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For those wondering.

One of many, and hopefully many more to come. We're no Nagash, no held grudges here, I hope. We're all going through something. So I genuinely hope that everyone who is sees a better place on the other side of it and works to get there. Me included.

I'm really happy about that. You can fit whole units wholly within 18". The Deathless is still wholly within 12" from him, though, unless that changes in a new book.

Good luck! Here's hoping you a strong showing.

Well, the deal is in Be'lakor. And it's less a trick than a threat that both have on each other. As always, 2+ Tough has you covered on the lore if you'd like to hear him narrate and synopsize it. Which I do. https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLyIEtHBf1vpLE3BP4vSwgvtSgD1oSBhj0

I was suggesting the Coach have some utility along with firepower, not mutually exclusive uses. Sort of how it is now, where it plays more than one role depending on its level and your needs. I would love to deploy this thing every game and my opponent is never sure which way I will play it. As long as whatever it does is in service of providing a solid foundation to attack from, I'll be happy. No sense in arguing over something that doesn't exist. Our Black Coach performs exactly as it does right now. In the future? None of us know. But it seems every time we bring up what we'd like to see out of the faction we start arguing over the details. As though one nice-to-have is better than another nice-to-have, none of which we actually have. Getting back on the subject of the Metawatch article and the two sample lists; they are getting tore up on the official Facebook page. I feel kind of bad. For me, though, it draws the legitimacy of these articles into question. They're intended to start a conversation, and get players point of view on new content and get games going using it, but this just highlights how little regard is given to some factions over others. Thanks for all the new stuff, GW, but you still can't get serious players to give NH the same kind of attention more powerful armies get. The new stuff doesn't address anything. We're still a ways away from the Be'lakor FAQ, I think. I'm hesitant to think of how the rulings will go.

Not bad. I'd still add something like "Spectral Translocation: Instead of making a normal move, you can remove this model from the battlefield and then set it up anywhere on the battlefield more than 9" from any enemy models. In addition, you may select any 1 friendly Nighthaunt unit that is within 3” of this model prior to this model's normal move or Spectral Translocation and remove it from the battlefield. After this model's move, set this unit up wholly within 9" of this model and more than 9" from any enemy models." This would allow the Coach to transport a unit with it around the table or using it's greater normal movement. Also, as an aside, nothing prevents GW from modifying ethereal saves. They'd just have to write a rule to allow it.

I could see that. Make it a hero, give it the Dreadblade's teleport, and allow it to take a friendly unit along for the ride. Toss in Nimbus, retreat and charge, and impact damage and call it good.

Careful. No levels will likely mean lower overall buffs the thing gives out. I'd hate to lose Nimbus or they make the Cairn Wraith that drives it mean nothing weapons-wise. I'd settle for level 1 as the minimum. Or the level rolls are enhanced by how many other heroes you have on the board when you roll. I was going to argue this, but you're right. Only Soulblight Gravelord Summonable units can be set in the grave --instead of any Summonable Up to half of your army can be set in reserve --instead of "as many as you wish" Can set up any of your reserves on the field within standard zone in rules --used to require a hero within 9" of the grave and could only set up 9" from the grave Can store units there until the start of the 4th battle round --used to be entire game Endless Legions is free, requires no heroes to use, is automatic, and brings back half units within normal zone in rules --used to require a general and a command point, but brought back full units and only within 9" Graves offer no further benefits, --used to offer Invigorating Aura which is now a spell all allegiant wizards know (with special rules) All this, combined with Deathly Invocation moving to a battle trait, is a clear signal that GW intends for the power of an army to come from their allegiance and not the units you could ally in. Can't store Spirit Hosts or Reapers in graves anymore. Can't heal them up, either. It's the same philosophy as killing all the extra artefacts was. They want armies to do their thing, not an OP artefact or ally choice. But that being said, if they did the same treatment to LoG gravesites and made them a standard Nighthaunt (or whatever the combined faction is called) inclusion, I wouldn't say no to it. It's still a lot of healing that we just don't have right now. Even graves bringing back half units is still more than LoG could bring back post Aetherquartz, unless you saved all your points just for that. Free half units is still better than choosing to not use a KoS buff. Oh no...now I'm wondering what abilities of ours are going to be moved off of warscrolls and moved into allegiance traits. Frightful Touch? Yes, do that, if it means more units can benefit from it. Ethereal? Sure. Kurdoss' CP steal? Why not? Capture Soul Energy? PLEASE give that to all heroes!

