ilaxu 'Minute'

I must admit I know nothing about Path to Glory. What is it?

Yea, the Undead Bretonnians are quite fun. Personally I would LOVE to do a Mousillon army but I'd end up wanting to do some many complicated conversions that the price would be astronomical... Blood Knights for Grail Knights, Hexwraith conversions for Questing Knights, Black Knight for Knights of the Realm, Nehekharan Cavalry for Yeomen, Skeletons/Zombies for Peasants, Ghouls for Grail Pilgrims...

So I'm reading this as Mousillon Re-Reborn...

So I'm playing around with some Freeguild-Bretonnia combo lists atm because having some decent infantry screens could be a real life saver. So far I've come up with this as a possible way to include a ranged skirmish screen for the army. King On Hippogryph -Legendary Fighter, Sword of Judgement Freeguild General on Steed - Lance & Shield Enchantress - Unicorn Damsel - Pegasi Archmage - Steed 10 Freeguild Archers - Hunter 10 Freeguild Archers - Hunter 10 Freeguild Archers - Hunter 10 Grail Knights - Banner & Trumpeter 16 Knights of the Realm - Gallant, Banner & Trumpeter Total Points: 1,960 So, Pro's v Con's as far as I can tell. Well, we have a large screen that can push up quite far ahead and get some decently accurate volleys off in the early game, especially against slow opponents. However as they aren't Bretonnian they will likely take battleshock loses so their main purpose is to slow the enemy so that the Knights can get the charge. This list is also somewhat limited with damage output, as it only has 3-4 units that are properly melee capable, two of which being the King and General. Basically it comes down to, is it worth trading the unit of 8 Knights Errant, the Amber Battlemage and the 16 Men-At-Arms for 30 Archers and a Mounted Hero? There are alternatives of course. For example, dropping the Freeguild General in place of the Amber Battlemage allows for the Knights to perform slightly better, albeit weakening the ranged power of the archers. Or just dropping one of the archer units instead. Or for a more drastic change, dropping the King altogether and replacing him with a Lord with the same gear to free up another 260 points to spend on extra units. Possible those 8 Knights Errant and the Amber Battlemage? Still, losing the Battleshock immunity for the Bretonnians hurts. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The reason why I'm going over this is because of the discussions from the last few days have been setting the cogs in the back of my head spinning quite a lot. Because point for point, the Freeguild Infantry are superior to their Bretonnian counterparts when it comes to basic damage output and basic durability. But when you also factor in the fact that Freeguild units don't gain benefits from a lot of Bretonnian abilities and spells then it makes the decisions a bit tougher. Is it worth spending 200-400 points on models that don't work with the synergy of the Bretonnians (which is what gives them a fighting chance 80% of the time) to get some quality improvements for aspects of the army, or is it better to go puritan to gain the best use of the Synergy of Bretonnia (Looking at that battleshock immunity...) I feel like making use of Free Guild units as the infantry could be useful depending on how you use them. So what does everyone else have in mind with their inclusion? How would you use them?

I love the look of the kitbashing you've done so far, and the list seems to be fairly solid. Plus the black and white looks really effective as always. Have you had any test games or still purely in the creation process?

Bretonnian memes would be quite amusing... Yea right now I am effectively broke as I'm going on a two week holiday four weeks from now so all spare funds are being pooled for that. Once I'm back from that holiday though then I'll probably start hunting for parts. I have half a mind to see if I can turn a unit of Sisters of the Thorn into Damsels/Enchantresses for the Bretonnians tbh. It would honestly be considerably cheaper than hunting down the 4-5 models individually and with a bit of kit bashing it might be doable.

Actually, I just had a thought. I have a mostly unassembled unit of Empire Knights hanging around somewhere. And some of their horse heads have a single spike on the face plate. Which I could argue is a unicorn horn under the armour. So maybe I can skip out on the Fey Enchantress model directly to cut costs a bit.

