DoK battletome 1.5 ruleset.
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New DOK models for Warcry previewed today.
New DOK models for Underworlds released today.
New Hero model and a boxset with Slaanesh ... and a book with rules (but not a Battletome) coming in November!
It's a good day to be a follower of Morathi!
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4 hours ago, Overread said:
Same for the others you mention. I figure we won't see tomes now for armies that have them until one of two things happens/
1) We get a 3.0 rules edition
2) GW has a good chunk of models to add/update the range with at the same time as the new Tome - generating interest and excitement and a desire to buy it.
Again I see your point but I don't think so. If that were the case why update KO? Or Sylvaneth. Exactly how many new models did they get? Or Fyreslayers. All they got was ... Endless spells and terrain. And the Orruks and COS didn't get endless spells argument is a chimera. Orruks and COS both got rules for existing spells. DOK and IDK have nothing in that line.
A part from that the tome does need a complete rework. For different reasons but just like KO and Fyreslayers and Tzeentch did.
Also Keep in mind, Nurgle will get a new book. There has not been a year without a new Chaos book. Khorne, Skaven, BoC, Slaanesh, STD and Tzeentch are just out so unless they create a new chaos faction (which would be great) that leaves Nurgle next in line.
I'm not saying any of this is going to happen tomorrow but 18 months time ... probably.
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On 7/7/2020 at 9:30 AM, Overread said:
3 years is an abnormally short period of time for a new Battletome. It does happen, but its not common, part of the reason Aos had faster than normal turn arounds is because AoS had some major restructurings and the early tomes were pushed out fast to try and sooth a very irate customerbase after the whole "no rules do what you want" disaster of a launch of AoS. That's why they were very bare bones and mostly just warscrolls with not much else.
[...]
That's why going forward I would expect bigger changes. DoK aren't even in a bad place balance wise, they work really well and have done through AoS 2.0 from start to now. You can't release a new book for them if there isn't much to change or add. So I'd wager we won't see a book until such time as there's perhaps a "second wave" of models.
I tend to disagree based on all the other factions. Fyreslayers and Sylvaneth are on their second battletome as are Seraphon, SCE, Orruks, Ogres, Khorne and Tzeentch. Technically Skaven are also on battletome mark 2 (Clan Pestilens was an early release). And I mean KO just literally got a new book and their book only launched in Spring 2017.
So that leaves the following factions to get updated tomes:
- Nurgle (winter 2017)
- DOK (spring 2018)
- LON (spring 2018)
- IDK (spring 2018)
With the exception of LON, the other 3 armies were definitely designed with AOS 2.0 in mind but were finalized before the new edition was fully conceptualized/planned. DOK and Nurgle have no endless spells or any explicit mention of them. Neither do IDK, but at least the fish elves have scenery, the other 3 don't.
So just going by the evidence of what GW have done with ALL their factions so far, DOK are in line for an update in the next 18 months. Just as they were in line for an Underworlds release - which is coming. I know re: the rule of cool but these days there does seem to have been a pattern to what gets released.
While I'd love to see a new wave of stuff and a replacement for the Warlocks with a new kit, going by GW's form with other updated tomes, it'll be a Hero, some endless spells and a piece of scenery and a reconceived book.
That's what I'll put my money on, but like you I'd much prefer a wave of new models and to wait a few more years.
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On 6/25/2020 at 3:54 PM, Graywater said:
I gave up on foam a long time ago after having more of my models break getting them out of the foam than when I was transporting them loosely.
I theorized out an army built around a couple large lifetaker blobs, but I'd never be able to take it anywhere, so I've never gone through and done it.
My solution was to get a few magnetic steel sheets from greenstuffworld and glue in some small magnets to the DoK bases. Then I lined shoe boxes with the steel sheets. If you then put bubblewrap or tissue paper clumps in the box it should work. But only if you're carrying it and have control of the box. May not be suitable for planes etc.
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If spray priming isn't working - most likely you're doing something wrong. Watch this video from LukesAPS: https://youtu.be/vbLi-pm9EhU
Weather conditions are a factor in extreme climates. In parts of the US and Australia you can have this (extreme cold and extreme heat). GW does make these products with UK's temperate climate in mind. But TBH there is A LOT of exaggeration on the net about climate and spray primer. Just don't spray on a windy or rainy day or when it's snowing or when it's too cold or too hot to be comfortable outside. If you can stand around comfortably without getting wind or rain in your face you should be good to go.