Thanks! No, not really. I'm open to suggestions, but I've always been a pure ghost player. I included the Vampire Lord because it was highly requested, though I'll have to drop him from the guide now. Our ally list has severely dwindled since Soulblight's release, so we'll have to wait to see if that opens back up later.

The Azyr app just updated. Here are our official allies:

I want to see one that leans heavily on mortal wound output. Something that gives Spirit Hosts a buff, that gives Frightful Touch to more units, and generally ups our damage potential. Another that focuses on magic, recasting and twin-casting, casting protection. Not to compete on the magic meta, but to give our existing spells more utility. Shademisting multiple units, Spectral Lure with a bonus, a secondary magical form of model return.

I guess the better question is: if you've used the Cruciator, did you save against both wounds and mortal wounds on a 5+ when his ability was active? We ran into a debate a few pages back. At any rate, thanks for responding. As a faction, we're always very eager for information and advice.

You're that Mike? I'd love to know how you'd play that list. Or any new list from Nighthaunt. As a playtester, did you test Nighthaunt? And if so, against what? How are we looking ahead or perhaps during AoS 3.0 before we get a new battletome? I know you can't offer anything that's behind an NDA, but I'd love to hear your personal opinions.

While Nagash (975 points) and Neferata (365 points) are listed in the Pitched Battle Profiles at the end of the book, their warscrolls aren't. My summary was based solely on the book. Nagash is too many points to be included as an ally (though we may be told he can be included under the battle trait Supreme Lord of the Undead like he is for Soulblight Gravelords, which makes him an allegiant general in addition to your army). Neferata, though, does have an updated warscroll on GW. She has the keyword Deathlords, so she can still be an ally to us right now. But, a general note on allies from this faction, assuming we can eventually ally with Soulblight Gravelords: I'm noticing a lot of their abilities now specifically target other Soulblight Gravelord units. For example, Neferata's Dark Mist spell specifically targets "1 friendly Soulblight Gravelord unit." Her Command Ability Twilight's Allure does as well. The Necromancer's Vanhel's Danse Macabre now targets "1 friendly Soulblight Gravelords Summonable unit." The Vampire Lord? Crimson Feast, which was one reason to take him as an ally, giving +1 attacks to a friendly unit from your hero phase to your next (way longer than our KoSoES's similar CA) also targets "1 friendly Soulblight Gravelords Summonable unit." Even the Mortis Engine isn't immune to this; while the Reliquary ability (once a battle, do D3 mortals to everything within 12") ignores all Death units, the Bound Necromancer ability (+1 to casting rolls) targets "friendly Soulblight Gravelords Wizards." The Coven Throne, same deal. So if you brought any of the above, half or more of their warscroll becomes useless unless you bring other Soulblight Gravelord units with them. In fact, the only warscroll abilities I can see that could benefit non-Soulblight units positively are: Belladamma Volga (200+135 points for Dire Wolves}: who's spell can add Dire Wolves to the game, and who's CA targets Dire Wolves Radukar the Wolf (too expensive to ally if taken as the set required in SG): has an ability that targets Kosargi Nightguard units Radukar the Beast (315+135 for wolves, thus too expensive): CA target's Dire Wolves Gorslav the Gravekeeper (too expensive to ally if taken as the set required in SG): Ability targets Deadwalkers and CA targets Summonable Deadwalkers Torgillius the Chaimberlain (too expensive to ally if taken as the set required in SG): Ability looks for Radukar the Wolf Watch Captain Halgrim (too expensive to ally if taken as the set required in SG): CA targets Deathrattle Kosargi Nightguard (too expensive to ally if taken as the set required in SG): Ability looks for Radukar the Wolf Bloodseeker Palanquin (290+a vampire, lowest being 95 for Kritza, Lady Annika for 110 being the only other option before being too expensive): Ability targets Vampire units Deadwalker Zombies (115): ability generates more Deadwalker Zombie models Corpse Cart w/Lodestone (80+115 for some Zombies): While the magic enhancing ability requires SG, the save enhancing one only needs Deadwalker Zombies White King (115+85 for some Skeletons): CA targets Deathrattle White King on Skeletal Steed (130+85): CA targets Deathrattle All of the above target those specific keywords, not "Soulblight Gravelords X." So they could offer those to allied matching units, if for some reason we could only ally with a keyword and not the faction. However, there are plenty of offensive or self-buffing abilities that might be worth considering, though. Lots of units under 200/400 that could make great allies on their own, even though they'd offer nothing to the army their joining. Blood Knights for 120 each, for example. Varghests for 155. Terrorghest for 305. They'd have to be pretty strong picks to replace Nighthaunt units, in my opinion.