THE RESULT IN A NUTSHELL... Cheaper Men At Arms: "DID SOMEBODY CALL FOR A COST EFFECTIVE MEAT SHIELD!!!" Cheaper Peasant Archers: "OH MY LADY THIS COWARDLY HERESY MIGHT BE WORTH DOING" Cheaper Grail Pilgrims: "FOR THE LADY" (In Bad French Accent) Cheaper Mounted Yeomen: "Actually, not horrible after all..." Cheaper Trebuchet: "CRUSH THEM BENEATH THE LADY'S STONY BACKSIDE!" Cheaper Knights Errant: "IS THIS WHAT BEING COST EFFECTIVE FEELS LIKE!?" Cheaper Knights of the Realm: "THIS IS DEFINITELY WHAT COST EFFECTIVE FEELS LIKE!" Cheaper Questing Knights: "We do exist you know..." Cheaper Grail Knights: "WAIT, WE'RE BRETONNIAN AND OVERPOWERED!? OH MY LADY WE ARE BLESSED" Cheaper Nobles: "Er, can you not just fix our rules that effectively do nothing?" Cheaper Damsel: "ALL THE MAGIC, ALL THE TIME!" Cheaper Enchantress: "I DON'T CARE WHAT IDIOT CHANGED THIS, NEVER, FOR ANY REASON, READ A FAQ ABOUT THE PRICE COST AFTER THIS!" Cheaper Lord: "I NEEDED THIS!" Cheaper King & Hippogryph: "VICTORY! WE HAVE VICTORY!!!"

Yea I saw that comment on one of the youtube videos and was wondering about it so I went to double check. It's a bit cheeky but Bretonnia can make use of Hammerhal at least. So a slight Bravery bonus all around. Because lets be honest, any bonuses we can find would be great. In other news I've started taking stock of just what kind of nightmares I'd have to go through to get my force functioning for tournament play. And it will indeed be nightmares. 3 60mm round bases, 45 60mmx35mm oval bases and 32 25mm round bases already sets me back $95 AUD for just the basing process. Then I have to find a Fay Enchantress model (Lady help me that won't be cheap) and two or three mounted Damsels. Of which, I need to convert two to be able to ride a pegasi... Then I have to find a suitable model for an Archmage on Horse (Another Damsel???) and a good substitute for a Battlemage (I REGRET selling that Elven mage two years ago) to cover the potential composition variations. Once that is done, which is no small task, I then have to find that blasted Hippogryph model of mine to tear it apart and convert the rider into a Bretonnian somehow. Then it's just the small task of painting 80 odd models in a few short months... Whilst taking a two week holiday and attending university... Oh, and my entire paint collection has dried out so I need new paints... Lady give me strength, I bit off way more than I thought I did... ...And the coffers are crying tears of blood... With Concerned Regards, ~ilaxu

@Duke of Gisoreux once again, love the old school Bretonnian models. Fingers crossed that Bretonnia does come back in the Generals Handbook 2019 but I won't hold my breath. But maybe, just maybe, we'll see something.

This kinda of raises the question, how do people feel Bretonnia should be played? Should they act as a force unto themselves for the Lady or would they act better as part of a combined detachment alongside other Order forces. After all, when it comes to cavalry the Bretonnians have a good assortment, especially when combined with their heroes for the synergy of skills and spells. But when it comes to infantry, they do rather lack a bit. I mean, peasants in large groups are okay but lets be honest, Fair Bretonnia is not known for its peasants in any good way... Personally I want to be a puritan and play with purely my brave Bretonnians but the less than ideal position of the ground troops tempt me to want to make use of troops from the free guilds (Although still using the peasant models). Freeguild Swordsmen seem to be an improvement over the Men-At-Arms, as do the Freeguild Archers over the Peasant Bowmen even without having a lord around to manage their synergy. What are others thoughts on the matter? Do you prefer your Bretonnians to be the only aspect of the army, or are you willing to fortify them with troops from other factions? Regards, ~ilaxu

@Fullbret Just realised that I misunderstood the notation you had used. That's a unit of 16 Knights of the Realm and 10 Grail Knights right? If that's the case then I'm inclined to say it looks like a decent army list all up. If you can add the Hammerhal origin to it then do so as it adds +1 Bravery to everything which is a huge bonus. That aside, my only real suggestion is prioritise getting the Chronomatic Cogs out early game to help with speed/casting as needs be. And remember that the Lord on pegasus is a monster hunter, not a hero killer. Against enemy heroes he will have a hard time.