Like @Sonnenspeer and @RuneBrush say Citadel contrast primers are great. Hell the corax white primer (if used right) is pretty damn good too. And honestly you can't go wrong with Chaos black. But I use rustoleum, army painter and other brands with ZERO problems too. The only one I'm not crazy about is Halfords (it's a hardware chain in the UK and Ireland) - it tends to be runny.
As the video shows there are some handy rattle can rules of thumb:
- Keep your rattle cans in a normal room not in your shed/garage.
- Shake the can for 5 minutes before use
- Ensure you spin the agitator at the top and bottom of the can
- Some ppl let them rest in luke-warm water (I've never needed to YMMV).
- Spray on in bursts not continuously
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55 minutes ago, Landohammer said:
This is a hugely dividing issue on other forums. Here are some quick tidbits i have picked up
-Rule "suggestions" in 40k are almost always officially adopted. So the word "minimum" isnt as relevant here as we think. For example the "rule of 3" was also technically a suggestion but was widely implemented. The ITC guys will be implementing the new smaller table sizes which further confirms this.
-The difference is pretty noticeable. You actually lose 6 square feet of gaming area.
-AOS plays at a smaller scale than 40k, so table reduction for us is definitely in the realm of possibility if they are already changing 40k.
Personally i think its ultimately on the shop-owners to decide what they make available to players but my pickup games of 40k will continue to be 6x4 as i always use realm of battle boards or Frontline mats and I am not going to tape them off.
As someone who walked away from 40K (and has two different 3K pts armies in mothballs) because of its tendency to attract the most toxic of "that guy" type gamers. Sure I can see how this would drive them nuts.
There is nothing stopping you having a pickup game at 48"x72". It just means that if somebody only have a standard 44" x 60" kitchen table they can still play a ≤2K game. I fail to see HOW that's a bad thing. Nobody's banning 48"x72". Great if you've got that size of table - so do I. But the majority of ppl I know don't.
And at 3K (aka Apocalypse for this neckbeard) 8'x4' is still perfect. But if all you have is a dining table that can extend to 90" then you can still have a huge epic 3K 40K battle. What's so terrible about that?! Most people in the world don't have the space for an 6'x4' gaming table or a bespoke gaming room. Most of us have families and need our rooms for the kids or an office. And some of us barely have space for our collections in our garages.
All GW are trying to do here is make games accessible to more people with normal sized tables. (Hell it'll make building a gaming table 100% easier if you can start with a standard frame bought in a shop.)
They're not banning 6'x4' or 4'x8' (or bigger) games.
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Honestly I think these sizes actual correspond to modern standard dining table sizes in the UK and US. I don't know about anyone else but I had to scratch build my 6'x4' table (and when I grew up it had to stay in my parents house until I could afford to buy my own). When Warcry came along with its 22" x 30" it kinda felt weird until you add the cards and a dice rolling space for both players then its a whole regular-small kitchen table. Warcry x 2 = 30 x 44 btw which is a normal size table (in Europe our equivalent is 114cm x 76cm) and the size of combat patrol above.
GW are just trying to let people use actual dining tables. They're not invalidating our custom made gaming ones.
What I'd actually like to see change is the semi-official display board sizes going to (or allowing) 22" by 30". Then you could use them for gaming too. 24" by 24" is cool when you have a 8'x4' or 6'x4' space. But if GW are going from mutiples of 2'x2' to multiples of 30" length and 22" width then a display board should be 30"x22".
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Might be the light but looks like Bugman's glow. Or could be Barbarian flesh from Vallejo. There's a useful comparison chart here:
https://redgrimm.github.io/paint-conversion/index.html
) you don't copyright a term, you trademark it. Copyright infringement is about having sentences and artwork and such being copied, or even just slightly too similar, not just a few terms here and there.
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It might have ended before it really began...
in Warhammer Quest
Posted
Fair enough I was under the misapprehension that as a 40k line it'd be more popular than a niche AOS Warhammer Quest - but fair point.