True enough. Hope it gets addressed.

For reference: These lists come from a couple prominent players, one of which is a former grandmaster and the other a current playtester. Interesting. I'd love to see how they'd handle the lists. Look at the second one, the list with Emerald Host. They dodged the whole locked-in Command Trait and didn't take Lord of the Host. Typo? Shenanigans? I'd like to see something about that.

I got a chance to read through a friend's advance release of Soulblight Gravelords. Interesting faction now, I kind of dig them. If I were to ever play them, I think I'd lean heavily into a mostly vampire setup with Blood Knights and such. Anyway, there were a few takeaways I wanted to bring up from the book. First, the confirmed stuff: Vampire Lords, or any ally from Soulblight, will no longer offer Deathly Invocation to us. It is now an Allegiance ability and has been removed from the warscroll cards. In order to ally with a Vampire Lord (if we still wanted) we'd need the ability to ally with the following keywords: Death, Vampire, Soulblight Gravelords, Hero, Wizard, Vampire Lord. Currently, our allies are: Deathlords, Soulblight. Soulblight does not exist anymore* (replaced by Soulblight Gravelords more on this below) so the remaining ally choices are: Mannfred von Carstein (Deathlord keyword) - 380 points and that's it (from this book) Soulblight Gravelords can ally with: Flesh-eater Courts, Nighthaunt (so they can take any of our units) The book contains 5 warscroll battalions. Given that the book is still a 2nd edition release, these offer standard battalion boosts to several units, along with both Allegiance abilities and a subfaction set of buffs. Okay, with that out of the way, let's get into some speculation: If you read the Rules As Written* then we cannot ally anything other than Mannfred. While it can be speculated that our ally list will be updated from Soulblight to Soulblight Gravelords, this would be a Rules as Intended* change, and thus would have to be agreed upon by everyone involved until our book is updated. If we are to gain new allies, this book shows that factions will be allies now, and not keywords. So, we'd have to get the ally Soulblight Gravelords, which opens up everything in the book below 200/400 points. It is not likely Malignant will be a thing we can ally with. The book still includes those keywords for the Bloodseeker Palanquin (Malignant keyword) - 290 and Mortis Engine (Malignant keyword) - 200, but it's not a faction keyword. But, again, if we get Soulblight Gravelords we'll get access to the Mortis Engine. And Necromancers. This book contains two changes to the way some rules work that I think we're going to see a flavor of in our own book: Endless Legions: This is now a battleshock phase battle trait that functions with the number of enemy units you've killed that turn. Roll a die, add any enemy units you killed this turn, and if the total roll is 5+ select a Deadwalkers or Deathrattle unit that you lost and return half of it at an open gravesite. No command points necessary, but it's always on. Reduced potency, but does not lock out model return bringing back models to that unit. I can see a similar function being included for Nighthaunt. No graves, though, so we may need to see it come from a hero or some other limiter. All allegiant wizards, no matter who they are, get the spell Invigorating Aura in addition to another single spell lore option (Vampires get Lore of Vampires, Deathmages get Lore of Deathmages, Nagash and Mortarchs get both [because they are vampries]). This spell has a high cast value of 8, but you can add 1 to the roll for it for every Hero you have on the field. It's 18" and heals any Summonable unit wholly within range 3 wounds (no roll), or if no wounds are missing, 3 wounds worth of models. What's even better than that is that all wizards can cast this in the same hero phase, even if another already has. The limiter is that a unit can only benefit from this spell once. Spectral Lure? All wizards have access? +1 to the roll casting it for every Hero we have, even if they aren't wizards? Can cast it multiple times per hero phase, just need to target different units whenever it's successful? Gimmie please! *Do yourself a favor here and be consistent. If you argue for Rules as Written, then things like our Krulghast Cruciator can't prevent mortal wounds (yet). That means no Vampire allies. It's not likely the Be'lakor FAQ will address our allies, but the SG FAQ might. Otherwise we're waiting for a new book. Alternately, if you read it as Rules as Intended, be up front with your other players because it can be a slippery slope and everyone needs to be on the same page. Don't assume.