Just want to check and see if I'm understanding this right. @Duke of Gisoreux @HanzoKurosawa The King (normally) hits on a 3+ when using his normal stateline. If targeting a monster or hero he gains a re-roll to hit. If he has Divine Blessing bestowed upon him this becomes a 2+ to hit. If he has his own ability active this becomes a 1+ to hit. Each hit wounds on a 3+ and causes D6 wounds at Rend -1. With the Sword of Judgement equipped his hit rolls of a 6 automatically cause D6 mortal wounds without rolling to wound. If under the effects of Divine Blessing this becomes a 5+, and if his ability is active then it will drop down to a 4+. So in an ideal charge when rolling to hit, any rolls of 1 are re-rolled, any rolls of 2 and 3 then roll to wound and any rolls of 4+ automatically cause D6 mortal wounds. Is this correct? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'll give my two cents based on my understanding of how Bretonnia plays but there are definitely more experienced minds around who can give better critique. @Fullbret My first suggestion is that another Damsel would probably be overkill if you already have a Prophetess and a Damsel as it means you'll have a wasted spell slot in games that don't have a Realm of Magic bonus spell. You'd be better off getting an Allied Battlemage (Collegiate Arcana) or Archmage (Eldritch Council) as they both have good spell options for supporting a Bretonnian force. The second bit of advice I can give is that different Knight units tend to have different ways to maximize their efficiency. Knights Errant generally are used as units of 8 and have a Damsel staying nearby them to allow for their re-rolls. In this state they can (potentially) outperform a same sized unit of Knights of the Realm. Knights of the Realm are ideal for larger units however, as at 10 models they gain a natural re-roll for 1's to hit. This tends to make them most effective in units of 16. Questing Knights are usually given a skip as they lose out to the other units on the charge (except vs Monsters where they equal KotR and Grail Knights) and only really gain an advantage in a multi turn combat which as a Bretonnian you should be avoiding at all costs. But if you were to use them, they'd probably be a 5 man Monster Hunter unit. However, expect the DISTRACTION CARNIFEX treatment for them. Grail Knights have amazing damage output but limited durability in comparison to their points. As such I highly recommend always bringing them in units of 10 if possible to allow for some unfortunate casualties here or there. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Concerning Endless Spells there are a few decent options for Bretonnia: Chrononmatic Cogs: Speed up time and imrpove your units movement speeds or slow it down to defend your casters and cast an extra spell. Soulsnare Shackles: Slow down enemy units in a decent area and potentially get some damage as well. Emerald Lifeswarm: Not top tier but it does give you some wound and model regeneration so it's an option. Prismatic Palisade: Good option for stopping the shooty boys turning your units into pincushions. Of these spells the best two are probably Chronomantic Cogs & Soulsnare Shackles, as both give you that much needed map control edge that Bretonnia relies upon so heavily. Again though please ask the AoS veterans for clarification as I've still only had one match after all and am basically just playing theoryhammer right now. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- QUick side question @Duke of Gisoreux, how do the Freeguild archers perform compared to the Peasant Bowmen and what is their cost like? Regards, ~ilaxu

Right, so I may or may not have taken 10 minutes to actually read up on this before bed because curiosity is a dangerous animal... Turns out, this is actually entirely doable as the Bretonnians don't have a unique trait curse you GeeWee, they are a part of the Order Alliance no they aren't undead you damn flesh eater court fan boys and are, funnily enough, not Lizardmen Seraphon 10ft tall illuminati lizards... Soooooooo, guess that means that EVERYTHING in the Bretonnian roster gets +1 Bravery AND Re-Rolls for Battleshock... That was a pleasant little find. Or was this something people were already doing?

That indeed would be the lord who I had in mind. Although I have no idea if I could honestly paint an army up to that kind of standard tbh. But I'd like to try something in that vein at least. And fair point about the abilities, perhaps I should adjust my statement to I haven't seen a huge amount of situations that they are useful as they're often overlapped by the abilities of the lords. In much the same way that the knights getting re-rolls for battleshock on the charge is pointless, because order gave them re-rolls for battleshock by default. Admitedly better than nothing though and if you can't get the Hippogryph King then it's considerably more worthwhile. On a rules note, I came across this and wondered how exactly does this work and would it feasibly be of any use to the Bretonnians? None of the other City Alliances are able to be used by the Bretonnians, but Hammerhal is the one which could be used. And if that Bravery bonus is in addition to the re-roll failed battleshock tests that Order gives then wouldn't it be a massive upgrade? Anyway, I'm off to bed as it's midnight. But may the Lady's Blessings shine upon you all. Regards, ~ilaxu

Ended up doing a full check through this evening. Final count ended up being 48 Knights that can be turned into one thing or another. Now to just work out what to do about Riders and color schemes... Part of me wants to do the 'traditional' many coloured march that Bretonnia typically displayed, but at the same time I'm tempted to do something similiar to what @Drakilian and have groups painted up in uniform colour schemes. Highly tempted to try a black and white design like one of the old White Dwarf show models. (Black & White with an axe, believe he was a named character.) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Seems to be a pity, none of those abilities seem to be of particular use to the Bretonnians overall... So CP are PURELY for activating abilities? I thought I'd seen on Miniwargaming that they can be used for re-rolls or something? Or is that a home rule they use? Regards, ~ilaxu

