Hollow

I have been collecting Beastmen for a quarter of a century. Most of the current range available for Beasts of Chaos in AoS I have on square bases from before The End Times. So you can hop back in your little box. Whilst many models have been moved to Online Only, The fact that the entire range is online only AND out of stock is not "in line with many other armies". Online Only means that they are not available in GW retail stores, but can be stocked by FLGS and Online retailers. Take a look around a dozen or so major Online retailers and compare the offerings to updated AoS factions (Like LRL) and BoC, it's laughable, most have nothing apart from a smattering of kits that have just not sold or the aforementioned Beastlord and Vanguard kit. I don't even know what you are arguing about. What are you saying? That the Current BoC model line will stay in AoS untouched and unchanged for many more years to come? You do not want new miniatures for Beasts *whether that is in a reimagined Beasts faction for AoS or as mono-god units for existing Chaos factions? We already know for a fact the Shaggoth is in ToW. Do you think it will stay available in AoS? I do not. As I have mentioned before, I think with AoS 4 reboot there will be Index rules available for the existing range for use in AoS at launch and the range will be moved over to ToW and if/when Beasts are redone in AoS it will be all new models (along with the Tzaangors and perhaps the spawn kits) You think what? When Beasts are released for the Old World they will use other models than the current BoC line? They will be dual use (which is something GW are not planning on doing with AoS/ToW) What are you arguing about? What is the point you are trying to make? What position are you advocating for? I don't think you even know.

I suppose that means nothing then... 🙄

This just isn't true though. Most of the AoS ranges have a handful of out of stock items. Just clicking through the different factions you can see this.

Dude... it's the entire range! Seems clear as day to me what is happening.

It feels like many on this thread are not familiar with the BoC miniature range.... at all. Take a moment and go to the AoS BoC section of Warhammer.com Beastlord (With Ripper Axes) - Out Of Stock Shaggoth - Out Of Stock Dragon Ogres - Out Of Stock Gors - Out Of Stock Doombull, Cockatrice, Centigors, Tuskgor Chariot, Jabberslythe, Ghorgon, Bullgors, Warhounds, Bestigors, Ungors, Gargant - All ONLINE ONLY. (Also all those aformentioned models are from Fantasy btw) The only properly stocked items are the Vanguard box, New Beastlord, Spawn and the Tzaangor range. That's it. Everything else has been left to run dry. My bet is an AoS 4 "Index" of existing units to be replaced by either a completely new AoS Beasts faction compremised of God-Specific beasts (Like the Tzaangors) and for the existing range of old models to reappear in an ToW BoC Faction box. Simples. In the same way as the High Elf and Empire kits are.

How are you not "being allowed" to play a game they are providing rules for day one of the ToW and are currently supported in AoS? Are you no longer "Allowed" to use an Iphone 10 because Apple release a new Iphone?

People are reading what I said (and what I'm advocating for) completely backwards. BoC fit ToW, it keeps the current models around and allows for NEW Beast type models to be released in the AoS setting (Either as a new AoSfied faction or apart of other Chaos factions) "Squatting" is completely the wrong term. They are being made avalible for ToW (which is where the came from in the first place for goodness sake) opening up logistical space in AoS for NEW SCULPTS and ideas.

People acting like BoC are some huge integral part of the AoS product line. They clearly are not.

No. It will mean that models that are going to be in ToW will be removed from AoS and be marketed as ToW models. Some will be removed entirely or new AoS reimaginings will replace them within the AoS line. Different kits, different systems.

I can see AoS 4 being a complete reset with all models earmarked for ToW (BoC, Dwarfs, WoC, Woodies) being last chance to buy until they return. (Just like what has happened with Empire models)

There really isn't.

Some people really don't seem to grasp the fact that ToW /AoS are NOT going to have official cross over models. They will have completely different factions with completely different model lines. Older models currently in AoS will be dumped from that system and picked up by ToW.

No. Warrior Of Chaos are a core faction in ToW. STD is AoS. They are different and you will likely see just how more different they become. ToW is a specialist game that has received more investment and resources than any other specialist game (Outside of LOTR) in GW's history. It's "Game Debut" is over 20 products with nearly 100+ products ear-marked for release over 9 different factions. I am NOT saying that ToW is driving AoS development. It's literally the other way round. AoS development is driving ToW's.

