Maturin

HEy there, thanks for your input. Actually, a lot of guys I played against, who are in their 40ies, didn't have any money back then, and used cardboard paper, white paper sheets or anything else at the time to represent the units they would have liked to play. And they enjoyed it! So when I started the hobby in 2014, I bought second hand armies, built grey armies, and nobody ever complained. Those guys were socially akward, but hobby wise, they were really open minded. You made a point about immersement. I'll tell you what, I once dabbled with the same guys in WHFB Pen and Paper Role play game. The setting ws incredible, the GM great, I was trying to really play a condescending Wood elf apprentice wizard( and was talking in a condescending way to other players, doing gestures as I imagined an elf would,etc, but they ruined it for me because they were either telling me about their private life, politics or about all the WH40k kits they bought this very week. Thing is, to ME, there is no immersement when I play tabletop games, even on a very painted table full of painted landscapes and terrains and with perfectly pâinted units. You're playing in a GW, you've got customers coming in and out, you've got all those strange 20something geeks with body odour problems, where's the immersion ? Even at a friends home, he's got his wife calling, you have his child running around, he has to cook, etc. As you said, to each his own, I can perfeclty understand most of you guys would rather play against somebody who painted an army. For me, it's about the people I'm facing. I'd rather play a very funny, nice, fair play, smart dude with a grey army, rather than play against a perfectly painted army played by a guy who has nothing interesting to say, who's not fair play or is a pain in the ass. Don't forget we also get some people in my GW, who are clearly showing sign of mental problems (and you may think I'm a ****** due to what I wrote earlier, but to the contrary, I talk to them as if they were as normal as I am). Converting and modeling is fun, but I also spent several hours using bits to make great weapons for my prosecutors coming out of the base box set. It was tedious! Rewarding but tedious! Maybe I have a peculiar way of looking at playing this game, but to me, my opponents enjoyment should come out of my personnal behaviour, or humane qualities, not about if I have enough time to paint during 200 hours for a 2000 points army

Wow, that's a strick work place or I don't know one ^^. Yeah, a separate spread sheet, but in excel, would be nice, we could easily see the stats without having to brows 250 pages of discussion!

Nicely put. Although, I have to say, most people I play against have nothing against grey armies. They prefer painted ones, but will happily play against anybody. What I wanted to know was if there was some official statement from GW. Because that's the manager who told me that "I was lucky that he let me play". Anyway, cheers for your input.

Take a phone pic

That would be a very interesting enquiry to read !

Well, you're not. Your minis are good looking, mine aren't. That's where I differ from all of you, I don't care or feel disrepected by what another player do! If I want to see good looking minis, I can read White Dwarf, go online, or just look at the Store's miniature, or come during painting events

Now I thank all of you, for giving your view on this matter, especially those who tried to explain their point of view/stance in a positive and encouraging manner! @Overread @michu It took me way to long to paint my 1250points and then again, everything was finished. The Store manager let me play because I decided to be in the tournament like less a month before its start. So that's nice from him. Thing is spend 4 hours on a mini to have a mediocre result, whereas some people can achieve the same result in 20mins! And time is of the essence ... PS : the lib's hammer is broken bc I stripped him of paint for I wasn't happy with my level of painting, so that's another loss of time!

Yes, totally logical point. That's what might happen to me in a very near future as I'll finally become my own boss, I'll work 7 days a week, at least 9 hours a day then I'll have to study for my Master's degree, then commute (1h30 a day) , then spend some time with my GF. So if that's down to not allow me to play because people are FEELING disrespected (the logical business explanation is actually more relatable to me) then the Store will lose one client. The manager won't care , because he has plenty of groupies in need of a place to play/hang out, but that will make one less "normal" guy in the GW. And believe me, that particular GW is in dire need of regular people.

That's a mature thing to do. A lot of you who reacted to Sleboda's post have a problem to understand something, YOUR Hobby is YOURS, not everyone has the same goal. If somebody shows with a grey force, it doesn't hurt YOUR way of doing the hobby, after all nobody deprives you the enjoyment of paiting and showing great minis. Some people don't even play with their minis, they just paint them. People don't always find the time or do not have the skill to do a proper job. It's not about how long they have been in the hobby. What are you going to do about someone who has like 1 hour of free time a day to do something else beside working, commuting, studying, taking care of his family if they don't want to spend it on painting ? NOTHING and that's not for you to decide. I don't understand how people can be so annoyed about somebody's not wanting or being able to spend as much time as they do on a hobby. Are you guys GW stockholders ? I really think some of you have confusing ideas about where your boundaries cease. You are you. Somebody else is somebody else. If they don't have the same way/time of seeing the hobby, then whoy care ? It's not like they're spitting in your face, stealing from you or whatever criminal or anti-societal action they could do. The only thing I ask of any person I play with, is not to cheat. Period. Being fair play and polite is great, if furthermore they're nice guys to talk with while playing or afterwards that's a bonus. I don't know if that's because english is not my mother tongue that you don't understand what I mean or ...