I like to do creative writing and battle reports tend to be a good way to get some practice. Plus I've read so many White Dwarf Magazines when I was younger that it's basically just habit to think of them that way these days. First time I've ever actually written one out though, so I'll improve it considerably That aside, I must admit that I actually don't know the range of abilities that CP can be used for besides activating the Lord/King abilities. Care to enlighten me? For army comp, I normally wouldn't have used a list like that but the GW staff member wanted something comparatively small to fight as he was using the Store display force from Soul Wars. Still, I totally agree that Casters, Grail Knights & the King will solve issues. I 100% want some more buff spells for improving damage potential. As for who went first, I actually would have chosen to go second but the staff member said it ran as whoever rolled highest went first for turn one. Regards, ~ilaxu

On a desolate plain there is a solitary hill, with the ruins of a civilization long past sitting atop its ancient mass. From the ruins come a wind carrying the voices of the damned, and even from the vast distance between the campsite and the hill the wails are still audible. And yet, in spite of that the men stand firm beneath the black banner marked with the golden thread in the shape of a grail, eager at a chance for glory as the lady in trappings of white and gold leads a solemn prayer to that most holy of beings. Then, as the sun crests the horizon and light spills over the hill, the wails intensify, only to be met by the answering calls of the trumpeters as the Bretonnians ride to war... Hey all, So I had my first ever match of Age of Sigmar today. Was only a small skirmish and points scores weren't used but I'll share it anyway. Army comp was as follows: NIGHT HAUNT: Knight of Shadows on Steed Lord Executioner 10x Chainrasp Wraiths 5x Glaivewraith Stalkers vs BRETONNIA: Lord on Horseback Damsel on Pegasi 8x Knights Errant 8x Knights Errant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Deployment was pretty straightforward, with the Bretonnians deploying in a position to circle around the hill whilst the Night Haunt went for a wider battleline approach with the intention of going straight over the hill. The roll off saw Bretonnia take the initiative in the name of the lady and began to advance around the base of the hill, with a precursory Divine Favour granted to the Lord in case of emergency. Turns out this may have been quite useful had dice rolls not gone in my favour, as the Ghostly Undead advance and the Knight of Shades attempts a long distance charge. However, thanks to the Lady's Blessing, it falls far short of the target. Turn 2 sees the Knights of Guilles take the initiative once again and immediately does an about face, launching a series of deadly charges against the foe. Both of the opposing lords take four wounds apiece (The Knights Errant actually scored 0, it was all the horses doing the work...) whilst the Chainrasp Mob loses half their number to the lances of the second unit of Knights Errant, clearly inspired to perform well in front of the damsel flying above. Three brave Knights are lost however, and the lord is wounded by the executioner. The undead quickly try to turn back the match. After all, victory for the match is decided by whoever owns their lord at the end. Thus the Glaivewraiths immediately line up and charge into the lord. All looked ill until a timely consumed quicksilver potion allowed the lord to strike first! In a feat of arms he singlehandedly dispatched the Lord Executioner, leaving the Glaivewraiths to try and finish the job but ultimately, failing b\to cause a crucial third wound and killing the lord. On the western flank things progressed far better however, with nearly equal trades as the Knights Errant fighting the Chainrasp's traded two of their number for three of theirs, whilst the other unit killed the Knight of Shades albeit at a loss of two of their own. The beginning of turn 3 saw another 6 rolled for the initiative. Truly the blessings of the Lady were upon us. Intent on making this the final round, the Damsel sent her airborne charger into a frenzy as she dived at the remaining two chainrasps to assist the mauled unit of Knights Errant, rewarding their efforts in the tough fight and finishing the foe. The other unit, now only 5 men strong and missing their banner, rode hard to assist their lord, killing two of the foul creatures outright. The lord himself only accounted for one as his wounds by this point were greatly effecting his combative ability. In return, the remaining shade wraiths caused a fifth and final wound upon the Lord. But, when all seemed lost, the Lady spoketh and the dice fell upon a 6. The wound was spared as the blessing granted by the Damsel negated the ghostly glaive. The final turn was short but sweet. The two remaining Glaivewraiths tried to finish the job against the gallant lord, but once again the Blessing of the Lady turned aside the foul creatures cursed weapons and the Knights Errant and Lord dispatched the final two foes with fervent abandon. As the last of the wraiths faded away, the men of Bretonnia let out a cry, though the Knights Errant who survived would never be quite so eager for a fight, as half their number lay dead and dying upon that cursed hill top... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ So to summarise, a quick game but a fun one. The Lady was most certainly shining upon me with the favourable dice rolls at the right times. So, what can I take out of this match? Well, first off, never underestimate horses. The horses did soooo much work during this game. On a more serious note, the Knights Errant performed admirably thanks to the presence of the Damsel nearby but I have serious concerns about the Bravery issues should they start losing a fight, and they seem to lack the punch without a buff spell to deal with ethereal units. The Damsel was a life saver (literally saved the lord after all) and without her this would have been a draw. But I am certainly feeling the lack of spellpower with her and in future I will 100% be going for a Prophetess first. The Lord himself is a little underwhelming, but I feel this had more to do with the fact that he was not in ideal fights during this battle as his monster hunter rule never came into effect, the Lord Executioner was giving him a negative penalty to attacks and in the end there were some less than ideal dice rolls. Anyway, that concludes the days actions. Hope you all enjoyed the read and feel free to let me know what you think. Regards, ~Alexi