This is just a personal view, but I think with AoS 4 fast approaching and with the launch of The Old World, 2024 is the time for some lingering band aids to be ripped off and for AoS to be finally freed up from previous fantasy lines. Grand Alliance Chaos - Blades Of Khorne, Disciples of Tzeentch, Hedonites of Slannesh, Maggotkin of Nurgle, Slaves to Darkness and Skaven are 6 clearly definied, setting specific factions that allow for ample creative freedom. With Skaven all but assured to be getting a full faction overhaul with the Launch of 4th, Beasts are the only real hangover from Fantasy. GW have been very clear that ToW isn't a setting rife with demonic armies. Skaven are also not a significant force, but Beasts are listed as one of the main core factions. It's almost been completely spelled out by GW that this is what is going to happen. The only real question is how Beasts as a "faction" will be approached in AoS, will they be completely reminaged (With a new AoS name and minis or "rolled into" the exisiting Chaos factions with God specific units) Grand Alliance Death - Flesh Eater Courts, Nighthaunt, Ossiarch Bonereapers, Soulblight Gravelords are once again, clearly defined setting specific factions, with it being spellied out, once again, that Vampire counts are NOT apart of ToW setting. Tomb Kings are the Undead faction of the Old World. No cross over... Grand Alliance Order - This grand alliance is almost 90% "AoSified" with only Cities of Sigmar holding onto a handful of Dwarf units that are confirmed to be in ToW (My bet is they will not be in CoS 4 Battletome). It has been stated clearly that Dark Elves WILL NOT be apart of ToW and I think it is pretty clear that we will be seeing Malekith and his accompanying emo-elves appear in AoS, retiring or picking up some of the old Dark Elf units (My bet is these will also NOT be apart of CoS 4). Seraphon are an AoS faction now, 100%. Lizardmen have been stated to NOT be apart of ToW. Sylvaneth are already pretty far away from Wood Elfs and with the potential up coming Kurnothi it will further drive that distinction between them (Woodies have plenty of existing kits to draw from for ToW) Grand Alliance Destruction - I think Ogors are on the AoS "refresh block" (and once again it has been made clear they are not apart of ToW) and I think we might see new AoS Goblins and the removal of Savage Orukks from AoS (to both be ported over to the Old World) So this is how I see it. Lizardmen, Ogors, Dark Elves, Vampire Counts, Skaven are not coming to the Old World. The PDF's are throwing the mouthy minority a bone. Dark Elfs, Dwarfs, Goblins and Savage Orks are going the way of the dodo. Beasts of Chaos are getting moved to AoS and there will be a plenty of kits that will be removed entirely and sent to the GW vaults. A final point, I think doing this (and perhaps even more) would be a VERY GOOD thing. I would love to see some genuinely NEW factions and ideas in AoS. I'm not a fan of everything having to stay around for ever and people screaming bloody murder because a model isn't being supported 20+ years after it was first released. I have said it before, but I would advocate a continual culling of the bottom 10% of AoS on a YEARLY basis. Keeping the game, models and factions fresh. Like pruning a tree.

I can 100% see the current BoC line-up being moved over to ToW (Considering almost the entire line is from Fantasy anways) and for Beasts to get an AoS "reimagining" (Or reforging if you will) God specific beast units could also be added to the mono-god factions and for the faction to be removed as it's own thing.

TOW - Bretonnia + Beasts of Chaos AOS - Seraphon + Cities + (4th Edition hype!) 40k - T'au + Aeldari Also plan on finally making a proper gaming table and getting into some 3D printing.

The problem I have with the endless spells is that they are very hit and miss in terms of miniatures. Some of them look great, whilst others look pretty poor. At the end of the day GW only has the logistical capacity for a certian number of kits. If endless spells were to be ended (har har) for AoS 4.0 to make way for new stuff, I'd be ok with that.

As for the Dwarf Dice. I could see them getting through all 9 factions in 2024. I could see Dwarfs coming with O+G in Spring, HE and Chaos in Summer, Beasts and Woodies in Autumn and Empire for Christmas.

People pay a premium for that sensation yah know! 😅

Aussie prices are expensive... It's almost like they are on the other side of the world with a higher per capita GDP than the UK.

I have said it before, but I really liked the concept of The End Times. Makes perfect sense to me that the world would eventually end (just as ours will) and people/factions actually died (just as we all will) As a fan of fantasy like Game Of Thrones, I have no problem with death, it's a fundamental part of life and stories without it lack something IMO. I also think it's peak grimdark-Warhammer for the world to be consumed by Chaos. The following evolution into the Mortal Realms over aeons, (with some familiar souls and concepts) has worked well, I just wish we would see as much detail and TLC given to the realms as a setting as ToW has received.

I'm waiting till I get my hands on the actual books, why they decided to double down on the "Good" v "Evil" descriptors I do not know, seems completely unnecessary. They have the factions split into Ravening Hordes and Armies of Fantasy. That's enough. Warhammer is quintessentially "No Good Guys". Following along but some really strange decisions in terms of how they are approaching things.

Having a look through the Beasts Of Chaos section of Warhammer.com, I really think (and hope) that Beasts are on the slate for an AoS 4.0 complete overhaul. Almost the entire range is from The Old World and with Beastmen listed as one of the 9 core ToW factions, I could see see them being "removed" from the AoS line-up only to reappear in a large Army Box (My guess is alongside Wood Elves) for ToW.

This is something that GW really needs to work on when it comes to AoS. The realms need be be treated almost like 8 "Old Worlds" With maps, factions, regions etc far more fleshed out.

You are deliberately conflating two completely different issues. You can try to order a million copies of a certain product if you wish, but you will only be allocated as many as they have to give. What does NOT happen, however, is if you order a certain amount and then get double that amount and are refused return. With all due respect, I think you are spreading misinformation and want to move on because you are being called out for doing so.