Wow, was he 8 ?

Ok, my GF's coming and she's got an Iphone. It takes way better pictures than my 8years old galaxy phone

Saddly I'll have to do everything again because it turns out Contrast paints wear off very easily if you don't put a varnish spray!

Nah really. It's worse IRL :D.

Contrast sucks (for begginers). Took me at least 4 hours to convert and paint that SOB : 4 hours ! and it's wonky as hell! Big hammer guy's hammer is bent AF!

Yeah, and most of you were pretty cool in that way, telling me how it's great, how it's part of the hobby, etc. Dude, are you y doppleganger ?

I totally agree with what you said. The best fun I had was playing WFB V8 for a year and a half, with a dentist who was about my age and whom with I could have regular conversations. Not saying you can't have regular conversations if you're a factory worker huh ^^.

What's disheartening to ME is that YOU'd deprive somebody of their enjoyment just because YOU think they don't deserve to play gainst YOU. If somebody's really into painting that's cool, and I have nothing to say about it. Why would you have to say something about me not being into it ?

Hey buddy :). Well, I don't really care about being "respected" by others because my minis are grey. I'd rather be proud of myself because I thought a lot about a list's synergy, how I did outsmart my opponent by reacting to his moves and won with fairplay! For sure, I'd like to have a cabinet full of wonderfully painted minis, but hey, maybe in another life time 😛

No way, you have game nights in your GW ? Ours close at 7pm, well most at the time it even closes at 6pm or even 5.30 because the manager has had a lot of "exceptionnal early closing" lately. See, that's a very big difference here. A lot of the regulars in my Gw are socially akward people, no mean people, but akwards. Some of them, I personnally feel discomfort when they're talking to me for too long and I'm someone who actually enjoys meeting new people. Imagine if I had to listen to them for hours for painting lessons. And most of the very good painters don't really hang out at the Gdubs. They paint at their place. You clearly don't have the same kind of atmosphere in your Gw than I do in mine. That's why I don't think it's fair to rob me or threaten to rob me of the only thing I really enjoy in the hobby!

The thing I have a problem with, is GW's mentality, and some store manager's too. I mean, I'm already paying for the miniatures. I'm paying for the paints, altough I don't use them. And then, I'm being told like they're doing ME a favour by letting me play unpainted miniatures. Imagine you're selling pizzas, if you do not have tables for people to eat, then that's it. But if you have tables, you're not going to tell those customers "Hey, I'm giving you a favoir by letting you eat here you know! So you use your fork and knife, no hands allowed or bust !" But with GW, they always pretend that they're giving you a favor. Just like they say "Oh we have free activities inside the store. You can come and build your models, with your glue, and paint them with your paints" Where's the free ? I just bought all that from your shop ... Free lessons ? Sure, like a guy in a one man shop can give you a private painting lesson 1 on 1, when he's being asked questions every 2 minutes, has to go back to the register to cash people out etc. Anyway, I think this debate could go on and on.

Nope, I don't :). I have the same fun, with my grey minis as with my ****** anvils of the shittypainthammer! I can appreciate a good paint job though, and it's always nice to watch some people's well painted minis. But if somebody wants to play the GreyHammer with me, I'm totally fine !

Ok, thanks for your reply.

Thank you for your intake. I do not refuse to paint. I suck at it, got plenty of advices, some leeway, my painted models sucks (to my standard), and I don't really have a lot of time. What I'd like to know is that, is there an official statement from GW, or is it up to the store manager ? PS ; Your point about others preferring to play against painted armies is to me irrelevant. I'd like my opponents to be fair play and roll dices correctly. Some just drop them, save 13 out 15 wounds, are always over the top stats wise, whereas I always launch the dice so it really rolls and only luck, not throwing method impacts the rolls, but if they don't want to do it the "correct" way after being asked, then I have nothing else to say. I can't force them to change dices either. Why should I be punished for being bad at painting and/or too perfectionnist. Cheers!

Once again, go find some people to play WFB V8 or the ninth age, those are great games! Honestly, If I had a friend or two to play WFB V8 with, I wouldn't even bother with AOS AT ALL!

HEy guys, Don't know if it's the right place to ask but this is a big question for me! I totally suck at painting. Hoarding ? Not so much. Basically, I have a lot of grey miniatures, because it breaks my heart to totally ruin those good looking minis with a horrible paint job! So, in my GW, it's mandatory that for tournaments, miniatures be at least base coat + bases + shade, but is there really a regulation about that ? Let's say I want to participate in a tournament, because it's my favourite part of the hobby, and I'm forbidden to do so, because my minis are greys. Would it be condone by GW? Cheers guys!