I'm still digesting what little I have been able to find, but I think any rules rewrite can only help us, right? Confirmed AoS 3.0 stuff (as from the streams) -Double Turn still exists -If you go second in a game, you get more command points. -More command abilities that exist in different phases -Core battalions, not a lot of detail, but supposed to address how some armies can take a ton of battalions and others can't -Complete rules rewrite with clarity and separation in mind -Lore will focus on Ghur We tend to go second right now, so the extra CP will be nice. Suppose that can change with a new core book, core battalions, and new battletome, though. I agree with you @dmorley21, I am not really keen on the Soulblight allies or vice-versa. I love me a vampire army, and the Vampire Lord is a great ally right now, but I hope that we are strong enough on our own that no ally choice is an auto-pick. So, they mention "core battalions," but they didn't describe what that is yet. In 40K there are Core Units. But our battalions already function like Core Units do, at least generally. Shroudguard is pretty much how they work in 40K; a leader gives out a buff to specific troops they command, but not all of the army, and doesn't benefit from that buff themselves. Being Core, they represent the spearhead of your army, and help you make choices on how you are going to support them with the rest of the army. Thinking on it, I think core battalions are more for factions like Tzeentch or anyone else who can just jam pack battalions into their lists right now, and gain all the benefits of it like the extra CP, artefacts, and abilities that can affect anything in the army, while factions like Cities of Sigmar are so restricted on what battalions they can take and tend to have rules that only affect the battalion. Either it will reduce the likelihood of seeing more than one or two battalions for any given opponent and that those benefits will only ever affect a portion of the army, or unlock a couple battalions that can be used for your faction regardless of the subfaction you choose but still only affect a portion of the army. For me, the biggest reveal so far is their commentary of "rules will be written with separation and clarity in mind." They have mentioned before that the FAQ system, though useful and necessary, has become more of the "actual" rules than the books they correct are, and that wasn't the intention, kills innovation, creates unforeseen power imbalances, and worst of all (in their words) the feeling you can't play the faction you selected until its FAQ comes out because it's "incomplete" at release or every major update until the purple text is printed. I hope they can kill the rules lawyering that happens before these FAQs come out, because that is one of the highest bars of entry into this game. Gatekeeping, in a word. The Cruciator is a perfect example. I hope that in the future it's not even a question if his ability affects mortal wounds or not because they will have addressed in clean language in the Core Rules how words and ability names work, and the window of potential you have in an ability isn't in how you choose to read the words but how it affects gameplay, and your decision to use an aspect of the game (like models or factions) isn't tied to your level of anxiety on if you can properly argue the rule. Magic the Gathering recently went through a similar rewrite of their Golden Rules for the exact same reason.