Good morning~ I said I would raise the banners and so I am doing so with the utmost haste. I have already planned a Knightly incursion to the local realm of GW to run out the basic force for a bit of rust removal. With any luck the Brave Knights of Guilles will perform admirably to their set task. If I can get some games in (as well as learning about the game of course) then I will post up some reports later. @oscisi I'll slowly add pictures as my army progresses but right now all one would see is a lot of mostly grey horses, hardly a magnificent sight. As for my conversion game, I'm admittedly still only a rookie. I've done a tonne of kitbashing in the past but very little full on conversions, and for the most part I'll have to convert already built models so it could be a bit tricky. For army composition, 2 units of Knights Errant with a Damsel following them on Pegasi sounds like a good fit for the cav part of the Battleline. Then just adding a unit of the peasantry and that should leave plenty of room for the Grail Knights en Masse alongside the Lord & Prophetess(es). Although I want to test out the big Knights of the Realm Mobs to see if they are worth taking properly. @Drakilian Did Legendary Fighter prove to be worth taking? Also, what relic did you take? My personal mindset is t grab the Obstinate Blade for -2 Rend on the Sword of Heroes. Regards, ~ilaxu

Good Evening Early Morning from Australia~ First off, I just wanted to say that it's lovely to see others around who still play our beloved Knights of the Lady even in the grim times that make up Age of Sigmar. In all honestly I haven't looked at AoS at all since it came out and basically quite playing Warhammer at that point due to the level of pain I felt at my beloved Bretonnians and beloved Fantasy World being torn asunder in the lore. And honestly probably would have been that will still had I not still been subscribed to MWG and happened to see a Bretonnain AoS game pop up in my subscriptions feed. Which was a shock, but I immediately clicked on the video and watched the multiple glorious charges (and multiple failed charges for the Minotaurs, bless the Lady and bad dice rolls) and was very, very happy to see the whole game play out. Thus this afternoon I've done some meandering around looking for rules etc. And I've found myself here, feeling very glad that there are still some others who fly banners emblazoned with the holy grail out there somewhere. And with this discovery, I'm now intent on raising my own once again. And luckily, I never actually sold off my old force either, although it's almost entirely unpainted and there a quite a few riderless horses. Still, that just gives room to design as I need to. So, the current model count is something like this: 1x Griffon Lord (Originally Island of Blood elven lord, due for a conversion.) 2x Pegasus Knights 1 x Mounted Lord w/ Lance & Shield [Empire Captain on Horseback] 1 x Paladin Standard Beaerer [Empire Captain on Horseback w/ Banner] 32 x Peasant Bowmen (with 2 full commands) 40 x Knights of the Realm / Knights Errant / Possible Grail Knights (Might be 48, will need to check tomorrow) Bit of a mouthful I know but I'm currently trying to work out what to do with this mob. Currently I'm thinking of converting the 2 Pegasus Knights into becoming Damsels, Paladins or Lords seeing as from what I've read here they really aren't worth using and I'd have to source out a third model anyway to make them into a unit. Concerning the Peasant Bowmen, they appear to be a lost cause. Although I'll probably use them occasionally, even if only as a DISTRACTION CARNIFEX to use the 1D4chan terminology. Which leaves the Knight blob... It's a little awkward now that you can't add Knights to the unit as individuals as it means that if I want to convert some of them into Grail Knights (Or Questing Knights I suppose, but as already mentioned they are out shined by mostly everyone else) I'm going to end up with 3-6 leftover models, which feels like a bit of a waste. So what are peoples suggestions on the matter? That all aside, I just wanted to say that it's awesome to see others talking about Fair Bretonnia and a special thanks to @Drakilianfor inspiring me into looking into Age of Sigmar after such a long break from the Warhammer World. Regards, ~ilaxu