A couple of fresh faces turned up in my army the other day. They introduce themselves as Bud and Lou, but I'm a bit suspicious. Still, happy to have them along.

You've got be beat by double. You're a mad person.

What @dmorley21 said. If you use the Bladegheists/Spirit Torment as an assassination drop from Underworlds, that's a good tactic but rarely used due to how quickly an important hero can just be erased. Basically banking on the Wave of Terror roll or die trying. You could opt for those points to go into more Hexwraiths. Yes, a Dreadblade with the Pendant is a high IQ move. You select the unit he is next to move and they will get their +3", then you teleport the Dreadblade next another unit you want to move, and then select that unit. They then also get the +3" to move. Basically, as long as all units who are within his 12" Pendant bubble are selected to move they get the bonus, but the bonus is at the start of their move, not his. And the condition of his teleportation is merely to check if any enemies are within 3" of him at the start of the movement phase. His actual teleportation can occur at any part of the movement phase. I'm also concerned that having the Chainrasps with the Hexies and Olynder might be too many slow moving units all in the same area of the board. Stormcast are slow, for sure, but you don't have to be as well. I'd have the Chainrasps and GoS either engaging first way ahead of her, or moving elsewhere on the board entirely.

I like this list a lot. Forgotten Scions gives the KoSoES his CA for free every battle round which is better than the Procession's once per game. Gets you the Pendant and extra CP. Lots of Chainrasps, lots of Reapers, so ready for most things. 3 spells/unbinds, the Stormcast don't usually bring a ton of spellcasting, but do have a few you'd want to try to shut down. Seems pretty good. A few questions: The Dreadblades, just for Forgotten Scions and objective captures, or do you plan on using them for any combat? Reaper blob might be too big to fit wholly within a hero's support bubble, though a Dreadblade will make that a bit easier to position. Disregard if you plan on running them alone. Olynder is the general, plan on her and the Hexwraiths moving as a unit? She's much slower than them but it's not a bad play. Are the Bladegheists just for the points or to be paired with the ST? A group that small will disappear really quick, but if you plan on using them from the Underworlds as an assassin group that seems good. How do you plan on running the list?

I love me some Reapers! They are so versatile, and on the fly too. If anything, I think it's the cost that keeps them from showing up in lists right now. I include them in most of my lists. Good to hear you had an overall winning set! If you were to adjust anything from the list you brought, what would it be? Reapers are in a class all their own. In terms of fighting in ranks, keeping their overall footprint small and in all of our "wholly" ranges, and still being very fast makes them the best overall standard unit. I'd call them elites if it weren't for their wounds. I don't think Dreadscythes or Bladegheists are even in the same class. Bladegheists and Shroudguard is a tournament staple, though, because of the 5++. If KC gets FAQed to do the same for both mortals and normals, shove him with a pack of Reapers and that'll be amazing. Shroudguard use will probably go down quite a bit unless people want just that much more 5++ running around, which isn't a bad thing. Dreadscythes, though, fill a different niche entirely. They shouldn't be aggressive attackers, and with Sorrowmourn Choir I think their use is pretty clear as being a screen for Olynder that has some bite and potential bravery-based defensiveness. And as her wound pool. They're meant to stick to her and attack in tandem with her.

Just found out about a tool (Thanks AOSCoach) List Analyzer Bot (BETA) Ran your list through it and it's rated A-. My own lists rate B+! 😄 The tool isn't updated with anything from Be'lakor yet, though. And since I'm talking about tools, this is what I use before I comment about math or potential. AOS Statshammer Hopefully these can help you build a great list.